Kevin Cooper /// Part 2 /// 220 | Forensic Files

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everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true grime Chino Hills California
1983 in the dark of night evil lurks around a quiet house at the top of a hill a sliding door was left unlocked
and evil makes its way inside the home a sleeping family are surprised and slaughtered one victim survives and
tells a story that doesn't fit the evidence found at the scene a suspect is quickly identified and the
man hunt begins Kevin Cooper is arrested convicted and sentenced to death for the
murders the evidence was overwhelming but was it suspiciously overwhelming did the police plant
evidence did they ignore evidence for more than 30 years Cooper has proclaimed his innocence from a cell on death
row can we trust the scientific results that were produced can we ignore coincidence after
coincidence after coincidence we will continue to present the facts and you decide if you think
this man is a murderer or a convenient suspect but remember once is happen stance twice is
coincidence the third time is enemy action is Kevin Cooper the enemy and were his actions
[Music] murder welcome back we got a lot to get into yes and we know that Kevin Cooper
was arrested for the murders of the Ryan family and young Christopher Hughes but
the trial Captain would be moved South to San Diego because of and this is as polite as I can put it anger in the
local community now the trial began on October 23rd 1984 during the course of this trial and
we won't go through everything regarding the trial because we have a lot of evidence that we want to get to later
but Cooper does decide to take the stand at his trial and he does admit this is where we know that he admits to being in
The Hideout house just 126 yards from the crime scene but he does deny having committed the murders he admits that he
escaped from prison he admits that he eluded uh law for law enforcement and he admits to being near the crime scene he
also admits to having some of his what he referred to as quote roll your own tobacco with him when he escaped now
when they found him he was on this boat allegedly trying to rape this girl does what does he claim on that front well
that he can just deny because he's not caught like red-handed let's say so the way that the way that this goes down is
this according to the to her he rapes her at knife point on her boat later she remember we said that they were already
looking for Kevin Cooper later she sees a wanted poster for Kevin Cooper and she
goes holy crap that's the guy that raped me so she calls and phones the authorities letting them know Hey Kevin
Cooper is either in this area or at least he was when he did this to me so he's not caught necessarily red-handed
for that he can just deny that now he's not going to be brought up on charges on
rape charges against this woman because they're going to be seeking the death penalty in these murder charges and
attempted murder of this young boy so while he is at trial Cooper he simply claims that he left The
Hideout house he went back down and these are his words quote I went back down the hill on foot at night in the
same manner as when I walked up the hill to The Hideout uh following my escape from this prison he states that along
the way he started stopping drivers asking them either for directions to Mexico or for a ride to Mexico now
here's one thing that I was awfully curious about if the because I can only I can only report what was presented at
trial I can't report without having speaking having spoke to his defense attorney I can't speak to their tactics
or what they tried to present at trial only what was presented at trial one thing I've often wondered about in this
case is did the defense attorney at any point do a call to action by the public and say hey did any can anybody confirm
this portion of Kevin Cooper's story were you a motorist that was driving that night and you were stopped or
flagged down by this man who you saw on foot and he either asked you for directions or for a ride because in my
opinion if if we could find some people to cooporate that portion of the story that might lead you to believe that he
is telling the truth and that yeah how did he get to Mexico right right so the prosecutor is going to claim that Kevin
Cooper murdered the family drove the vehicle to Long Beach dumped it there and that he hitchhiked to Mexico
again I don't see any this is on the reverse side of this on the opposite side of this right where's the
prosecutor presenting people that are willing to testify saying hey I drove this guy to Mexico
from Long Beach or I picked them up in Long Beach so the way that this goes down Captain is it's February 7th 1985
that the jury begins deliberation on February 19th 1985 the jury convicts Kevin Cooper of murdering Christopher
Hughes Douglas and Peggy Ryan and their daughter Jessica and also convicts him of attempted murder of Joshua Ryan yeah
and for this he's going to be sentenced to death yes so we go through that because what
has gone on with this case since 1985 is we have Kevin Cooper who is proclaiming his innocence of these
murders from his prison cell on death row and actually he's almost been executed there was one time I think it
