The Devil's Teeth /// Part 2 /// 180 | Forensic Files

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[Music] crime on August 7th 1972 in Springfield New Jersey parents Salvatore and
Florence dama tried to call the police they wanted to report their daughter Janette who is 16 years old either is
missing or as a runaway they were told that their daughter would have to have been missing for at least 24 hours
before they could take the report earlier that day Janette had had at least one argument with a parent before
leaving her home to venture off to her friend's house which was 8 Miles Away the plan was she was going to walk 3
miles by herself and take the train the rest of the way to her friend's house she was also scheduled to work at her
part-time job later after going to her friend's house she never arrived at work she never arrived at her friend's home
we did cover some speculation and some rumors regarding of where she may have gone that day however there are people
to suggest that either she did go to this party or there was no party at all we also suggested that that could be
just poor recollection on the on the part of these young teenagers who are being asked questions
why are they being asked questions because not only is this girl missing but approximately 6 weeks later her body
is found in a wooded area on a cliff known as the devil's teeth right and so they're asking her they're asking these
kids about these events that took place 6 weeks prior now we got into the whole thing of whether this was a situation
where the parents had reported her as missing or as a runaway the police state that the depal family called in a
situation that their daughter had run away right the police would later give different accounts on this situation
because they were interviewing the parents and according to the police it was the depas that had reported Janette
as a runaway police would later say that a runaway situation is not really investigated that they they give a
description of the girl they give some brief information to their beat cops right and if nobody sees the girl they
they don't really do anything you might kick the bushes a little bit but you don't spend a lot of time working on a
situation where somebody left willingly from their home now they did interview janette's
parents the problem that investigators had with with her parents was this they claimed
that the answers that they got from her parents regarding the the final day the day that Janette had disappeared these
answers were short and often vague answers and almost with no details and the police did not seem to like this
they thought that the the the Palmas would have more answers for them they would have some details some information
that might provide some leads into the eventual murder of their daughter but just a few days after their daughter was
found the mother said some odd things to the newspaper yes and this a lot of people in the public took some issue
with these statements now this was Florence D Palma this was just two days after the discovery of janette's body
she tells a local newspaper this is the new Yark Star Ledger and quot she says she had resigned herself to her
daughter's death weeks ago now mind you she's saying weeks ago and yet her daughter's body was just found two days
before giving the statement to the newspaper and she states that the Lord had told her and had gave her peace
weeks before finding the body of her daughter and some would point out that that suggests that maybe the parents
knew something or maybe the parents had some kind of involvement in the the actual murder or what took place with
their daughter yeah so maybe the parents know a little more or maybe it's just some other intuition that she eventually
felt like she had to accept well when I find out a little bit more information about the parents and about the dupa
family I don't find her statement to be so incriminating let's say um yeah we have statements from her other daughter
Cindy now Cindy was older than Janette from my understanding there were two other daughters living in the home with
Janette now I said that they had a large family like seven or eight kidss I'm assuming the other kids had grown and
moved out of the home but it's often reported that the two remaining daughters you know after they found the
body of Janette newspaper articles will say the two remaining daughters so I'm assuming just two of them live there now
Cindy is the only one that I could find that would give statements that would talk about this case for years to come
um I wish we had a little more information from Cindy as to what was going on with inside the walls of that
dama home during the course of when Janette was still missing and the body had not been found because I'm assuming
that if her mother had resigned herself to her daughter's death weeks ago before
before the discovery of the body that there would be things going on with inside that home you know you would
think that she would almost be would she be comforting her husband or her husband
comforting her you would you would think there would be a lot of dread inside that home prior to the finding of the
body but the reason why I say that it I don't find that that statement to be so incriminating is one thing we have to
keep in mind here and factor in in this situation is that the diploma family especially the parents were extreme
religious from my understanding they went to the way that it's been reported was
they were not just the type that that that attended church on a weekly basis that they would often go multiple times
per week and that they were extremely religious and I that's why I don't find it so
incriminating because I could see with somebody being incredibly religious and their daughter having been gone for
three four weeks I mean you start hope you lose hope you lose a little bit of Hope every day each day as it gets
further and further from the last time that you saw your child and at some point you might just have to put that
