L.I.S.K. Update ////// 74 | Forensic Files

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directv.com [Music] [Applause] welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
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the big Captain thank you thank you thank you it's good to be seen and it's good to see you cheers mates and it's
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did there first up we have big Pete from York England Big Pete says I hope I hope
you can make it over to the UK when the Browns play in London well I'd love to do something like that Captain you're
very well traveled have you ever been to London yes I went every weekend every weekend I went there once on a shorter
trip than I would have liked London is a great place to which everyone should experience next up we have Cassandra in
Seattle who says try some allegian split shot that's an espresso milk stout from
Seattle and her name was Cassandra next we have M&L Rec recruiting in Massachusetts let's go to Oregon City
and say hi to Mark also all the way in Berlin Germany we say hi and thanks to Laura and I would like to give a thank
you to Angela in Australia who sent us a wonderful Christmas package with a really cool Australian beer koozie it
was full on man it was full on we we're practically we've practically been adopted by Australia the listeners don't
know that but yeah that's where I'm fleeing to when the stuff hits the fan they they want to they want to make our
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the business and enough of Australia as well so gather around grab a chair grab a beer and let's talk some true
crime hold on [Applause] [Music] [Applause] man [Music] Captain are you ready are you holding on
to your seat cuz we are going to do a quick update show I'm holding on to something this is a case that we've
covered maybe more than any other case uh we've done a few episodes on this one way back in season one we covered the
Long Island serial killer case and managed to accuse many people along the way of having been the actual killer or
at least maybe you should talk to them a little further uh but we will not let this case rest and anytime there's a new
development we're going to talk about it we're going to talk to each other and we
also asked for the wonderful Joshua Zan and Rachel Mills who did a fantastic job
on the show Killing season I hope everybody checked that out because that was about the Long Island serial killer
case as well as other cases throughout the country I thought it was one of the best documentaries that's come out in
recent past and we've asked them to join us to talk about some of these recent developments right and currently it's on
Amazon so so I'm I'll put a link in the show description so you guys can check that out if you haven't already one of
the greatest things about this documentary is at the end of every episode they they hook you yeah and they
do I don't know if it was Josh I'm going to I'm just going to assume it wasn't Josh and it this was Rachel's doing I'm
going to give her the props for that um but it's at the each at the end of each episode you're like okay well maybe I'll
watch the next one but then they hook you and then you I have to watch the next one this is a
very easy show to binge watch yeah the really cool thing here too is they got the websleuth community involved in the
show yeah very cool and you know I thought I really actually thought that that was going to be a Cheesy thing not
because of the web sluth thing I'm a web sluther myself I've been active on there
for a few years we're not going to talk about that um but if you're on there it's not hard to figure out who I am um
but the thing here is the thing here is though I'm glad that they got him involved but the thing that was really
cool was the web sluther that came forward that they actually had on audio or video they had some amazing theories
like some really good stuff to check out there and the great thing about K well some of it is just not Theory some of it
is just a great insight and actual knowledge I mean it's just not just some speculation the other thing I loved
about Killing season was it what was it about Eight Episodes I think during the course of those Eight Episodes there's
about three or four really sketchy dudes that they come across that you're like oh my God this guy either he's either
the killer that they're looking for or he's he's done something that that that we should lock him up for so check out
The Killing season available on Amazon so a couple things happened with this documentary one they dove into new
information they try to uncover as much as they could but during the course of filming and editing a couple things came
out in this case that we want to talk about in the news and we're going to take you down some different roads with
these new developments in the Long Island Gilgo serial murder case but we're we also going to take you down a
different Road on how we typically do these shows I know that typically with with an interview show it's usually just
me and the interview ease however there were some conversations that I wanted to
have been had between the captain and I regarding this ongoing investigation yeah so it just goes between a little
bit of the interview and then we go back to talking so anyways we'll see you in a
little bit and let's check in with Josh and [Applause] [Music] Rachel [Music] first off congratulations on the show
Killing season was recently on A&E but I'm wondering how long ago were you done with the production of the show and
there's been developments in the case since then did you remain involved in the investigation uh that's a great question
officially I guess you can say that we were done filming last year in January of this past year of 2016 but um editing
process takes a long time and with um active investigations things can happen and um
as we were finishing up literally episode 8 um things things broke May of 2006 in uh in Long Island and that was
the county executive yeah um saying that he was demanding spot's resignation now
that hasn't happened spot is still in um in leadership but that was interesting so we had to open the edit back up um
and make sure we we would be able to include that into the last episode that was literally the last day of editing
right this you have the the highest elected official demanding the resignation of the district attorney in
part by what happened in the Gilgo case so we were just you know kind of flab GED that it would still it was always
happening you know and it's always been happening and it continues to be so it's
it's the case that really just doesn't stop one very fascinating part of The Killing season was that you chose to
work with the websleuth community now I'm a big fan of web SLO what was your takeaway from working with the
participants well you know the the web sloes are an interesting group um it was really interesting we wanted as kind of
Jal ists to look at what not only look at like what the case what was happening with the case but look at what was most
interesting to the webop community you know in a lot of ways we wanted to make a true crime show for True Crime Junkies
you know and the best way to do that was really to go to web [ __ ] and also like
they had kind of done their own sleuthing and so we wanted to pick up where that left off now the interesting
thing is like the web slth Community is like you know they're very particular uh
you know you've got um some really interesting folks on there all different backgrounds all different styles all
different like levels of like you know communication and so it was it was it was very interesting I think people were
skeptical though at first they definitely didn't want to reveal who they were to us right ra you know
everybody's like would you say they're were very nervous up front yeah I mean that's it's very easy to hide behind a
handle or a screen name there's some security in that so for for two filmmakers to come in and kind of you
know communicate with them and try to get them on board it took a little bit of convincing but yeah on film they were
like no no no no no I don't want to go on film I don't want to go on film I was like you've got such great ideas come on
you know but you know it was interesting because that's the whole thing and that's it's a good question actually
because it's really like it's about trying to bring the case out from the shadows out from like behind the veneer
of like the cable pundits like the Nancy Graces and really try and like Empower people just regular citizens to do uh to
do things you know you know and it's interesting with the webs community and going down the rabbit hole of all the
Long Island Sero killer Forums on that site the um some of the bigger issues or the holes in the case um from a public
St stand point from a web sther standpoint kind of Rises to the top I and that definitely came out when we
discovered through websleuth through fieldnotes that the mother of the toddler was not in namus I don't I think
it would have taken us much longer to figure that out if field notes hadn't said anything if he hadn't said anything
and then to really understand what that means what are the repercussions of not having her nameus and Now spoiler alert
fast forward you know to a couple of weeks ago now that she is in namus because of our communication Josh and
myself and um and uh thank you Todd Matthews um working with the medical examiner's office in nasau is that now
she is in namus and we thought we were just GNA you know we wanted to make sure that happened if we we knew we probably
wouldn't catch the serial killer right but we can do something small however that small thing has now kind of been
