Lynne Harper /// Part 2 /// 143 | Forensic Files

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crime [Music] ly Harper was a 12-year-old girl who disappeared on June 9th 1959 from the rcaf station in Clinton
Ontario now two days after her disappearance Lynn's body was recovered on a farm it was discovered that Lynn
had been raped and strangled with her blouse now on June 12th we have 14-year-old Steven triscott he's taken
into custody because he's last reported to have seen Lynn Harper he tells the police that he sees her getting into a
car they don't believe him and then on June 13th he is charged with her murder now I kind of want to underline all of
that just think about how fast things are happening here right so less than 48 hours after her body is found we have a
14-year-old who was arrested and charged with first deegree murder mhm so very fast
investigation maybe uh understatement or maybe no investigating at all is would be the
question there um on September 16th of that same year Steven Truscott his trial began and then on September 30th the
jury returned a verdict of guilty let's go through Steven's accounts of the events one more time he picked up Lynn
on his bike at the school they went at her request right she asked for a ride he said sure I'm going that way anyways
they ride down the road they pass the bush that's what we call it then they pass the bridge then he drops her off at
the stop sign at State Route 8 and then he heads back to the bridge turns around
sees her getting into a vehicle uh maybe a Chevrolet right yeah a Chevy late model or 1959 Chevy possibly a Bel Air
gray in color a lot of Chrome right and something orange on the back we don't know if it was a license plate or not
and then he heads back to the base and then he ends up babysitting that night uh within within an hour right he is out
of that area so that's his story yeah he's sticking with it even though he is now charged he is now in prison he is
now waiting to the death penalty but he's going to be hung that's that's a that's the worst death penalty I think
or your head being chopped off I well let's not get into that debate I think that's a whole another show in itself um
but the thing here is Captain not only do we have a very small very short and fast
investigation we have what I would say is a very fast trial as well he he's brought to trial on the 16th of
September and he's gets a guilty verdict on the 30th of September this was supposed to be a controversial ual trial
this was supposed to be a big deal because we have a 14-year-old a minor who is charged with first-degree murder
and oh yeah that's a death penalty case this was supposed to be a big deal I'm surprised that the that the trial was so
fast um now when the jury did return with the verdict of guilty they did have a recommendation for Mercy um to the
judge the judge however sentenced trus Scott to death uh to hang as you had said I don't I don't think we need to
look into this and and and judge what kind of Judge this is and whether he did the right thing or the wrong thing I
think here we have a situation where we have a certain type of crime was committed and there's a certain penalty
for that type of crime and so I think even though that there was a recommendation of Mercy um that just
being he's a 14-year-old boy and that's hard to sentence that person to death um
I think we have a judge just putting into place what is supposed to happen in these type of Trials it would eventually
be overturned and this would be commuted to a life sentence instead of the verdict to hang well cuz he was actually
supposed to die pretty quickly yeah it wasn't like you know here or and also this is again the 50s so it was like you
know within months they were going to you know uh take out his sentence but uh that was quickly overturned yeah yeah we
thought Texas executed people quickly this was supposed to be very a very fast execution uh thank God it was it was
commuted to a life sentence um there there would be another trial okay um and a big part of this was
there was an A U author that wrote a good book called The Trial of Steven Truscott and in this in this book the
author basically takes his side and says that he's wrongfully convicted mhm so this is going to lead to um people
looking at his case again and we're going to learn some things that we weren't told in the first trial and I
think you're going to be able to see how we have a jury that comes out and and comes back with a guilty verdict because
there were certain things they didn't hear uh the the first and I think which is the most important is the time of
death and we discussed that regarding the stomach contents of Lyn Harper it was discussed that she had her last meal
around 5:45 p.m. she goes missing and the jury is told that her stomach should have emptied within 2 hours of that last
meal well it couldn't empty within 2 hours because she was killed before that time had elapsed yeah put in the time
period between 7:15 and 7:45 which makes Steven triscott look very guilty because he's admittedly with
her during that approximate time mhm so he he's most likely our guy if you go off of that now one thing that we end up
learning here is that that same doctor had submitted several reports regarding this and regarding the time of death and
those earlier reports that he was submitting had a much bigger window of time you know he's stating she died
sometime between 7 7:45 7:15 7:45 that's a very precise amount of time mm the earlier Reports say that she died
sometime between 7 and about 700 a.m. the following morning so a 12-h hour window yeah well
cuz what happened with the trials once they put such a you know exact time period you know 715 to
7:45 the scientist Community comes out and says hey that that's not how this uh test do you know and you can't have a
you can't pinpoint it that accurate so he actually went back and did the test again still put in the time of death
