A Dark Past /// Part 2 /// 115 | Forensic Files

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foreign [Music] Bale died and passed away in October of 1962 she was found dead in a river near her
home in Lake Charles Louisiana Sharon Hensley she's been missing since February of
1973. she went missing off the coast of Key West Florida Annette Carver Vale missing since
October 1984 from Tulsa Oklahoma what's the one thing that these women have in common they were all married or
had an intimate relationship with Felix Vale Gina we've been talking about Felix Vale
and earlier we covered the mysterious death of his first wife now you said that they had had a son together and she
died just months after he was born whatever become of his son oh gosh Bill his son bill was Bill was
born I think in July and his first wife Mary was killed in October so he was literally months four months old I think
and so bill has a aunt in Louisiana that takes him and keeps him for a while not not a
long while maybe a year and then Bill takes him and moves back home to Mississippi with his mom and dad and
stay there for a little while maybe a year maybe two not very long and so his mom probably is raising the sun then
Felix takes off and heads to California this is when he really starts just traveling all over very nomadic like
I've said and he takes off and goes to California at some point he comes back and he gets his child bill this toddler
and he says hey this is my kid I'm taking my kid I'm going to be the dad you know
[ __ ] he took that kid because he goes off of California he's living the true hippie
lifestyle and they're they're roaming around you know the hate Ashbury District I mean
everything it's it's definitely you know the time Life Magazine of the hippie lifestyle that's
what Felix is doing at this stage but he learned quickly that he could take his son bill
and use him as a pawn to get the things he needed to survive okay housing food women drugs whatever it is
he needs oh look at me I'm a single dad um I mean it's the ultimate chick magnet
look at me I'm a single dad with this little you know towheaded baby and and oh my wife tragically died by accidental
drowning and I'm just trying to survive and you know here light up and pop this and we'll
babysit your kid while you go screw her and you know whatever and it was I mean unfortunately for Bill
but it was a genius on Felix's part it really was for the Deviant piece of [ __ ]
that he is it was a genius move so Felix has his son bill with him but they're they're definitely not living a
traditional home family lifestyle and Bill stays with him until he's like eight or nine or so but what what
happens at this point they're on this Orchard in California in Merced California and he said there's
this little farm boy that he's talking to and he's like you know I just I don't like living like this I want a home I
want to eat I haven't eaten in two weeks I've had nothing but grapes for two weeks literally
and this farm boy said you should go to the police and tell them so Bill literally gets on the road and walks
like two or three miles down the road and finds the police station and says hey my dad
is doing all this I'm tired of taking drugs I mean sad tragic tragic story I'm tired of living this way oh by the way
I heard him tell his girlfriend that he killed my mom and the police were like whoa so that's
the first time the investigation is reopened into Mary vale's death okay and this is 1970. Louisiana comes to
California interviews no I don't know what happened but nothing happened it just it was dead in the water
horrible choice of words right there but um the police hear this this story from
this little boy that his father had killed his mom and now they're going to go talk they're going to go talk to
Felix they put him on them I don't know what kind of pills they were I don't I think it was LSD I
don't know what they had on it but they had drugs on them so they charge them convict them for drugs and that's when
he gets put on probation and his mom I think bailed him out you know they get they get money to get
bailed out of jail and his mom did it well at that stage Bill his son goes back to Mississippi
and lives with Felix's mom and dad and was from that point on raised by his mom and dad
um Felix showed up I don't know a year later Kim and Sharon show up at the farm and
Bill sees him and is just petrified totally petrified he's afraid that his dad is going to kill him
because he turned him over to the police you got a feel for this little boy here
what ends up happening with Bill his son was raised in a Christian home and went on to college met a Christian woman
they married they were strong Christians unfortunately bill passed away I think it was in 2009
of cancer and but he had a family of his own I think three sons basically really didn't have anything to
do with his dad because he knew the truth in fact there's we have a audio tape of Bill talking to his preacher at
his church because he knew I think at this stage he knew he wasn't going to live that much longer because of the
cancer they had and so he he told his preacher to audio tape professional you know and and talks
about his growing up and how he was treated by his dad and just being drugs all over
the state of California you know living in a tent and then turned him in and the
confession that he made because when Felix told Sharon that he killed his mother Bill heard that
but Felix didn't know he heard it until bill went to the cops in Merced California and turned them in that's
when he found out and that's why when Felix showed up that very first time back at the farm bill was so scared he
thought he was going to kill him because of what he did you know what he had said
to the cops but that that time he showed up Sharon was already gone and he told Bill he said you don't have
to worry about her anymore I fixed her something along the lines of I fixed her to where
she won't tell anybody anything so Felix having killed his first wife do you think Gina do you
think that once he met these other women and once they became involved with him in a long-term relationship that Felix
