Hunting Humans /// Part 2 /// 498 | Forensic Files

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[Music] where we left off from yesterday Captain is we have a young woman who was
abducted and managed to escape her attacker when she tells police and detectives about what happened to her
she is able to give them detailed information that lead them to a man named Robert C Hansen do you know what
the C is for it stands for oddly enough Christian is Robert Hansen's middle name
now Robert Hansen the general thought or what is known of this guy around Anchorage Alaska he's a family man a
businessman and he on the surface everything the investigating officers know about Robert Hansen is telling them
he wasn't their guy and when I say he wasn't their guy meaning he might have been involved in this incident regarding
Cindy pulson but he's probably not their guy for the other missing women and for the
bodies that are turning up Robert Hansen is a family man and a successful local businessman he owned a bakery and when
the detective ran Robert Hansen through their computer system which we need to point this out it's very important to
point out that at this time in our timeline that this very moment the Anchorage police were in the process of
switching to a new system so when they type in his information into their computer system the system tells them
that Robert Hansen was clean he didn't have any police record at all and when the detectives started to ask
around what they end up learning is that Hansen was known around town as a an expert Hunter and in fact he held
several very impressive hunting records several world records for bow and arrow hunting in fact he held the world's top
Mark for taking down a doll sheep by bow and arrow this was in 1971 for killing a
Ram with a 42in horns he held the number two record for Caribou the number 12 ranked in the
world world for mountain goat the number 133 ranked doll sheep and the 34th ranked black bear I'm like 197 for
killing a big ass spider so this is a hunter's paradise and he's a very skilled Hunter well and all we can
assume is that their law enforcement system is not connecting them to other counties you especially during this time
so basically what they're saying is he's clean once he moved to Alaska he's clean
and he's been a good upstanding citizen yeah the trouble the short of it Captain
will be that they were in the process of setting up their computer system it wasn't quite finished yet and so some of
the records had not made their way to that system well if they need a guy so they were not able to find them at that
very moment when they're looking this dude up whose vehicle and plane put him at the air field of where this Cindy
pulson escaped from so a quick background on Robert Hansen he was born in Iowa in
1939 his parents with whom he had a difficult relationship with were very strict and often made him work long
hours at the familyowned bakery during his childhood he was often bullied for his stutter and severe acne in school he
had no close friends after graduating high school in 195 7 he enlisted in the US Army Reserve where he became a
skilled Marksman serving one weekend a month and working at the bakery the rest of the time sometimes volunteering as an
assistant drill sergeant at the police academy in the town of Pocahontas it was in the Army Reserves one weekend that
Hansen lost his virginity to a working girl then in 1960 he fell in love with and married a local girl soon after
Hansen burned down the school bus garage of the local high school why well is there a reason did he
ever tell us did he ever say the reason so this is a really kind of long and weird story so he's working at the
bakery and now mind you by this time he's graduated high school he's in the Army
Reserve and he's an adult but he's a young adult he must be about uh 18ish 19 at this time at this point he's
officially in charge of making cinnabuns yeah well this is 1960 so he would be 21
he's actually a couple years older than what I thought he was he's look he's working for Mom and Dad at the bakery
and so when you think about like these local mom and pop shops you have a lot of teenagers that tend to work these
jobs right so he's working with a couple of kids that are still at the high school they're still active in the high
school 17ish 18ish and he is kind of because he's older than these guys they think of him
differently much differently than what his classmates thought of Robert when he was attending High School right his
classmates thought of him as a giant pimple well and at the bakery he's a bit of a somebody right he's the owner's son
he's an adult he's gone off to the Army Reserve he has life experiences he's a part-time drill sergeant at this Police
Academy yeah so now he's Mr pimple head so he kind of creates this little Clan amongst the young men that work there 16
17 18yar old boys you know they're all very rebellious want to raise a little hell he convinces them hey like we could
go out and do some stuff in this little town in Iowa where there's nothing to do
you know we could go out and shoot at things shoot at stop signs we can uh set things on fire there's ways that we can
have fun be rebellious and you know cause problems yeah jug off some goats so he convinces a couple of the guys
that work there at this bakery that you know what let's get together and we'll stake some places out and we can do this
or that or the other thing check out some goats a couple of the guys are smart enough to weasle their way out of
these arranged hang outs that are after hours you know they're smart enough to know hey if we end up doing something
bad it could be bad for me so I'm not going to put myself in this situation one night he and one of the boys that he
convinced to go with him they go to this garage that houses the buses that drive
the kids to school so this is school property and he decides Robert Hansen decides to set fire to the building now
there's some conflicting stories here obviously because we have two people that went there and they both have a
somewhat different story of what happened but after the building burnt down and the the vehicles inside were
practically destroyed as well I mean this is a big deal with a lot of damage a lot of a lot of cost involved in this
damage well because these other guys are teenagers well what do they do they they
run their mouth you know they're at parties or they're at school telling people hey I know who did this or I was