was was it 2004 mhm he was hours away from his execution they they were going to gas
him within hours of of when they receive a phone call stating you know what we need to take another look at this we
have some things that we need to look at and that's what I want to do here Captain is look through some more of
this evidence that we didn't get to yesterday and take a good look at it and try to determine does this point towards
him being guilty do we have the right guy or has there been a murderer out there on the loose all these years for
30 years let's just list some of the pieces of evidence that we went through yesterday well the most damning piece of
evidence is Cooper's own words he admittedly is at the Hideaway house within yards of the murder scene yeah we
also have the cigarette butts that were found in the stolen vehicle from the Ryan's house yeah one being a regular
cigarette but one being a rolled cigarette we know that he rolls cigarettes he claims that he had tobacco
from the prison we also have his footprint or a footprint at the scene of the murders which kind of lines up with
the the shoes that they would give you in prison we also have the potential murder weapon you know we said that a
hatchet was found near the home as if somebody driving the stolen vehicle had just tossed the hatch Hatchet out the
window and be Beard's making a little sloppy and we we know that this is likely the murder weapon because it has
some of the vi victim blood on it what it does not have is fingerprints from Kevin Cooper on it we have smudges on
the hatchet but no fingerprints now the sheath to this Hatchet is found in The Hideout house where he admits to have
been staying we also have people that occupied that Residence at one time stating the hatchet came from this home
we also have a missing uh we have some missing knives that we didn't discuss yesterday there's some missing knives
according to the owners of this Hideout house that were supposedly at the home sometime before Kevin Cooper occupied it
for those couple days and since the murders they've not been able to find these knives again he could have just
tossed these out as well with the autopsy showing that the weapons used in these attacks would be a hatchet of some
kind or Axe and then some kind of knife so we have now missing knives the other thing that we have Captain is we have
the surviv the Lone Survivor the young boy stating that he saw three white men he also said possibly Hispanic but
what's reported most often is that he saw three white men and you brought up that he said maybe four as well
regardless um Kevin Cooper is a single individual right and he is not a white man uh he is not Hispanic nor would I
believe him to be mistaken for either of those description he's an African Aman man um later the
interesting thing here though is later little Joshua's story changes a bit where we have him telling changes a bit
yeah we have him saying that a little bit more than a bit my friend later his story becomes that the person that
committed this all he could see all Joshua could see his limited memory of the crime was seeing a shadow shadow
figure a dark shadow figure with possibly bushy hair now I will say Mr Cooper certainly had bushy hair yeah uh
and all those you can see it in his arrest picture when when they're walking him to the uh police car he's got very
bushy hair yeah see I wonder if he was just keeping this style cuz was just getting out of the 70s and maybe like he
was really into disco possibly I think uh he was into whatever hair that he could get in the prison at the time so
here's the strange thing though you have to wonder why does this boy's memory change okay well no I hate to laugh but
the the the thing to me is when you have you would think now now I'll go back and
say this boy was hit on the head we know that so the early questioning can we even believe any of that and if we're if
we're to believe any of that can we believe any of the story changing so dramatically and I just think they
almost cross each other out and you should just not view it as any evidence as at all I think you're exactly right
and the reason why I liken this to I've never been knocked out I've never had my
throat slit I've never been attacked in the horrible horrible manner that this Joshua boy was attacked in I've never
had to go through a tragedy or such a heinous crime as witnessing family members being killed I could only I
can't I can only imagine what that would do to someone let alone a boy that young
now what I had to kind of think about is my own perspective my own life experience and and I liken that to
having a a big surgery you know I've had a couple surgeries in my lifetime and when you're coming out from the
medication there's the there's these little pieces of memories that I have coming out from this medication and it
they're they weird memories they memories of you know I saw doctor touching you no I I saw a person or two
in the room but but then when I'm when I'm clearheaded lat later M I have a hard time even figuring out what time
that would have been what the person looked like how many people were in the room things of that nature and that's
what I see kind of with his story as well and I know people are sitting in their garage or their car right now