between 7:15 and 7:45 but also in in uh parenthesis stating or possibly within 12 hours of that right so again this is
now you're you have a big gap and and remember though we have eyewitness reports stating a odd vehicle in the
bush later that night yes way past 8:00 yeah so the the theory is that Steven attacked her killed her and left her in
the bush but then was able to return and be back with other people by 8:00 p.m. no visible signs of injury on him and we
when we have these other reports when we start to look into this we have some some reports that would come out many
years later regarding the insects and the things that take place on a body as it's decaying there is there is a
scientist stating that she firmly believes she says she gives it a 95% 95% chance of accuracy that Len Harper was
killed after Sundown and killed sometime before Sun up uh based on what she sees
with these insects and their activity on the body there is somebody else that states that she would have been killed
before Sundown so I don't know that that gets us anywhere um but we have several
different reports pointing towards the possibility that she was killed at a later time mhm Okay and like the captain
said the big problem with that is well there was a vehicle spotted on the lawon property and this is a a dark colored uh
52 uh Ford convertible they found tire tracks in that area as well this wasn't investigated this
vehicle was not investigated and I'll tell you why it wasn't reported to the police until after they had already
zeroed in on Steven triscott MH by this point they had already interrogated him for hours probably had already charged
him by the time they hear about this vehicle we don't need that information because guess what we've already got our
guy our guy has no access to a vehicle right so that that doesn't mean anything to our investigation well a big problem
with this investigation it happened so quickly you know the charge happen so quickly then you have whatever evidence
now we have one you know we have evidence coming in of we saw this vehicle well we're not going to
investigate that because that has nothing to do with our guy or our Theory so that's one piece of evidence but I'm
guessing normally in murder cases there's hundreds of uh leads so how many leads came in after the arrest and and
pushed aside you know pushed aside because we already got our guy we're we're building a trial here now we're
we're not working on an investigation anymore we got our guy and I think what we have here Captain I think that we
have an investigation where I think it quickly circled in on this 14-year-old and if he is your Prime Suspect I think
these investigators thought you know what it's only a matter of time before we get that confession we I believe they
thought he was guilty and I think they thought it's only a matter of time because he's a kid he'll eventually
confess and then boom we got our trial we're all done with this thing what other stuff was not not worked on as
part as part of this investigation one thing that I found very strange was many years after the fact
their teacher came out and now keep in mind this was a split level class this teacher taught both of them even the day
of her disappearance mhm it's very rare I think that you have a situation where somebody knows a victim and knows the
person that's supposed to have committed the crime and this teacher says he was never interviewed the police asked him
no questions at all that seems seems a little hurried and a little strange to me yeah but this is a typical case of a
investigation having blinders on creating a theory and then trying to make that theory stick MH you know this
is uh you know this is error 101 right this is the number one error that these in investigators make the first thing to
do is yeah if you do have a theory then let's prove that theory wrong right and I think if they would have done that
they would have found that their theory was proven wrong pretty quickly mhm yep you you speculate as to what you think
happened then you have to go find the evidence to back up that speculation and lead you to the correct person to the
correct suspect uh here they circled in on the suspect first well on the time frame is really difficult because if
this crime happened today it'd be pretty simple let's run DNA test and we'll know
the answer within days right and I kind of want to back up what we were talking about earlier regarding the stomach
contents and the reason why I believe that the earlier reports of what the doctor saying is probably more accurate
than the later report where he really zeros in on that that short 45 minutes saying this is your time of death is
that you can see that the doctor was kind of tailoring his report his later report to what the investigators had
learned during their short investigation because in the early reports he states that the stomach contents may have
contained meat he doesn't say they did contain meat or they didn't contain meat he says may have in the later report he
says that the stomach contents contained turkey well where did he get this information this came from questioning
her parents what did she eat for her last meal oh around 5:45 that night she finished dinner we had turkey for dinner
right again boom all of a sudden turkeyy is in the report right yeah this is this
is ridiculous and not to mention that every eyewitness that goes along with your theory there's one that contradicts
it or several that contradict it m so my big thing here is they have evidence that she put up a fight right right and
there's no marks on Steven so therefore he didn't do it to me that's all you need that's all you need that's you know
all this other stuff doesn't matter to me if you know cuz you know unless you're going to tell me that you're
theory is that Steven and somebody else attacked her mhm then where's the marks on on his body right it doesn't make any
sense well ultimately Steven triscott he would end up getting out of prison he would end up serving a 10-year sentence