involved or I was almost involved and so they're kind of telling the story to these other people of what happened the
police and the school system really had no clue what happened other than they knew that it was not an accident that it
was set it was an arson well word starts to get around town that Robert Hansen was involved in this and the kid that
was with him on the night that they set the fire he becomes a witness and testifies against Robert Hansen so in
court speak Robert Hansen willfully and maliciously set fire to a building this occurred in Iowa in
1961 for this he gets a threeyear sentence in prison remember he's already married at this time his wife decides to
stick with him because she believes going off of what Robert's telling her and everyone else hey this group of kids
did it and they're trying to blame it on me and because somebody's willing to testify against me I'm taking the fall
these guys right his family believes him and his wife believes that he's innocent
but eventually he ends up confessing to her and to his mom and dad this is while he's serving out that
three-year prison sentence well and also you know the family business he's set to
make some dough well you asked why it's believed that Hansen burnt down the building in retaliation for his unhappy
high school years or or it was because he hated the school's superintendent who just so happened to be good friends with
his father Hansen's father and a regular customer at the family bakery either way
Hansen ends up serving 23 months in a Reformatory and then is released and then successfully completed
parole one year later so he got out early for this arson that he committed right in 1963 he remarried because what
happens is once he confesses to his wife and to his parents she believing him this whole time now she knows not only
did he set this fire not only is he an arsonist but he's managed to lie to me for over a year now mhm she don't want
anything to do with him those two split up so after he gets out 1963 he gets married again to a woman with whom he
had two children with a girl and a boy in 1967 the Hansen family of four moved to
Anchorage Alaska now an Anchorage Alaska this is reported that you know Hansen was well-liked by the people that knew
him and following in his Father's Footsteps Hansen opened a bakery and the business was a success now Hansen always
had a hobby of target shooting and was pretty skilled at this and he was always somewhat a casual Hunter back in Iowa
but Alaska is a Sportsman's Paradise mhm so Robert Hansen became an avid Hunter well just to be clear it's spelled h a n
s n not s o n like the famous multiple talented group Hansen either way it makes me think of
that song and we need to have their beer on the show called um hops a funny side
thing was I was at the grocery last week and that song came on and I don't care what anybody think that's not my cup of
tea that you know their style of music but that song regardless puts me in a fantastic mood every time I hear it that
was their style of music when they were younger there they've got they've gotten
much better if you haven't listened to new Hansen you you might be surprised I've been trying to talk about Hanson
for almost 500 episodes once in Alaska as we already pointed out he becomes an avid Hunter several hunting records
setting several hunting records which we already listed some of his ranked records but when the detective started
asking other detectives because keep in mind still at this point he's looking at
this guy going this guy's got a clean rrap sheet why all of a sudden out of the middle of nowhere this guy picks up
a a woman at gunpoint handcuffs her and does all these horrible things to her we
didn't go into detail and I didn't think it was necessary but it was a lengthy assault that he committed on this woman
according to what she's telling the detective so the detective's going yeah you don't just go from being a a nice
guy Family Man businessman it's a brutal rape it was yeah one day to being a monster the next so he starts asking the
other detectives like hey what I'm hearing about this guy and what I can see on paper isn't adding up there was a
hammer involved about Robert Hansen mhm and he at some point when he's talking to these
old skilled seasoned detectives that have been around for a long time he's starting to get less stories about
Hansen's hunting records and more stories about Hansen's police record right because we said that
for whatever reason those records hadn't made their way to their now computerized
system right one detective that he asked immediately referred to him as bad Bob Hansen AKA man who jerks off goats so
the records having not been fully transferred yet tell a very different story about this family man we and the
successful Baker We already mentioned this arson fire okay but then we have a story out of 1972 or
73 where Robert Hansen got into some bad trouble this was for two separate incidents one for attempting to rape a
housewife and he was also caught for raping a sex worker now it's a little convoluted but but things seem to fall
apart pretty quickly in both of these cases as they were trying to charge Robert Hansen with these two different
crimes from my understanding Captain they are very different crimes especially the housewife crime mhm
because this is a weird situation ation and this might be his if you want to use
some air quotes here his first sexual attack we do not know for sure but in this situation he stops off at This
Woman's house and he says that he needs to use her phone for whatever reason that he
that he gives her and I believe she allows him to use the phone and then he leaves without
incident he comes back to her place like 30 minutes later yeah why I think the ruse was that you know because his
head's a big pimple is that he convinced her that a bee stung his face and that's
why his face looked like that so he needed to call the hospital the using the phone ruse might be to make sure
that she's alone in the house yeah or that and so he comes back 30 minutes later knocks on the door she opens up
boom he's sticking a gun in her face and he's attempting to attack her and rape her whatever ends up going down again
those both those stories are a little convoluted but what we end up happening at the end the result turns out to be
that they dropped the rape charge and then reduced the attempted rape charge to an assault
charge which Robert Hansen pled guilty to so the short of it is somehow this all got reduced and now Robert Hansen
