Delphi Murders /// 4 Years Later /// Part 1 /// 468 | Forensic Files

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all right [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] four years later and no arrest in the Delphi case as the days continue to pass
on we keep asking Indiana State Police are they getting any closer to a break in this double homicide case
it's been four years since the murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German and still the voice of the suspected
killer continues to haunt Delphi Indiana that audio clip of the Killer's voice telling the girls to go down the hill
was released by Indiana State Police investigators say Libby recorded the suspect's voice and snapped this photo
on her cell phone before her young life was taken away tonight the killer still on the Run
being chased down by many of the investigators who've been out there since day one like Carroll County
sheriff tobles and B seems like it was just yesterday when we started this thing 13 year old Abby and 14 year old
Libby were out on a walk on the Delphi historic Trails on February 13th of 2017. when investigators say they were
approached by this man the girl's bodies were found the next day in the woods about a mile off of the main trail in
2019 Indiana State Police released an updated sketch of the suspect that composite looked nothing like this
previous sketch which had been the face of the investigation for two years it's like wait a minute now we got to start
all over and we've got to explain why they're doing what they're doing they've obviously received enough information on
the first sketch to realize that that person isn't the right one several agencies still working this
investigation all of them we're having like a team weekly meeting in Delphi the Carroll County Sheriff
dedicated two detectives in his small Department to follow up on leads basic footwork legwork so to say phone calls
what was this individual doing on February 13 2017 you know where they work where they traveling for the past
four years police have served search warrants questioned Persons of Interest and received thousands of tips still no
arrest we still have those up and down days I guess it's the easiest way to put it
hello [Music] the general statement across the board from law enforcement and the Press is
that there is no new news in the four-year-old Delphi murders case and Captain I say we gotta get rolling we
gotta Jump Right In because no new news heck we got a whole bunch of stuff to talk about here
first it was announced that there would be no press conference on the fourth anniversary of the murders of Liberty
German and Abigail Williams the two middle school students who went for a hike on the Monon High Bridge Trail in
2017 and did not return alive a questions about the case from both the local community and across the nation
and Beyond have been escalating for more than two years so a few weeks ago the local newspaper the Carroll County Comet
ran the following readers invited to submit questions about double homicide Carroll County Sheriff Tobe lessenby
agreed to answer questions solicited by the comment from readers and others alright Captain let's Dive Right into
this I actually submitted some questions myself hoping that they would be chosen
and we might get some answers to these questions so the questions I sent in are as follows first I did a little butt
kissing it it always helps to do a little uh you know Grease the wheels a bit here well it's better to do butt
kissing than butt sniffing there you go so I started off by saying dear Sheriff lessenby thank you for your hard work
and continued efforts on the this very difficult case I truly appreciate the dedication shown by you in the Carroll
County Sheriff's department now for the brilliant questions is there any reason to believe the killer had some kind of
help or assistance and is this making this difficult case even more complicated than normal by help or
assistance specifically I mean a second perpetrator or maybe someone who dropped
the man off or picked him up or do you think someone is providing a false Alibi well I also think people lean to the
idea that there's two individuals because there's two sketches and they look so dramatically different from each
other yes and you've often heard me say that I believe that the bridge guy has some kind of help I don't know what that
is and again it could be someone unknowingly helping this guy or even willingly the second question I
submitted was if the man on the bridge was totally alone where do you think he parked his vehicle if a vehicle was used
at all again a great question and this is something that law enforcement pointed out as one of the kind of their
updates was they were looking for a vehicle they never tell you the color the make or the
model they don't tell you if it's a sedan or if it's a truck but there is a vehicle that they wanted people to come
forward if they saw it I believe on the 13th uh no update from law enforcement on
that vehicle I would have to go back to our previous Delphi murders shows which we've done seven of them so far the
first was Delphi Murders episodes one and two parts one and two I'm sorry episodes 110 and 111. this is back from
May 2017. so we've been there since the beginning and we've continued to cover this case and look into it when
something new comes out and one of the great things about this case about the True Crime community and this case is
right from the beginning people were promoting pictures that law enforcement put out the sketches that they put out
then we've had some updates a big change two years after the murders when they released the new photos but we've also
had some big Publications on this a podcast that was pretty huge down the hill and then just recently released
around the four year anniversary the down the hill documentary on HLA yeah we Revisited the case in July of 2019 and
this would be after that big press conference with the news updates when they changed to the new sketch and said
the old sketch would now become secondary it was during that news conference that they also released
information about the vehicle that you just mentioned I do believe there was some very brief and vague description I
would have to refer back to those episodes but our first two episodes there was really nothing as far as good
information the timeline was much shorter than what we now know it to be so really we were able to lay out a
really good detailed timeline with much speculation in those later Delphi episodes which again we did four parts