and then he would be placed on parole uh there's a bit of a weird situation here
where I guess the warden uh at the prison at some point became a parole officer and Steven triscott went to live
with the former Warden uh his current parole officer lived with him and his family um so which I think shows you
something about Steven's character yeah um you know we have somebody that watched over him in prison feeling like
it's safe enough to bring him around his his family yeah and stepen actually you
know uh 14 I think to 18 was in one prison and then he actually was moved he was transferred a couple times
that's correct there was a lot of concern that you know we have a I mean he he went into prison at 14 yeah like
you know this could be bad for him some some people get in the system and they never can get out well so let's let's
keep that in mind because they're not saying that he's innocent but he's he's not serving the sentence that he was
supposed to serve if he was guilty of first-degree murder right can we agree on that he's serves 10 years and then
he's paroled that that seems like a big jump from a death sentence or a life sentence so you had mentioned you know
what other leads or possible suspects would have been uh ignored let's say and this is something that I found
interesting because you know this was from the Ontario Court of Appeals many years later these were arguments that
were made before the Ontario Court of Appeals M um so the defense maintained that once the Ontario police officers
locked in their sights on triscott back in June of 1959 that the investigation like you and I had said stopped indiff
indifference took over and seemingly obvious leads were ignored including cluding previously undisclosed
information pointing to other suspects now unfortunately in this report that we have here these suspects are not named
in the court documents because they have not been charged with anything but these
individuals include a convicted pedophile stationed at the rcaf base at Clinton at the time of Lyn Harper's
death the opp learned about him in 1997 after being contacted by a retired London Ontario Police police detective
who felt that this man was capable of murdering a child the man had pled guilty to sexual offenses and possession
of child pornography in the late 1980s when the police searched his house in connection with those offenses they
found an 8 volume transcript of truscott's hearing before The Supreme Court of Canada from 1966 to
1967 interesting also mentioned in this is an Airman who had been stationed at Clinton Prior to 19 1959 he was
stationed at alimer at the time of the murder but had a home in Sea forth uh which is close to the base which he
visited frequently close to C5 yeah uh between c3d and C5 you're correct he was identified later by the
CBC uh This Is The Fifth Estate show uh identified him as sergeant Alexander smelly pants no sorry uh Sergeant
Alexander kichuk and I say close yes very close we'll get to kichuk here in a minute cuz we have more information on
him uh also mentioned in this report we have a former salesman who drove a 1957 Chevy and apparently called at the
Clinton base frequently the man came to the police attention after he tried to break into a home of a retired op
detective this is Barry Ru who shot him with the pellet gun and then began his own investigation in a report to the op
rule concluded that the the man could be a potential suspect in several murders including Lynn Harper um this case the
cases that he mentions have common characteristics all the victims well a lot of them are are listed as
hitchhiking victims um and their bodies or clothes were dumped in what what were
considered lovers Lanes yeah why I wonder where they the clothes folded that's a good question we'll get we'll
get back to that too because we have some information on this salesman as well also mentioned we have a convicted
rapist who lived in Sea forth at the time of the murder and worked on the Clinton base as an electrician at least
one day a week the man who was convicted in 1948 he had spent 3 and A2 years in prison and had been to the Harper home
this is very strange MH okay so we have he's convicted his convicted rapist who had
been to the Harper home before the murder to rep well he was there to repair a clothes dryer he was an
electrician yeah well there there's a connection you know I I believe a lot of times these people know that you know
know they're attacker I I'm with you there and again if she's getting into a vehicle not pulled in a vehicle remember
there was no report of a struggle but did she know that individual was it somebody she had seen before somebody
she knew and trusted she like you said seemed to have willingly gotten to the vehicle yeah and if this sick piece of
[ __ ] was in her house uh fixing a dryer you know he probably would remember her
name mhm Caesar walking past Drives By hey hey you need a ride somewhere Lyn do you need a ride yeah want me to take you
back to your house yeah pretty easy um also mention in here we have a minister uh who is an accused sexual offender we
got we have to say accused um he lived in a village just north of the Clinton base uh he had been accused of sexual
assault by his grown daughters years later well he's real sicko but one claims that when he was when she was 6
years old she hid in her father's car and remained there when he took it out for a drive at some point on this drive
he stopped on a gravel road and opened up the trunk moments later she claims that she saw him carrying the limp body
of a girl towards a grassy treed area Jes where he spent about a half an hour uh before returning to the car alone
right now but some of these leads and stuff are coming out way after investigation yeah so I mean to be fair
to the investigators you're exactly right and and you know what uh you know those are all very strange situations
but I've just come across a maybe even a more strange one because I have in my notes here um read through the suspect