was of the mindset that you know I'm just going to use this person up and however this relationship ends it's
going to end on my terms you know did he was their fate sealed when they met him and got involved with
him were they already dead in his mind at the end of that relationship yeah he you know I'm gonna be on the fence on
that one and I know that's the dumbest answer you could hope for the reason I say that is back in the
very beginning when I first met him I would have said oh yeah definitely but you know you're young and eager in the
case and you know it's early on and you're like oh yeah this guy just set up and
kill all these women I don't think that's the case to be honest with you and the reason I say that
today is because since then I have learned that there were so many other women he was
married like seven times and there were so many other women from the death of his first wife Mary
hortendale to after The Disappearance of Annette Veil his third his last wife or the the
I think that is his last wife but after The Disappearance of Annette that there were so many other women that
we were unaware of until just in the past year maybe two that he had a long-term relationship
with he married them and there was domestic violence but they were able to escape so he didn't set out
thinking like the one woman and I I won't divulge their names because they are still around they're still living
and the privacy issues if it's out there in the media go after it that's great but I'm not going to be the one to put
it out there um but these women one woman you know he was choking in the shower and it was
upstairs and and her brother was downstairs and heard the commotion he comes up and him and Felix getting a
fight you know he's saving his sister so if one if her brother wasn't there he he
could have very easily and he probably would have killed her I I there's no doubt in my mind that he would have
killed her but I don't think he set out in that relationship saying okay when I'm done with her and used her up
and got all I can out of her I'm going to kill her I don't think that's his intention I think what happened
is when the relay when he because all of these other women that are still out there that had a
relationship with him whether they experience domestic violence at his hands or not
I think I don't think he set out to kill each one of them to end the relationship but
I think if he was in it long enough they were very short relationship one woman he was married to for one month
you know one woman he was with for a couple of months they were very very short relationships
I think if they were a year or better they would have ended up dead Gina with all of your experience and I know you've
covered a lot of domestic cases during your career and some of them turn violent what is
the difference between Felix who is a killer and someone that is just prone to violence there there
[ __ ] out of their girlfriend or wife and they there's a certain threshold they
they'll stop at Felix you know you push that button and they're like okay you're getting the
[ __ ] beat out of you and I might break your nose and bust your lip but I'm gonna stop when I'm when I feel you've
had enough Felix doesn't stop until they're dead so once that button of his is pushed
he carries it through to the end those women that are still living are lucky I believe there's one more victim out
there that's a good possibility I mean given the the length of this timeline here and with how many women he claims
to have had relationships with we've seen how some of these have ended but why do you believe there's another
victim out there the whole time I talked to him he only said one name completely
I've never been able to find her and precing things together my theory is that it was after The Disappearance of Sharon
but before he met Annette so in the 70s he was traveling and Hiking through Colorado and he met up with a group of
people and this is stuff he told me and he he was very much into live food me and of course I'm like live food what
are you talking about you eat you catch a rabbit and just eat it and not kill it
I mean what do you do you know what and no live food the way he explains it is you go again like to an orchard you
know great Vineyard and you pull the grapes right off the tree and you eat them right there that's as fresh as they
can be okay that makes sense I asked him I said well do you ever have again it was one of those times I want
to provoke him and see what he would say do you ever eat meat I mean how do you do live food if you're eating meat well
he steered clear of it and then I asked him again at another stage in the conversation and I said
what do you eat like sushi is that like food you know as a joke and he said no but he during this camping
trip in Colorado his whole life was like a extended camping trip I think the one point he tells me about a woman
he met up with and of course I have to hear all the graphic details about all the sex they had while they're camping
and you know all the detail s and then at another stage of the conversation when I'm talking about the
live food and I jokingly talk about sushi you know and meat he makes a reference it's a weird
reference and he says no but you know I've tried it once before and um it's just it just wasn't pulling
my thing and I got the feeling that it was while he was with these people in Colorado and he was talking about
drinking blood and he claims it was an animal but he wasn't very clear he was very very vague about all of this
so my assumption is I I can't help but Wonder wait wait wait wait a second so what are you saying are you saying that
Felix killed a woman and then drank her blood did he push this woman to the edge
and kill her and decide just to try it you know just to see what it was like he was very I believe him
when he said tried it and I didn't like it I do believe that but what was it that he
tried because he wasn't specific he didn't say oh it was a doe it was a rabbit it was a squirrel he just said it
was an animal you know he was and he's a very he's very detail oriented but he was very vague in that
so I it's in your mind you know but I couple that with this story he tells me about