making fun of me thinking of every week my friend nothing tragic nothing crazy happened to me I I just trying to put it
into some get some kind of perspective from my end why this kid's story could change let's touch well the other reason
his story could change is it doesn't fit The Narrative of the police so let's just play Devil's Advocate and then they
go hey we have this guy we think he's responsible so now we need you to testify that you saw a single black man
commit these crimes and this is who you're going to point your finger towards or you don't even have to say
you saw a single black man because that's not what he says you can just say you didn't see three white guys commit
this crime right you know and you could help a young boy along with changing that memory by going look you've son
you've been through a lot you know you were your your family's been wiped out you were almost killed yourself you were
in so much pain you were in and out of Consciousness all night long what we think has happened here is that the the
people that you think were responsible that you think were in the home at the time of the murders were not people that
you actually saw in the home at the time of the murders these were Rescuers these
were people coming to your Aid later at a later time and you were going in and out of Consciousness during this time
that is where those memories were created let's talk about the sheath because that sheath was found in The
Hideout house now there's been people that have said the police might have planted that sheath why because they
searched The Hideout house and did not find that sheath upon the first search right it's kind of like the keys yeah so
the the problem I have with that I think that's a leap by by people on the outside I think that's that's a a leap
by people saying look they searched the house the first time if it was there in plain sight they would have found it
well I want to throw a couple things into the mix here it was the home the home was searched by
deputies first of all second of all at the time that they searched the home they may not know that this sheath that
came from a hatchet it's obviously from a hatchet is of any importance at all when you're doing this initial search by
let's go ahead and assume un inexperienced law enforcement agents deputies low guys on the totem pole
going into this house they may not have a clear understanding of what took place at the
murder scene right they didn't see a bloody Hatchet so they said well this doesn't matter you you send out deputies
to Canvas the area and look for obvious signs of evidence right that's not an obvious sign I agree with you there yeah
they they're looking for a a man covered in blood MH oh well we didn't find that
or we did not find him so what happens is later you have the medical examiner that says that look a lot of these
wounds were caused by either a hatchet or an axe well now all of a sudden a hatchet sheath becomes something of
importance two you have a civilian who found the hatchet covered in dried blood and had victim's hair on it yeah we have
finger prints but not Prints but smudges correct but so the other thing too is wasn't there a eye witness of a couple
um that was on that road or close to the road of the house and saw um three white
man driving a station wagon the the car that was stolen and this is big because this points to Kevin Cooper being
innocent because we have the Ryan's vehicle that was stolen and yes I know that I pointed out that he did have
enough time to steal the the vehicle go to Long Beach make his way to Mexico and
check into a hotel by 4:00 that afternoon he had enough time to physically do that the problem with that
is we have eyewitnesses saying that there were white men inside that vehicle we don't have any eyewitnesses saying I
saw single black man driving that vehicle let's talk about that car a little bit because that car is like I
said something that is very very tricky when you want to say that Kevin Cooper is guilty well let's just me you know to
be clear there's a husband and their wife they're in the car the husband believes he saw three individuals the
wife believes she saw four now I believe the husband was driving so I'd put a little more weight into what the wife
saw because she wasn't driving she had have to pay attention on that level we also have a situation Captain where we
have an eyewitness who states that they saw the station wagon the following day so we know that the the vehicle was not
found until about a week later right so where was the other person that saw the vehicle okay well let me kind of go
through this thought first M the the thought being this with with the vehicle not being
found until a week later we know where Kevin Cooper was during that time period we know he was already in Mexico right
so if we assume that he killed these people stole the vehicle dumped it in Long Beach he would have done that
before going to Mexico mhm what we don't know is where that car was for the next
few days the problem being now that there's a witness stating that that car was being operated the day after Kevin
Cooper says that he was already in Mexico right so it doesn't NE necessarily matter where the vehicle is
as long as it's not in Mexico I don't know that this witness has um stated who they thought was driving the vehicle at