in July of 2019 so again sticking with the vehicle idea my third question is is there still
reason to believe that the vehicle previously mentioned in news releases is in fact involved or has that vehicle
been cleared as you said captain they asked for tips about this vehicle we've received no update as to if it's
still information that they're even looking for at this point right and then some interviews I've seen law
enforcement still state that they believe they're one tip away from solving this case so without the long
lead in it I'm now going to go through the questions that were selected and the answers provided to those questions by
the sheriff in charge Tobe lessenby the Carroll County comment starts off by saying there are five sections of
questions to this story that's pretty interesting they broke them down into a few different sections to keep it nice
and neat and easy to follow for the reader and the five sections are as follows those specific to the double
homicide case questions concerning internal and external Communications questions about the crime scene and
adjacent Terrain questions about the command center and questions about the overall safety of
Carroll County the first question Captain is do you consider this a cold case and why and
Sheriff Tobe lessenby responds absolutely not a true Cold Case provides no leads no information to follow into
this is not the situation with the Abbey and Libby investigation our investigators are still on a daily basis
receiving information which can be looked into in essence the well has not gone dry he
says well what's really interesting about the down the hill HLN documentary is when they talk about the early
involvement with the FBI how they didn't hesitate they got him involved at one point the FBI agent said there was
hundreds of Agents working this case next question how would this case be handled from the
beginning had there not been any audio slash video of the person of interest answer obviously we would have had to
rely on other evidence gained from all sources is there any area that you can see like I just said there was hundreds
of FBI agents work in this case is there anything that sticks out at you that you
would have done differently if you were in charge of the investigation that's very difficult to answer because I don't
know what information they know to be fact right that that we are uncertain of stuff that's probably just been
speculation and rumored about so far in this investigation I did recall hearing tobles and be say you
know he was asked one of course he's asked this question here but uh he was asked a similar question
some different words involved but very similar question and one thing he did say was you know we called some dogs in
some Bloodhounds that were going to come in and help us search for the girls when
they were still missing right and he says you know if I could go back and do it again what they did was when they
found the girls unfortunately if they find them dead when they found the girls these dogs
were being brought in from out of town if not out of state we called that off and he says if I could go back and
change at least one thing I would have changed that I would have still let the dog show up because maybe they could
have provided a a trail maybe not necessarily to the killer but at least the dogs may have been able to
follow the Killer and we might have been able to learn some of his movements or at the very least what way he he left
this area right because I I think the difficult thing here is I don't think there's any clear going back over all
the interviews going back over different podcast episodes and the documentary I don't think there's any clear definitive
eyewitness that can say I absolutely saw Bridgeman enter or leave the park I think there's people that believe they
saw Bridgeman but then they say ah I think I saw Bridgeman but he didn't have his jacket on at that point
so again I think this is a big misstep and one of the things when you look at the crime scene we know that this
perpetrator took these victims down across the river to the other side did he come back across that River leave the
park entrance or was his vehicle parked somewhere else or did he leave on foot and I think if you look at the two in
the close proximity of the crime scene there's multiple locations on that river that look like you can cross like a bed
of rocks or where it's just very low water and there's Pebbles and stuff around so I think that dogs would have a
really good shot at keeping the scent of the perpetrator and one thing that the sheriff is on record as saying is that
look we have a lot of what he calls very good speculation about what direction and how the perpetrator would exit sit
this area but he said it's just that it's just very good speculation we do not know for certain how he left this
area did one or more than one set of footprints lead Searchers to the area where the girls were found
and lezambi gives the following answer this speaks to an evidentiary aspect of the investigation and I would
respectfully prefer not to answer this is interesting because I I don't know if you've seen this or heard this before
about the potential of footprints that being from bridge guy and or the victims or both
that may have led the people looking for Libby and Abby to their bodies I I had not seen this speculation before
it's it's certainly not out of bounds it's something anybody would have thought of I had always heard the rumor
that there was something that alerted one of the Searchers and kind of got their attention
and at the same time they very quickly saw what they thought could be one of the victims
and then they they walked in that direction and confirmed it was what they thought they were seeing well what we do
know is confirmed with law enforcement is like I said the perpetrator took the victims across water so even if the
ground is hard and not leaving footprints around the Water Area there could be some muddy spots
and if the perpetrator crossed that water multiple times good possibility that somewhere he left a footprint is
there partial DNA or a full DNA profile of the suspect if there is DNA has it been run against a genealogy DNA
database and his answer is very similar this also speaks to evidentiary aspect of the investigation so he declines to
answer however he is on record saying we do have DNA now is it that of The Killers we don't know
yeah it's very difficult here there's a lot of Rumblings online that I've heard that they do have DNA I obviously can't
confirm that but the other rumor that I hear is that this individual was at one of the searches and from people being at
