Edmund Kemper /// Part 1 /// 261 | Forensic Files

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chair grab a beer let's talk some true crime many have told the story of Edmund Kemper but you've never heard it quite
like this before most of the information in this case is well-known but I will lay some of it out
here Edmund a milk Kemper the third was raised by a mother that even when he was
just a small boy she very likely hated him Edmund like to play death ritual games
with his sister he tried living with his father but he didn't want him either he
grew to be a large man an extremely intelligent IDI was about six foot nine inches tall and his IQ near genius level
some call him the ogre of Aptus as an adult he was convicted of the mutilation slayings of eight women was this hulking
monster born evil or was he made evil this week we will study Edmund and those who have studied him before we will try
to learn about the angry little boy that lives inside this giant homicidal man this is a look at the murderous madness
of Edmund Kemper the co-ed killer well I'm not an expert I'm not an authority I'm someone who has been a murderer for
almost 20 years can you say how many people might be doing crimes like you were doing it would be a guess but it's
not it's a far more than 35 it isn't that impossible in this society it happens are there more people they
didn't give up how many she didn't give up I did I came in out of the cold and what I'm saying is there are some people
who prefer it in the cold you were able to appear like a ordinary person non-threatening - I
lived as an ordinary person most of my life even though I was living a parallel I'm increasingly sick wife other life
one that can let me back in the car I locked myself out she opened the door for me my gun was under the seat what
the hell am i doing telling you that am I looking am ia masochist am I looking to be tormented further we're trying to
show you just how awful the Scott how commanding his rages God the true-crime garage army loved the hit
series mine hunter the show based on the real-life events of the genesis of the FBI's behavioral science unit housed at
FBI headquarters in Quantico Virginia on mind hunter the main characters Holden Ford and built inch are essentially the
dramatized on-screen versions of famous real-life FBI agents John Douglas and Bob Ressler like on the show in like in
real life these agents worked in a special unit of the FBI that had many objectives but two of the most important
were helping local law enforcement agencies solve crimes and studying the new phenomenon at the time which was the
realization of the significant increase of stranger on stranger crimes serial offenders and serial killers which are
both terms now often use but back then serial offender and serial killer were new terms both coined by the special
agents working with this unit at the FBI this week we will be discussing serial killer Edmund Kemper who spent a lot of
time talking with the FBI over the years the general topics of discussion who was
he what crimes did he commit and why the first series of mine hunter features some of these dramatizations of these
talks with Kemper and the FBI now we both watch season 1 and loved it and one thing we have discussed on our show off
the record and I say this almost shamefully captain we both loved actor Cameron Britton as serial killer Edmund
Kemper heck sometimes during breaks we when working we would stop the show and we both were doing Kemper impressions I
particularly liked the scene when they were talking about the horrible murders Kemper has committed and he's offering
the agents another slice of pizza now this is disturbing on several levels because while I'm watching the show and
thinking to myself I could listen to Ed Kemper talk for day then the realization comes back to you
kicks you in the teeth with the reminder that Edie Kemper was a despicable human
being he's a monster and yet I find him somewhat charming and some might be saying well that's the TV version of
Edie kernel and it is but if you and we have watched interviews with the real Edie Kemper it's very similar so we felt
bad about that but we're not alone in our liking of the TV version of Kemper because actor Cameron Britton did win an
Emmy for his work on the show yeah well on some of the lines that they use in the show are direct lines from the
interviews that were recorded so let's go to the real-life version of the genesis of the FBI's behavioral science
unit and case study of Edmund Kemper now interviewing serial killers so it was it
was John Douglas that suggested to Bob wrestler that since there were so many serial killers locked up that they
should start talking to them to see if they would talk about what they had done and why they believed that they did it
one just like you here earlier with the pizza offering the pizza the FBI would offer them a special meal
like hey if you interview with us we can get you a pizza or we can use some specialty sub or something that you
can't get in prison well Bob Ressler agreed with Douglas and they decided that they were going to start
interviewing these guys and actually they decided that while they were in California helping law enforcement to
start there because as we all know from the various cases we have covered here in the garage California has certainly
had it's more than fair share of weird crimes and serial killers yeah so this was 1978 and they're going to go
interview their first serial killer and they decided to start with Edie Kemper Edie was housed at the California
medical facility in Vacaville California they decided their best method of going