the time that they saw it but again regardless it doesn't matter who was driving it because we know Kevin Cooper
could not have been driving it okay also further information further eyewitnesses
regarding this car there's a witness who states this is from a woman who states that she is scared of being ident ified
as this witness but is willing to testify under oath if necessary she states that she saw three white people
in the Ryan's car and they were driving pretty crazy all right they said that they almost crashed into her vehicle her
grandmother was with her that day she wrote down the license plate number of the vehicle that almost smashed into
them hours later this is after the murders were discovered the authorities broadcasted a description of the missing
car with its license plate so the person the person that's the woman and her grandmother MH they see this broadcast
they go out to the car they get the slip of paper from which they wrote down the
license plate number and they say it was exactly the same H and why do you think this is important
oh well this is really important because if we go back to the eyewitness the sole survivor
Joshua his early statements are I saw three white [Music] men this show is sponsored by better
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[Music] 2023 all right we're back Captain cheers to you Captain hey there was it was really great uh off the
record this week so if you want to check that out we did a kind of talked a little bit the update of Kena Jenkins so
check that out on Stitcher premium that was a highly demanded update highly requested so one piece of evidence
captain that we have not got to yet which I originally thought this could hold the whole key because I tell you
for the past week or so looking at this case I have been swayed Every Which Way I one minute I think he's guilty the
next minute he's innocent next minute stuff was planted nope he's guilty again yeah and like you said you sway every
way you go ah he's guilty he's innocent maybe OJ did it maybe it was Casey Anthony I'm not really for sure at this
point I'm very confused the thing that we didn't get to though is a piece of evidence that I don't think could have
been planted and and it is hair there was hair that was found in the little girl's hand she had was clutching some
hair when her lifeless body was found now I've heard and read this hair as being described as Blonde or brown hair
yeah remember I said yet earlier that one thing I don't like about this case is people presenting this case often
have an agenda they often want to sway you in their Direction and one thing I've noticed is this hair being
described as Blonde well guess what if she ripped if she ripped this hair in defense off of one of her attackers or
the killer mhm and it's blond hair well we know Kevin Cooper does not have blonde hair and actually he probably has
the furthest thing from what would be described as blonde hair so I wanted to know for certain what
color was this actual hair because like I said I think some people have an agenda and they describe things in
certain ways to sway you to their side this I found a picture of the hair it's not blonde hair I can tell there's no
way anyone ever should describe this hair as blonde hair now what I will say is it's appears to be brown hair to me
and not a light brown a a a pretty as brown as brown can be it's the most normal brown hair I've seen get
down Charlie Brown what I can tell you though I do not need a microscope I do not need a fancy degree or a laboratory
to compare hairs plucked from Mr Cooper's head to the hair that was found in this little girl's hands to tell you
that they're not the same hair I can I can from pictures of the hair found and from pictures of seeing him
Kevin Cooper I can tell you that that hair does not match that person you don't want to run this through like some
computer program or possibly call up somebody good friend FY Malik and and ask for a second opinion I I I'm telling
you I'm right on this it's not Kevin Cooper's hair and I think we can get back to that in just a little bit
because I do want to discuss this other guy what there's another guy yes there's
an there's another guy who is this guy well some people that point to Kevin Cooper being innocent have also pointed
to somebody else as a likely suspect okay okay so this is what we know about this this person turain on June 9th a
woman named Diana roer calls the sheriff's department okay and she tells the sheriff's department that her
boyfriend Lee Faro had come home in the early hours of that day okay comes home basically in the middle of the night
right all right he arrived at their home in an unfamiliar station wagon a vehicle
she identifies as a station wagon and she doesn't know she's never seen it before right she also says that he is
with some people who stayed in the car she doesn't know who these people are cannot identify them she said that he
came into the home he changed out of his uh overalls or bib overalls whatever you
want to call them she said that he left these on the floor of their closet mhm he was not wearing a t-shirt when he had
come home he left the house about he's wearing some overalls you know without a t-shirt he's
just peacocking all over the place that's how he arrived at the home correct she says that he left a short