faith in God and you might be looking for answers and she may have come to this conclusion or or felt that felt
that she was being given this information well this is part of the reason why this case to me is so
frustrating because for every bit of information that you think maybe you're going to get closer to having a picture
of what was going on mhm it seems like there's a counter story so one story is that the family is really religious and
so again she had this uh God told her your child passed accept it mhm okay that's one story the other story is that
the family is not that religious and that one of their daughters started going to a different church that was not
their denomination right but then the family started going to that church and then there's reports that Janette is
highly involved in church Works uh for some teen crisis center type thing maybe crisis center is not the right word but
um you know where she's like mentoring yeah and there's other reports that she was not involved in church at
all that she possibly was involved in like Witchcraft and so that's what's so frustrating about this case the same
it's the same thing we saw when we discussed janette's character what kind of person she may have been what kind of
teenager she could have been yeah it's you have half the room telling us that she was super religious and she was
super into going to church and she was uh trying to Mentor some of her peers to find religion and to join the church and
then you have the other half of the room saying almost the opposite the exact opposite saying no her parents drug her
there her family drug her there multiple times a week I think they called it a drug and alcohol counselor which was
weird to have a drug and alcohol counselor be 16 but I think it was more of a system set up
where if if a teenager was having issues where they could call and it would be somebody of their own age to say hey
come to the church we love you we we care about you let's get you some help if that makes any sense well yeah
because you would have the that would provide some the opportunity to discuss what's going on inside their life and
things maybe that they've experimented with without the fear of getting in trouble you know from anybody without
their parents finding out or or a teacher or something like that yeah so supposedly she did do this you know but
again there's probably a story out there that says that she never even went to that church well while we're on the
subject of these newspaper articles there were several that came out within the two weeks of the discovery of her
body um and there were several that of significance in my opinion there are two that I would like to discuss and here
are the headlines from these two the first one is uh headlined girls sacrificed in witch right and the second
is deepalma say Slayers possessed by demons okay I think we should go through both of these because this is where this
might be where the the Genesis of where these rumors about Witchcraft and Satanism having been involved in
janette's murder let's start with the one that's called uh Girl sacrifice and witch right yeah and here's the
important little snippet from from that article MH it starts investigation into the death of 16-year-old Janette dealma
is focusing on elements of black Witchcraft and Satan worship a review of death scene photos according to reports
is leading authorities to believe the girl's death may have been in the nature of a sacrifice pieces of wood at first
thought to be at the scene by chance are now seen as symbols detectives throughout Union County have been
alerted to the possibility that a cult or a cult member played a part in the death a search party discovered her
remains she had been missing 6 weeks on September 19th in a wooded area of a quarry at top a 40ft cliff about 400
yard from Shunpike Road one Searcher said two pieces of wood were crossed on the ground over her head
more wood framed the body like a coffin another person who was there said I guess if you were looking for signs they
were there all right just go ahead and read the next one so we can dive into both of them at the same time and I'm
going to kind of give a uh summary of this article because it's it's a bit longer but it starts by saying parents
say daughter may have been murdered by persons who whose bodies are possessed by demons then the article mentions the
following incidents of Witchcraft in the area also stating authorities said that
janette's death may be linked to a coven or witchcraft assembly in the area and what's especially troubling here is this
is the first mention of of this situation this article also mentions acts of animal sacrifice this taking
place in a reservation near by stating that State Park police found these acts committed against dogs cats and even a
goat the reporter wrote about a bowl of blood that was found the bowl of Blood also contained the bodies of pigeons who
had had their necks snapped I think it's important to point out though when we're
talking about the animal sacrifices that the State Park police had found yeah that this was in a nearby reservation
this was not in the same area where janette's body was found it's I think it's key to point
that out yeah but how many miles away I don't I don't know off the off the top of my head here I mean look if
it's 5 to 10 miles in that radius could be linked possibly what I'm getting at though is yeah is there possible that
it's spill over or at some point that they moved into another area yeah that could happen but what I what I want to
make sure that I point out here is those acts those things that they believed were going on in that reservation were
not going on in the area where janette's body was eventually found they found no
evidence of that at any time right there was rumors that there was witchcraft activities going at Devil's skull or
Devil's teeth but those were just rumors and maybe maybe the name itself Devil's
teeth inspires those rumors yeah this again Devil's teeth is a difficult place to get to mhm so you know you