who has two incidents that point to him being a violent sexual offender he's now only serving 6 months
in prison that's because the system tends not to believe females so this ends up being a conviction for assault
with a dangerous weapon that's [ __ ] it was supposed to be a 5-year sentence so they didn't let him off easy on the
sentence itself but it was a 5-year sentence with a recommendation that Hansen received psychiatric treatment it
was after the 6 months after serving 6 months that he was transferred to a halfway house and and placed on a work
release program one year later Hansen was released on parole and parole was terminated after approximately three
years yeah again two two big crimes that he basically gets a slap on the wrist yeah well the victims are probably
traumatized for the rest of their freaking lives now remember this required him to receive psychiatric
treatment during his time in prison m and so during this psychiatric treatment the court ordered psychiatric
treatment what we learned is this was this was carried out by a Dr J Landon stated that Robert Hansen suffered from
a dissociative mental illness and suggested that Robert Hansen's criminal activity stemmed from that illness and
stated that Hansen's type of disorder was difficult to treat successfully but a subsequent letter from Dr Allan Parker
filed eight months later indicated that Hansen had made sufficient Improvement through therapy to Warrant his release
on parole unbelievable so you have one doctor saying this guy's got some issues that we find are going to be very
difficult to treat successfully and then another doctor saying at a later date he's been treated successfully yeah we
can send him out to parole I fixed him now there's one thing that is left out of that little statement and that that's
actually these are statements what I just read were found they're from Court um documents what wasn't in those court
documents is a statement that he made during the course of this psychiatric evaluation where he told the doctor that
during his teenage years and of course I think he's being a little deceptive here
but he says during his teen AG years he he often fantasized about doing all sorts of harmful things to girls and
women who rejected him yeah he seems stable that's not the end of his police sheet here
Captain because in 1977 Robert Hansen stole a chainsaw from a store in Anchorage for this Robert
Hansen entered a plea of guilty to Larson in a building he was sentenced to 5 years incarceration with the provision
that he be El ible for parole at the earliest possible date and that he received psychiatric therapy to case his
transition back into the community now hold on a second I just want to point this out assault with a deadly weapon 5
years stealing a chainsaw 5 years you can't even begin to compare those crimes correct and keep in mind had that
been had the the theft been his first charge you know the first time breaking the law he would have got a lot less for
that he probably would have got probation maybe one year Max but because he had had multiple
offenses and you know they they were aware of that they're going to give him the five years for that theft charge
they should do shock therapy on his ball the way that that I want to go through that that theft charge because we have
some detailed information on how that went down based on off of the court records so this took place while Hansen
was shopping at an Anchorage department store when a store security guard observed Robert acting suspiciously in
the store's Sporting Goods section he watched Robert place an old sales receipt on a chainsaw box and leave it
leave the store with it the guard apprehended Robert in the parking lot Robert Hansen described his thoughts
leading up to the shoplifting as follows quote I I looked at them and remembered
about 5 weeks previous my father and I had been cutting wood for our fireplace in his remarking three or four times how
much he would like to have one meaning a Saul my folks live in Oregon and were visiting us for 4 weeks he wanted a Saul
to use when he and my mother go camping along the coast I told my father that he
would be more than welcome to take mine but he refused I thought of this and all
the presents my parents had given me through the years and how wonderful it would be if I could give him a saw for
Christmas I also thought of course about my life at that time my wife and I had just bought this summer a new home and
put everything we've had saved for more than 9 years into that home I guess many
many thoughts went through my mind as I looked at the saws I wanted almost more than anything to please my father and
could just imagine the expression on his face on Christmas Day if I could give him that saw I walked around the store
some more and out the front door outside a man had just had a heart attack the police fire department and paramedics
were there to give him treatment my father is 69 years old and has had one heart attack and is very overweight
again I thought of the chainsaw and how pleased pleased he would be to receive it at Christmas I walked back into the
store again to the saws I thought there was a young man watching me but then he seemed to
disappear on the one box that I picked up there was a sales receipt I guess this is when I first really seriously
thought about taking the saw it seemed like nobody would know if I paid for the saw or not if they saw a sales receipt
on the box I took the saw and walked out the door and I was apprehended and arrested I know what I did was wrong and
I am very sorry for doing so Robert Hansen was 37 years old at the time of the offense and he had children he's married
his family has this Bakery he's successful he could afford to buy his father a saw I was going to say not
successful enough to buy a saw maybe not but the way I see it Captain is I'm seeing a guy who is manipulating
those around him when he's liar right when he's caught when he's innocent whatever he's a man who cheats and he's
a liar when he was caught for burning down the building he was able to convince his parents and his wife hey
I'm just the Fall Guy didn't really have anything to do with this convince him so
much so that once they put him behind bars they still believed him now he's standing in front of a judge at
37 giving him this sad story about his father's in bad health and what a miracle it would be if I could just give