the search they said well look there was tons of people in the community searching and what were they doing they
were smoking cigarettes they were drinking bottled water sodas dipping what do you say after every episode
don't Litter these individuals were littering all over so is it possible that from one of these items they have
DNA but it's not actually at the crime scene it's just with inside the park yeah so let's take that a step further I
I believe if I'm going to kind of read between the lines here and try to figure out what what it is that he is saying or
what it is that he isn't saying uh because these are two very different answers when asked in person he says yes
we have DNA we just don't know if it belongs to the killer or not keep in mind the questions we're going through
here today I believe that these questions were submitted to the sheriff and he's able
to sit down read through them and think very clearly he doesn't have to think on
the Fly he can pick and choose which ones he's going to answer and that's why I think you get different answers at
different times when he's interviewed in person he's a little more forthcoming and I think it's because it shows his
General nature he wants to be a little more transparent he wants his agency to be the the heroes for this community
this community is in desperate need of a hero or Heroes to find bridge guy and and hold him responsible for this
terrible act what we have here Captain I I have to look at his words and say okay
well what what does that mean as far as the DNA goes well it means a few different things to me one the DNA has
to be of a type that you can immediately go I can't connect this to the killer because
we've reviewed enough cases that there are certain types of DNA that if found you know the likelihood of
it belonging to the Killer is like 99 chance right if if we were to find semen in the direct area or of the victims or
on the victims you would expect that to be from the killer if you found blood that didn't belong to the victims on the
victims or near the victims you would believe that that came from the killer so I don't think we're talking about
that type of DNA I think we're probably working with either touch DNA or like you said saliva or DNA that would have
been transferred to an item that would have been discarded in the area the problem with this doesn't necessarily
have to be the Searchers themselves that certainly can add to it but this is a this is outdoors this is a public place
there could be beer bottles or cigarette butts or any type of debris that they could find someone's DNA on they just
don't know if it's related to that case to to this double homicide was that debris discarded there on the day that
the victims were killed I think ultimately that's the Crux of this case and the the downfall of this case is
most cases don't get a spotlight this one did the evidence that they do have they have to keep close to their chest
but they keep getting the spotlight so they they're trying to give the information out but again they have to
keep things close to the chest and I think that's because it's getting such a big Spotlight that's what leads to
rumors conspiracy theories and and a bunch of other stuff the public has been given two sketches is the thought there
is more than one person involved or is the second sketch the suspected killer please clarify the two sketches this has
been a point of confusion since the second sketch was released and his answer is these were produced by
information gained from Witnesses near the area during the time frame the primary focus by investigators is on the
second sketch Juan Kelsey Libby's sister I think three weeks ago in an interview
that I was listening to they were asking her about the second sketch she never mentioned that they got it from
eyewitnesses she said law enforcement told her new technology is the reason why that there was a second sketch and
what a frustrating thing and maybe a misstep in this investigation to spend two years of your life doing nothing but
promoting this picture to turn around and and try to go back to those same resources and outlets and say oh by the
way that picture is not correct here's the one that we want you to present to the public and that's certainly a
possibility but I want to Echo what what the sheriff is saying here because that's been their stance from Jump
Street and it's been the The Stance of the sheriff's office as well as the Indiana State Police both agencies have
always said that the second sketch was based off of witnesses that were near the area during the time frame and
they're really they're really honing in on the day that the the two girls went missing and that's the information that
they are very strong on and really looking for more information regarding that day not as much
the second day the day that the two were found the next question is was video collected throughout Delphi from
February 13 2017 including video from the building across from the abandoned CPS building multiple pieces of evidence
including anything technologically based have been gained at least information followed into or brought to the
attention by the investigators at least information followed into or brought to the attention by the investigators is
the second part of his answer which seems a little bizarre to me if you can get surveillance footage
from anywhere surrounding the park the bridge those private properties right any way
in and out I'm hoping that they didn't just sit back and wait for people to bring that to their attention the
investigators need to be out pounded on doors pounding the pavement and collecting that information themselves
they knew by noon or one on the 14th this is a double homicide I I guess maybe he's just giving a
a PC answer I don't know but it seems a little weird the wording brought to the attention of the
investigators well again we have zero evidence or zero confirmation that any eyewitness or surveillance was caught of
a guy covered in blood and I believe this individual would have been covered in blood I think it would
have been absolutely impossible for him not to be and then I don't really understand this question I'll read it
though captain and if you uh can figure it out just uh throw something at me and
and tell me what's up question no matter how distant do you have the man walking
on the bridge videoed by Libby on any other video okay I see what they're saying now do do we have video
of him doing anything else or is there any other video of this man I guess walking elsewhere or seen elsewhere his