about this was to show up unannounced and without permission from the FBI and without giving the prison prior notice
as well so this is for two reasons one the FBI these guys believe the FBI would have
told them no you can't go around interviewing serials right and - they also believe if the meeting was
scheduled with the inmate that the inmate would likely be considered a snitch by the other prisoners thus
possibly putting their subject in danger and making them far less likely to cooperate and agree to these interviews
so if they showed up unannounced the other inmates would just assume that they simply were investigating a case or
investigating something or other now we have to consider how terrifying this could be even for federal agents first
they can't go in there with their gun or weapon you know they don't want those things
working their way into the you know population right and second they have to sign waivers agreeing that if they were
to be taken hostage at any time that they understood that they would not be bargained for well on both these men
they're gonna go in as a pair so both of these men are trained but ed is also six
nine that's a big boy yeah basically locked alone in a room with six foot nine inch tall almost 300-pound man and
then another thing that Douglass was concerned about was the IQ of Edmund Kemper now I gotta be honest with you
here captain I've seen this IQ kind of all over the shop I've seen it listed as high as 146
and as low as 131 yeah or 31 well I do know that he was tested at least twice so that might be the cause of some of
these variations I also understand that there's multiple versions of the what we
would just call the IQ test which could give a different score so to speak sound
like credit scores there's different top levels of different credit scores yes and so we have Douglas who he thought to
himself and I'm sure he discusses with Ressler in advance he was a little worried that you know these guys are
used to being the smartest guys in the room and now they're in there with this giant and they're worried that he's
than them you know so physically he could overpower them mentally he might be able to manipulate them or to
[ __ ] them to put it quite frank right but like I said both these guys are trained individuals these guys have
made it to the FBI so they've dealt with some of the scum of the earth mmm oh yeah so they're gonna I mean but just
imagine if you're not trained at all right some of these police officers have taken criminals that have done heinous
crimes and they had to lock them up handcuffed them put them in the backseat of their car and transport them to
another prison or to another jail by themselves mm-hmm and so yes this is a this sounds crazy to us to go hey you're
gonna go in to this little steel cage with this killer but uh but I also think these guys are a lot tougher them that
maybe he gave him credit for well you and I discussed Wickline which was a somebody that was put to death
here in Ohio for a couple of murders yeah and Wickline was a large man who was quite strong as well and he was
intelligent too he was not as big as Edmund Kemper his IQ was probably not as high as Edmund
Kemper Zinn and he he was a guy that you know we spoke to several officers that said I knew guys that had to transport
him I knew guys it had to be in a room with Wickline and they told they went to their superiors in advance and said I
refuse to be alone with him right if I'm going to be in a room or in a car with this guy
there better be multiples you know there better be a bunch of good guys and only
one Wickline so the thing with you know and like you said these guys are trained
these guys are skilled individual Douglas was a I believe he was a boxer in in college you know so so a bit of a
tough guy I guess yeah I mean this lucky if you're a trained boxer and then you have to you had to deal with the scum of
the earth those guys aren't off they're not afraid of this guy but keep in mind just the
reach alone on Ed Kemper I mean six foot nine yeah but you know the difference between a norm
human in actual trained boxer I think that anytime somebody says hey I trained as a
boxer you don't want to fight that guy right that guy knows how to throw a punch the thing no to that it's tough
for us regular civilians to get over is just the idea of forget about his size or his intelligence but just the idea of
being in a room with somebody that you know is not only capable of murder but according to the case file it tells you
that he enjoyed it yeah I'm not trying to put a damper on this but I also think some of the
psychological warfare on this is you know II d69 he kills women hmm you know I mean like it's not like he just killed
anybody in everybody right you mean you mean he's not like like Russell Crowe entering the Coliseum
fighting - yeah are you not entertained are you not entertained so the John Douglas and Bob wrestler
they were interested really in truly and anything that Kemper wanted to tell them
but per the unit's study they were primarily interested in getting answers to the following questions one what
leads a person to become a serial sexual offender and what are the early warning
signals to what serves to encourage or to inhibit the commission of his offense 3 what types of response or coping
strategies by an intended victim are successful with what type of sexual offender and avoiding victimization for
what are the implications for his dangerousness prognosis disposition and mode of treatment
alright so question for you because if you watch mine hunter they don't really have questionnaires or really much of a
objective at the beginning or that's at least what the show portrays hmm so do you think that this was the first the