this woman and the fact that I can't find her anywhere in existence at all and he was Smitten by her and it all
coincides together and I can't help but wonder if she's another victim that has just been never been identified
and it would be very easy for her to slip through the cracks because she came from Sweden according to him and they
immediately connected and she you know went her separate way you know his cryptic ending of the relationship
it was very similar yeah we see this time and time again with Felix he has these lengthy relationships with these
women and then they just supposedly leave on their own yet they're never seen or heard from again and
wonder if that in the Colorado trip and the live food with the blood and everything all coincides the timing just
fits so that's that's that story for what it's worth was there anything incriminating
that Felix had said to you or what did you get from him that they were able to use at his trial
um that was used in court or that could have been used in court that was beneficial to the the case
however when he was arrested I was able to continue the undercover operation for several months after that by writing
letters and then talking to him on the phone from jail he would call me you know the reason I did that was because
we knew the journals were there the but we we couldn't get to them and law enforcement had come down in May to
arrest him and they had a warrant obviously for his arrest but then they had a warrant to
search his property for the journals well they were from Louisiana and in the state of Texas there's some law
that does not allow journals to be obtained with the search warrant whatever the law is you know I don't I
don't know those that's for the attorneys so they come down here and this warrant says you know what we're
looking for are personal journals and letters and things like that and the judge here in Texas said nope not
signing off on this because it's against our law okay fine so basically all they
could do is they all they could do was arrest them and that's all they did their warrant won't allow them to get
the journals but you've established a relationship with him you think you can get this information so I wrote him a
letter in jail and I said I said hey at this stage in our relationship our plan was I told him I was divorced and that I
didn't have custody of my kid and I had gotten a big inheritance and I bought an
RV and I was just gonna go sit at the beach and you know disconnect and I wanted him to come with
me and of course he was all over that and so that's how we left it and then of course when he's getting arrested
then I said how do I make contact with him to let him know that hey I'm still here
and just see what happens because I was there when he was arrested I was taking the pictures but I had a hat on I had my
hair pulled back I had a big camera in front of my face so he didn't know it was me but at the
time I didn't know that he didn't know it was me I wasn't sure so I wrote him a letter as my character
and I said hey I went by to see you your neighbor said you got arrested I saw it
on the internet oh my God what happened and he immediately writes back and he's like oh it's so great to hear from you I
you know I'm getting railroaded and it's a conspiracy you know that's been his story the whole time
so I knew that he didn't know that was me behind the camera so I was like okay let's ride this Pony
out and see how long it'll last so I thought I've got to get permission to get into
onto his property that's all I needed once I'm on there I'll do whatever the hell I want
so I asked him I said where's your truck what do you need me to do do I need to go and like turn off the electricity or
carry out trash or anything what do I need to do I'm I'm at your disposal and so he writes back he said yes
he said I want you to go and get my truck it's impounded the Sheriff's Department
and then the keys for everything is on is on the truck key ring go to my place then of course he had this like honeydew
list you know mow the grass and patch a hole in the roof and there's a tree that
fell over that needs to be righted all these things and I'm thinking I'm not doing that [ __ ] you know I'm going in
I'm going to snoop through everything so whatever and so of course I'm all over it and at
this point we're writing and he's calling me so every Saturday he would call me and then I'd get probably a
letter a week from him so it took about a week 10 days to get you have to get permission you know signed to release
the truck to me so I get that and I go on a Friday afternoon and my husband had taken me over there
you know he's followed me and we dropped my car because I wasn't going to take anything off the property I didn't have
permission to remove anything I wasn't going to remove everything but I was going to photograph every damn
thing the man owned so I went prepared and that's exactly what I did and the first day I get over there it's about
four o'clock five o'clock in the afternoon and my husband left me there and with my vehicle and he had taken off
and went back home so I'm looking looking and I'm just I'm not I'm looking for the journals and I'm
not finding them at all and so I called my husband and I said hey we're I'm not finding them I'm gonna go
on it's like 10 o'clock at this point I said I'm gonna go on and come home and I'll just come back tomorrow because
there are a few things that I hadn't looked through well there's this one tote like a big
plastic storage tote that I kept overlooking because I thought tools were in it from another time that I was in there it
looked like tools were in this tote so I just kept ignoring it and but I kept going back to it so I'm just gonna
look in there and there was stuff piled on it so I set the stuff aside I opened it and it's full of all his journals
30 journals in there the mother lode and so of course I'm ecstatic at this point
this was in a part of the shed that was a storage room on the back side but there was no locking door or anything
I put it inside the main part of the shed so I could lock it up because I didn't know what was going to happen he