answer is this is close to an evidentiary information question and I prefer not to respond this is
interesting because we we know his statement of however Bridge guy left the area is all speculation it might be very
good and very informed speculation but we can't say for certain how he left the area
if you had other video of this guy of bridge guy on any type of surveillance footage or or anything that's in this
question here you think that would help them pinpoint that down a little better I I
have a hard time though believing that there's no other footage of this guy anywhere else
I I probably would lean more towards the the thought that there is video of this
dude someplace else they just don't know that it's him like if you have some bad
distant grainy footage of of random people walking somewhere you might be able to go well he might be in this
footage but we have six people ten people 18 people in this footage that are all unidentified what
we do know about the bridge guy picture it's coming from video that Libby took the speculation at first was that it
didn't come from herb nobody knew that a lot of people thought it came from like
a trail cam or something so maybe that's also why people are going hey well if if we thought their original picture
came from a trail cam there must be a bunch of trail cams out there and did one of them pick up and take a picture
of the murderer well this goes to that same thought why have no other pictures from Libby's
phone been released to the public and he gives a similar answer this is close to
an evidentiary information question and I prefer not to respond but again when he's interviewed in person
we get a slightly different answer to a slightly similar question and it was look we have additional video we have
additional audio however there's nothing and I believe his exact words were something like
there's nothing Earth shattering that would be on there that would help anybody in the public go okay well now I
know who this is I think that Echoes what something we've said before we have to believe that they've provided us with
probably the best portion of that video for us to look at they've probably provided us with the best portion of
that audio for us to hear that's the best chance that the public can help to identify this guy or submit
the right tip that will lead to an arrest in the Delphi case foreign [Music] [Music]
welcome back cheers mates you always make us feel so welcome there Captain well I just want to go back again it's
the Crux of the case you asked for a bunch of questions all your answers are going to be well we
can't share that information I mean again a lot of cases don't get the spotlight that this one's getting I I'm
so happy that four years later we're still talking about it we still care we we still want answers we still want
Justice and people are trying to do everything they can it's it's almost like and here's my other issue you
collected the questions you sat down and took the time to answer them why not just every question that you're
going to answer is the ones that you put out to the public the ones that you say
well we can't answer that we have it's there's evidence there and we can't release that you don't need to print
that well I think you got to keep in mind we got two different entities at work here we have the the newspaper who
collected all the questions decided which ones would be asked to the sheriff submitted them to the sheriff and then
he's he's answering the questions back to the newspaper and then they're the ones printing them so they would have
had hundreds of these questions if not maybe a thousand or two and they're the ones that are kind of
curating if you will the questions that are submitted to the the sheriff and I think in you know just to be
I mean maybe they're just responsible they're trying to be transparent correct so the next question is why have you
never released the FBI's suspect profile to the public and Toby's answer is it has been discussed with the FBI but
again it is currently felt it is too close to the evidentiary element now we talked earlier about what would I have
done different or you or or anybody else out there this is something I would pivot from I would I would pivot to if
you do have an FBI profile if you if you have one and you think that it's good that needs to be released pivot that
should be released to the public I I well I think the profile might might be more important than the actual sketch
because I think a lot of the sketches coming from that fit that video and that is so grainy that I look the guys down
the hill audio was cleaned up and as an audio engineer I would tell you that clip
is completely dirty and that's cleaned up by people that are connected to the FBI so I think the these sketches
especially after four years have done a lick of good other than maybe create some speculation on the internet if they
would have released the profile with the sketch people would have started eliminating people right away and not
set in as many tips and maybe not sent you on as many wild goose chases are there regrets about not securing the
morning Heights Cemetery as a possible part of the crime scene and then they go on to say I.E possible
exit route of the killer or Killers his answer is at the time it was uncertain exactly what the totality of the
circumstances were yeah I get that and I and I'm on his side they didn't know exactly what they
were dealing with and right it's it's hard to go back in time you can't and and change certain aspects of your
investigation question do investigators believe the bridge photo and voice belong to the
same person and this is a question that keeps good question it's a good question
it keeps recycling this question over and over again though throughout the the years here and his simple answer is yes
uh we believe the bridge photo and voice belong to the same person right which makes me believe that it's one
perpetrator right and we have Doug Carter from the Indiana State Police who said in the the famous press conference
the two-year press conference he said you know the voices you hear remember before it was just down the hill right
and then it became guys down the hill he specifically said before releasing that
audio that the voice you are hearing is one person the day the girls were found how quickly
were you personally on the scene how quickly was the crime scene secured how many police and emergency response
individuals were physically present at the crime scene what departments were represented at the scene his answer as I
recall a very short amount of time less than an hour by law enforcement immediately I do not