first things that they're trying to get answered and then that developed more later
I think that probably the between the two of them John Douglas and Bob Ressler that this was their primary goal right
from the onset of everything right I just don't think that they put pen to paper to come up with an
effective strategy so according to this show the TV show and what I think we can
kind of infer from the show is like you said they come up with basically a questionnaire hey here's kind of a
script to not share with the subject but between the two of you you know that you're working to get answers to these
set of questions right but that script happened once they got a doctor involved correct and I think what that the whole
genesis of that would be and where the smarts of that comes into play is these guys were extremely busy and what I mean
by that is when this first started they weren't being paid to or their superiors
didn't even understand that they were out interviewing these serial killers they were actually supposed to be there
on other business they're training local law enforcement agencies on how to detect and deduce certain crimes they're
also working with local law enforcement agencies to actually solve crimes so while they happen to be in the
neighborhood so to speak they're like okay well what prison is nearby and who is locked up for life or you know any
let's go talk to them yeah both of these guys were also original members of New Kids on the Block so they had a lot of
stuff going on so most of the time in the beginning until they got their grant money they were doing this on their own
time in the evenings and on the weekends so I think the script and I think putting together a list of actual
questions is really just a way to maximize their time in their efficiency while they're there talking to him
you've watched plenty of interviews with Ed Kemper you you know it's obvious he can just talk and talk and talk and talk
for hours and hours and hours when he graduated he was most likely to have a podcast in his high school class so the
the interesting thing here though is you asked do you believe that these were were questions that they saw
answers to right from the beginning yeah does it because if I'm wrong it made it
seem like we don't know what to expect so let's just go in there and see if we could get him talking I think that's the
truth I think that's the truth on some level we do know that this was their objective because this was later
released many years later this was after they got their grant money it's kind of
to champion their cause so to speak they released these sets of questions hey this is what we're looking for when we
interview these guys in an FBI news bulletin to the rest of their department in their agencies I'm confused in real
life with the TV show but also in this TV show wasn't the first meeting a solo meeting where he actually didn't go in
with his partner well that's a dramatization in real life there were three individuals this sat down with Ed
Kemper the first time and I don't know the name of the other officer involved and I can to be honest with you I think
it was a local FBI agent you know Douglas in wrestler not local to the area right I think that that FBI agent
probably worked because they had not been in a prison yet and they didn't know that hey you could just walk up
within flashier FBI badge and most the time that works to get into the prison right well cuz a lot of these prison
guards or local officers had a lot of respect for the FBI well think about two of the questions that they listed there
within those four you know and they're all kind of lengthy questions if you really dissect them each one is actually
multiple questions worked into one question right but the simplicity of it is two things one what is the early
warning signals of who this person could turn into be I know the answer too much
flicky flicky and then too this is interesting what can a victim do if you find yourself it caught up with an individual
like this a serial killer serial rapist what can I do to try to get myself out of this situation and it be
a viewer wise you know are there things that I can say things that I can do are there actions I can take or reactions to
this madman that I can use to to save my own life and get me out of this situation right because what we've seen
with Bundy you're gonna see with Kemper you're gonna see with other serial killers that they will have moments
where everything you know this plan that normally takes place normally these serial killers it's like after the first
attack or the second attack then they start going well this is how I'm gonna do it this is my ruse to get them in my
car then we go here then we drive this and then we do this and then I pulled my gun on them and they kind of have a
routine that they're building but there's also times where it's like my routine was to pick up pick up a
hitchhiker or my routine was to pick up a sex worker and they will do that and they just drop the individual off and
there is no murder right so what made those difference than the actual attacks the simplicity of both of those
questions and actually in my opinion almost all four of those questions is really early detection of a serial
killer and preventing more loss of life you know we have how can a victim get out of this situation one as law
enforcement you want a victim to get out of the situation not only to save their
own life but to help you solve the crime help you make an arrest somebody that could later identify somebody that did
something terrible to them or at least attempted to do so and then we have the early warning signals you know the early