descriptions and then ask the captain which ones jump off off the page um they they all maybe they could jump off the
page and ride into prison well look I mean you have to you have to like the suspect that actually worked at the
school and worked at the family's house that that's a big worked at the base and
then there was one that worked at their house yes because those are obvious connections mhm that that's you know
that the attacker would have known the victim and but all these scenario iOS to me sound a lot better than
Steven yeah they do but the problem that I keep coming back to with this whole case is that it's very strange to me
let's say that Steph is completely innocent let's say that his story is correct that he dropped her off at the
at County Line or at the County Road Highway 8 and she was picked up by a vehicle it it doesn't it seem weird to
you captain that that whoever picked her up and then ultimately ended up doing this to her that she ends up back very
close to where she's p i mean extremely close to where she's picked up from with
within a mile within a half a mile maybe even a quarter of a mile from where she
was picked up from right so are you saying that that's strange and that points to Stephen I'm saying that it's
strange in the sense that it it it would it would Point me away from her getting
into a car I'll say that um it doesn't to me the well the only reason why because all the eyewitnesses all the
eyewitnesses that saw them right or didn't see them or stepen it comes back you can't Overlook the the big biggest
piece of evidence to me is that they know that she put up a fight and I don't know exactly what that evidence is but
I'm guessing blood on her hands uh you know F maybe broken fingernails from clawing at somebody I'm not really for
sure but they know for a fact that her attacker would have marks on them and Steven did not mhm so again it's it's
too small of a window um he was doing a nice thing for somebody you know you need a ride I I'll take you in chances
are that Lynn you know being the younger girl maybe she had a little bit of a crush on Steven and that's why she asked
Steven for a ride and not to walk with somebody else mhm and and this this older boy gives her a ride on the bike
and drops her off and several people see it but again no marks on this boy right
I'm I'm not saying Stephen by posing this question I'm not saying Stephen what I'm saying though it
seems very strange to me that she would have gotten into a car abducted by the driver of that car raped and killed and
placed in a location that's almost the exact same location that she's picked up from well I believe that within a very
short amount of time I I'm thinking I you know going off the top of my head here all the cases we've covered all the
cases we've read about that we've see on the internet how many can you think of where
a child is abducted and then the body's found almost in the same location as the
abduction it just it's got to be close to zero right I mean I I I can't think can can you think of any no just not not
off the top of my head but look you pick up an individual you know the motivation
here is sexual right obvious and I believe this happened like I said somewhere else and then in the process
of looking for a place to dump the body you know this person might not have known the area super well mhm and just
drove around to find a spot mhm and oh well oh here we go I can pull off here you know and then they dump the body but
to me I'm like I'm saying I'm just saying it's a percentage thing I'm not saying it's impossible I'm not saying
that it didn't happen but what I am saying is out of all the cases that that we've reviewed and all the cases I've
looked at over the years I it's hard for me to think of that same situation taking place right but what I'm also
what I'm saying though is that the person the murderer right did not might not have known that they're dropping the
body off so close to where they picked the person up at is what I'm saying have they would have no clue that they're
returning to damn near the same place to to drop off something they picked up I'm
saying there's a possibility they might not have known okay I'll give you that what I'm saying I'll give you that but
you know off the top of my head there's the only a couple situations that I can think of where where this was even a
possibility and you know one would be the deli case that we covered but there's a big question if those girls
were even removed from that wooded area and then returned yeah but look I I don't think that matters I I just think
I find it strange oh and here maybe here's another situation I think the Oakland County child killer I think one
of those victims was returned to roughly the same area but they were held for days um I I'm just pointing out here
that it's it's strange to me that to to believe that she got into a vehicle drove away somewhere for hours and then
was returned to the same location I I'm not saying it's impossible I get what you're saying but I think we can agree
that it does seem it's an oddity yeah I guess anyways there's a lot more to get to right after this
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today you can do this when you Angie [Music] that all right Cheers Cheers mates cheers all right so we have a suspect
here in Lin Harper's murder who stands out and this is that Alexander cajic and the reason why he stands out and the
reason why we bring him up is he is somebody that a lot of people involved in this investigation or close to this
investigation back in 1959 believe that he should have been somebody on their radar he should have been somebody he
should have been a concern for them and a piece of this investigation and it doesn't appear that he was so let's go
over who kich is he was born in 1923 uh he was uh part of the Royal Canadian Air Force he was a sergeant uh who lived
and worked in the area at the time of the murder now Sergeant kichk was known to be a heavy drinker um and from the