recall without referencing reports mainly Sheriff's Office Indiana State Police and the FBI well I think at one point
there's a statement in the documentary again it's a documentary so it might not be factual but they claimed that there
was at least four crime scene technicians investigating the crime scene and basically saying that there
was tons of evidence that they were able to collect at the crime scene and I can't recall 100 Captain but I think
that the person that gave that statement was from Delphi Police Department or Indiana
State Police it was a member of law enforcement that said that that there were four crime scene technicians on the
scene and that I think he said they worked the scene for about four days all together so a lot of time spent
there and you wouldn't spend that long of time at the crime scene if you weren't continually finding new pieces
of evidence or just pieces of anything really because you don't know what is evidence and what is just it what was
just already there I think that because the murders took place Outdoors because the victims are found outdoors and this
is an area that while very remote where the bodies were found this is also parts
of this area are high traffic as far as foot traffic goes I think that that complicates things and
that that adds to the list of things that you collected during that time when you're when you're trying to piece
everything together what what you do is you collect everything you can possibly find
and then later determine if it if it has anything to do with the crime at all now
when you say high foot traffic areas the bridge well yes I would guess the uh the moon and high Trail
system itself um the bridge maybe but uh yeah the the other side of the bridge is not going to
be have the same level of foot traffic you know and again certainly where the girls were found is not going to have
nearly the amount of foot traffic as you would expect on the trail system itself
yes and and there was also some foot traffic some people instead of taking the trails they would follow the River
Line so there would be some foot traffic along the River Line yeah and the the other issue too becomes that you have
such a big area to cover as far as the crime scene texts go right because we know that at least an
article of clothing was found in the creek itself the bodies were not found in the water so I mean you can and then
the we know that the bridge guy was on the bridge and the victims were on the bridge we know that they were dropped
off at the trailhead and walked the trail system to get to the bridge so you can see if you close your eyes and try
to imagine as you hear the words coming out of my mouth you can see this crime scene just growing and growing and
growing uh very quickly for investigators one we also know that we have a shoe that was found and we know
that her phone wasn't found at the the crime scene so you have to take those pieces of information and triangulate
all of that together where was the phone found that's not clear but it's it's clear that it wasn't like connected to
the the crime scene maybe it was on the other side of the river I'm not really for sure it's just the statement they
made they found the phone because of it pinging off the towers when they found the bodies and when they found the
phones were separate times so that is what leads me to believe that the phone was not in the same location as the
bodies right that's why what I wanted to clarify because the whole place is a crime scene right so it found at the
crime scene just not right with the bodies is what what we believe in the public domain there have been
descriptions of the crime scene descriptions of items found and the positioning of the bodies do you feel
there was an excessive number of persons present once it was determined to be a crime scene I guess there the simplest
form of this question would be were there too many people involved in the search that they have contaminated the
crime scene and once you go from looking for two girls that are alive and well or
or maybe injured or just lost to you now know you have two murder victims how quickly were you able to secure the
scene to make sure that it wasn't trampled all over and his answer is once secured by law enforcement as a crime
scene no I would surmise that Searchers did not immediately know what they had come
upon that's interesting be because when we had the former prosecutor come out and I I think this is a little
irresponsible but whatever I'm irresponsible myself I'm I'm not I'm no saint Captain but when the former
prosecutor came out and said that there were signatures left by the killer at the crime scene and specifically where
the bodies were found and he said that he he would label that as three or four signatures and then
another person from law enforcement asked a very similar question once provided with that information from the
former prosecutor pretty much confirmed that that there would have been about three or four
different signatures now I've seen the public hears this and they go crazy they go crazy trying to figure out what those
signatures could be and of course a lot of people's minds go to something very bizarre that you would
see in some not so great thriller movie out there one of the things that that I saw that was speculated and and maybe
continues to be to this day was that the killer wrote a word or words at several places in the crime scene and
one that gets a little difficult because they're Outdoors so where is he riding this did he bring
things with him to leave leave a note or more specifically I've seen it discussed
that it was one word in particular that was just written over and over again and
to me that seems very very much like a psychological Thriller Velveeta Cheesy type movie thing here
and what we do have though is we have the sheriff who's saying look law enforcement got there as soon as we
could obviously the Searchers found them first but we got there as soon as we could and
as soon as we were there it was a crime scene and it was secured and we pushed everybody out of the area and he goes on
to say that he would surmise that most of the Searchers were not really aware of what they had come upon
the Searchers coming upon two victims and not really understanding what they've come upon kind of contradicts
the idea that there was some kind of display made of the crime scene yeah I think that if if
you they were able to see writing all over the place one one you'd have to if there was writing the obvious spot that
it would be would be on the victims or their clothing because you're outdoor I think it's it's actually very telling