signs of of the creation of the serial killers if I could just interject for a second this has been on my mind all
morning but we're talking about serial killers so it's relevant okay don't give me those eyes big shout out to Bill burr
the comedian I was watching his show last night his cartoons show on Netflix f is for family and there's a scene
where he's arguing with this kid and he starts fighting the kid mm-hmm and then the dad comes up and he's like what do
you what are you doing you're trying to fight my nine-year-old son you what what
are you some kind of [ __ ] right and then you notice that the guy's name on his name
badge that's fighting bill Berg's character his last name is Dahmer and he's then he starts calling his son
Jeffery and the kid has blonde hair with the little glasses and I just thought I
can't one I can't get away from true crime but how clever it is that he just kind of threw it in there like I wonder
how many people watch that and didn't even know that it was Jeffrey Dahmer and true crimes kind of seeped its way into
all different kinds of media well on the fact too that like the cartoon is based
around that time period where Jeffrey Dahmer would have been manjil okay okay well but a key thing to keep in mind
when talking to these serial killer types and we've touched on this a bit already is that they are often skilled
manipulators and some of them quite intelligent which as is the case with Kemper so it was it was and is extremely
important that the FBI agents know the case inside and out in order to hopefully get the answers to the
questions and to advance the FBI's ability to prevent detect and capture serial offenders and serial killers now
the agents are going to want to learn everything they can about Kimber's childhood environment relationships
crimes habits and his arrest but they're gonna want to know this in his own words
right from his mouth and when we come back we will talk about some of the things that they learn
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your mother worked there yes I was also involved in killing coeds because my mother was associated with college work
college co-eds women and had had very strong and violently outspoken position on men for much of my upbringing my
mother was a sick angry hungry and very sad woman I hated her but I wanted to love my mother and I watched the alcohol
increase I watched her social life drop off I watched her get bizarre she had terrible pain from her life earlier life
her upbringing a failed marriage with my father I'm a constant reminder of that failure I hate
to distill it down into such the one word reality is like dad there's a lot that leads into that happening but that
is what happened they represented not what my mother was but what she liked what she coveted what was important to
her and I was destroying it why did you actually kill the girls my frustration my inability to communicate socially
sexually I wasn't impotent but emotionally I was impotent I was scared to death of
failing in male-female relationships I knew absolutely nothing about that whole area even if just sitting down and
talking with the young lady I need to be able to really communicate and ironically enough that's why I began
picking people up and I'm picking up young women and I'm going a little bit farther each time it's a daring kind of
a thing at first there wasn't a gun I'm driving along we'd go to a vulnerable place there aren't people watching where
I could act out and I say no I can't and then a gun is in the car hidden and this craving this awful raging eating
feeling inside I could feel it consuming my insides this fantastic passion it was
overwhelming me it was like drugs it was like alcohol a little isn't enough at first it is and as you adjust to that
psychologically and physically you take more and more and more it's the same process so it finally came down to the
thing of do I dare bring this gun out already realizing if that gun comes out something has to happen
Edmund amel Kemper the third was born December 18 1948 in Burbank California now during his childhood Kemper was
physically and emotionally abused by his alcoholic mother Claire Nell who was divorced from his father before the
divorce ed was close with his father after the divorce Ed's mother hated him and it's believed this is because Edie
looked almost exactly like his father one of EDS favorite games to play as a boy was a game that he invented in which
he called it gas chamber or the gas chamber this would be a game that he played with his sister where they would
take turns basically pretending to be gassed or gassing one another and then he would
ride around pretending to be in pain on the floor as he's pretending to die because of this game that they were
playing now why Claire Nell and Ed's two sisters slept upstairs she made her son at the age of just
eight years old sleep in the dark and cold basement alone at night this is likely that she
did this for many reasons but the reason most often cited for this treatment or abuse was she was afraid
Edie would molest or rape one of his sisters so and we've heard in several interviews Edie described this and he
describes it in a way that makes you really realize how tormenting this was for him this was a
form of some kind of psychological abuse because he was afraid to be in the basement by himself right but there was
there any evidence that he would do this or is this just a made-up nonsense fear
by his mother oh then he would rape or molest the sister right that's a really good question and I've this is the thing
that I've often wondered about because now let's say you're his mother you're now in a situation where much later in
life this is projected as being a form of abuse and torment that you instilled on only one child out of three right you