stories I told or been told uh heavy drinker might be an understatement he's heavier than than us
times four yeah well he's basically if you take what I drink and what you drink and times that by four there that's what
I meant yeah so he's a heavy drinker with previous convictions for sexual offenses some involving young girls MH
now like we said he served in the air force during World War II um but he returned to civilian life in 1945 in
1950 uh he re-enrolled at the in the rcaf and was originally posted at the station in Trenton but soon afterwards
he was transferred to the station in Clinton now we know this from our case you know this is close to our case here
he served as a supply technician until 1955 but in 1957 he was transferred to another station now this is located
about an hour away from Clinton however kich made frequent trips back to Clinton
where Lyn's Harper where ly Harper's father was the senior Supply officer well there's your you know connection
there yeah good possible connection but we also have this situation that takes place about 3 week 3 weeks before ly
Harper's murder kich was arrested and charged by the Ontario Police for attempting to lure three young girls
into his car outside of St Thomas Ontario the charge was dismissed shortly afterward um but the judge gave kich a
warning regarding his behavior basically the way this thing went down is he sees
three girls walking on the side of the street he pulls up to them opens up the car door he's trying to lure one if not
two or three of them into his car um there's different reports on what he was using to as a ruse one is saying you
know uh possibly new clothes or new underwear yeah when they said the new underwear I thought yeah that seems like
a strange thing to offer somebody to get in a car you want some new underwear yeah like anytime you hear that run for
your life well I guess there's hey come in the garage want some new underwear nah I guess there's lack of sufficient
evidence because like we said the charge is eventually dismissed but the judge gives him a Stern warning the warning uh
goes something like this hey I know what you're up to I know that you were what you were trying to trick those little
girls into your car we're going to be watching you kind of thing that's the kind of warning he got yeah well they
should have said hey look with this underwear stuff right no more no more you don't even look at little girls and
if you do no new underwear for you for the rest of your life or we're going to hang you you sick son of a [ __ ] well
here's a reason why cich should have been on their radar for for reasons already stated but more importantly for
this one uh in the early part of June in 1959 we have kichuk probation officer advises is the Air Force officials of
another incident of indecent exposure involving kichuk in the town of SE forth not far from the Clinton base now on
July 2nd just 3 weeks after the murder of ly Harper kichuk was hospitalized due to overwhelming anxiety tension
depression and guilt um according to the rcaf documents but this is after the charges are dropped right right but but
he's he's experiencing this overwhelming Ani anxiety this tension depression and
guilt 3 weeks after the murder of Lyn Harper right that's my point is that a lot of people would assume well he was
charged with this but they dropped the charges so he shouldn't have anxiety over that is what I'm stating yeah that
that's no longer on his mind right the other thing that I think to me is like bingo bango
Boingo is that this idiot sold his car mhm and and again I think if you look at um everybody that heard this story Lyn
Harper's story they also heard about Steven's story and Steven's accounts and Steven claiming that he saw a car and
that he saw an orange thing on the car M and I think that spooked him and that's
why he got rid of the car I also believe like I said that the crime took place at
least the sexual crime took place place somewhere else and I believe that vot was probably the car do we have a rough
description of that car that he sold uh I actually could not find that okay but but it is mentioned that he
sold his car after her death right okay that's that's very interesting in itself
now kichuk drank himself to death in 1975 uh his final days were spent in a psychiatric hospital in Ontario yeah it
just seems like this whole case you know is law enforcement investigators putting
their blinders on going after Stephen not following leads you know I I don't know if it was ever reported if uh kich
was um investigated at all well you're right it's never been confirmed that the Ontario Police ever investigated him
regarding the murder of Lynn Harper now I want to bring up somebody and we shift
gears here a little bit Captain we'll bring up somebody his name is Barry Ru uh he's a retired op Sergeant uh he says
that a traveling salesman uh should be a suspect in a string of unsolved murders
he also believes that he knows the identity of the person who killed Lynn Harper in June of 1959 Ru is the author
of a book called a viable suspect Ru said he first met who he believes is Lynn Harper's murderer um who he calls
Larry talbet uh although that's not the suspect's real name uh Talbot's not you know he's not been convicted of any of
these things a lot of fictitious names in True Crime he's got he's got family members out there and we have an author
who's accusing him of multiple murders so choosing to use a different name um he says that he met talbet during a
robbery um but it's a bit more complicated than that it's it's reported as a robbery I've heard uh Barry Ru
story on this of how this robbery went down and sounds like a good recommended reading uh yeah I want to take you
through this this story a little bit so Barry R uh his his now wife her name is Pat um at this time they weren't lovely
name they weren't living together um Pat had a cottage and Barry had a place elsewhere but anyway one night they have