my father this one gift on Christmas morning like he's Tiny Tim from Charles Dickens Christmas Carol or something
yeah it's just too bad you can't give your dad a new son that's right Christian so what we
see here I believe is a guy trying to tell this and sell this sad story to a judge the judge didn't believe it and
that's why he ends up getting the 5 [Music] years this show is sponsored by better
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app [Music] today we're back cheers and that's no lie we switched over to some umah hops mhm
tasty thank you Hansen Brothers this go ahead I was going to say you know they're they're kind of similar to us
because they have they have a garage themselves I believe their company's called threo garage or something or
three car garage or something like that sorry I was gonna laugh because I think most people own garages but what do I
know so well it's not a chainsaw right during this during this prison sentence and it ends up getting reduced and he
doesn't have to spend the full five years but what ends up happening here we did state that you know he has to
undergo another psychiatric evaluation during this time and this is when Robert Hansen is diagnosed with bipolar
disorder and of course we got to keep in mind this does not mean what we're going to
end up learning about him that's not typical of bipolar disorder and also given the time frame we're talking about
the 70s so a lot has changed and fortunately we know more about things like this now than we did back then at
the time he was prescribed lithium which I don't know if that's still something that they hand out I don't I don't know
much about it he wasn't required by law to actually take it but this will have this will be interesting
because we said that he owned a plane right he owned that plane that the victim led the officers to at the
Airfield right so he owns this plane but he was denied a license due to this medication that he was prescribed MH
again no one knows if he was actually taking the medication I couldn't find anybody to say either way way if he was
actually taking it but the way that he comes about buying this plane is pretty interesting because in the early
1980s Robert Hansen reported a burglary at his home he says that $133,000 worth of items were stolen from
his family's home it wasn't too long after this it's a lot of chainsaws that he purchased the
piper super Cub bush plane yeah this is a very very tiny plane so the thought is maybe he used this money that he
received from the insurance policy on the burglary to his home to buy the plane that's a big part of the story so
now we're going back to the investigation it is he responsible we have this sex worker that we found in
handcuffs a truck truck ever found her is he responsible for this he's saying no he's saying I don't know her I've
never seen her before and he he I believe he has an alibi as well yeah he has two Alibi so this makes it very
difficult for the police because if we're going to take this thing in front of a judge and say that this guy
abducted and and assaulted this woman but she escaped well if you put this thing in front of a judge or even a
jury of his peers you run the risk of going well it's this Working Girl's word against this successful Family Man
businessman who says he doesn't even know her never met her and he's got two other people that are considered to be
good upstanding citizens that are saying well he couldn't have done that because
he was with us that night the police are smarter than that though they know how things work and even though they can't
bring it in front of a judge yet they're going to still work on Robert Hansen and
so they're going to question him they want him to slip up they want him to give them information that they can work
with to build a case against him at the same time while they haven't officially filed any charges against him for the
attack for the rape and the Abduction of Cindy pson another body turns up this is
a couple months later and this is Paula golding's body turns up so so the police
are really concerned number one that they got this violent guy out that they believe are 100% to be guilty of what
Cindy pson said this guy did there's too much evidence to them leading them to him the problem is The
Alibi and Hansen doesn't really admit anything when they first interview him in fact he's a little bit rude when
detective Floy asked him about the attack and the sexual assault Hansen says to Floy you can't really rape a
prostitute can you Floy fires right back and says in this state you can so they're looking at this guy well I mean
that statement right there shows you what kind of respect he has for women well in particular the victim here in
this case right and maybe the other victims that you're seeing as well the missing women and the bodies that are
turning up so what we have here Captain is more bodies turning up a guy that's looking really good and you got a couple
detectives that are saying you know what look at this guy's past he was a violent
sexual offender before that's what he still is today we believe he abducted raped and was going to kill Cindy pson
but she was able to get away we think he's responsible for a lot of these other ones the other thing too that made
Robert Hansen interesting to them is that he owned a plane because at least one or two of the bodies were described
and we went through those articles described as inaccessible in an area that was inaccessible MH however if you
had a plane those areas were accessible right but then also think about it this way investigators gring okay yes we know
that she's a sex worker but parts of her story line up I went to this guy's house
then we went to a plane this is the guy mhm and he has those items now you have these two aliis so that's when the
investigators are going to go hey somebody's lying so we're going to we got to crack down on
somebody and like I said her story is making some sense so they're going to go after his Alibi well and keep in mind
too I mean yeah when they find her when police find her she was still handcuffed
she was still beat up yeah the scene to me is like the end of Texas chainsaw m here the first one where she runs out
onto the road and she's screaming and yelling and comes across that uh semi truck driver the problem though too then
becomes people that are familiar with cases such as this one well not such as this one but such as the Cindy pson case
of her Escape let's say there are plenty dozens hundreds thousands of cases where