kind of signaled out this dude singled out this dude and put him through hell and you know it's it's kind of like a
Cinderella situation right treat one bad and the other good well but you hit on something important here what if there
is some type of evidence that he would have molested or maybe even raped his sister yeah then in a sense you're
preventing the torture or abuse of another of your children you see what I mean by putting him in the basement
well right and you're not puttin him out in a shed right but now this is also the
50s so the basement they're not what basements are now a basements must have been terrible in the 50 Ryan they're
probably wet and I I heard also that he could hear rats possibly yeah so the thing when we talk about Edmund Kemper
here that we should be completely clear about regarding this story is that there
has been variations of his childhood and variations of his story throughout the years I do wonder what is fact and what
is fiction after all these years have passed I do know from an interview that he gave he
described sleeping in the basement and described it simply as every night he would go down he you know he would he
would walk down the stairs right so picture like an old rickety wooden staircase he would walk down the
stairs and there was a single light at the bottom of the staircase and he would you know it has the string hanging
from it he would reach up and he would pull the string to turn it on and then he said that that would only light up
basically that corner of the basement right well he slept in the far corner away from that so he would walk all the
way because he was afraid of being in the dark in the basement by himself well that was that's the age where your
mom says go get the towel out of the basement you go okay and then you brave the courage bits middle of the day and
you turn on the light and then you grab the towel and now you have to turn off the light but you have to run up the
steps you're so afraid that something's gonna grab you right so he would walk the length of the basement basically to
the other end where there was another light hanging and he would put you know with a string and he would pull the
string and turn that light on and then he would walk all the way back to turn off the light that was near the stairs
and he there most reports and stories would say that he was locked in the basement every night I don't know if
that in fact is true because his own words state that he he was in charge of closing the the basement door
he actually references that he would get yelled at by his mom because of the the
cold would seep up into the house if he didn't close the basement door and she didn't want to feel the cold wow that's
so nice of her I don't know if he could hear rats you know then that's the other
rumor was that he could hear the rats scratching around in the night hour if that was just made up in his head yeah
or if it's just the story to make it worse than what it actually was and all reality let's say there were no rats at
the very least we have an eight-year-old boy somebody who's very young mentally young as well emotionally young sleeping
by himself in a dark cold basement to which it's so cold that he's required to shut the door so the cold doesn't seep
into the rest of the house and at the very least in the middle of the night he's gonna hear the furnace turning on
and off so there would be noises that would probably startle him and wake him up or scare him throughout
the night all right and on top of that why are you there why are you in the basement if you know it's
because your mother fears this then it's late and again if there's no evidence that you're gonna do this or even
capable of doing that do you then become capable of doing it because you are essentially being accused of being
capable of doing it well the other thing too captain is it is no question that his mother was an alcoholic so there
could be a skewed perception on her behalf as to what was going on in her home if she was drunk or under the
influence a lot of the time while she was home but Kemper did engage in psychotic and psychopathic behavior
early on so he started off by dismembering his sister's dolls this was all based around a violent fantasy that
he would later tell us about killing his mother and his sisters now one book describes this scenario pretty simply in
something something like this stating that as Edie sat awake in the cold dark basement at night and his hatred grew
and grew he fantasized about killing the females upstairs so right because he's less than right and they made him less
than but also just because your son rips apart your daughter's baby you know our
Barbie dolls I don't know if that's a sign of anything the fact that he is stating that it was a replication of how
he would murder his family now that's that's a whole different level but a kid just ripping apart a doll that's
sometimes boys will just be boys yeah and he said that he started off by like popping off their heads you know so like
if you picture like a Barbie doll or any kind of doll they usually had like that
plastic head connected to a much stiffer stronger sturdier plastic body and he says you know he would get like pleasure
from hearing that that noise when he would pull the head from the body right well later he said that he actually
believes he even received some kind of or got some kind of sexual arousal by doing this and look I'm just gonna
put this question out now because we're gonna be talking a lot about his viewpoints on things and again this is
this is also hindsight is he just making some of this stuff up later in life to make him seem more interesting I mean