had been arrested about two or three weeks at this point and I didn't know if there were going to be
vandals you know somebody torched the place I didn't know you know so I wanted to secure him as best I could without
removing them from the property so I did and I go back the next day and I spent 16 hours photographing all the journals
because also I didn't know when or if my cover was going to be blown and once he tells me you cannot go back
on the property I couldn't go back on the property without trespassing obviously my main goal was to get all
the data from the journals fast as possible possible and that's what I did that Saturday I went back and
it was 16 hours and I just started photographing Pages page after page and every single page
that he wrote down I photographed and then he had a little file cabinet and I went through there and he had things
that were important to the trial like Annette's original birth certificate he had the letters
that he had written to his mother about The Disappearance of Sharon he had the original letters there
things like that so I took photographs of all that so those came into play during the trial we'll get right back to
Gina frenzel private investigator investigating serial killer Felix Vale right after this quick beer break
foreign [Music] Felix's journals there's so much you know I woke up today at 7 45 I had a banana and blueberry
smoothie at 8 45 I did 72 sit-ups and I mean it's it's ridiculously mundane but then every once in a while he'll
just interject something and you're like whoa wait a minute so it's almost like you have to go through them all and I'll
be real honest with you I have not read them all the very first journal entry is
December 31st 1984. a net disappeared in October of 1984. everything prior to that is missing
and then you get into the 90s and there's a couple of years missing but then then it starts back up again
and you're like wait a minute so we've kind of figured out a pattern that obviously he got rid of things that
were incriminating in the 90s he dated this woman and there were some domestic violence I think
associated with it and so my assumption is okay obviously he wrote about it and he thought
oh I'm going to get rid of it and got rid of it and I thought to myself why for for like a year
I thought to myself why is it that every single thing from 1984 back is just missing and right we
need to find stuff prior to 1984 because this is when these disappearances and the murders took place so you're able
through reading his journals to figure out that there's a time period where he moves back into his parents home and he
had always kept a lot of his things at his parents home after his mother passes away he has to leave so you're able to
trace these things to the addict of his parents home and didn't you come across a section in his journals where he talks
and discusses about getting rid of these items all of the things he has kept in his parents attic forever and ever which
were the journals and he's burning them and he's reminiscing as he's burning them
and one of the things and it's really it's insignificant stuff except one section and he says and I'm paraphrasing
but he he basically he says you know with this whole family situation of arguing with you know the family
member by the nickname of Bunchie arguing with Bunchy and you know his wife and you know about the estate and
all this I have learned to and then also reflecting back on everything in my past
life while I'm reading the journals and then burning them he's basically saying all
this in his journal he and this is not a paraphrase he says I have learned how to resolve conflict without
resorting to murder we were thankful enough that Gina sent us a bunch of the audio from her undercover work when she
was sitting with Felix in his home interviewing him he's being recorded he does not know we found this next clip to
be very insightful regarding his character swear on their life that our government
never has or never will have a squad to kill people suicide I mean you know like uh assassination Squad
yeah that they think the Arabs do or everybody Hitler and Russia really oh [ __ ] our
government's got so many different well the Recon Marines is one and he was a he was a Recon Marine is
that what scared you about no no I'd be scared hell yeah oh it's just the thing that scared me about him and her
boat was these uh these blind spots that their ego protects they're willing to fight to the
death to protect you from attacking those blind spots yeah they don't want to hear about it did they ever come
after you physically no oh it's just a verbal type of attack that would be scary he uh
he thought about it a couple of times oh my God I reminded him who I am and so that's all it took he's he's
scared of me he doesn't know he didn't know how much I know about killing myself you know about
killing people learning pain whatever incapacitating and I don't know I've studied
10 15 different forms of martial arts that gives us a chance to hear Felix's voice to get a get a feel for his
mannerisms and how he's talking to Gina in in some of the conversations they had
the thing here is though he the the important thing is listen to how he responds when somebody has a problem
with him there's a guy that has a problem with him from a previous relationship and he states that guy does
not know what I know about killing about killing people very telling about Felix's character unfortunately Gina did
not get that Smoking Gun material from Felix he never stated anything that was highly incriminating regarding the death
of his first wife his second wife for The Disappearance of any other woman however there were some things that she
was able to provide to the state that they used as evidence at his trial as far as the under
[Music] ground that that they were able to introduce like the letters that he wrote
about The Disappearance of Sharon fact that he had Annette's um original birth certificate and her passport
picture um those types of things that was key because they were able to introduce
this law and I think it's like a 404 b or 401b I can't remember the name of it but basically it allows the state to