the biggest break in the case in years development in the case yeah since April 2011 it was really like the last little
thing on our note like oh let's get Jane do number three who's the mother of the
toddler just to back up a little bit of the bodies that were found along Ocean Parkway there was a mother and a toddler
and nobody quite knows like toddler what's a toddler doing there these are all sex workers you know and it's a big
question uh is it a sex worker who bring brings a baby Along on a trick which we
now know actually happen happens quite a bit uh we didn't think so or as some people have said you know is this a
different sort of relationship and this is like somebody who the killer or Killers knew and you know could this
even be the wife and the child so this mother and toddler who are found is very very interesting because that like gives
you a lot of Clues to go off of um you know you can't just give birth without there being a lot of Records you know so
you know a lot of these Victor are really like under the radar sex workers and now we've got a mother and toddler
so it's really interesting for a lot of people but really strange thing is we thought that the killer was being really
devious and this is one reason why people thought it was law enforcement was because the the person who dumped
the bodies separated intentionally separated the mother and the child left the child basically next to another body
who's known as J do number six and in and dump the mother literally across the county line in Nassau County
now all these unidentified victims that are found on the suffk county side of this of this crime scene are in namess
but for some reason Nassau County wasn't putting this Jane Doe in and uh from that you know we just emailed him and he
said oh there we can't put this person in because this these body parts here I think it was like a some extremity
extremity mother something you know they're like oh we can't put these bodies here we can't put this this we
can't create a record for this Victim Because the victim is already in namus and we're like what do you mean what do
you mean and they're like actually we've linked this victim to another victim named peaches now R and I knew quite a
bit about peaches because Peaches was another uh victim I dismembered por so that was found 40 m east in Hemstead but
we you know when this case rolled around we were looking at all the uh dismember
bodies uh around and you know you would think there's not that many but actually
there's a lot of dismemberment you know the question is whether or not uh it's a
forensic countermeasure to prevent identification or is this somebody who's like enjoying dismembering somebody as
as Peter Brent had suggested with um some of the bodies found in Long Island so as a
result it's now basically been proven that if janeo number three is linked to peaches in fact the body parts of the
same victim which we now know through DNA this completely extends the forensic footprint of the killer the Killer is
now just killer or Killers has now not just dumped bodies in Manorville and Gilgo Beach he has also dumped a body in
Hempstead and that is 40 miles even like closer to New York City so now you start
to put your thinking cap on and say hm is this guy from New York City is he live more towards Queens you know it
really changes everything and the disturbing part is that suff County apparently knew this and nasau
County knew that this victim was linked but didn't tell anybody and uh that's what I think we found so
interesting I mean it's not this game of trying to get information out of the police it's kind of more of frustration
of why the police aren't being as forthright as possible and if the answer is well there's an active serial killer
now roaming around two counties I I get it but but I don't know I mean you would
think the public deserves to know so that's where we stand with with at least that side of of the new developments do
we have a known cause of death for either peaches or the toddler or at least how the remains were found well
you know first of all just to go even further with why it's so interesting you want to say the 97 verse 96 and what how
that totally changes so the other thing is Peaches was found in a rubber made tub yeah off a Trail in a state park but
it's really like a very kind of it's not it's not really a park no but and also just um in case you forget she was found
probably within three days of having been murdered right right right which is very important so this body it's a torso
um dark skinned person uh there's a a tattoo of a peach on it and um and it's just a torso literally the midsection
yeah no arms no legs no head um and you know the way it was presented being found in this rubber made tub
there's the idea this is something that web Luther Peter Brent brings up you know it was It was kind of placed there
to be found um and so it's more than just forensic forensic countermeasures when you're chopping up this body it's
also there's a little bit of a ha look at look at you know look at what I've done and and see how horrific I am uh
but the most interesting thing is this body was found in 97 now going back to the bodies that are
found along Gilgo Beach and in Manville um the earliest one was 96 that's that person is known as Fire
Island Jane do uh in 1996 a pair of severed legs washed up in a plastic bag on Fire Island um that was in '96 and
then in 2011 uh they found the rest of this woman's remains on gilo beach now we
didn't quite know was this person really connected you know this is one of the things that maybe if you think there's
numerous different Killers around there and everybody's just using this area as a Dumping Ground you know maybe it's
three but now when you have This Woman's severed legs found in 96 and then this torso found in
97 you start to put it all together and you start to see a little bit more you know go yeah well then just in addition
to that there was that gap between 96 and arguably 2000 with j number six right and Jessica Taylor in 2003 and
then fast forward to 2007 when the first the Gil go Beach 4 went went missing which was uh 2007 and that was Marine so
having peaches now directly linked to Gilgo puts you know brings everything back a little bit 97 right well you say
well the 96 okay 96 97 2000 2003 uh 2007 like it starts to fill in and then where
you have these periodical gaps and you're like no no no this can't be the same guy suddenly you know there's a
difference between a 4-year Gap and a three-year Gap you know what I'm saying or and so it really brings in a question
like is it now we we debate back and forth maybe it is one killer you know we've definitely now started to say like
wow you know um so that was I think the biggest Revelation um on the body side go ahead
yeah no I was gonna say um Todd Matthews has been working with us very closely um
Todd Matthews Todd Matthews is the is the director of the media director media director of namus um which is the public
database yes who happens to be his own he started out as a wasn't a web Sloop through back then but it was a from the
D Network yeah from the D Network yeah he he's uh he's very interesting because he's the guy who found who discovered
who tent girl was right uh and that was his own case for like 20 years so he's a
citizen Luther as well who's now running uh the direct of communication for n so kind of interesting yeah it's
great um but I bring him up and I bring this process up because we' been working
with him very closely for the past I mean for years but very heavily the past month and um between all our work got
the mother of the toddler into namus and Todd um through conversations that I've
had with him um feels this is a big this is big progress and uh I think he is now
going to put more energy from his side into looking at the rest of the unidentified and more active when you
say more energy from his side which is just like maybe tasking a couple more people with with making sure that all
the Biometrics are in like the the the dental records and everything but and and there's also um ways that they can
work with with DNA as well they can be more um they can Outreach more to possible people who could be connected
and do that I don't want to say too much about it but um that should be coming sometime soon so you know it's very
interesting we got in this just all we wanted to do is really bring attention to this case and maybe try and identify
somebody um we we've always said that it's identification of these unidentified which is
really you know the key to solving this case but also I think it's the key to empowering people like if you're
listening to the show and you're interested in True Crime you know and you're like well I'm not going to be a
cop but you can actually go out there on webs you can actually identify yeah you
can help identify and you can make a huge major break in a case well look just today I'm going to bring up the the
pillowcase all right yeah yeah so literally um coming back from you know holiday weekend I go on to webu and I
see that my inbox is full from people saying did you see about the pillow because you see by the pillow they go
online and the web sther so just to back up when Peaches was found in that rubber
container back in 97 a pillow sham and a towel was found with her um and no one had figured out like where those came
from or like had done the the the really deep work to see you know you know what
was who was the manufacturer where was you know where may have someone bought that in Long Island or New York back you
know Circa 90 to 97 right um so they actually were able to trase it back and have discovered that it was manufactured
I believe between 90 and 95 okay by a certain manufacturer that only sold to these places so right now as we're