that that whatever these signatures are probably most of the people in that search party would not recognize this
type of stuff to be quote unquote a signature right and like you said there's no
there probably is not some bizarre display going on at the crime scene either if if we're to believe these
words to be fact then what that means to me is that someone probably spotted a body
and then very quickly told people not to I'm going to walk a little bit closer to
confirm that I'm seeing what I think I'm seeing and we're calling it in we're not
we're not venturing into this area well based on the HLN documentary they were saying a Searcher actually spotted them
by zooming in you know like they were looking through their phone and zooming in on the camera so
maybe they spotted him from a distance so they wouldn't be able to see the signatures also if you're around the
creek bed you wouldn't be tall enough to see over the brush to actually see the victims because they're kind of in a dip
correct and often in these search parties you know it's still very early on that they're looking for these girls
they're looking for them on the second day when they're found less than 24 hours after they went missing so you
might have a different speech that is given but often there are you know everyone's instructed usually
in these situations to if you see this then then behave this way if you see this
behave this way and you often especially when they believe that they're looking for a victim or for evidence which is
not what they would have believed at the time they would be instructed to not approach
anything if as a Searcher if you see this do not approach the scene do not approach this
item or this article you have said you recognize the voice on the video this is this is probably the most
scary slash haunting portion of these questions you have said you recognize the voice on the video do you recognize
it as a jail inmate other law enforcement team or person you know outside your employment sphere and
lesson B says I still have not been able to pin it down in my 30 plus year career
or even as with most of us meaning law enforcement we have heard certain voices but have difficulty in recalling exactly
who it is well a couple thoughts right away is when they're asking the parents about what they hear or did they
recognize the voice how they point out how calm the individual is and I never really
thought about the energy that the person was using that this perpetrator was using but when you listen back to it the
energy is very calm and I really like the idea of people pointing out when he says you guys down
the hill it's not a command it's not angry it's very authority figure or parental figure and I think that's
very important when I hear guys down the hill and exactly that the mannerism and
the tone you're right it's very quick and to the point and instructional at the same time
I to me my mind jumps to somebody that's used to directing a group of of children or a group of
young adults and my mind immediately jumps to teacher and I don't know why captain please don't let anybody Stone
me to death in the in the center of town here but my mind jumps to gym teacher I
don't know why that's always like popped in my head of of I think it's really the
tone in the mannerism of something that's kind of a laid back quick to the point in instructional guys down the
hill yeah quick to the point point no fake in cooking them seems like a pound of bacon um I agree with you Jim teacher
look into that aspect but I think you can broaden her your horizons a little bit somebody that might have coached
Little League baseball what I would like to know because the girls were out of school that day and that's why they were
out on the trail to begin with and I do not want emails from people that look we
got a lot of people that are teachers in our audience and our listeners a lot of
them are fantastic teachers I only want to know specifically to that that school system because you know
Captain everything changes from area to area right and even on the calendar year
for a school in particular but for that direct community and that direct school system I would love to know because the
girls were off of school that day were the teachers off as well or was that a day where the teachers would have been
working in some capacity but without students next question the families of the Delphi victims have appeared on
countless shows and internet videos for interviews Libby's grandfather Mike Patty stated he called cop buddies and
asked if they could ping Libby's phone were you or one of your deputies the cop buddies he called some of you will
remember that when the girls were missing Mike Patty at some point I think when we again I'd have to refer to our
old episodes but I think we put this on our timeline like in the six o'clock hour of the day that they were missing
could you could you look into their phones and lesabi's answer is I would suggest he was referring to someone in
law enforcement and it could have been even dispatch initially the ultimate decision was a law enforcement decision
so I think what tobles and be saying here is just because it's a cop buddy doesn't mean that it has to be somebody
at his Department that Mike Patty was reaching out to Libby's grandmother Becky Patty with whom she lived and who
is the mother of her biological father Derek German stated during an interview there were countless cars at the trails
that day not all of them looking for the girls did The Paddy family post on social media the girls were missing
before contacting the Sheriff's Department this is interesting because I would like
to a better answer here it's I do not recall but I know we were not immediately contacted because the family
did not suspect anything negative and we're simply conducting their own search right so you're like me what I'd like to
know and somebody from the community probably could let me know was this information
distributed through Facebook and where people reposting this or sharing this with uh people in the community on
social media from my understanding a couple things happened one I believe that they were on the night news now
some areas that's 11 o'clock or 10 P.M I believe they were on the night time news with hey we got a couple missing
girls and we're still out here looking for them Mike Patty in particular is is interviewed briefly in that statement
that is released to the public via the news I do believe that Mike Patty's family somebody in the family did put
something on Facebook kind of calling to action people to come help look for the