dinner they have drinks and Barry decides to stay over that's the night that the breaking happens he's sleeping
he hears a loud disturbing noise he gets up out of bed only to find a masked man with a gun
inside this Cottage okay now so Barry exited the bedroom and and confronted this MK man in another room well the
first thing that the guy wearing the mask says to Barry where's the bride or bring out the bride something something
of that nature so he says you know let's leave her out of this you know go ahead
you can I can give you my wallet what ever let's leave her out of this he says no bring her out here he's got a gun you
got to do what he's saying so he calls for Pat Pat comes out of the bedroom MH he tells the burglar tells Pat to lift
up her night gown expose herself MH um you know Barry pleads with this guy let's again let's not get her involved
in this he insists so she lifts up the night gown eventually what what ends up taking place is that he that Barry and
Pat are robbed he takes some money from them and at some point Barry he's a he's
a he's a police officer at some point he must have realized that this burglar does not have a real gun he has a pellet
gun so he starts calling the burglars the the bluff here because because this guy's threatening them and he's asking
them to do things that they don't want to do I mean pet guns hurt but I mean you can take one you take a couple so at
some point Barry recognizes this to be a pellet gun and he starts to challenge the man that's broken into the home and
he says you know what I don't think you're going to shoot us I don't think you're going to shoot us at all I like
this guy I like the cut of his jib that's right nice jib the thing here is now the mass man he gets scared of Barry
and he flees the house well Barry is a police officer he he sets out on Chase and he's chasing after this dude while
he's chasing the dude the dude turns around and shoots Barry in the chest with the pellet gun mhm Barry fights
through this he tackles this man and let me put it how can I put this politely does he say to him now lift up your
skirt for me boy no to put it politely he beats the crap out of the guy all right very good right I don't think this
guy was out to rob the place and I tell you why and Barry doesn't either because
of things that they found on this guy after he's arrested okay he had four sets of shoelaces in his
pockets okay inside the guy's car they found they found his car parked nearby he had left the keys on the wheel and
inside the car were his shoes and his underwear so this burglar had was wearing gloves and a mask mhm carrying a
flashlight a gun he had a knife on on him he had four sets of shoelaces he had removed his shoes so he could be quiet
and also probably not to leave Footprints and he had removed his underwear as well possibly for some kind
of fast situation if you need to be fast with your pants I think he I like Barry think that
this man was there to to rape Pat to tie her up and who knows possibly kill her mhm but because because this guy is
somewhat of a sophisticated criminal when caught in the act he's able to turn it into a burglary I was just there to
rob you guys anyway this is how this guy this Larry Tolbert guy becomes known to
Barry rule yeah the problem I have with this and and feel free to give me the evidence to say that I'm wrong but he's
breaking in to possibly rape uh older lady well they weren't old at the time they
were they were in their early 20s right but in the 50s that's a older lady okay right well it's older than our
victim that we're talking about Len Harper cor right that's what I'm saying so I'm just saying that it doesn't that
part doesn't fit for me well Barry rule believes this Larry talber is guilty of multiple or well let's say this to put
it more accurately he says he should be a a lead suspect in several unsolved murders that took place over a span of
years in this area now one of them one of these such cases was the murder of a Oakville woman um this is Pauline Dudley
um she was age 17 her body was found and located by a farmer working in his Fields um this was in Oakville in August
of 1973 she was 17 years old um the thing here is the car that tber owned at the time was
spotted not far from where Dudley's body was found and when police located him they searched his car well they found
Blood on the on the headrest and hair on the floor along with other items in the
trunk well here's what they found in the trunk they found a wooden dildo cream a
knife two flashlights brown sheets a short sleeve shirt and inside the pockets of the short sleeve shirt were
surgical gloves they bring him in because of these strange items that they find in his vehicle that's spotted near
the body MH of this unsolved murder and when they bring him in he fails several polygraph
tests long story short Talbert was never charged for Pauline Dudley's murder it was one of those situations captain that
we've talked about plenty of times on this show where we have a group of police and we have a group of detectives
who say we know who did this we're we're absolutely convinced we know who did this we got nothing on the guy we got no
evidence so yeah we have no evidence and we're not going to make it up thank you
that's what they're basically saying we know that they did it how does this but we can't prove it and we do and we're
refusing to man to manufacture yeah well how does this bring us back to the murder of young Lyn
Harper well I think part of that you brought up something interesting was that you know ly Harper was a young
victim 12 years old I think this Pauline Dudley thing shows that that this person
is might be capable of committing murder against a younger girl uh I know 17's different than 12 I get it um but here's
the big thing um Barry rule list a number of reasons a number number of connections but the one that that stands
out the most is including the similarity between culbert his Talbert's car at the