speaking um they're hard at work at figuring out and cross referencing where that what what store may that have come
from now that me that might might sound not significant but everything's significant
yeah we didn't know that putting the mother of the child in neus was going to be as significant as it was you just
never know right you never know right so now it's like okay like did he get it at
Macy's in like the Roosevelt Mall you know like all these things are going to point to where the footprint of the
Killer is and when you're talking about Geo profiling you know that all that becomes really significant so that's one
um kind of big update and if I could just say real fast that kind of specific information is what web sther do so so
great and where I understand law enforcement not wanting to include webs Luthers you know in all these
investigations I understand their hesitation but for instance if they got and they might know this information
already we don't know but if they have information like that of like let's figure out where this um object was from
um could spin they could save so much Manpower because they are they're as we always say they're overworked and
underpaid so those are the kinds of things that they're super good at yeah [Applause]
[Music] all right we'll get back to our interview with Joshua and Rachel right after this quick beer break this show is
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our beer break you have got to get the public involved when it comes to these cases especially cold cases and we have
seen with cases that we've recently covered we covered the Jacob wling case a couple weeks ago and we saw in that
case it's 27 years old and a blogger gets involved and starts piecing together crimes that were related to the
Jacob wling case and what I'm getting at here is that it seems almost shameful to
me I understand that law enforcement needs to hold certain things close to the vest because they have to be able to
verify if a confession is real or not and know if somebody is an actual suspect but we see something like with
the Amy mahalic case 26 years after the fact they come forward and they say you know what we found this curtain or we
found this rug at the crime scene and we believe that it's part of the crime scene that it's part of the victim that
it's linked to the victim here yeah can can the public help Trace these have you
seen these before do you know anybody that owned this curtain or this rug but you're asking 26 years later people move
away people pass away people forget what what is shameful to me is that it's so late in the game I like with the Lisk
investigation that they're coming forward with this information now and asking do you know about this pillowcase
let's figure this out and that's what the web sluth Community is so good at well and I just think the True Crime
community in general is good at I mean we're all armchair detectives I think that's why we get into the genre right
so and then you know recently you know we covered a case uh season 1 that you know is close to our hometown but there
is uh some developments that we're trying to make behind the scenes uh you know we haven't really talked about that
on the show but we don't really want to discuss that until there's some validity
to what basically you discovered um you know I can't take a lot of credit for that well so but to to put to what Josh
and Rachel are talking about here getting webu and namus involved in these things we've been working with local law
enforcement here and the namus organization for several months trying to put some things together here and
we're hoping to see some developments in a case that that we've worked for and I
never knew what namus was you know so just explain that to some of the audience um listeners that might not
know what it is so it's it's it's not missing persons it's unidentified remains or unidentified bodies you know
so every jurisdiction throughout the country they find unidentified bodies Jane do John do and they put them into
this system it's called the namus system because they you know the victims want to be named you know identify us yeah
yeah it's a good name for the so so the name of system they they are able to put
in certain amounts of information regarding these Jane do and johnos and the the problem with it is it can be
very vague information so on a national Spectrum right now it's voluntary so so law enforcement is not required to go in
and put anything in there um they're they're not required to check namus uh but what has recently developed in this
country which is great it's a great thing they tried to get it passed nationally that it would be a required
uh act that law enforcement would be involved in that they right they would have to put all this information into
the database correct and right now what has taken place is there's only two states in the country that have passed
this and made it law but it started with Connecticut and then it moved to New York where this is now a requirement
that they are checking these that they are putting certain information in there now anybody can go to and I recommend
that you do so go to namus go to their website Scout around on there and see what's going on in your community or if
there's a case that you're interested in and a missing person or somebody that that's been lost for for years you can
you can troll through there and and figure out what's going on and see if there's any kind of match it some of the
information is vague because this is voluntary some of it's very descriptive and detailed um but the thing here is
law enforcement and the FBI they actually have the ability to get onto namus and they can see different
information than the general public can so it's a valuable Source it's a valuable piece that that is not required
and should frankly be required in all states well so here's the interesting thing right so this all stem
from uh the this these parents of this guy Billy smolinski who's from Connecticut we
actually interviewed the smolinsky family uh if you go on uh the A&E uh site you can actually see the interview
we did to smolinsky you can actually even see uh the work we did on peaches before we knew and and we didn't include
it because we can never like say oh she's a definitive victim and suddenly we find out later at when the shows done
that peaches really is a victim and it's funny because we did all this work to try and find out who she was so you can
actually go on the site and see the additional con the additional content about peaches but this is so they were
trying to pass a law for years called Billy's law after this and basically the whole problem is is that this this
public database isn't um sorry when missing person information is entered into the database
um there's two different databases there's the database that the police can see and there's the database that the
public can see and they're not they don't work together and that's because Law Enforcement wants to put some
information in that they don't want the public to see but what happens is no offense to law enforcement or to anybody
but you know data entry is not law enforcement strong suit uh it's not really anybody's strong suit pretty much
I don't know but you know these guys are out like having to hit the streets and like find Killers not hunting and
pecking on a computer to type in information and so as a lot as a result a lot of this kind of missing persons
stuff is all like you know just kind of gets messed up like you know was the person 5'6 or 65 you know or you know
were they born in 19 you know 66 you know 67 or 76 you know all these little number changes you know
uh are are you know could totally do it so you know you're never going to be your best ad nobody else is going to be
the best Advocate except like you or you know if you're a missing person it's like your family so they made this law
in Connecticut and and Murphy is the guy the congressman who we interviewed you know to try and pass this thing that you
know they have to put this information publicly you as a parent need to be able to go in and look at this information
and make sure that the information about your missing child is actually correct because what they had found out when
they went to look is that all the missing person information about their kid was incorrect and so when it was
going through the databases there was no hits because it was all incorrect so Connecticut was the first one to pass it
now Chris Murphy interestingly enough tried to get this bill passed nationally but anything that's required by law
enforcement is not going to pass nationally so unfortunately it's died three times now and and that that was
really frustrating for us because it was like come on it's missing people you know what I'm saying like how like you
put put the information there you know it's it's there's so much tragedy but unfortunately they did it and now so now
it's happening through States and so it was first Connecticut Chris Murphy now Cuomo signed it and uh that's part of
the reason part of the reason is you know it's it's by law and recently there was an article that is specifically
about this case and specifically about namus and they're talking about the unidentified deceased missing persons
that are out there and how namus can be involved in this and the interesting thing here when we talk about the Long
Island serial killer case this article states that in Nassau County where bodies were found we have 11
unidentified deceased persons and in suff County where some of the other bodies were found in this case we have
27 unidentified missing person deceased bodies yeah I mean that that to me that's a crazy statistic yeah yeah it's