this is a guy that wants to talk he wants to be heard he wants people listen to him are they more likely to listen to
you if you're coming up with these and arresting scenarios mm-hmm well and here's Captain where I think we should
probably drop a bit of a warning for the listeners as we're going to get into a couple things that I know some people
don't like to hear about and this is typical behavior of a lot of these serial killers so some of you might want
to just kind of fast forward about a minute minute and a half or so so one of these behaviors that Kemper Kemper was
showing us as a young man when he was a teenager early in his teen years this included
the torture and killing of animals now the family had two cats one of them he buried alive and he later dug it up in
which he stored the carcass of the cat in a closet in their house and then the second cat he killed with a machete so
this is a different situation much different one buried alive the other he's actually physically attacking it
with a machete to the point of he's getting blood on himself during the course of killing this animal right but
this is a huge step up from dismembering dolls yes and actually I found this quite interesting some psychologists say
that cats are the most killed animals by these young later to be serial killers because of a couple of psychological
reasons one most by far most serial killers are men and many have suggested that the cat on some psychological level
is representative of the female gender right and then a lot of these guys kill for their hate of a single female or of
all of the gender well I think you see this with dahmer you also saw with the cat torture
videos of Luka Magnotta aka pukin ah ha de but in that scenario with the Luka Magnotta case his victim was was a male
yeah and so that's that's why they believe that cats are usually you know we see the torture of different animals
we certainly did when we talked about BTK and as you mentioned several others but seems to be the cancer the most
often killed by these guys now this is a good time for us to introduce what the mine hunter guys would refer to as the
homicidal triad well hold on this is a good time to apologize for people that we probably says that two and a half
minutes fast forward two and a half minutes so you probably caught that tail in and we're sorry about that yes so the
the homicidal triad as the mine hunter guys would later come up with this is after years of studying these serial
killers and interviewing them and coming up with and getting information straight
directly from them so these behaviors these three behaviors that we would see time and time again in the childhood of
these eventual serial killers are these three types of things one fire starting to bedwetting and three Cruelty to
Animals I'm a fiow stata twisted firestarter hey so uh with that edmond is he wet in the bed is he making the
wet basement wetter I don't know about wetting the bed or fire-starting but we do know he was doing the cruelty to
animals but this is I mean throughout their studies this is something that they would see enough to the point that
they came up with a name for it the homicidal triad and this is something that they would see out of these serial
killers where they would often exhibit one or two or all three of these behaviors during their the course of
their childhood well there's different levels too of like pyromaniacs I mean when you're a kid especially a young boy
and you yet a box of matches or you get a lighter you're gonna light every toy that you
can on fire mm-hmm but then sometimes you're hanging out with one of your buddies and they're like to the extreme
and I think that's kind of what they're talking about there's always gonna be somewhat of a fascination especially
with little boys playing with lighters or matches yeah yeah so people out there listening shouldn't freak out if they've
experienced them I would freak out if your son or daughter is doing the cruelty to animals thing that seems to
me to be a different level but like you said some kids play with fire some some kids wet the bed
I mean right and I don't know how much I think years later I'm curious to see how
much they think the bedwetting is actually involved because it's not that's not a destructive behavior when
you compare it to the other two you know it's not a destructive behavior at all did you have a wedding of the bed
problem well but they're talking about seems like you're defending this one no I'm not defending any of it what I'm
saying is it ain't what they mean by bedwetting is of of a considerable older age right you know if you have a
three-year-old kid in there wetting the bed sometimes they're just a three-year-old kid right anyway it's
what we do know is Edmond grew up to hate his mother and at the age of 14 he ran away from home this is in search of
his father and he finds his father in Van Nuys California so when he caught up he was looking for a better basement
well when he caught up with his father his father had a new family and he didn't want Edmond staying with them so
Kemper said just him being around gave his stepmother migraine had headaches so he was shipped off to go live with his
father's parents on a 17 acre farm in North Fork California yeah but can you imagine though okay let's say you're not
well okay say you are married and then you bring your son around and your wife is saying I get migraines hmm this kid
gives me migraines you're really gonna pick this Looney tune over your son well you got to keep
in mind he's already chose to not choose his son he's right not been living with
his son he's already walked away from that job and from that responsibility and that's why I but you also yeah I see