time later and did not return for a long time okay now both this woman Diana and
her father both have concluded that the overalls were were were covered in blood
right two two eyewitnesses yes and so Diana turns she turns in this evidence to the Sheriff's Department M she gives
it to a deputy and she says hey look not only am I giving you what I believe to be blood covered bib
overalls but I'm telling you I think that my uh boyfriend Lee Faro I think that he was involved in those murders
she also stated that a bloody Hatchet found beside the road the hatchet that we've discussed matched a hatchet that
was now missing from her garage mhm like I said a hatchet could be found in almost any home so the police department
the sheriff's department they never tested the overalls for blood that were turned into them good job well I don't
know that all of them are to blame because what we have here these items were this item was thrown away in a
dumpster mhm okay so it was not tested nor was it given to Cooper's defense so phone logs would later back
up a Sergeant's story that he had retrieved them and made multiple attempts to turn them over to uh the
lead investigators right and why wouldn't they take them I I cannot answer for them well it's probably
because they have a suspect that's black so he's been he's been you know this problem's been brought to this person
who collected this this item and he's saying look all I can do is attempt to turn it over to investigators if they
don't want to do anything with it I can't make them now about this Furrow Guy Lee
Furrow he has a bit of a background he had actually been released from a state prison earlier that year he had been
part of what what has been dubbed and I should shouldn't have laughed about yeah
yeah I'm making you in sensitive prick he has been he was a part of a murderous gang okay that's what it's referred to
in the newspaper but he was given a short sentence in return for turning States evidence against the leader of
this gang who was I guess sentenced to death for this this murder that they were convicted of so Furrow told friends
that while he was a part of this gang he had killed a girl cut up body and thrown
her body parts into the kar River now this here's another bit thing about this Lee guy right the station wagon that
didn't turn up until about a week after the killings right this is near the home
of Lee's stepmother who lived in Long Beach right so okay back to these gang murder it's just one right from my
understanding it's the murder of one person yes the murder of one person but how many people were involved in the
murder of this one person um that is not clear but it's more than two well it would at least be Lee and this guy named
Clarence Ray Allen okay so so at least two yes the only reason why I bring this up is because we have it's one thing to
have criminal a criminal past right because we know that Kevin Cooper does he broke
into cars he broke into other things and but now we have a past of somebody that
Comm committed a murder or was at least involved in a murder right with a group of people yes and I'm assuming that it's
more than just him and Clarence Ray Allen because it's referred to as a murderous gang meaning a group of people
that have committed at least one murder now the the information that I have and this is a very squishy
unconfirmed speculative information squishy okay so this information is is that the gang leader was Clarence Ray
Allen and he had raised the same kind of horses the same kind of Arabian horses as the Ryan now remember they were not
only raising horses but they were training them and showing them as well MH so there's like I said squishy
unconfirmed evidence that Allen may have had previously threatened to kill Peggy
Ryan why that they had some kind of fight over a horse saale that had gone wrong that squishy that he he felt that
he was cheated um and that she was uh you know threatened threatened her life okay let me try to unpack this
a little bit so we have eyewitness that claims that he was possibly in their vehicle the night of the murders came
home roughly a little bit after the night at the time of the murders came home to change was an overall was
covered in blood these were never tested we also have the person that he lived with the girlfriend saying hey and also
the hatchet that is the murder Weapon quote unquote looks kind of like the hatchet that's missing from our house uh
also by the way we're into horses he also possibly sold well the gang leader the gang leader that he was supposedly a
member of might have been into these horses right and this gang that he was involved in also murdered somebody as a
gang so I mean it's just how many more things do you need to tie to this guy well there I mean there are there are
actually a few more things so there there is at least one eyewitness if not two or three eyewitnesses that claim to
have seen three white men at a bar at some point after the murders and they believed that at least one of them was
covered in what appeared to be blood like had blood on their clothing but people you know you would just assume if
you're out in public and you see somebody like that that it's you're not seeing blood it's paint or it's uh you