it's a heav and and not only crazy but that's scary it's a heavily populated area you know so the you you might
expect a higher number there however these are more recent cases this isn't going back to the beginning of time this
is in more recent times yeah yeah well there's a lot of granted there's a lot of space in suff there's a lot of wood
you know but it's like it's really interesting you know as we kind of get more granular with our data and that's
something we try to show in the whole the whole series whether it's you know Tom hargrove's murder accountability
project so those who aren't familiar with this Tom hardgrove was an investigator and he set investigative
journalist yeah and he set up this uh nonprofit organization that basically tracks unsolved murders MH yeah tracks
them Nationwide and actually when they started putting this data together together and collecting it and then
cataloging it once he had put in all that work and all that effort there was a bit uh he was a bit hesitant to
release this because I saw an interview with him and he stated you know I felt like by releasing this to the public
we're almost saying you know what if you want to if you want to kill somebody and
you want to get away with it then you can do that in Detroit you can do that in Chicago You're you could probably
kill somebody in one of those cities and and nobody ever catch you for it he was
worried about that portion of it however investigatively and the amount of help that it could do yeah in Reverse to that
is what is much more important and what we're going to see you know this is holding local law enforcement
accountable it's not just reading about somebody dying or being found somewhere and and then months later you read about
somebody else or a year later you read about somebody else no it's it's putting it all together in one place to look at
it and say whoa 30 that's a high number 35 that's that that is unacceptable and are they connected yeah yeah do we have
a serial killer here or do we have a group of people doing this uh for some reason these murders are going unsolved
and we've got to hold law enforcement accountable to that yeah I mean that we are paying their I mean I don't want to
sound uh super negative uh towards law enforcement because I support law enforcement obviously a bunch of friends
involved in it but that's this the reason why we have law enforcement this is the reason why we have tax in the in
our cities and going back to something that Joshua and Rachel were talking about earlier that's another thing too
you know when these cases go cold even if it's just a couple of months if they've got nothing if they've got no
leads let's present it to the public let's get this crowd slle thing involved and see how we can take these cases off
of our books and put people behind bars and like we said before I mean we've always joked you know the true true
crime garage but our our listeners we like to call them the True Crime Army and but that's essentially what all
these other podcasts and all these documentaries are doing as as it becomes more and more popular genre you know
there's a lot of intelligent people that dive into these cases uh as a hobby and
I I think we're going to start seeing more and more cases solved um you know by the True Crime Army but you know one
of the things I wanted to say which I found so interesting which we we were talking about earlier which is like when
the police come um and you know say well we need help identifying who this individual is you
know 12 years ago and and you know it's like it's weird but like you almost have
to make it you have to think like a a movie or think like you have to make it engaging for the audience you know what
I'm saying like you it can't it's not we're not in the days of uh you know um it's 10:00 Do You Know Where Your
Children Are or call this thing on a call this face on a milk carton or even um America's Most Wanted you know like
it's 2.0 you know and in the 2.0 world you have to like make it engaging like you have to show people that there
things can be done like when first you do the TV show and then we happen to have this little thing this invest you
know this thing with peaches and now everybody is all over this case and now you really do have
people and a chance to actually solve it one of the things that I like the most about The Killing season and I didn't
know this in advance even having talked to you before the show came out I didn't
realize you were going to travel around the country and check out different cases I thought this was all going to be
Long Island and you ended up covering some cases that we've covered on this show and I have some suspicions about
the Long Island serial killer case and that that stems from one of the cases you covered and we covered the West Mesa
uh body pit case or Bone Collector as he's been referred to um one thing we were able to point out on our show was
that out of the 11 victims found five of them knew one another we were able to connect the five of them and I have a
suspicion that with the Long Island case if we if we can let's take a leap here and think and say maybe one person did
all of these murders well that's that's a lot of bodies right it it would be hard for me to believe that some of the
victims did not know the Killer and and I don't mean that it was like a boyfriend or a best friend or or
somebody that they had a long-term relationship with I'm talking about maybe it's a frequent customer or
somebody that they had known from the area there's a reason why some of these girls went with this guy and that leads
me and that leads me to my other suspicion regarding the Long Island case is that maybe and I don't mean to
discredit your web sluther who said that we probably have a torso killer in the area um we we very well may have uh but
well just to be clear in the documentary one of the websleuth guys is he comes out saying hey look there's a chance
that there's not just one killer that there's possibly two and his evidence of that is that there's a torso killer
right he believes that there's a torso killer so if you go with one being a torso killer and one just being uh
dumping of bodies and not cutting them up then we have two killers right and and I would suspect in either situation
you know whether it be two or whether it be one that the the difference in how they're leaving the bodies to me points
out that there's some way to trace the murderer from the victim and what I mean by that is if you essentially he's the
Torso killer is taking these bodies apart he's removing all the identifiers from the body and he's just leaving a
torso so therefore if you if you need the hands or the the eyes or the face or the head to to identify the body if you
can't find those you can't identify the Torso that I had to get rid of so therefore to me placing a torso in in a
rubber tub and dropping it off of a trail in a park somewhere just seems to me like a quick way of getting this
thing out of my car and leaving it somewhere and furthermore I don't really care if it takes you 3 hours to discover
what I have left here in the park or if it takes you 3 weeks because you cannot trace it back to me well and yeah my my
thought too on you know I think it's crazy to think that a killer can't change we've seen it multiple times in
the past where you know somebody might kill somebody with a gun and then kill all their other victims with a knife so
you know this idea that these serial killers never change they always kill the same way that just I think
historically that's been proven false well actually it's you're exactly right it's been proven time and time again
that they most of them do change they adapt and here's what typically happens in these cases where you have a span of
Many Bodies over the span of many years right so what typically happens is either a they get better at what they're
doing and they improve and they get harder to catch or two they're something outside of the actual Act of Killing has
changed in their life maybe at one time that they they lived with other people so they had to dump in one way and now
they live alone and they have different means and they have more time and more privacy to do whatever they need to do
that that's one way they changed another way that they changed we saw it with Ted
Bundy he just starts losing control and he's just becomes a frenzy killer after at some point he's he's less thought out
and he's just disorganized where beforehand he was very organized and another situation we've seen in multiple
cases and this happens a lot is they start to get lazy they start to get they think that they're good at what they do
after a few bodies they've not caught me I've been out here running around for years they've not caught me they can't
there's no way they can catch me they don't even know what they're doing I don't have to make the extra effort
anymore you know that's that's very interest interesting point number one you know I'm now you know I haven't said
this publicly before but you know now kind of thinking about the the one killer maybe he did get lazy you know um
just like um uh riffkin riffkin you know was cutting up at first and then decided not
to you know there there was look at the care how how dismembered they were earlier and like even how of the
dismembered victims how they started to be less and less dismembered um you know
there's that and and I think we are may we may find out that actually at least on the gb4 side that the girls may have
worked together um you know the West maer thing is very interesting um because we were able to find out that so
many of them knew each other but they didn't but one thing we didn't go into on the show is they actually some of