introduce during the trial previous bad Acts and part of that was The Disappearance of Sharon and
Annette and part of their disappearance and their story of The Disappearance were
the inconsistencies of the you know the letter that I found and the passport photo and the original birth certificate
you know he says oh she took off with these guys to travel all over well she didn't have her passport she didn't have
her birth certificate a time she didn't have a driver's license so those were her
identifications and she didn't have them with her you know those types of things
so that was what I was able to bring to the table as far as my undercover work on the case Felix Vale is arrested for
the murder of his first wife Mary hortonvale before the trial takes place Gina is in town now she suspects that
her cover may have been blown because this point we have newspaper articles there's all kinds of stories coming out
about this case she goes to the prison to speak with Felix and confront him to find out if he
knows what she knows how are you I'm I'm not very good how are you me neither me
neither but I'm here right now so uh what's going on what's what's the deal nothing just the circus yeah
like this is not the country I was born in yeah well what what I want to know I mean I
want to know what's happening okay what I don't know I my best guess is that it's uh some kind of circus
you know that I have gotten plucked up into yeah you know it's it's not there's no
real legal stuff going on they have they they're there's a lot of stuff out there
I know and it's all [ __ ] there's uh what what they're saying get ideas didn't even happen
nothing nothing happened you know uh my wife fell out of a boat 50 years ago and
drowned in a river and and that's the only thing that they're even that's even halfway factual
what about the other women what about them yeah what about them I don't know I mean I've dated like uh
several hundred maybe in my lifetime 74. I don't know where any of them are I don't I I've never
you know there's a couple of them that I found mentally interesting and I I hadn't I made an agreement with them
what do you mean an agreement uh an agreement that that we would look each other up in
about five years and have some conversation to see what either of us had had learned in any time if you know
and and that never happened and none of them well I did I looked one of them up and
I'm not going to tell you anything I mean I I looked one of them up and and she was married to a guy and didn't want
to have any conversation with me so that was it I'm you know about a five minute
visit and where I met her husband and hugged them both and and uh well that was that your wife and that no no there
was not uh there's just so much out there in the media there's so I don't care listen listen I don't know that's
why I want you to tell me what I don't have what I don't have a a computer because nine it's I don't
know what percentage but a way majority of the information out there on the net is just stuff that people are playing
with well then tell me what happened I don't know what happened what what happened what what do you mean you don't
know I don't know where did she go I don't know I don't know where any of them went or are
I you know I found them uh every woman that I have ever been with I left them when I left them or they
left me they were they they were healthier and smarter than when I met them what about that's the only common
denominator there is well you know you're the common denominator well sure you know
tell me what why are they pointing the thing at you with Sharon in the net also they're saying that you had something to
do with them disappearing why why why did the three people who started the rumor that there was foul played when my
wife first wife fell out the boat why did those three people get together and we're storing people
uh one of them that was in the boat that picked her up that wanted to screw her before I married her and was resented
the hell out of the fact that I got her and he didn't okay that's one another one was and listen wait a minute
I'm getting there okay another one was uh insurance adjuster or whatever we had travel
insurance because we were had been in Mexico and we're going again all right so he didn't want to pay off any kind of
policy so he got together with the guy in the boat and they found another guy who was a Hot Shot lawyer fresh out of
it had to be fresh out of lawyer school at the time whose wife had come to my bed
before she married him and didn't tell him about it until after they were married and so he was gunning for me
also those three people got together and they convinced the district attorney at
that time to do you know to try to put together a case okay all right look they tried they
went they got four deputies to go beat in the bushes and talking to all kind of people yeah and all right
take those four deputies did try to do the same thing that this little writer out of Jackson Gary Mitchell yeah yeah
that's slimeball uh these four deputies tried to do the same thing that he did except they didn't have his talent
that guy's got some okay but that was 51 years ago okay so what so now they've they've they've reopened obviously
reopened this case I mean look okay listen there was no case they tried to make okay those four deputies
if they didn't have something to put you here with they go to court on facts I know exactly
no they don't not here this is Calcasieu Parish Louisiana wake up wake up you know what you wake up I've
seen the pictures of Mary's body yeah yeah have you no I haven't asked your attorney because I've seen
him okay so what so what what about them ask your attorney you need to see those
pictures who took them I don't know who took them but they were taken 51 years ago when her body was pulled out of that
River all right who who took them though I don't know did the coroner take them I
had no idea they call them no they were not taken by the corner because she wasn't even out of the river yet
okay so they can't use them in court I don't know I have no idea I do they're using them anyway but they think I'm
they think I'm ignorant enough not to know that well when you look at those pictures that's sure it's all doesn't