a dancer or a working girl gets beat up by a boyfriend or a pimp and blames it on someone else that happens happens all
the time police don't suspect that here but that's where it could easily go to in the minds of people that are tasked
with the duty of determining Robert Hansen's guilty or not right guilt or not and you have these other people that
are saying well he couldn't have because he was with us that night we'll get into
that in a minute but what we're going to have here is very interesting because the police decide well let's build a
case against Robert Hansen he's our guy if we all think that he's our guy let's surveillance him let's watch him let's
build a case against him well what do we need to do let's forget about the the rape and the abduction as far as Cindy
Paulson's concerned we can always Circle back to that let's try to connect him to
the murdered victims or to any of the missing women so let's build our case against him that way one thing that they
do is they reach out to the FBI in quanico and they actually didn't think that they were going to have any good
result with this they just made a simple phone call and said hey this is what's happening here in Anchorage we got these
women missing turning up dead this is how they're found oh and by the way we got a guy that we like for this Roy
Hazelwood who we referenced in the trailer was the man that picked up the phone the FBI agent that picked up the
phone mhm he tells the officer the detective he says don't tell me anymore I I don't want to know who your guy is
tell me about the victims and how you're finding them Roy Hazelwood starts to shoot off back and he says I bet you
your guy is like this and I bet you he does this and he's about this age and this is where he lives he's probably
married he's probably successful he's probably known in the community mhm he's telling them everything that they
already know to be true about Robert Hansen Hazelwood says you know what take this to the local
FBI get get them to sign off on it and we will send you some agents okay so this next part is from the Criminal
Minds fandom page which is an odd and unexpected source for this week's case but turned out to be a very good source
the information is real good and laid out nicely so I was happy to find it there's a paragraph that says the
Alaskan investigators began looking into Hansen again and contacted the FBI who sent in their profilers this was
according to the site here Captain says John Douglas but some sources say it was
Roy Hazelwood they profiled that the killer would have low self-esteem a history of rejection by women and be an
experienced Hunter they also correctly predicted that he would take souvenirs from his
victims and would have a stutter so let's examine this for a bit and clear up any of the Douglas versus Hazelwood
bit as well for the record the phandom page is citing sources so they don't have anything
wrong they are just simply citing other sources right so they included both which I think is very responsible they
say it was either Roy Hazelwood or John Douglas that helped the Anchorage police
and the state police Alaska State Police with this case yeah I agree it's good that they put both of those in there so
first off anyone that has listened to the show for a long period of time know that John Douglas and Roy Hazelwood are
the two FBI agents that we have have talked about more than any others by far Hazelwood was my nickname in high school
we have referenced quoted and explored their Works countless times they are both ogs when it comes to the FBI's BSU
they work together and relied on each other's work at time and expertise plenty as have we I can see why this
part is confusing and the short answer is because they both worked on the case so it makes sense that you would see
Douglas's name and or Roy hazelwood's name the other truth about the FBI's profile is that in this
case the FBI was only brought in after local law enforcement already identified who they believe to be the killer which
is pretty rare right the in this case the Alaska State Troopers and the Anchorage police pretty much knew or had
that gut feeling that Robert Hansen was the one that was killing women mhm again
in fact they were calling him bad Bob Hansen but they needed some experts to help them secure a search warrant for
bad Bob this would be to search his home his plane and his three vehicles that he
owned at the time so FBI agents John Douglas and Jim horn were sent from Quantico out to Anchorage to assist the
Alaskan authorities attempted on more than one occasion to get a search warrant for Hansen but needed more
ammunition as the da wanted to make sure that the courts wouldn't find that the police were going on a fishing
Expedition right saying hey we think this guy's killed all these people we're just going to go in and toss his house
and search the plane and hope to find stuff that lead us to building a case against him right so John Douglas and
Jim horn shipped out to Anchorage brought into put together a psychological and behavioral profile of
the offender well one of the things I think about Hansen that's such a a t-ball shot
you know put the ball on the tea and headit it out of the park is we we know that he's a hunter and that he collects
trophies and he collects uh parts of the animals as trophies so if he's killing multiple women why wouldn't he keep
souvenirs or trophies of those kills as well well and really what they wanted was to say you know
what we brought in these outside experts who on their own put together their own
psychological profile of who the offender would be what his behaviors would be personality would be and then
we can take that and say you know what they created this independently we're telling the judge hey look this match is
Robert Hansen this match is the guy that we've been trying to go after and we can't can't get a search warrant for and
so once they have that they also want something else from the FBI these guys have worked these type of Serial cases
so these guys can put together a list for them of very specific items that they need to include on their search War
when they go looking for items at his home so in general that was really the main job of John Douglas and Jim horn to
put together the search warrant information items they were searching for and the profile on the suspect that
would commit these types of crimes MH this all works and the Da goes for the search warrant judge grants the searches