them actually knew each other from they all went to the same grammar school the thing that we were able able to point
out on our show andove on our show which was really cool was that there was a caller who had called the mother of one
of the victims now the caller herself she's a sex worker and she tells the mother that you your daughter is dead
she's been killed along with another girl and they're both going to be found in the West Mesa body pit and it turns
out later that this girl that had called she's found in that same pit as well with those with those other two girls so
it's easy to link those three together and when we were yeah and the big question is is how did this lady know to
call the mom of the victim right and then who did she know to get this information from and then how the hell
did she end up in the pit exactly well but the crazy thing here though is that we were able to prove that she knew at
least two of the other girls so you could you were pairing five of the victims together and proving that they
knew one another furthermore the the girl that called that ends up being found later yeah the last time she spoke
to her parents before she was reported missing she had called them and she was very excited she had a new boyfriend he
just got out of prison they were going to run away and get married together and she never identifies the boyfriend the
parents never meet him we don't know his name however it's after this phone call
a few months later she's reported missing and then after that she's found in the west meso with along with these
other girls two of which she named by name and five that were all linked together per our show well let me just
give you a little bit of a vice this year in 2017 if you start dating a guy and he's he's the love of your life and
he just got out of prison don't tell your parents that part okay that's not good or at least at least tell his name
yeah yeah or make sure you get his fingerprints yeah absolutely yeah and you saw did you see the latest
developments in the Mesa case from a couple months ago not really for sure what you're talking about I'll fill you
in real fast so with Lorenzo Montoya who a lot of people thinks is you know the number one suspect who is conveniently
killed um or dead so just recently some journalist put pressure on the records department at Albuquerque Police
Department um and got released some videotapes of Loren from Lorenzo Montoya um and the the news release them and you
it's it's Lorenzo you can't see him um and what they released was like a static phot like a static video of like his bed
and side table and then of um the sound of what sounds like duct tape being pulled so the idea is that he was there
with uh some women they actually released photos of these women too um and that you know we know he's he's
killed in the past um this isn't you know evidence that he is the killer but it does exhibit that if that sounded
correct and it's duct tape and you hear garbage bags that you know he might have
been involved in some other NE nefarious activity um other than just the one murder that we do know he committed well
all right but just between me and you and everybody else that's going to listen to this
case I really don't get the vibe that they're actively investigating the West Mesa case oh what you do exactly let me
give you that idea I feel like in this case what has happened here is that they discovered all these bodies they spent a
good year or two working the case they have a suspect who's dead they have a suspect that is behind bars for another
case and I feel like here they're just saying okay well that's going to have to be good enough well and then we see this
all the time when there's a bunch of sex workers that go missing uh they do because because of the public fear
because of the public outcry yeah they put a little work into it but once it goes out of that you once the public
isn't talking about anymore I think they really just throw up their hands and they go look these women were putting
themselves in danger so look they're sex workers we're we're not going to spend all this time and energy to try to solve
their murder I mean the weird thing is is we actually got that on film where like we were TR that's when the when
that's where we like make the phone call to like the hotline because they weren't
speaking to us so we were like going to call the hotline to like try and speak to them but we couldn't even get through
because both of the numbers were down and so we were frustrated that they weren't going to speak to us but then
you you know you see like oh my God guys like you know your your your hotlines aren't even working I mean how much you
know how much work does it take to do that I I I I think you know Albert is a tough Place
yeah Al is a really tough place you know they've had some real issues with their
law enforcement uh we've spoken to the law enforcement since then and they've kind of been like a little bit like um
reactionary to maybe at least take our phone calls yeah um and it again it like seems like they want to do something but
it also is a systemic problem of just the whole thing yeah well and then with a case as old as as old as a West Mesa
case and everything they [ __ ] up from the beginning looking into that case uh and that they've been um investiga and
still are by the Department of Justice um not for this but for other civil right
violations um in the course of investigating this kind of case with so many victims that's so old you may come
up with something that's not going to reflect too good on yourself as a police department um and I think that's always
a concern um when maybe there's been two to three um uh you know different kinds
of leadership going on over the past decade um you don't want to look like you didn't do your best um even if it
maybe it was the responsibility of um your predecessor right I think that's that's
what we're finding in in a couple of these cases like it's one thing like sure they want to do the work but
they're also a little afraid of what they might find EXA and then they're going to have to like publicly be like
you know I don't mean to change sub subjects here but regarding the long island case there's a part on your show
where you're interviewing either the new Chief or the new commissioner of police
and there's discussion of an FBI profile regarding the Long Island serial killer
and he has said that he's going to to seek that out and have the FBI do it and and has that been addressed has it been
presented to the public it has not been addressed um did he promise to deliver it to us
because hell I'm going to call back I don't from my reculation he didn't promise to deliver it to us he said that
a a profile is going to happen that doesn't mean they have to share it with anyone yeah unfortunately yeah and one
of the biggest updates in this case since the documentary The Killing season which is on Amazon you can check that
out now on Amazon uh I'll put a link again in the show description but one of the big things that came out was the
police chief um it has some charges against him he's facing he's in a little bit of hot water can you talk about that
a little bit yeah um so so this was interesting R got a tweet from a woman uh who claimed to be a sex worker and
um we met her kind of candescent in this car and and uh she uh told us that she allegedly had sex with the former Chief
of Police um uh at at a house in Oak Beach um and you know police officers and sex workers is you know it's not the
craziest thing in the world uh for them to have sex but I guess the point was they had sex in the bathroom of this
house basically four miles away from where uh 11 bodies were found basically four months
after so not only like you know you're just literally you know you've got so many
bodies of sex workers found and here you are a police chief having sex with a sex
worker just like around the block literally and just a couple months later and it's it's just one number one it's
kind of tasteless you know and and Beyond the bounds of like you know um what you should be representing as a
police officer but to kind of do that kind of sends a different message of you know you really don't care about what's
going on and so um there had been a lot of talk on wedu and a lot of other places that you know the police chief
you know he has already been incarcerated uh for um for violating a guy's rights a guy basically broke into
his car uh her at the time he was a heroin addict uh we've told that they would actually break into specifically
police cars to steal drugs because sometimes the police officers have drugs in their car from evidence or what have
you yeah confiscating it so they they knew what cars that they were getting into and they stole they broke into this
police chief's car and inside the car they found a duffel bag and inside the duffel bag they found this like quote
unquote nasty porn um we're not quite sure what nasty porn means but it's got to be pretty nasty for someone to call
it nasty porn so uh take your own inference there um so the police chief goes to the guy's house as like he's
being arrested takes the guy and like starts beating the [ __ ] out of him and this mysterious duffel bag
disappears and the porn disappears um which gives you some indication of maybe what we're looking at and then it
suddenly comes out that this guy had been doing a lot of other things he had been surveilling some other detectives
he and the da allegedly had been in cahoots and there had been all this talk about this guy was running a sex ring
and he was a police chief and you know to the point where people were like saying oh my God this police chief is
the Long Island serial killer that was just kind of nuts but um uh you know we now have a sex worker