know maybe they were hunters and had it was animal blood so we have that statement we what we don't have from
those eyewitnesses is them saying one of those men was Lee Furrow we don't have that we just have three unidentified
Caucasian males at a bar one of them being covered in what was thought to be blood well we also have his girlfriend
saying he came back with this station wagon with other people in it and we also have the couple that says hey we
saw a station wagon with at least three white males in it well and another thing
against leao is this remember the vehicle that was being driven by the woman and her grandmother was in the car
as well and they said they almost got into an accident because the station wagon was driving so
wildly well she was later shown a photograph of Lee Furrow to which she would say I believe that guy matches the
description of the guy I saw driving the vehicle at the time so now we need to talk about the shirt though remember we
mentioned he came home Lee fur according to his girlfriend Diana comes home in the middle of the night he's not wearing
a shirt and he's got these overalls on that are covered in blood he leaves those at the house changes the clothes
and if we think that these three men are the same as the three men later spotted
at the bar he's getting cleaned up to go out for a celebratory drink after having
killed these people yeah we showed them a lesson after they screwed us on horses
well one big big piece of evidence against Kevin Cooper would be a t-shirt that was found okay so the problem with
this t-shirt though is we have Diana rer who is the girlfriend of Lee Furrow stating he comes home without a T-shirt
and oh yeah by the way the bloody t-shirt that was found beside the road leading from the murder
house mhm that was his shirt it matches a shirt that I had purchased for him at one time she states that it's a Fruit of
the Loom shirt uh with one of those you know it's a t-shirt with a breast pocket
right and she stated that she knew this to be his shirt because she purchased form right so how's this
against the big problem with this shirt though is it has blood evidence on it mhm okay and the problem with this
evidence is on the shirt it points toward Kevin Cooper his blood being on that shirt well I'll
smack my ass call me Susan so this is difficult because it's like you like you said said before you said earlier um you
know after so many times it can't be a coincidence anymore mhm but there it seems like there's as many coincidences
pointing towards Kevin as they are pointing to somebody else I agree with you but the but the the thing that
Cooper's not going to be able to shake is this t-shirt and I say that because the problem with this t-shirt and I I
think I called it yellow but it's I I see a picture of it and I think of it as yellow it's often described as a tan
t-shirt so if anybody out there knows about this case and I'm talking about the one and the same okay they're the
same shirt okay well now I don't trust you with that hair sample well if I showed you this picture you would say
that this shirt could be yellow anyway regardless of what color this shirt is the problem for Kevin Cooper is this
shirt contains his blood and it also contains the blood of Doug Ryan of the father right so
if this shirt was discarded near the crime scene and it has the suspect's blood Kevin Cooper and the victim's
blood on it he's looking pretty damn guilty at this point right this shirt is a big piece of contention for both the
defense and the prosecution and not so much at his trial at Kevin Cooper's trial but later at his appeals why
because they tested here's what Kevin Cooper States he States look they took my blood and at some point they put it
on this t-shirt okay they put my blood on this t-shirt it it didn't come from my veins
it didn't come from an artery it didn't come out of my body and go onto that shirt it went into a tube somewhere and
then from the tube it went onto the T-shirt right and therefore it was planted by law enforcement or
somebody and that's how they've put me behind bars and that's how they're going to kill me
the evidence to suggest that he might be right is this that later they test this
blood and there's this okay so they find EDTA right right in this sample okay what is this this is this is a
preservative that is used to preserve blood samples such as the one that was taken from Kevin Cooper years ago right
I think they found this in a couple of the samples with OJ as well well ooper states that the Eda that's found in the
blood on the on the shirt in that sample is proof that they took it from the tube that they tried to preserve my
blood preserve the sample and then they dumped it onto this shirt the problem with that is Eda is a
common compound found in hand creams laundry detergent and other everyday products so that being said if this
shirt had ever encountered any of these products like laundry detergent there would be some presence
of Eda found possibly in that sample and has the defense ever tested the shirt to
see if there's any other blood you know because you they can say we have two blood samples here but maybe there's a
third from my understanding and from looking at the shirt and from evidence produced from the shirt
I believe they've only found two kinds of Blood on the shirt one coming from Kevin Cooper and one coming from Doug