they're going to go hunting let's say at Robert Hansen's house now where Roy Hazelwood comes back
into play Not only did he answer the call and encourage the local authorities to pursue the FBI to get involved was at
some point during this case John Douglas he's hospitalized and this is for quite some
time and it took place during the Robert Hansen case Douglas nearly died from stress and you text me a couple weeks
ago and said hey I'm seeing stuff saying that they're working on season 3 of mine
hunter look at the time frame that we're talking about here yeah this would line
up with where they kind of left off on season two they might start working the Hansen case in season 3 and we'll see
Douglas's character in the hospital at some point yeah again so Douglas is nearly down for the count so Roy
Hazelwood is sent in to cover for Douglas and what he's going to do is he's going to prepare the detectives
that will be interviewing Robert Hansen after his arrest he's going to be telling them hey these are the tips and
things that you can use to try to get a confession from him or if you can't get him to willingly
confess here's some tactics that you can use to get him to slip up and give you information that you need unwillingly
Captain before we move on too far while we're passing around some credit we need
to make sure that we give a big batch of it to Alaska State Trooper detective Glenn Floy and Anchorage PD officer Greg
Baker both Floy and Baker were extremely determinated to catch whoever it was that was killing these women and burying
them out in the woods determined these were the guys that suspected Hansen was the right guy when others were
dismissing him and they didn't treat the victims alive or otherwise any differently than
they would any other citizen of the community here's what they wanted to do Captain and this is genius because
they're like you know what if we can find items that are rape and assault victim says she saw in this man's house
the gun that he used on her and other items that he used on her that's going to be enough for us to really take this
to the next level the next level is put this case in front of a grand jury that's where those false aliis will come
back into play and we'll Circle back to that but the other thing that they wanted to do detectives aren't stupid
they see that this guy he filed this insurance claim for $113,000 and then in pretty quick turnaround buys an
airplane uh okay well when you submit your report to the insurance company you have to submit an itemized
list of everything that was stolen from your property you now have an abduction and
rape victim who says I was in the basement and she's describing items that he had put on that list of things that
were stolen from his home so now you have an insurance fraud charge that you can bring against this
guy so when you have trouble convincing a room of people that this man is a serial killer
who's killed dozens of women MH what what is the best thing for you time time will be on your side but
you're afraid he will be killing other women in the process or could be destroying evidence in the process so if
we can lock this dude up on anything the insurance fraud charge the rape charge the abduction charge let's get him on
that put his ass Behind Bars and build a case against him while we have him locked
up sure enough they get into his home they start seeing things that he says were stolen from his house that he
received insurance money for yeah I mean this guy is a criminal on multiple levels
he doesn't really care for anybody's concern other than his to make sure that he's getting ahead the thing they really
wanted to find was that 223 Ruger mini4 which is the gun that they found the shell casings near a couple of the
buried bodies so they were hoping to find that in this search they would eventually
find it and the other thing that comes about is now they are taking this case to a grand jury so they can go back to
those two guys who say that I was with Robert Hansen that night he couldn't have abducted and raped this woman and
they can say you know what you told us that story now here's your subpoena you go tell it to a grand jury and if later
we can prove that you are lying you will be doing time yourself well how quickly
they changed their stories neither of those men were with Robert Hansen that night Liars
pants on Fires I want to say that they got a couple search warrants and looked through things and didn't find anything
and then they went got a couple different search warrants and went back because they didn't find anything like
just like out in the open I think they were coming up empty most of the time and then they found like some kind of
hidden area in his addict or something like that well you're you're exactly right um now but it's a little conf
confusing because think about the search warrants in general they are seeking items that would be involved in
different charges related to different incidents things that took place at different times right so some of the
items they are finding out in the open these would be the items that he claimed were stolen during the burglary the
house burglary right because he's he's very fond of his trophies his hunting trophies and a lot of the valuable items
that he says were stolen from his home are in fact those hunting trophies that he's got mounted to the walls so not
only were they out in the open they were on display and he was proud to show them
off so they find those right away but all that's going to get you in court is a charge for this insurance fraud they
want charges of murder rape and abduction and you're exactly right they're not finding the guns and the
torture weapons or dirty shovels or anything like that out in the open that would lead them to be able to bring
forward those types of charges what they end up finding and it's a weird situation because and it's really great
that Roy Hazelwood was able to kind of school these detectives and and prosecutors in how they should be
communicating and talking and interviewing Robert Hansen because what they do is they bring him in for
interrogation at the same time that they're searching his home his property in his Vehicles well it's a great time
to bring him in because he would know that they're searching so he's going to be constantly worried the whole time
that they're asking him questions what are they finding well and the stutter and I don't want people to email me I
don't know the science of any of this but in this situation what they're going with is that the man's stutter seems to