who's corroborating that uh she did have sex with this police chief um you know not too far away just
really close and so let's just be clear for a minute because with these allegations coming up with the sex
worker she's saying hey look I had sex with the police chief right and I had sex at this party with the police chief
and we don't know if it was we're assuming that it's p paid for right so and what we do know about the Long
Island serial killer case is that we have Shannon Gilbert which was at a party yeah and she something goes Ary
she leaves the party calling 911 saying they are trying to kill me yeah and then
her body is found months and months or years later yeah and it's it's debatable if Shannon Gilbert's even a victim of
the Long Island hero killer hero but we have you're talking about a sex party or
or party where we're being entertained by a sex worker the former police chief has sex with her in the bathroom at this
Oak beach party and we're talking about Shannon Gilbert being present at an oak beach party now obviously these are two
completely separate different parties but we have a situation here where Joe Brewer has been investigated and some
people say that he's been cleared of any um any responsibility in Shannon Gilbert's death but the problem here is
we have we have additional people that are at that party this wasn't just a Joe Brewer party this was multiple people at
the party and we have unidentified persons at this party because Joe burough was not investigated until well
after the fact right so one could speculate that possibly what if there was the police chief at this party and
if the police chief was at the party and Joe Brewers cleared that maybe Joe Brewers shouldn't have been cleared yeah
maybe he's only cleared to cover up for the unidentified persons that were at the party and this also points out a
frequency in these type of events going on in Oak Beach mhm and and like we also
said a lot of these victims of the case when their friends and family are being interviewed they were saying look we're
going out to these parties or going out to meet somebody and it's a and the amount of money is way higher than it
should have been mhm almost like a lore and maybe it's just this this sick um sex ring where they're using these women
and they don't care about them then they're disposing of them because they are they are people of power and so that
that's kind of where we're at with this you know that's that's coming from One Source um now of course we've continued
to hear these rumors year after year um this is the first person who's come forward but to kind of um legitimize her
statement more people need to come forward more women need to come forward we think they are we've heard yeah rumor
not rumors but murmurings that a scary thing right if you're a woman who um is going to allege that there were these
sex parties with probably drugs with um powerful people in law enforcement that's that's really what are you going
to benefit off of that yeah so it sounds very much like a movie um that's kind of
like why we didn't want to put too much Credence in it um also because we thought it took away from the real
investigation but at the same time something is rotten in Denmark and the unfortunate thing is this is what what
happens and I'm I'm probably going to be wrong um spectacularly wrong here um but
this is what happens in a lot of cases where you know you've got police officers or in this case a police chief
doing really bad things and it ends up tainting the rest of the investigation so people start kind of going off on the
on the conspiracy route that maybe this guy's the killer or something like that and it's it's not that this guy's a
killer it's it's you know these tragic events and ends up kind of bringing out everybody's dirty laundry and and that's
definitely what's happened here yeah okay so Joshua and Rachel with all these new developments what do you think that
this is going to lead to I I mean I am less interested in the um sex Pary vot Beach it is interesting maybe there is
something there I'm more interested in identifying these unidentified um victims I think that's probably the
biggest um possibility to create a timeline by if you identify them you're creating a timeline you're you're
building up that narrative to then go backwards and you know cross reference um if you know maybe there's a digital
footprint we don't know we don't know because we don't even know who they are um so moving forward with trying to ig
peaches trying to ID Asian male which we've been working again with Todd um hoping that we can do something there
there's still Jano number six um still Fire Island Jane do who am I missing uh HML
cherries and then yeah yeah yeah I mean look that's the problem we believe in this case that that one of the best
things to do is concentrate on the missing and unidentified on unidentified not on some of the other stuff but I you
know the other stuff is Sexy and You Know exciting and titillating um rather than just iding some you know person
it's really sad and tragic um it's it's not you know sex parties in below in Long Island right um but you know I
think the most interesting thing is is all the people who are now talking about this case
um you know and it's interesting because like it it it takes the show you know and then the show Sparks this and then
somebody else does that and uh you know it's it's it just requires a lot of time a lot of effort
and a lot of coverage basically I mean this is why we continue to do shows like yours which we think is great you know
it's about reaching out out to to people who want to see these cases get solved and we really believe at this point in
the power of crowd sleuthing you know whether it's web SL D Network Charlie project whatever but you know the
answers are out there well your your show has brought this case to what I like to call present day sleuthing to
present day True Crime Army it's it's more than just um old people sitting at home watching dat line you know now our
show is very interactive with our listeners and we get tips from our listeners as well as theories and case
suggestions and we love all that we love having that interaction we feel like we're one big uh army of ants working
together collectively with one Consciousness yeah and what we're working on right now and thing that
you're spearheading we're hoping to prove something yeah in a case that we covered and if we can do so then we're a
part of the a bunch of this happening it started primarily through uh Cal and by
bringing that to the conscious Forefront and then look what's happened with that
and if he gets a new trial or if they offer him an alpha plead that is directly linked to the public pressure
yeah I believe and then if you look at other shows like uh Missing Mara Murray uh a show dedicated to one case and what
they brought to light as well and you know again with the serial case you got undisclosed and uh uh truth and Justice
and stuff like that and and if it wasn't for this Collective um there wouldn't be
Motion in a lot of these cases right right they would be still standing still they would be colder than ever and
what's great about The Killing season is they went out of their way and championed a place like web SLO and
brought them in they brought them out from their basements and they brought the web sleuths out from behind their
computers and put them in the Forefront trolls they put them in the Forefront of
the investigation and low allowed their opinions their theories to be voiced as well as I mean there was such good
speculation from some of these web web sluther on this case and I think what you're going to see here Captain I think
you're going to see this type of thing trending upwards where where and one can only hope so where we're going to see
the documentarians working with the armchair detectives we're we we're already seeing podcasts working with
armchair detectives and we're going to start to see law enforcement working with the whole group with the
documentarians with the podcasters with the web sluther with the armchair detectives and it can only bring good it
can only help the cause yeah and one of the things that are interesting with what we're working on right now is at
first we kind of felt silly like oh we're just a we're just a true crime podcast like is this are any of these
detectives going to take our thoughts serious now we got kind of Lucky cuz we have u a detective friend that you know
we could drop his name and that kind of helps but I've been really surprised lately with uh your theories on on this
case and I'm sorry that we're kind of being secretive about it but again we and we're not talking about the Long
Island case we're talking about a case that we've been working but we we've gotten lucky that there is a Cold Case
detective in Columbus that's been interested in talking with us and we've spoken to him in the past about a a
previous case to gain some knowledge um and we're I mean to you got to you got to shake some trees and see what falls
out right right right and well and and I think the smartest people know especially when you're in a room of of a
bunch of people the you know if you're a smart person I I believe that you're you're well aware that the answer might
not always come from the smartest person or from the expert you know not you know
normally when they have these cases you know they're when they have these cases you
know it's a eyewitness or somebody that just saw something that comes out later and that opens up a whole another can of
worms so it doesn't have to be an expert that Sol these things cuz I mean look you know I never was this true crime
junkie now I'm a part of True Crime garage you know I I just did it so I could you know oh I know how to record