Ryan so where do we go from here well that's the problem because you're the problem the shirt when first presented
with this evidence of the shirt mhm you go okay this makes him guilty his blood was found on the shirt then years later
you go wait they found Eda in this sample right well then it's planted so he's innocent if it was planted he has
to be innocent or is there somehow that this guy killed these people and the police just thought they were doing the
right thing by making a case against him so well the Eda in my opinion actually doesn't clear anything up because as
much as it points toward it being planted it also points toward it well it could just be happen stance that it's
there yeah yeah I agree I really want to know when Joshua started changing his story because I think there's something
there you know if if you come out of this traumatic situation and you say hey I think it was at least three
individuals regardless of color that once you start changing the story to well I think it was you know one person
and it was a black man or a man of color so I think once you figure out where that story starts changing because
there's again there's so many for all the pieces of evidence pointing towards somebody there's
pointing towards somebody else as well well I here's one thing that I don't like about this case it's the racism
Factor okay I think that I think race and racism gets brought up in this case a lot because we have this individual
that might be wrongly convicted and he happens to be African-American right and what I here's the problem with that the
problem is that all this does is murky the waters all it does is confuse things and Cloud things in my opinion I don't
think that the police went out and sought a black man for this crime I think if they had any Prejudice about
them it was against Kevin Cooper not against an African-American man right and what I mean by that is they can
prove that he was near the crime scene roughly about the time the crime went down very near yes and so therefore for
I think that if there was any Prejudice it was against Kevin Cooper not against an a African-American man if that makes
sense M and so I think when people bring up racism and bring up this kind of thing it only clouds it doesn't help
anybody solve this any faster because the problem is we're running out of time this guy will be likely will be executed
at some point we stated that in the early 2000s he was hours away from being executed and if you allow something like
racism to get involved in this push that aside please push this aside because I think some of the evidence might be able
to point you to what actually happened here now we should we should mention too well I think what you're trying to say
is that they get a couple pieces of evidence right and it going against Kevin Cooper does not matter what color
his skin is it's just the fact that we have this heinous murder we're trying to pin it on somebody right and they got
cloudy in in that vision and had nothing really to do these heinous murders look
if I believe if Kevin Cooper was a white man this still would have happened the same way it happened oh I agree I think
that if police thought that I were in that Hideout house at that time that they would say you know what this is our
guy but right but the difference here is they wouldn't have to have the key eyewitness Chang their story so
dramatically now did we mention that he is a appealed this time and time again yeah and we well I think we have and I
think we've also mentioned that he has claimed his innocence throughout correct now one part of the appeals process
remember we talked about that hair that was found in little Jessica's hand yeah okay that hair was part of his appeals
because they wanted to test that hair to prove that it didn't come from Kevin Cooper and it didn't come from Kevin
Cooper we know know that to be the truth right here's the problem with this though the hair did not come from the
killer the hair what belonged to victims it was victim's hair that was in Jessica's hand so this kind of backfired
on his appeals because it didn't point to the killer at all didn't help find out who the killer was we already know
who the victims were well in this case is so difficult because we could have done four parts on just speculation and
debating that and that's not really what we're trying we're trying to get a little bit closer to the truth and I
think um you know anybody that has opinions on this case please go to our website true Crim garage.com and check
out the blog on this case well the thing the problem with this case is this Captain we could have discussed it four
or five hours but we have already we only recorded two hours of it it the the problem is each little point of evidence
is a discussion topic it's something that you could argue for or against the guilt of Kevin Cooper and when you start
pouring through these item by item by item it gets awfully lengthy we didn't want anybody to have to sit and listen
to us pour through each and every single item the reason being is that in my opinion let's throw this I want to take
this shirt the the shirt with the blood evidence found on it all right let's put
that in its own little compartment as planted evidence well no let's put that in its own little compartment for now