girls so this this would be an easy way to get that information out to all of your friends and family hey if you're
available can you come and help us look for these girls we don't we don't think anything terrible has happened here we
just we know that they were dropped off near the moanin High Bridge and the trail system there we got a lot of
ground to cover it's getting dark it's getting late it's getting cold all hands on deck we need some people to
help us look for these girls so I don't know exactly what was sent out but we have statements by the family that they
were using those methods to try to rally some troops into helping them look and just so we're clear do you remember what
time they found the bodies well it was right around noon the next day and do you know what time
the search started that day on the 14th I believe it was at 6am next question is
who notified Anna Williams that her child Abby was missing and when did that notification take place his answer is I
would have to reference earlier reported information so we don't really get an answer there question it has been stated
in a press conference that quote it was all over by 3 30 on February 13th end quote this statement was based on
what information his answer evidence I do not recall a specific time though but rather a
timeline this is curious to me because it doesn't really answer the question 100 percent it was all over by 3 30 on
February 13th I see our timeline that we've put together and I've seen everything else
that's been brought up in this case and it does in fact look to me like this is very likely the situation that they were
abducted and killed in the same area in a very short period of time we do know from
statements from law enforcement and interviews and the documentary The Bodies were found
less than a quarter a mile away from where the bridge ended has n't determined the girls were killed
where they were found again this is a question that keeps kind of recycling through over the years answer
yes based on information known yes question why did you and the prosecutor choose to
do an interview with headline news HLN yet ISP Indiana State Police said there would not be a press conference this
year again who is leading the case the state police the county sheriff FBI or the County prosecutor you can see the
confusion for the public and the mixed signals so to speak expand on who runs what parts of the investigation who
determines when there's a press conference this is an interesting answer the general sense the leading agency is
the agency who routinely patrols and responds to calls for police services in a given jurisdiction
so in this case in his professional opinion the crime occurred in the county of Carroll County so they are considered
to be the lead agency his Sheriff's Department the state police the FBI the prosecutor's office and the
investigators from the prosecutor's office and other agencies are considered assistant agencies coming on board to
assist the Carroll County Sheriff's Department he does go on to say being a small agency we frequently rely on
larger agencies who have many more resources to help with investigations this is
commonplace throughout the United States smaller agencies will sometimes relinquish an investigation to a larger
assisting agency such as the state police but I feel strongly that since this crime occurred in the county I feel
we are the lead but with many partners additionally when decisions which we feel are major to the case are
being looked at are investigative partners are consulted like a huge Think Tank and we all reach a decision which we all
agree upon next question the public has heard for four years the investigation is one puzzle piece from being solved
what is that one piece specifically is it a name is it John Doe told me he killed the kids or are you looking for
confirmation of what you know John Doe was not at work he has a blue jacket he cut his hair on February 14th or I saw a
guy with a bloody jacket at 4 pm on February 13th at the gas station you are not giving the public a lot to
work with yet no arrest in four years aren't you worried about more victims is the suspect dead or incarcerated so that
is why no press conference or additional information is being released his answer is the person specifically
responsible for Abby and Libby's death our team of trained experienced and professional investigators will know
that one piece when they see it I think that's a very clever answer by Mr lessenby there yeah definitely and I and
I think he's right if they know more than we know and they're working this case as much as they're telling us that
they are that one piece when they have it they'll they'll recognize it immediately and they will act on that
information as soon as it's presented to them I get the feeling that they know who it is or have a good idea of who it
is I think they've got a lot of tips they've ruled I think people out they've had a lot of people that the True Crime
Community has said oh we need to look into this guy this guy just created this murder this guy is a rapist this guy is
a pedo in the area while all their DNA would be on file I believe they have some form of DNA and
it's not matching those people but also these people are not matching the signatures the profile other things I
think they have a small list of people maybe if it's not just one that they're focused on
it's a small list and I think some of them I keep hearing from Kelsey that this will be solved one day and she
said in the last interview I listened to her she said something to the the point
of that this individual will slip up and I also kind of heard that you almost get
that feeling I don't know if it was said directly like that in the documentary but you get that feeling from law
enforcement too and so that makes me wonder if they're like well if it's not one person that they have a small list
of people and they're waiting for something to slip up I think based off of information that we currently have
where we have the sheriff saying we have DNA we just don't know if it belongs to
the killer or not we have fingerprints we don't know if they belong to the killer or not
what that would tell me is that you can't really clear anybody 100 percent unless they have a rock solid Alibi for
the time in question right and based off of evidence there other than than an alibi they're not able to clear some of
these people or potential suspects however you're exactly right Captain what they're going to do even though
they cannot clear a specific person they will prioritize these individuals and they will put some