know were a bunch of devil worships going up there to perform to acts uh probably not likely right and it sounds
like they were leaving I I hate to be gross but they were leaving the carcasses and they were leaving evidence
of such at this reservation like it was pretty easily found you know they were finding blood and they were finding
bodies of animals now I could find one story specifically talking about chickens and I know that that newspaper
article referenced dogs cats and a goat right however I couldn't find any things
specifically saying that they had found carcasses of a dog cat or even a goat right again these could just be
rumors then the other rumors that are weird are these items that were left at her body these Blair Witch
type items that would be be left at the at our sacrifice scene right yeah well and that's what I want to kind of focus
in on we should push away the stuff that's going on may or may not be going on at the reservation and talk
specifically about what was found with her body and at the crime scene now there are three generally three
different reports of what are considered to be likely what was found there because this is all over the shop
Captain we have different people saying different things were found at the crime
scene the first one I want to discuss is we have the police officer officer Dawn that we
had spoke about yesterday he was involved in he was the one that responded to the call about the arm at
the apartment complex and he was part of the search he was one of the first people to see her body at top of that
Cliff yeah now what he described at the scene was he described a single cross a single wooden cross now I have to we we
have to be clear here this is not a a wooden cross that somebody built and had nailed into the ground this is what he
describes as a a large stick crossed over by a smaller stick that would form the appearance of a cross lying on the
ground this would have been just above if you were at the feet if you were at her feet looking at the body this would
be just above her head right so some people would say it's like you know a a headstone almost right but he also says
that it looks like there was a tree and that possibly a tree just fell over over
mhm and therefore making the cross he says between the cross itself and janette's body were four or five stones
that looked like they were placed around her head giving the the image of almost
a Halo right those are the only things that he describes finding there or seeing before he's told by detectives to
get off the cliff and go down and tell tell people to back up and get away we have another account this is from a
girl named Lisa she's about she would have been about janette's age and I don't want to give her full name but she
says that she went to the crime scene two days after the body was found and when she got there the crime scene tape
the police tape was still they had still roped off the area right but that there
was nobody guarding the area so she went up there this is almost like a like a standby me situation you know going out
to see a body but they've already removed janette's Body by this time yeah this is not as cool I mean think about
that if stand by if Stephen King said hey I'm going to make a movie where they go you want to see a
body yeah and they go but there is no body do you want to go see where it happened not as cool right hey for
anybody out there listening this is just my own opinion the movie Stand By Me incredibly good the the book that it's
based from the body very good that's something people should check out anyway let's go get into what Lisa says that
she had saw there now remember we said that that janette's body had kind of sunken into the ground right so when
Lisa went up there you could still see the outline of where the body once was so it's not like you she's looking at
some random spot she's looking at a spot that that is correct and what she described was that
there was a large log that would have run uh above where her head would have been and then a smaller log that would
have been right at her feet and then to each side of the body were multiple makeshift crosses from from small
branches yeah this gives a vague picture of maybe a a coffin like thing or resting area for Janette some some say
that they were building kind of an altar and that's where the sacrifice had to happen was on this altar you know but
you know not not where we look at it as like you know I was raised Catholic so you think of altar being something that
was raised right but this was you know basically we're creating an altar on the ground mhm like a perimeter around the
body right so not so much a a casket the third account is what is described according to newspaper accounts and this
is kind of a combination of the two we have the cross that we spoke about that o officer Dawn saw above the head and
then we have the log going up by the head area the log also at the feet area and then the body is positioned between
two logs as well giving a full outline of either an altar or a coffin like uh situation now with inside that perimeter
that was created by those four logs we have multiple makeshift small crosses created by branches small branches on
both sides of the body but this is coming from Lisa this is the from newspaper accounts okay so we so we have
Lisa's accounts that are similar to this newspaper account well in a sense it's it's almost
like officer Dawn's account is minimal you know there he's only finding a few items there and then Lisa is a little
more extravagant there's the addition of the logs with multiples makeshift crosses on both sides of the body and
then the newspaper account is like a combination of the two but on steroids where you have everything involved and
you have you have a bunch of stuff surrounding this body so what's your gut telling you what I think Captain is I I
favor officer Dawn's account as well as the teenager Lisa's account rather than the new newspaper and I have nothing I