audio so let me get involved and even this dummy you know has had some pretty interesting thoughts on some cases
throughout our last 70 episodes or whatever well and the great part of it too is that these these documentries you
know it was it was once that only the TV waves were reaching everywhere okay now
we have all these great True Crime podcasts out there that that we we have listeners in Russia you know and and in
Australia in Germany in the UK in Canada all over the place and what's great about that is the we're finding that
there's this community and they're everywhere and that should be scary to the bad guys it's going to get harder
and harder to hide as technology gets better and as the community of these these forces get better yeah so when you
are diving into these cases is know that you might be the one that stumbles upon
something that could make a break in something working with the web sluth community and I know that they have a
lot of good theories on this case what were some of the better theories that you heard I I know you don't have time
to investigate all of them the threads on this case are amazing uh what were some of the theories that were presented
to you I know what I I I mean well the two killers versus one you know right what
else two killers vers one Oak Beach Oak Beach it we went over that hack it we went over that yeah
Peter hacket yeah always law enforcement always law enforcement every one of our
cases everybody's like must be law enforcement must be law enforcement and I think we might have touched upon this
before but it is very interesting and I don't think we've ever quite nailed the understanding of this but basically when
you have a serial killer case or that goes unsolved that has a number of victims the
public typically needs an answer for why the case is unsolved and they we have this need to to find a logical answer
because you know because if it's not law enforcement that means that anybody can
be able to get away with this and so it's just very interesting how um it's like a social experiment that uh people
people always say it is the police who are doing it it uh becomes the most logical reason since the killer hasn't
been caught oh it must be a police officer right um that's very interesting and and of course that came up in Long
Island um right and maybe if it's not a police offer it's officer it's someone in power someone with money someone um
in some kind of control role and that's why they're able to get away with it right where the sex the sex party thing
you know it's it's interesting you definitely see a lot of kind of urban legend you know Mass hysteria things come up
over and over again so yeah I don't know it it was hard for us to really separate
you know what's a what's a specific Theory thank you for talking about these updates with us now what do you think we
can expect with this case going forward so I think we're going to be hearing there's pretty maybe new updates that
are happening yeah you know the FBI is involved in the case and so uh we know I I'm excited I'm definitely
gonna looking forward to seeing what's new going to happen but I think we're going to start to be hearing a lot of
more updates over the next two to three weeks right think so I hope so yeah yeah
that's fantastic we're hoping to hear some more as well and who knows you might find your guys you might find
yourself in a situation where you got to pick up the camera and get back out on the road and and do another show well I
mean look if something breaks we're going to pick up a camera and we're going to go even if you know even if the
show isn't active right that second I mean we did that two weeks ago going out in Long Island right um with the press
conference so you know it's it's not other people who do documentary series is kind of um you come in you you do
your punch card and you care about the victims and their families but at the end of the day you go home and you leave
it you know on the edit room floor essentially unfortunately and fortunately for us uh it's kind of the
47 thing for us um yeah we can't get rid of it if we wanted to yeah I know how you feel thank you both and I'll tell
you what if there's any more developments uh let's get together let's do this again no totally appreciate to
and you know everybody watch Amazon and then jump on web SL and let's see if we could solve this case yeah and Josh and
I are dance mob on what and we're also on Twitter you can reach us uh We've have a lot ofver ation going on kind of
all the time with regards to this case so Josh is at Josh Zan and I'm at at Mills Rachel I'll write those handles
again web sluth is dance mob and then it's Josh Zan for Twitter and Mills Rachel Mills Rachel for Twitter so
thanks again for talking to us two of the coolest people in the True Crime documentary world yeah that's right
thank you both it's been fun all right thank thank you thank you you too thank you take care
bye this week's recommended reading is slave slave girls by Wiley Clarkson who is also the author of Hell hath no fury
and whatever mother says uh this is a plunge into a nightmare of unspeakable abuse and depravity uh this case this B
this book actually features several different cases uh so check out slave girls by Wiley Clarkson you can do that
by going to True Crim garage.com click on the ended page we got all of our books listed there don't forget about
Lost Girls by Robert kker which is one of the best books is the best book about the Gilgo case in the Long Island serial
killer so pick up both of those by going through our Amazon Banner but uh anyways
I'm going to leave you with this clip from this press conference about the accusations that this prostitute is
making towards the police chief I think you'll find it interesting it's about 16
minutes long but check it out it's there's some mind-blowing stuff there [Music]
there has now been a significant development in the oak Beach Gilgo Beach murder for murder's
case that development is that an escort an active escort here in sua county has determined to come
forward and discuss with the Press discuss with the public that this escort met former Chief of Police of
suff County James Burke at a party in Oak beach in 20 and at that party she had sexual relations
with former Chief Burke for which he paid this is the first time that there has been an actual connection
made between former Chief police Burke Oak Beach and prostitution it's the first time this
has ever Cur and that's why it is significant up until now there's been a great deal of surmise about Chief bur
and his involvement with Oak Beach we have circumstantial evidence that he had some knowledge of Oak Beach his
assignment for example to uh the first precinct in that area possibly his assignment to the Marine Bureau in that
area um and his connection with Dr Peter Hackett the former former police surgeon
of suff County uh who was the head of Emergency Medical Services for a several years back in the 90s we now know a new
development has also occurred today we now know that James Burk and Dr Peter Hackett were in connection with each
other working with each other in the late 1990s uh with respect to flight 800 and
the Crash so they knew each other they certainly had a connection with one another and when you take that and
combine that with the knowledge that we're we're giving you today you'll see that these are significant developments
down the road on this [Music] [Applause] case Jimmy Burke never mentioned that his involvement with Oak beach in his
sentencing to the federal judge when he was sentenced for the crimes that he has
been convicted of and for which he is in prison he never mentioned that connection now it is being
made to examine Jimmy Burke under oath as part of the case uh that I I have brought on
behalf of the estate against Dr Hackett he is no longer just conjecture he is now a potential witness in fact so I
will attempt to cross-examine or examine uh former Chief Burke under oath as soon
as the case that's pending in court is decided uh so that's another development as well Jimmy Berg the same man who had
porno in his car the same man who was soliciting prostitution the same man who was responsible for the investigation of
the Gilgo Beach Oak Beach uh murders is the same man who met this escort in Oak Beach and solicited her and had sex with
her and paid for it after the investigation had already commenced so that's why we're here today
and with without more than I'm going to have ask uh that lean uh be willing to answer any
questions so you're alleging that um these parties where Burke was at where you were at um were other people there
yeah um were other uh uh law enforcement there I mean I would imagine so um he was there
uh um I mean I don't know specifically I but I mean I would imagine so but it was
a party there were numerous people there yeah there were numerous people there I
mean um drugs yes right and and so this party where did this party happen o Beach can you just start out by telling
us the story of what happened that you how you came to meet James I was invited by a friend uh while I was at Stony brg
University um well during the time in April I was not at the University enrolled as a student I was um at
another at another school um but I was still coming back to Stony Brook because I was going to be re reinstated in
September and I um went to this party with a friend as I often traveled back up uh to New York because I didn't live
here at the time I lived in Rochester so I came um with a with a friend um and there were there were other girls there
that I knew that I would rather um keep uh under the you know I I don't really want to reveal that um I was told by