time and the one that Steven Truscott said he saw now Truscott said that he saw 1959 Chevy possibly Belair on the
evening that Len Harper went missing and we have Tolbert who has a 1957 Chevy mhm so we have a similar
vehicle there's one problem here though uh the vehicle that tolber owned at the time was a turquoise blue now according
to Barry rule we have a situation where she probably disappeared if she got into
that car she disappeared around 7:30 7:45 Sunset was at 9:06 that night um so Barry would tell us that there's a
chance that with that sun and at that angle in the distance that we have Steven trescott from the car that he had
may have thought he was seeing a gray car right one thing that they share the similarity of is they both have a lot of
Chrome on them he did say he saw a lot of chrome now we have this Larry tulbert why would he be in the area he's a
traveling salesman what does he sell um hopes and dreams no I don't I I don't know what he sells murder I don't know
what he sold but I do know this that we have Barry rule uh the retired op Sergeant he likes he likes Talbert for
several murders he believes he should be investigated and looked at in several cases um all of these were ones that he
was able to go back in time and he was able to confirm that Tolbert would have been in the area or near that area when
a murder was committed well maybe he sold shoelaces and underwear I don't I don't think he was a shoelace salesman
or maybe maybe wooden dildos but you know Barry Ru points out something interesting here you know what better
job for a uh serial killer to have than a traveling salesman you know you you could commit a murder on Tuesday in one
town and you could be hours and hours away by Wednesday or Thursday mhm you know and if nobody saw you if nobody
spotted you maybe they don't have things to connect you to the crime I'm going to
go with this Captain it's a little bit of a stretch it's a leap I'm going to say a leap but he should have been
investigated but we could just make the argument that the case should have been investigated period yeah and I mean
Barry rule list several other cases that he would like to see this uh Larry Talbert um uh investigated for um I'm
not going to go into all of them um because like I said it it's a bit of a leap and we're here to discuss the ly
Harper case but it's certainly an interesting leap and one that I'm willing to take I hopefully have to pick
Pi up his book at some point I did not get a chance to read the book itself but I did see um an interesting presentation
that he did regarding his suspect all right well let's get back to LY Harper's case and and so what are our final
conclusions on this ly Harper case cuz we had a you know a kid sentence then released now he's out mhm uh it's just
seems like even after they let him out they didn't really investigate this case no it's it's it's similar to the West
Memphis 3 case where you have somebody that ends up not serving the appropriate sentence for the crime that they're
convicted of and later they're released and then you just say uh yeah uh we can't we're not really going to go back
and investigate this even though now it looks like we never found the guilty party yeah it's sad too because you know
in this case it's even harder though because the amount of time that's passed the the um primitive investigative tools
that we would have been using back in 1959 well they actually uh went to test Steven so they could get answers mhm uh
DNA test but when they went back through the DNA evidence that they collected at
the time it was all damaged uh so they couldn't actually do the test and he was willing to take the
test yeah I think I think again shows another sign of his character that's definitely a check mark on the Steven
trust side uh that he did not commit this murder um what are what are my thoughts and opinions it's tough for me
Captain because like I said it's it's that one hour of time that there seems to be so many questions in differing um
opinions as to what happened by eyewitnesses during that one hour of time it's very tough it's very confusing
I do like that we have um in Steven trescott favor I like that he spotted a vehicle um and then later we have Barry
rule coming out saying hey I have a suspect that has a similar vehicle right I like that in his favor what I don't
like is that you give me a license plate number and that's not a legit number it
doesn't work yeah I think that whole part of the story is fictitious I don't think he saw a license plate I think he
might have I'm hoping that he's innocent because I I I like to and I know it does
happen but I don't want to believe that this kid was killed by another kid um I think maybe he was scared into
giving that license plate number the problem that have too with the license plate is me personally if I see a
situation go down to the point where I'm going to make a mental note not only of
the description of the vehicle but a mental note of the license plate number then guess what it's not going to take
me till police come to me to ask me what happened to LY Harper I'm going to be going to other people and saying look
this could be nothing but I was with Lyn Harper she's only 12 and I saw her get into this car and here's the license
plate number I think something weird happened right I mean to to take special not I drive past a thousand cars every
day I never I never make note of the license plate number right but again this case is all about the small little
things that don't really matter MH until a tragic event actually happens and to me this is very much like a butterfly
effect case you know if if Steven wasn't so nice to give her a ride that maybe she wouldn't have been on state rout 8
at the time that there was a uh somebody traveling in that area to pick her up right that could have done this
crime um if somebody saw him if the DNA evidence um didn't get destroyed there's
all these little tiny things that if they happened we would have had to answer the and then the big butterfly