be directly related to how nervous he gets how out of control a situation gets for him and when he's uncomfortable when
when he's nervous when the stakes are high he stutters he can't control himself he
reacts and so what they wanted is just what you said Captain let him know we're searching his properties let's bring him
in let's question him at the same time while the the heat is already cranked up to 10 and what they get are some
information because as you said they're turning up empty-handed with the items that would lead them to the more severe
charges the the charges that they're really they really care about they don't really care about the insurance fraud
other than to jam them up long enough to bring these other charges they end up finding through some of his own words
Robert Hansen's own words that he has a false wall at some at some place in his home it might have been the basement
might have been the attic might have been both and inside of that false wall he had hid things like guns that he had
used and things that he had used to torture some of these women they also found an AV
map which was really interesting because it had uh several things marked on this
map and I believe it was about 21 or 20 or so things marked on the map having found this they already know where some
of the bodies were recovered the bodies that they've recovered are matching up with some of
the marks that Robert Hansen made on this map they know Robert Hansen made these
marks on this map because he said he told him where to find the map and where to find these other items they're in the
false walls the gun they were looking for is this uh 223 Ruger mini4 that they know was used to kill a
couple of the victims they didn't find it in any of the properties that they were searching because it was in his
boat which was in fact on his property but they didn't have a search warrant for the boat this so that's where they
had to go back and get a search warrant for the boat they couldn't afford to anything being found in the boat to be
thrown out of court at a later date so this [ __ ] turd had a plane and a boat yeah but keep in mind it it is
Alaska so like plane ownership is a lot more common there and these smaller planes and there small it was a small
boat it wasn't like a yacht no he still a [ __ ] Turd In The End when they find the gun
and run ballistics they are able to come back and tell him you know what this gun
you're which was his prized gun which oddly enough the profilers said he would have this very close relationship with
the the murder weapon and he would value this over many many other items in his possession he would treat it with a
certain high intensity level of care when they said to him look we've we've connected the bullets from your
favorite gun to four of the victims that's when they get a confession from Robert
Hansen and it's a pretty long one but I've reviewed it and the short of it is basically he's saying that women that
work the streets women that work as dancers they're not good people and so it didn't really matter that he killed
them that he should be allowed to do whatever he wanted with them because they're not the same as you
and I or everybody else so they don't have the same rights as he does oddly enough he doesn't
consider himself to be a bad person or didn't at the time of his arrest which is completely bizarre giving his police
record and what he was out doing although years yeah but it was fixed with therapy and he would end up
pleading guilty to this in the court of law and he ended up receiving a life sentence plus
461 years so he was never going to get out and then part of that plea bargain now
Alaska does not have the death penalty so that was never going to be an issue but part of that plea bargain was he was
going to have to tell the officers where they could expect to find the remaining
victims right but but he would never be charged with those crimes he could only be charged with the four murders correct
that that he was confessing to he was charged with four murders convicted of four murders one of
them is clut Annie who's never been identified he doesn't know who she was or claims that he doesn't know who she
was and he was also charged and convicted of the insurance fraud as well as the abduction and assault on Cindy
Paulson so that's how you get a life sentence plus 461 years he confessed to 17 murders overall they recovered all of
those bodies there still are some bodies that have not been recovered uh and I'm getting a little
confused I shouldn't say they recovered all of the 17 police believe that he's probably responsible for 21 or more
murders and they think that the reason why he wouldn't confess to some of the other murders goes back to his original
confession that some of the women weren't working at a show bar or weren't working the streets right and therefore
for whatever reason we've gone through this time and time again with these serial killers their confessions don't
always make a lot of sense sometimes they make up higher numbers sometimes they really downplay it yeah and I'd
also say possibly in this case there would be victims closer to the age of maybe 12
to 14 and a lot of times you'll see serial killers not willing to admit that they they killed a child yeah the
missing women that they have that are still outstanding to this date are of the age range of the the previous
victims that we've already discussed part of that you wonder if they were just left out in the open or tossed into
the river which is a little bizarre that he didn't use that time and time again these other crimes he was not willing to
confess to those for whatever reason detectives were also very concerned and remember we saw this in the BTK the BTK
case as well how can you have this seral killer operating for years and years and
years living with his family and nobody else knows about what he's out doing and so one thing that they had to
do was Interview his wife extensively not telling her what they're going to charge him with because they
wanted to be able to determine if she had any clue of what old bad Bob Hansen was up
to what they discovered is that she traveled a lot she was a good person she had no clue of what he was doing he was
doing almost all of this while she was away on travel with the kids in fact in a lot of these murders he called them
his summertime projects which she would be out traveling for the summer I believe she