look like an accident to me have you ever seen a floater that came out of the Calcasieu River with all the
debris and sunken barges and everything it's got on the bottom of it yeah but I'm not talking about that
well I I have I'm not talking about streaks and scratches and crab bites and things like that that's not what I'm
talking about you need to see those pictures I I have not seen them yet I would like to see
them so what tell me about sharing I don't know anything about Jerry you're telling me that she just you know the
story is that she just failed off into the I don't know why I don't know where she is or where she went
any more than I do any of the other 200 or whatever I'm talking about the 200 [Music]
one time I tried to count them up and I lost counters about 200. in in my lifetime that's irrelevant I'm
talking about the ones that are in the media okay yeah the media I don't know I don't know any more about them than I do
the others what about the jacket that Mary was wearing that white jacket that she was
wearing I don't know anything about it I don't remember you should have talked about it I have not remembered what kind
of clothes we had on I don't I had no idea that she had a scarf on I didn't remember that
you your original statements typically said that she was wearing a jacket when they off and when her daughter this week
no I didn't say this I said your state your original statement for the police 50 years ago oh and then he was wearing
a jacket in the accident report yeah well then that's probably accurate I don't remember
what happened I don't know I didn't I didn't remember that you had one on I mean if if I said that at the time then
she probably did well she weren't naked and we find her body and she doesn't have a jacket on
okay well I don't know anything about that and then Sharon you have different stories
you have different stories of who she left with I don't know who's I don't remember who she left with I gave it my
best shot when her mother who she didn't like her mother shipped her off she got
pregnant and her mother said you know that shipped her off and you know to avoid religious embarrassment because
her mother was really strange that was long after yogurt okay you know Karen didn't want to be around I went with
Sharon one time to visit her folks and they they had uh you know we were there a couple of days I think and
she tried to have one conversation with her mother that did not work out very well and didn't try anymore she talked
with her brother some and her father probably about the same amount that she did with her mother
which was like 15 minutes or something so what happened what happened why did she just take off what did she take off
from I don't know I don't remember I mean you know some some place where Boats were that we were
playing with some boat people what were their names but you said oh I don't know I don't know I don't remember
I I probably I might have guessed at the time that I tried to you know I mean at
the time I don't think you would know no I I didn't want to go with them all right I'm not taking this [ __ ] they were
swinging people and I didn't want to go with them you knew back then I don't know but I
did I might have I I gave it my best shot and what about in that you said you put
it on a bus in St Louis I remember that yes but I don't know I don't know the names
of the people that she left with beautiful people on the bus well yeah you know like people see now no we had just met
him at the zoo we were walking around at the zoo and we met these people that were uh
three guys three guys and two girls one girl two girls oh [Music] oh they were going
South America you know yeah they were going south she wanted to go south she was ready
I we we had you know listen she the only reason we married was so that she wouldn't get taken away
from me while we were traveling okay one one point we were in some country and um when we weren't married and they
almost took her away from me okay well I can understand why why would she why would you not go with her y'all were
together for a long time oh no we were together off and on like just like Sharon when I and several other women
that that traveled with me or stayed periods of time with me then they would go be with other people
for periods of time and they would some of them would come back you know Annette and Sharon were two of the ones
that periodically would come look me up wherever I was well I thought they were together all the time because they oh no
no oh so so when she just she just gets on the bus says I'm gonna go with these people I just met so for sure she'd done
it before and that was the last time you saw her yeah yes it was you know I don't believe that well you
don't have to believe it I don't care who believes it I mean now I'm I'm just shooting from the hip I have been from
the start yeah not not like you of course excuse me from the hip you know it's your job no I am pretty pretty dead on
and I get what I'm going after I I hope you're getting paid well no not a single
dime not a single Bond yeah yeah what's your motive Justice the wrong place I don't think so you have to shoot Bears
Louisiana I think I'm in the right place I'm on this side of the garden yeah Justice is a joke here they make up
their own they make up their own log they're breaking several federal laws by even having me in here they've got no
they've got no probable cause there's nothing because they have sexual evidence be like sexual evidence actual
they have no factual evidence of anything yeah they do or they wouldn't have been able to get an indictment on
you that's not true you know in any other place it would be true you know what I was told you know that that's I
know that I'm the only person that really knows that have nothing because nothing I have done nothing bad to
anybody no listen I slap one woman she slapped me three times first and I told her each time don't do that again
third time I slapped her so she would stop slapping me okay that's the one woman yeah I've ever had and it's not
that's okay no listen there was two different times I studied martial arts when I got when I wanted to