I wonder what the actions were between you know or what kind of relationship was there violence or anything between
Kemper's mother father what was their dynamic like because if she is you know this alcoholic Looney tune then you'd
think on some level okay yeah I didn't choose you then but hey things are probably pretty bad for you so maybe I
should do something well he would have had a good idea and when I say he I mean Edmonds father would had a good idea
because I believe his and I don't remember the exact words but something something similar to this he stated that
being with Claire Nell with Edmonds mom was worse than the time he spent fighting in the war and he was from my
understanding like he referred to his time in the war he was in in served I don't know which war it was but he
served over a year in combat to what he referred to as suicide missions and he said being with her was worse and more
frightening than being in those suicide missions saying there you go so you would have to so you're you're a bit
yeah but well here's my point though it's worse than a suicide mission and that's what you're putting your
eight-year-old son through in his opinion yes and then when your son finally shows up and leaves there and
says look I didn't like living there so I've ice I sought you out I came and I found you I do have to give some some
credit here you know I'm not liking Edmonds father at all I don't I don't say he sounds like a he's a piece of
[ __ ] I don't appreciate him not being around for Edmonds childhood or for taking the responsibility of being a
real father but what I will give him credit for is sending him to his parents home
rather than shipping him back to Claire now alright so use a piece of [ __ ] but
you a little less piece of [ __ ] because you sent him with your parents well he
probably figured hey if I can't raise you here then I'm gonna look I turned out yeah maybe he considers he turned
out pretty fine and he maybe he has good fond memories of his childhood and thought well I'll send you to go live
with my parents he imagine what this country would be like or what this world would be like if
if every man actually manned up and raised their kids well that's a big portion of of this study into the serial
killers and why I said that we'll take a look at this situation and try to figure
out if Edmund Kemper was born evil or if he was made to be evil because the very
simplistic thought of a serial killer is this that they cannot have and and you can email me you can hit me up on the
blog you can do whatever you want but you it would be tough to convince me otherwise for a person to knowing and
willingly and plan out the murder of multiple people of multiple individuals they cannot have the same or share the
same emotions that quote-unquote normal people have so why don't they have the same emotions as we do what about is
that excluding like soldiers well again that's that to me is a different situation a serial killer is a very
defined type of person and killer okay where a soldier is a different definition of a killer
technically they both are still they both are killers but there are they're huge differences between the two so
again why don't they had so then the question then becomes why don't they have the
same emotions why don't they have the same responses as we would to their environments into behaviors around them
into treatments that they're receiving and this when you go back and you really get to
probably the simplest form of this is does it start with being a little baby and does it start with having a mother
that didn't want you and having a father that wasn't there and not developing those emotions and not of you know
developing those behaviors empathy and not developing empathy at a very young age while and also knowing that it
doesn't always have to be that order sometimes it's the mother that rejects them and the father is still around but
he is just uh not such such a great father so there I think you see it happen multiple ways yes and not all
serial killers had a horrible time growing up a horrible childhood but some of them did and I do understand that
there are a lot of people out there that had bad childhoods because look if if everybody out there that had a bad a
quote/unquote what they have determined to be a bad childhood right grew up to kill people in the double digits and the
it you know ten or more people yeah we would be running out of people on this planet so it's I'm not saying it's an
excuse it's more of a question of why and how alright so his father ships him off to live with his parents yes on a 17
acre farm in North Fork California and it seems like Edie got along well with his grandfather but not
so much with his grandmother his grandmother was a bit of a strict disciplinarian his grandparents got him
a 22 rifle for Christmas for small game hunting there are differing stories about what I'm about to tell you but the
simple truth of it is this that on August 27th 1964 fifteen-year-old Edmund Kemper used his Christmas present to
shoot his grandmother in the back three times as she sat at the kitchen table typing afterwards he stabbed her three
times with a kitchen knife this is because he says that he didn't want her to suffer he wanted to end it for her as
quickly as possible the reason being for killing his grandmother he's stated over the years that there's
been several reasons but the one that he cites the most often is he wanted to see
what it would feel like so his grandfather was out it was not home during the time when he killed his
grandmother and the reason why I say there are differing stories about this is because there's the way that these