on a high priority list and some on a lower priority list because the people on the lower priority list they may have
compared things with that individual and things that the crime scene and such and
said you know what we can't clear him but he's not a high priority for us because of a b and c
he doesn't fit exactly what we're looking for because of a b and c maybe it is his DNA doesn't match any that we
found maybe it is that his fingerprints do not match any that were found and even if we don't know if we have either
of these things of the killer we do suspect that we would find this person's fingerprints and or their
DNA at the scene and we don't so we make them a low priority suspect I think the problem with the signatures
is we got to take that and look to it for future evidence because look this this guy let's say he is a
serial killer there's very likely that these might be his first two murder victims he may have committed some other
crimes along the way they usually ramp up to this but if these were his first two murders
then these signatures at the murder scene may not be signatures that would be present at any of the other crimes he
ever committed or thought about committing and so these signatures are more something that we would use for a
future murder that oh if you saw these three or four signatures then law enforcement might believe that it's the
same guy I do like that statement by by them saying those same words that I just
used if if law enforcement recognize these same three or four signatures at a future murder we would
probably recognize immediately that it's the same guy that makes me believe that
these have to be fairly specific signatures yeah now signatures themselves can be very simplistic they
don't have to be these you know crazy wild things it could be something posing the bodies is a signature
okay opposing the bodies could be mean something as little as they face them in the same direction or laid the victims
out so and put their feet together and then their arms over top of their chest it doesn't have to be anything
grandiose like you would see in Hannibal Lecter the TV show it's it could be something as simple as
they were posed in that manner they were both placed face down in the the detectives have determined that this was
they didn't fall that way that he chose to manipulate the crime scene and place them that way and I don't want to get
too much into the signature aspect of it because these are child victims and and I I have
some very strong suspicions of what I believe those signatures to be and maybe we'll talk about that sometime on off
the Record or another show but um the thing I keep going back to Captain is what doug Carter says when
he's speaking directly to the Killer around the two-year anniversary when he says I can promise you
that those two girls are not in the same way that you left them that day meaning I I feel like he manipulated the
crime scene specifically the the victim's bodies in some way and that's Doug Carter and he says that at probably
one of the most emotional parts of his press conference and I think that's his way of saying
whatever image you have of your victims in your head that's burned into your brain of how you left them that day and
the things you chose to do with the victims and the ways that you chose to manipulate the crime scene none of that
exists anymore that those victims are not the same way that you left them they're not your
victims anymore you don't hold any kind of power over over them or whatever degrading
actions you took that no longer exist you've not won we we will find you yeah which is interesting because
they're saying that they're crime was sexual but they're not saying if there was assault or rape we would assume if
there was we'd have some kind of semen DNA but they're saying this is about power
and about control and that was said in the the two-year press conference so by letting them know that this is not your
crime scene anymore you don't have control over this we we gave the victims back the power next question
can you elaborate about your reference to this case as having a Twist that you have never seen before is it something
more than Libby's audio recording and videotaping of their assailant or assailants
and his answer is one of the main twists is that Carroll County has had a high success rate of finding missing persons
for this case to have the initial outcome was nothing we even as seasoned veterans experienced
foreign [Music] thanks so much for joining us here in the garage do not hesitate if you have a
tip no matter how small you think it is please call 844-459-5786 and please join us back
here in the garage tomorrow until then be good be kind and don't live foreign [Music]

Delphi Murders /// 4 Years Later /// Part 1 /// 468

Part 1 of 2 www.TrueCrimeGarage.com

February 13 marked four years since two middle school students Liberty German and Abigail Williams went for a hike on the Monon High Bridge Trail and did not return alive. It was announced that there would be no press conference on the fourth anniversary. Many are looking for an update and some more information on this case. Well here it is. Join Nic & the Captain in the Garage as they take a look at the now four year old investigation. This week TCG explores some new information coming out of Carroll County, Indiana. This is a case that the Garage has followed from the start and will be there when it is finally over.

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Brief Summary

Four years after the Delphi murders, no arrests have been made, but investigators continue to pursue leads and tips from the community.

Key points

Delphi Case Update. Four years later, the Delphi case remains unsolved, with ongoing investigations and no arrests.
New Sketch Confusion. The release of a new suspect sketch has caused confusion in the investigation.
Sheriff's Insight. Sheriff Tobe Lessenby discusses the ongoing investigation and the challenges faced.
The Search for Evidence. Investigators are focusing on the day the two girls went missing, seeking more information.
Surveillance Footage Questions. Questions arise about the lack of surveillance footage from the area during the time of the crime.
Justice After Four Years. Despite the time passed, the community remains invested in finding answers and justice.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

The killer's voice continues to haunt Delphi, Indiana.

Discussion of the ongoing investigation into the Delphi case.

3:59WatchNov 3, 2022

Tension

55/ 100Some tension

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