travel I didn't want to be paranoid about getting robbed so and I've only had to use it twice one
time three guys jumped me coming out of a restaurant with a date and they were going to knock me out and take my date
and my money and and they they would listen they were not successful with that another time I was walking down the
street with a woman a date and four guys jumped me and they were not successful either
one of them held my date up against the building while three of them tried to take me down I walked them out in the
middle of the street where we were stopping traffic and when people when traffic stopped on both sides of us with
their headlights on it was nice blowing their horns these guys freaked out and ran and turned us Luke okay but what
does that happen okay I'm just telling you that's the only two times in my life that I had used violence and it was both
times exactly that that's it I'm not a criminal I'm not a bad person I have not been violent I'm not well you
know you you didn't respond other than that this person when there are that when
there are court records that show that you beat the beat the [ __ ] out of best fields you beat the crap out of her
there's no reason how is she able to get a restraining order against okay she she
called me down to the courthouse and I got in a room with her and two two or three guys to know
and we sat there and talked for 30 for like 15 10 15 minutes and then and she told them
her version of what happened I told him my version of what happened they weren't
that far apart that was not that was not true okay so so after like 10 or 15 minutes it was
all of us talking we were all laughing the the two deputies and Beth and myself saw all laughing okay
the end of story you know no no uh forget it okay so I'm I'm walk out and I go to get in my truck Beth follows me
out and and halfway to my truck and asked me if she can come home with me and does and we screw each other's
brains out for a couple of days it's that doesn't matter that's okay that doesn't matter to you no it doesn't
matter but the fact is [ __ ] there was enough evidence for her to get a restraining order and shoot I mean
her story maybe maybe there was enough but she didn't I mean that was not that was the end of it
but you're just you're just making you you sound like you read Jerry Mitchell's said no you know I read the Tulsa
Oklahoma police report okay that file okay listen on a net okay I have read every police report every case File ever
written about you okay yeah I don't get my information don't you forget you think it's all true
I know it's all true you know don't forget that very first day that I met you what did I tell you I
did as a for a living and that's exactly it and that is still what I do for a living
I don't try to blame other people for mine so you're a female Don Quixote sure you call me what you want
what'd you do to them all those years in Oklahoma yeah what did you do to him I know what
you did tell him I have confirmation what you did too you think I hadn't talked to him from from who
and and they told you that I did some stuff to them yeah and you kind of pulled yourself told on yourself too in
those journals wow yeah a baby set them yeah you did want one babysit them nope you're never gonna admit anything that
you've done are you what anything that I've done I mean everything in your life is always
somebody else's fault that's amazing everything in your life is always somebody else's fault didn't it no no no
no yeah you sound like a Serial thing like I'm not ethereal anything you've made a cereal thing out of me
though in your mind and so you're not interested in the truth you're you're tell me the truth I know no you dance
around with [ __ ] and ego crap tell me the facts yeah tell me the facts I have and no because you say well I don't
remember [ __ ] you remember you don't want to tell me I I tell you I don't remember when I don't we had a lot of
fun together all three of us I'm sure pedophiles have fun no no no no no no I'm I'm uh you don't like the labels
I'm not that I've never done that yes you have yes you have where where you're you're
so so why you want me to tell you the facts and then when I do you're you're telling me
that I'm fine you are lying Felix you are I am an investigator and that's what I
do I find out information and I go after it and I prove it either right or wrong
okay and I have proven more things right about you than wrong and now is your chance to tell me whether it's true or
not and I have told you what's true but you won't explain anything away you just
gloss over it there's nothing that I have done that needs to be explained away yeah
okay let's go back to a Mac what about her okay you said the last time you saw her you put her on a bus that's true
three weeks later she was seen with you in another location yeah we have witnesses to that yeah
yeah you're gonna tell me this thing in blue right here because the goddamn sure is
it is it's a fact and and these witnesses that saw us together three weeks after yeah three
weeks after what after you're saying you put her on a bus a number what the date was or that but I
know but you were on record early on in the investigation with Tulsa Police Department I don't I don't know about
you know I don't know about the accuracy of it I mean the bottom line is you know
you know you can sit here and get past all your ego crap but the bottom line is in the bottom of your heart you know
you're never getting out of here you know that so why not just tell the other two
families about where their women are so that they can sleep at night do you sleep at night
do you yeah it is incredible you're incredible absolutely I'm damn sure am incredible
that's right um you know you're never getting out of here I do you're never getting out of here
you're never going to get out of here so why not just give the families closure they had no right to arrest me
[ __ ] they didn't have it you do not have the right to take someone else's life no of
course not and you have why the only time I even thought any other people were the two
times that I told you about that's a lie that one well okay that's [Music] well that was intense right