someone because my area of study in which I have my bachelor's degree from Stony Brooke um is in you know crime
forensics things like that uh so I was introduced uh well not introduced but I was pointed out to him he was pointed
out to me as a high ranking official no one really gave me his title anything like that so um you know I continued to
party and I remember that the outfit that I wore was not really consistent with what you would see an es an escort
wearing I had on um I think abber proman Fitch cut off shorts and you know just some stupid shirt and you know Converses
so I I didn't really come across as anyone who was um you know someone you could solicit for sex so um I remember
walking by him and saying hello um that was pretty much the extent of that interaction um there was really no um
really nothing uh untour that that occurred at that point uh I came back again in August for another party um it
was it was at the same same location um and at that point I was dressed a little
bit differently I remember what I was growing and it was a little bit more Mis risque um I had never up until this
point uh ever accepted money for sex this is actually my very first encounter with um
uh pay pay pay for you know sex so um well what I would like to add from the first party is I did see Jim Jim
Burke grab a Girl by her hair and drag her to the ground uh I don't know how playful it was or how aggressive it was
I don't really know I wasn't right next to them when it happened um but I I do remember that she was she was an Asian
Asian girl um so uh the second party I went I was a little a little more risque um I
encountered him um we had a conversation uh it it wasn't really much um I was I was fairly intoxicated myself
uh I was not on cocaine I've never done cocaine um it just you know a whole lot of Boo and uh I remember hearing that he
was high up and I figured all right this is my opportunity for you know a a PBA card from uh from you know a high high
ranking official that you know that was just a joke in my head um so he started to do things like um as we were talking
he would rub his hand up my leg which you know I mean I'm I'm a woman I know when a man wants sex so uh you know I
kind of took the queue and he he kind of guided me to the bathroom um where we started to engage in uh sexual behavior
um he was uh frustrated because he could not consummate the ACT uh he became to he he began to get really aggressive um
and he used uh the term that I was not a good [ __ ] um uh so at that point uh he began to um
try to uh reach you know ejaculation through uh oral sex um but it wasn't really oral
sex it was more of him grabbing me in an aggressive manner by my hair his himself inside of me um choking I
remember tears not tears from crying but tears from from how aggressive it was I
was tearing up um and he still couldn't shouldn't uh reach reach a point of um of
ejaculation so he kind of just gave up and uh threw money at me which was my first encounter with um getting paid for
uh for sex was with with was with him now at that point I didn't know that he was you know so high ranking I actually
went back to a police officer friend of mine uh later on and um told him about the encounter and he said that uh he
referred to him as Jimmy um that was that was Jimmy Burke and I said who's Jimmy Burke and he showed me a picture
and I said yeah yeah that's that's him and uh then I saw him again when he got arrested I remember seeing him being let
out in handcuffs and thinking well that makes sense cuz he's you know not a very
nice time I had called in a tip um on an unrelated manner to the goo Beach task force um I called in the tip a couple of
months ago um I uh received a call from the detective in charge of the case uh two one of the two that's what they told
me um his name is detective foro CA um he actually revealed me to the person I tipped on he revealed that I was the CI
to the person that I called the tip in on I have a question you were now you were there not as a as an with an escort
service you were there just as a party just as a party you were never affiliate with any particular esort service were
you did you have knowledge or did you know any of the victims of the of of the the Mur I I did not know any of the were
there other escorts at this party yes how do you know uh I mean now that I'm I've in the business now for 6 years and
in hindsight I can look back and say the Behavior Uh two two women on on another
person's lap being led you know leading into adjacent bedrooms and and doing certain things uh but you're making an
assumption you don't know that the individuals were escorts you you don't you didn't identify the women that were
there as escorts I mean if they walk out with money in their hand doesn't that make them you know doesn't that make it
more suspect is that what they did yes and did you and bur agree to a monetary amount how much did he pay you
he he threw me like a wad between 3 to 400 I I can't really recall uh it was it was just a wad it first it looked like a
100 and then when you you know how sometimes when you have really crisp bills you kind of push them apart and
you notice that there are more underneath that was the the situation and I was a little uh dehumanized but
kind of like oh well I didn't know that I could make that money for 15 minutes of not
doing much uh so you know that that's and this happened after the investigation was already underway this
was in uh the first time I met him in just in passing was in April 2011 I in in that area April 2011 and then I know
in August 2011 is when we had our mini trust can you tell us what the Gilgo tip was that you uh wanted to tell theise
it's unrelated to this the the tip uh that was made to the police by Leanne was related to the Oak Beach case
however it wasn't a tip about Jimmy Burke it was a tip about someone else and Leanne does not want to reveal that
person and and it's not it really would not Advance the point that we're here for today and how you characterize his
behavior that night aggressive uh aggressive arrogant uh Untouchable were you afraid that night
or now have you been afraid since not until they revealed me as a CI when you saw when you witnessed uh
him brag a woman down to the ground and you say you don't know if that was um aggressive or playful I mean were you
alarmed did it look to you like something you should be concerned about she seems to be laughing which was
almost maybe that is consistent with his behavior she has you know encountered him before and that was something that
it was consistent he kind of just wrapped her like this and kind of like like you know took her down you
know I mean it's it hurts more if you just grab by one strand but he kind of like went like this and and just kind of
dragged her down and she she didn't seem to be too too frazzled by it I mean I I
I would have been uh she seemed to be more you [Music] know I guess uh used to the behavior has
your friend that was there that night um provided the same testimony to John uh uh they're they're not going to speak
but I have uh I have stated that I will take a l detector test um I have no problem doing that and whose house were
you at the night of the sexual [Music] encounter the house is is she can identify she believes she can identify
the house which was a large house uh a year round house at Oak Beach and it was adjacent
to the beach uh the actual person who owned the house it's not all that clear at this point
and what she does know she'd rather keep confidential at this [Music] point until next week be good be kind
and don't litter [Music] you can live out your Master Chef dreams when you find a professional on Angie to
tackle your dream kitchen remodel connect with skill profession to get all your home projects done well
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L.I.S.K. Update ////// 74

TrueCrimeGarage.com (http://truecrimegarage.com/)

The Long Island serial killer or serial killers case continues to fascinate Armchair detectives and true crime followers worldwide. Recently the documentary TV series "The Killing Season" has put the spotlight back on the unsolved serial case and several like it. For years the cases of the remains found in and around Gilgo Beach had gone cold. Very recently there have been some developments regarding linking some of the victims and some bad deeds within the investigation. Tonight we have asked Joshua Zeman and Rachel Mills of the hit series "The Killing Seasons" to join us in the garage. We will be discussing LISK updates and the future of this investigation.

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Brief Summary

Updates on the Long Island serial killer case with insights from Joshua Zan and Rachel Mills on their documentary Killing Season.

Key points

True Crime Garage Introduction. Hosts Nick and Captain welcome listeners and introduce their beer of choice.
New Developments in Long Island Case. Discussion on recent developments in the Long Island serial killer investigation.
The Importance of Identification. Identifying the unidentified is crucial for solving cases and empowering communities.
The Power of Public Involvement. Public engagement can lead to breakthroughs in cold cases, as seen in recent investigations.
Billy's Law and Missing Persons. Billy's Law aims to improve the accuracy of missing persons databases for families.
The Long Island Serial Killer Theory. Could one person be behind all the murders? The discussion raises suspicions about connections between victims.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

This is a very easy show to binge-watch!

Discussion on the Killing Season documentary

6:32WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

65/ 100Some tension

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