was a teacher or something and had the Summers off but she also even tried to help the
police once she was aware of what he was guilty of once he confessed she even helped them try to locate some more of
his items that he may have concealed somewhere or buried on their properties so she was just another victim in this
long story of Robert Hansen but this guy again he's you know he's Beyond a monster cuz Not only was he raping these
individuals to take it individual out and give them a head start here I'll give you a knife or maybe I don't give
you a knife maybe I Leave You handcuffed maybe I take the handcuffs off but I'm going to hunt you down like an
animal that's what they really should have done they should have got him to confess and then they
should have said hey by the way we're going to take you out to the field where where we found a body and they should
have just said hey uh Robert we're going to give you a little head start and uh we'll be coming for you well and that's
one thing that they were able to determine Captain was in the earlier murders he was killing the victims
elsewhere and then bringing them to the burial sites in the later murders he's all wrapped up and in love with this
hunting it's like well why not combine the couple things that I love the most right ABD this woman a lot of the
physical attacks the the rapes and such sexual assaults took place at his home and then the the ruse of oh I take these
women to a cabin out in the middle of nowhere that's he's just putting them in a plane so he can land that thing and go
hunt them out in the wilderness and then bury them where he kills them and I want
to be very clear about this we told this story in the trailer about General zarof
who if you were able to El lud him for 3 days and get away from him and his hunting dogs that he would set you free
and he gave them a knife and some food and a three-hour Head Start yeah that's not the case with Robert Hansen no he's
he's hunting women who he lets out of his airplane who in many cases are naked still handcuffed and sometimes even
blindfolded so it's not like this guy was giving them any type of fair situation at all to to get free he was
setting up a system and stacking the deck against them so he could hunt them for fun with no worry that they were
going to get away yeah sickening exactly and I think some of the words from The Trial really sum up Hansen the best and
this is from the closing statements before he was sentenced to that lengthy prison sentence and this is coming from
the Prosecuting attorneys and they're talking about the victims and Robert Hansen and they say 17 may not be the
end of it meaning there could be more victims we feel from what we've learned that there might be more bodies out
there and then the prosecutor points to Robert Hansen and says before you sits a
monster an extreme aberration of a human being who has walked amongst us not even his wife of 20 years had any
inkling of his dark evil side his crimes numb the Mind Alaska serial killer Robert Hansen who killed as many as 21
women maybe more died around 1:30 a.m. August 21st 2014 at an Anchorage Hospital the cause of death appeared to
be that he died of natural causes Glenn Floy a retired Alaska State Trooper who was instrumental in Hansen's 1984
capture said quote on this day we should only remember his many victims and all of their families and my heart goes out
to all of them as far as Hansen is concerned this world is better without [Music]
him [Music] thank you so much friends for joining us here again in the garage I'm getting right up in your ear
if you need more True Crime garage check out our other show our bonus show called
off the Record if you're nasty and that's on Stitcher premium Colonel do we have any recommended reading this week
this week we are recommending death on Ocean Boulevard inside the Coronado Mansion Case by Caitlyn Rother this is
perfect timing as well to recommend this book because this case is coming up on the 10-year marker now this
unfortunately is one of those True Crime Mysteries was it murder or was it suicide Rebecca zah House's family
believes she was murdered as investigators found conflicting evidence of Foul Play in this book author Caitlyn
Rother explores all the theories that point to Foul Play and brings out some new details about the case check out
death on Ocean Boulevard find that title and many many more on our recommended page at true Crim garage.com again
friends we can't thank you enough for joining us here every week in the garage and until next week be good be kind and
don't let [Music] it [Music] you can start your day off right when you find a professional on Angie to get
your plumbing right first connect with skilled professionals to get all your home projects done well
Well Visit angie.com you can do this when you Angie that

Hunting Humans /// Part 2 /// 498

Part 2 of 2

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In the famous short story “The Most Dangerous Game” General Zaroff hunted shipwrecked sailors. The Zodiac killer used lover’s lanes in Vallejo, a lakeside park and the streets of San Francisco to shoot young couples. In the 70’s and 80’s someone was hunting the young women of Anchorage, Alaska. This week we explore the story of Alaska’s most cold blooded killer - Robert Hansen the Butcher Baker.

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Brief Summary

Robert C. Hansen, a serial killer, evaded capture for years, committing multiple murders in Alaska before being arrested and convicted.

Key points

The Abduction and Escape. A young woman escapes her abductor and provides crucial details to the police.
Robert Hansen's Clean Image. Despite his violent past, Hansen appears as a family man and successful businessman.
The Arson Incident. Hansen is convicted of arson after burning down a school bus garage.
Psychiatric Evaluation. Hansen's mental illness is noted during his psychiatric evaluation, complicating his case.
Inconsistent Sentencing. Hansen receives a light sentence for serious crimes, raising questions about justice.
Robert Hansen's Emotional Conflict. Robert Hansen reflects on his desire to please his father with a Christmas gift.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

You don't just go from being a nice guy to a monster overnight.

Discussing Robert Hansen's transformation from a family man to a criminal.

WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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