can you imagine going into the jailhouse or the prison to confront a guy that is
going to face charges well in the other fascinating thing here Captain is we have yes Gina is a private investigator
that is what she does for her career but if you heard early in the interview she
says that from time to time she will take on these cold cases pro bono because she she wants Justice for these
families you know she's essentially doing what a lot of the armchair detectives and web sleuthors wish they
could be out doing right the difference here is she put herself in in the way of
harm you know she put herself in the Lion's Den she went and knocked on his door and sat in his home and spoke with
somebody that she suspected to be a multiple murderer right and had to stare in his eyes and uh smell his Bo yeah
yeah well ultimately Felix Vale was convicted of the murder of his first wife Mary hortonvale who was found
decades before dead in a river near their home unfortunately regarding The Disappearance of Sharon Hensley and
Annette Carver Vale there's been no justice in those two cases I do want to point out some people that that really
made this come true you know this this is something that should have been worked out decades before it would have
never gotten done if it wasn't for people like Gina frenzel the private investigator that we spoke with Jerry
Mitchell the investigative journalist who kept these stories alive and the mother of Annette Mary Rose now Mary
Rose has stated that she is disappointed that they didn't have enough evidence to
charge Felix with The Disappearance or death of her daughter you know but she has some closure in the
fact that she knows that the man she suspects and has always suspected of killing her daughter is now in prison
and he will be there until the day he dies well and one of the things that I just find so
fascinating coming from the True Crime world is how many audiobooks have we listened
to how many podcasts have we listened to how many books have we read and we get we dive into a case and we start doing a
little bit of work ourselves and it was the same thing here private private investigator or not
that that's what happened she read this book she got invested and then she did work and she was able to uncover some
stuff for the for the prosecution she became a witness for the prosecution um very interesting story and then to
have her being confronted and so it's a tough cookie right that to have her confront him at the end of the day in
jail before the trial um I'm sure when he saw uh her at trial uh he almost pooped his pants
well I do want to point out here uh that that the cases like this provide hope and should provide hope to families and
friends and communities of lost loved ones from years ago a case doesn't have to go cold and I want to thank Mary Rose
Jerry Mitchell and especially Gina frenzel for working this case and and bringing that hope back to all of us
that look into these cold cases and we just want to thank private investigator Gina for talking with us and we we were
interested in this bringing this as a story or episodes to our show just to kind of show a different side you know
uh instead of us just sitting in the garage and talking there's there's a lot of different facets of the investigation
process to bring Justice that are definitely interesting uh do we have a recommended reading for this week uh yes
this week we are recommending American Kingpin by Nick Bilton uh in 2011 a program grammar launched the ultimate
free market called The Silk Road on a website hosted on the dark web where anyone could trade drugs hacking
software forged passports counterfeit money poisons without Big Brother keeping an eye on things after a while
the media got wind and the new website where teenagers dealers hackers and terrorists could buy and sell Contraband
detection free was investigated this is the true story of the Epic hunt for the criminal mastermind behind the Silk Road
so check out American Kingpin by Nick Bilton and you can do that by going to our website truecrime garage.com click
on the recommended page you'll see all of our recommended books and movies there and if you want to purchase
anything just use our Amazon banner I want to thank you Captain for another great week here in the garage well maybe
next week you'll let me talk we will we'll think about that and I want to thank everybody for listening
subscribing telling a friend and all the wonderful five star reviews we love love
you we love you we love you we'll see you back here next week in the garage and until then be good be kind and don't
listen [Music]

A Dark Past /// Part 2 /// 115

Part 2 of 2

www.TrueCrimeGarage.com

What if somehow you learned about someone's past? You know the secrets of a monster. What would you do? One murdered woman and two missing women all had one thing in common, they were married or had an intimate relationship with the same man. Tonight we chat with Private Investigator, Gina Frenzel. She got involved in the investigation of a serial killer but to do so she had to sit down with the monster.

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Brief Summary

Felix Vale's relationships with multiple women lead to mysterious deaths and disappearances, investigated by Gina Frenzel, revealing dark patterns in his behavior.

Key points

The Mysterious Deaths. Three women connected to Felix Vale mysteriously vanished or died. What links them?
Felix's Manipulation. Felix uses his son as a pawn to manipulate others while living a nomadic lifestyle.
Bill's Confession. Bill, Felix's son, reveals shocking details about his father's past and his mother's death.
The Unidentified Victim. A mysterious woman from Felix's past may be another victim, lost to history.
The Discovery of the Journals. Finding 30 journals in a storage tote becomes a pivotal moment in the investigation.
Felix's Evasive Answers. Felix struggles to explain the disappearances of women in his life during an interrogation.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Look at me, I'm a single dad!

5:36WatchDec 7, 2022

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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