have very little to base this off of but the newspaper account seems to be the most extravagant it seems to contain the
most items up there and oh right but they're they're in the business of selling stories right it it could just
be sensationalism you know for the purpose of their articles which you and I absolutely hate that I I think I
question that if any of the writers had even been to the location I think that they were probably basing what they
thought was there off of other people's stories and off of other people's accounts of what they may or may not
have saw okay so what was found by the body in my opinion yeah um I I think that it was probably like I said I think
that the more accurate statements would be either Lisa's account or officer Don's account so okay so to contradict
officer Don's account we have another officer that says yes there were Sticks and Stones up there near the bot body
the body was found in the middle of the woods and in this officer's opinion the Sticks and Stones were just there by
chance they weren't arranged by anyone nobody had placed them there that they were just there because Sticks and
Stones exist in the woods right now officer Dawn you know these two are not really these two officers aren't really
saying one is right and one is is wrong you know he's saying Don would have seen
Sticks and Stones up there but I don't believe they were arranged now officer Don would say well this officer was only
up on top of that Hill for a very short period of time before being asked to leave and what I believe I saw appeared
to have been purposely placed in position near the body the thing here is under this
situation both of these officers would have been asked to leave the area relatively quickly after finding the
body where you have somebody like Lisa who if she did venture out there two days later
she's she's looking at something and not being removed she she can stand there as
long as she likes and observe whatever is there whatever's present now keep in mind it is in fact 2 days after the body
was removed from there somebody could have altered the scene I think that Le's could be slightly exaggerated she I'm
just factoring in that she's a teenager I'm factoring in that she might have been scared while she was up there that
also she's like think about what the one officer said yes of course there were sck and Stones up there it's the woods
for crying out loud right I think maybe she may have seen things up there and put into a little more uh thought that
was necessary into what items she was looking at I think the answer for me and what my belief would be is that it's
somewhere between officer Dawn's account and Lisa's account of what was seen up there and it's also possible that
somebody went up there and had these little crosses made out of sticks and put them down mhm as like a Memorial to
the girl I mean you see that all the time somebody dies in a car wreck you know two days later it's like there's a
bunch of crosses that put somebody put down could be something like that but from all the accounts and all the
interviews I've heard the majority of the police officers say there wasn't anything there right I'm not
going to go too far-fetched with this Lisa Turtle story you know there there was no
crosses there was no nothing because that would have been reported by multiple cops if there were crosses
there weren't were there some sticks that were placed in certain you know look it could be as simple as the area
was altered before or after the murder MH and that's why there there is some sign
of any of that but to me there is no sign of that this was a sacrifice or witchcraft yeah it's it's a strange
situation because like you said we have multiple officers saying that they there
was nothing up there to suggest that and then we have two of the officers one who
says at the scene hey this looks like Witchcraft and then another officer officer Dawn stating I saw a cross and I
saw some Stones arranged near the [Music] head this show is sponsored by better help do you look forward to the holidays
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cheers captain now I tell you what regardless of what was found up at the scene okay because it's all over the
shop either nothing was found some items were found or a whole bunch of items were found that were resembled items
that would be satanic in nature or witchcraft the thing here is we there was a great book written about this case
and it's called the death on the devil's teeth and this was written by Jesse Pollock and Mark Moran now one thing
these two guys did these guys are authors I believe they work for or founded something called weird New Jersey or
weird NJ which I guess is like a b anually publication that comes out for uh weird things that happen in the state
of New Jersey is that right Captain by anually does that mean twice a year or every other year I always get confused
when I hear that I but I believe their publication comes out twice a year now one thing these guys did which was great
was they took the information of what was speculated to have been found at the scene
according to officer Dawn according to the teenager Lisa that we discussed and according to the newspaper Accounts at
the time and they took this information and they presented it to some experts in
the field of of Witchcraft and Satanism to get their opinions on you know if if in fact these items were found at the
scene what can we make of it right okay so the the first Professor that they talk to and this is Ronald Hutton now he
teach courses on contemporary paganism at the University of Bristol he says that the items that he sees in the items
that he has been told and described to him as being placed at the at the murder scene at the crime scene and his opinion
are not even items considered to be that of a pagan or ritual magic uh relationship he says that um regardless
of what or wasn't found at the scene items described in his opinion these are all traditionally Christian symbols that