stories go is either his grandfather was out in town shopping and then returned home or he was out hunting and the IDI
was mad that he could not go or upset that he could not go hunting with his grandfather well if his grandfather in
fact wasn't out hunting then we know he wasn't mad about that right regardless when his grandfather returned to the
home as Edie would describe it they had a brief interaction where his grandfather waved to him you know he's
getting out of his truck and he waves to him and like I said it seems like the two of them had had a good relationship
you know and Edie waited till his grandfather turned his back and he shot his grandfather he would later then hide
the body in a closet and he said that he shot his grandfather for reasons that all seemed to stem from not wanting him
to have discovered that that he had just killed his grandmother yeah maybe not wanting him to see the body maybe not
wanting him to be disappointed and in kemper yeah probably several things here so not wanting him
to be angry ahead or upset with that disappointed in that as you had said or also at the loss of life of his wife
right you know his longtime companion the weird thing though here captain and we've actually heard this with several
other serial killers and and how reference BTK as a prime example here his Edmund immediately felt like at any
time a whole bunch of people were going to come to get him like everybody in the
whole world probably knew what he had just done and that they're going to come up there they're going to arrest him
they're going to attack him they're going to kill him any number of those things right
and we heard that with BTK Dennis Rader would say that often when he would go out and he would kill somebody or kill
multiple people he felt like in the first 48 hours afterwards that the police were just going to show up at any
time at his door knocking and saying hey we know what you did buddy now you're arrested it's like this paranoia sets in
yeah that's interesting and so Edie said that in that situation he was going to shoot and kill anyone
that would have approached the the farm or the house at that time that was his mindset at the time so we almost have to
count our blessings here in some form right because he's out on a 17 acre farm out in kind of the middle of nowhere if
he were in a major city when he had done this can you imagine all the innocent people that weren't coming to get him
that would have probably had been killed that day I mean you even something as simple as the person delivering the mail
right you know we'd have a scenario where it would be he'd be a mass murderer and they would have caught him
and then the other the serial killings would have never happen well mm-hmm that's tough to say that stuff to
citizens not tough to say when I what I'm assuming is that in the 60s 64 if you had a guy that went on a rampage
going around killing people in a city that the cops are gonna come and arrest that individual yes but essentially
isn't that what ended up happening and what I mean by that is that okay so we get lucky that there's nobody else there
and at some point his paranoia it wears off and he calls his mother and explains
what he had done and he is going to be picked up like you said he gets arrested for killing his grandparents right
Kemper was committed to the attesa Darrow state hospital for the criminally insane
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right we will talk more ed Kemper the co-ed killer tomorrow back here in the garage until then everybody be good be
time and don't litter

Source: https://www.podbean.com/media/share/pb-yfbzg-a10809

Edmund Kemper /// Part 1 /// 261 Part 1 of 2 www.TrueCrimeGarage.com Edmund Kemper was raised by a mother that very likely hated him, even as a small boy. Ed liked to play death ritual games with his sister. He grew to be a very large man and extremely intelligent. Ed was about 6 foot 9 inches tall and his I.Q. was near genius level. As an adult he was convicted of the mutilation slayings of eight women. Was this monster born evil or was he made evil? This week we take a strong look at Edmund Kemper - The Co-Ed Killer Beer of the Week - You’re a Good Man Charlie - Brown Ale by Santa Cruz Mountain Brewing Garage Grade - 3 and 3/4 bottle caps out of 5 It’s the shopping season so save some cash with our codes and sponsors! Download the Poshmark App for FREE and use invite code GARAGE5 to get $5 off your first purchase www.BrookLinen.com - use code GARAGE to get $20 off and FREE shipping www.AwayTravel.com/GARAGE - use code GARAGE for $20 of a suitcase www.Thoughtfully.com/GARAGE - use code GARAGE for 20% off your order

Brief Summary

This episode examines Edmund Kemper's life, crimes, and the FBI's interviews that shaped criminal profiling.

Key points

The Story of Edmund Kemper. Exploring the life and crimes of Edmund Kemper, the co-ed killer.
The Charm of a Monster. Reflecting on the disturbing allure of Ed Kemper during interviews.
Interviewing Serial Killers. The FBI's groundbreaking approach to understanding serial killers through interviews.
Kemper's Childhood Trauma. Edmund Kemper's abusive upbringing shaped his violent tendencies.
The Homicidal Triad. A psychological pattern observed in serial killers: fire starting, bedwetting, and animal cruelty.
The Homicidal Triad. The concept of the homicidal triad is explored, detailing behaviors seen in serial killers.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Was this hulking monster born evil or was he made evil?

Questioning the nature of Edmund Kemper's evil.

4:28WatchDec 5, 2018

Tension

65/ 100Some tension

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