effect in this case that we haven't really talked about much but you you have a country that sentenced a boy
that's 14 years old for a crime that I believe he didn't commit he sentenced to be hung within months of being tried mhm
when you didn't even spend months on the investigation and this was such a black
eye on um the Canadian justice system that they got rid of the death penalty all together right and uh Stephen was
one of the main reasons for that it was a good wakeup call for them yeah so this case to me is all these
little you know Butterfly Effects if Steph didn't or what if uh you know heck what if Stephen and Lynn actually went
into the bush to make out for a little bit maybe this doesn't happen there's all these little tiny things that maybe
could have stopped this tragic event but it's a really fascinating story this is
one like you know as we're researching in it like the the first day of researching it I I really got into it
and trying to break down all the different points of the eyewitness uh testifying and all that stuff and what's
really interesting too is you know Stephen went by a different name for so many years now him and his wife actually
have become experts on this case and they can break down all the testimony all the eyewitness accounts that
contradict what the investigators have and again rule number one don't create your
own Theory and if you do create your own Theory spin as much as you much time trying to prove it or trying to disprove
it as you do trying to prove it yeah and I think for me you know we talk about all these tiny little
moments for me too one thing that I come back to that makes me believe Stephen is
innocent and underlines that for me is what what exactly were Lyn Harper's intentions that evening that we don't
know we've heard stories that she wanted to go see the ponies or that she wanted
a ride up to Highway 8 for some reason she if she wants to see the pony she doesn't accept the ride all the way
there what was that argument about that night was she planning to walk away or run away from home and got picked up by
the wrong person and that's why she wanted Steven to drop her off rather than take her all the way to The
Farmhouse you know I I if if we knew her actual intentions I think that would give us a better Direction better sense
of direction as to stev intentions and I maybe and I'm I'm with you Captain I think they're we got a
couple people that see him on the bridge we got a couple people that see them cross the bridge that lines up with
Steven's story that makes that that makes that very precise small little time window even smaller all right so do
we have a recommended reading for this week yes this week we are recommending a question of evidence the case book of
great forensic controversies by Colin Evans um scientific sleuthing and slip-ups in investigations of 15 famous
cases ranging from the suspicious death of Napoleon to the murder cases of Dr Sam The Fugitive Shepherd and OJ Simpson
a question of evidence takes readers inside some of the most vexing forensic controversies of all time in each case
Colin Evans lays out the conflicting medical and scientific evidence much like we saw in the Lyn Harper case and
Steven trescott case today all right thank you to you Captain thank you to everybody out there and remember we you
don't have much time we have a pre-order of the douche canoe shirts so you want to go to True Crime garage.com click on
the store Page and and get your douche canoe shirt I don't want somebody saying 6 months from now oh I wish I would have
got one like too late I'm not you know too late yep all right that's enough for this week thank you to everybody out
there we will see you back in the garage next week until then be good be kind and
please pretty pretty please don't Litter or we'll kill [Music] [Applause] you [Music]
a lifetime of hard work children laughing in the kitchen family photos on a restaurant wall a legacy that lives on
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Lynne Harper /// Part 2 /// 143

Part 2 of 2

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Lynne Harper was a 12 year old girl who disappeared on June 9th, 1959. She was last seen in the area of the RCAF Station in Clinton, Ontario. Lynne's father reported her missing. Two days later Lynne's body was recovered on a farm. It was discovered that Lynne had been raped and strangled with her blouse. A classmate of Lynne's was questioned and later arrested and charged. The real question, is he guilty? If he is not were other very good leads and suspects ignored in this case? Tonight we discuss the murder of Lynne Harper and the highly controversial conviction of Steven Truscott.Beer of the week - Apocalypse Cow by Three Floyds brewing companyGarage Grade - 4 and a half bottle caps out of 5

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Brief Summary

The episode discusses Lyn Harper's 1959 murder, Steven Truscott's wrongful conviction, and the investigation's failures to pursue other suspects.

Key points

Fast Investigation. Less than 48 hours after her body is found, a 14-year-old is arrested for murder.
Controversial Trial. Steven Truscott's trial began just days after his arrest, leading to a guilty verdict.
Ignored Leads. The investigation focused solely on Truscott, ignoring other potential suspects and evidence.
The Strange Connection to Kich. Alexander Kich, a heavy drinker with a history of offenses, was never investigated despite red flags.
A Disturbing Encounter. Barry Ru recounts a terrifying home invasion that hints at a deeper connection to the case.
The Unsolved Murder of Pauline Dudley. Larry Talbert is a lead suspect in the unsolved murder of 17-year-old Pauline Dudley.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

This was supposed to be a big deal!

Commenting on the fast trial of Steven Truscott.

6:30WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

55/ 100Some tension

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