all the other evidence and there's lots of it none of it specifically names Kevin Cooper as having killed these
people however by the same token none of it exonerates him MH none of it excludes
him so there there is the big issue there's the big problem right there now now let's go back to the
shirt was Kevin Cooper's Blood on the shirt yes 100% yes how did it get there what did it come from a tube we don't
know did it come from his body we don't know well whoever put it on that shirt if it was planted I hope that they come
forward one day and say hey I did this and I was wrong it probably won't but they should well there's an individual
uh his last name is um I can't think of it right at this moment um but we we know it was there was a there was a man
that worked on this case uh that worked on some of the blood evidence and I will
say this there seems to be some shaky things going on regarding that operation whether this could have been
tampered with with it whether it was planted right there's some shaky business going on there and that makes
me not trust this shirt so much it makes me have a hard time trusting this shirt
and the best opinion I can give on this case and as far as the guilt of Kevin Cooper I'm not going to lie to you I
think there's overwhelming evidence to suggest that he might be guilty but I don't have anything to
pinpoint him 100% other than that T-shirt and I don't trust I don't know that I trust that evidence right I don't
trust a lot of the evidence I'm just going to break my part down real quick the the way I view it is you don't kill
a whole family to steal a car we have other people that are tied to the to the family have other possible motives and
as much speculation as there is out there again you don't kill a whole family steal a car you possibly kill a
whole family and steal their car because they did your gang wrong and and in the
autopsy when they when the coiner comes out and say says that they think that all these attacks were done within a
minute or so mhm that that points to me as evidence that this wasn't done by one
person or couldn't have been done with by by one person it would be if that medical examiner is right it would be
very very difficult in my opinion for one person to have committed all of these murders in such a short amount of
time as has been suggested by by the medical examiner the other thing that I take issue with is that the medical
examiner also suggests the autopsy suggest the use of multiple weapons the use of multiple weapons and not that not
to say that one person couldn't have entered the home brandishing multiple weapons however I just find it unlikely
I think multiple weapons to me points more likely to multiple asants before before we leave Captain I
want to wrap up with some words from The Lone Survivor from Joshua Ryan and his thoughts on this case he States I wish I
could remember I don't know if they think I have the answers or that it's in my head it won't come back to me Josh
says he doesn't remember seeing Kevin Cooper that night only a shadow and he also says quote I want to know if really
did it I couldn't live with myself knowing that there could have been a chance that he didn't do it that's not
[Music] right thanks for listening thanks for telling a friend till next week be good
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Kevin Cooper /// Part 2 /// 220

Part 2 of 2

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Chino Hills, California, 1983 - In the dark of night, evil lurks around a house at the top of a hill. A sliding door was left unlocked and evil makes it's way inside the home. A sleeping family are surprised and slaughtered. One victim survives and tells a story that doesn't fit the evidence found at the scene. A suspect is quickly identified, and the manhunt began. Kevin Cooper is arrested, convicted and sentenced to death for the murders. The evidence is overwhelming. But was it suspiciously overwhelming? Did the police plant evidence? For more than 30 years, Cooper has proclaimed his innocence from a cell on death row. This week we discuss the horrific murders of the Ryen family and little Christopher Hughes. We will try to determine if Kevin Cooper is guilty of these murders. Beer of the Week - Grapefruit Double IPA by Claremont Craft Ales Garage Grade - 4 and a half bottle caps out of 5

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Brief Summary

Kevin Cooper's conviction for a 1983 family murder is debated, focusing on evidence, witness accounts, and potential wrongful conviction.

Key points

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The Kevin Cooper Case. Kevin Cooper, convicted of murder, maintains his innocence for over 30 years.
Eyewitness Account. Joshua, the sole survivor, claims he saw three white men at the scene.
The Hair Evidence. A piece of hair found in the victim's hand raises questions about its origin.
The Bloody T-Shirt. A t-shirt found near the crime scene contains blood from both the victim and Cooper.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Can we trust the scientific results?

Questioning the evidence against Kevin Cooper

4:32WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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