would have been found there we talked about cross-like things being found uh maybe a coffin or an alter like
situation being found at the crime scene right which hence my idea that somebody
could have left these after the body was removed now another professor teaching on the subject points out that uh and I
was happy to find this because I I know little about this subject uh I like to read about cold cases um but crun you
know I thing out sorry sorry but you know I know a lot of people think that Satanism
and Witchcraft and things like that can come up a lot in these cases and actually that's just not a thing um when
it does come up it's usually simply a bad lead or misunderstanding and the reports on
Satanism SL witchcraft being involved it's often described very Hollywood like presented in ways that seem cheesy and
fake to me so I was happy to find this something I had thought this is from Dr Jason Koy professor of history at the
College of Charleston he's a renowned expert in the field of Witchcraft and he says modern-day witches or wiccans have
nothing to do with historical Witchcraft and are generally peaceful environmentalist and feminist who who
practice a sort of new age neop Pagan religion mhm which he says seems to have nothing to do with this case at all
nothing that was presented to him and nothing to do with uh janette's murder in his opinion he states that this looks
more like the work of some psychopath with a type of religious fixation well some of those ideas that he was talking
about kind of get brought up in the west Memphis 3 case mhm where Daman talks about that he wasn't was more so a
spiritual View and almost feminist views as well mhm yeah and that's one thing I
had always thought like I said I knew very little about this but that was always my understanding that these are
not traditionally violent people looking to go out and make actual sacrifices on
humans or or animals uh while we're on that subject though Captain I want to mention though I you had asked about
where uh regarding the location of those quote unquote animal sacrifices that we
disc right that took place at a place called the what Chung I hope I said that right
it's not right I did not say that I'm not terribly off I can't be terribly off because it's w a t c h u n reservation
now I don't know the location in proximity to where her body was found well what good are you but what I do
know is I'm just reviewing my notes here that according to police they refer to these as uh santoria acts that they
found evidence of this in the uh reservation and this is the the largest park in Union County so it's in the same
county as where she was found and the reservation is a 1,945 acre Forest so a very extremely
large area now we pulled that information from the article that was titled the Palmas say Slayers possessed
by demons there was also one thing that was extremely interesting near the end of this article and that is that and
this is straight from the article stating quote the investigation has also been widened to include a review of the
list murders well Captain we have not even got to this portion of the case yet not Lisk right list some people hear
that and they hear Lisk l i k but it's list yeah like I wrote a list I was researching this case and it was like
this might have something to do with the Lisk murders and I thought Long Island serial killer again it goes back to 72
God oh my God this is so fascinating then I realized I was a [ __ ] so why would why would they suggest that the
investigation according to this article and quote the investigation has also been widened to include the review of
the list murders well we have to paint a picture here Captain is not a pretty the list
murders so the list murders are a a a family was murdered in this area just months before Janette had gone missing
okay and this is considered to be one of the most famous cases from the state of
New Jersey you got to keep in mind though the community was still suffering and still trying to heal and and and
still trying to make sense of this horrible crime that had happened just months before this teenage girl goes
missing and then is ultimately found dead in the Woods right now the list murders were not discovered until
December 7th of 1971 remember our Janette DePalma case is taking place in August and September
of 1972 so less than a year later what we have here though Captain is upon a welfare check to a home
occupied by The List family mhm now this home is referred to as a mansion and it
was given the name Breeze null and I don't know if that was given to the home by the family or if it had had that name
prior to their purchasing of this Mansion but police are responding to a welfare call at this seemingly
well-to-do family MH we have a home where what was reported is that the family would be gone on some type of
vacation visiting the um the mother's mother who lived in North Carolina and they had told people that they would be
there for several weeks the the milk deliveries had stopped at the home the mail had been stopped as well as
newspapers but there were lights that were left on inside the home day and night and apparently no activity going
on within or around the home finally neighbors began to get concerned as the lights began to burn out one by one and
it almost appeared like the family had left the home and they were never going to return mhm so when the police respond
to this welfare call they decide to enter the home they find an unlocked window in front of the house towards the
front of the home and they decide to enter the home through there as they made their way through the home they
could hear what sounded like either Symphony music or religious music like being played over a
radio they made their way to now mind you this was referred to as the ballroom I believe which you would think would be
like some big grandioso room right but it's was 2et by 2 feet very small it it was a ballroom for
a puppeteer is for all those tiny dancers so they get to what was referred to as the ballroom and when they get
there the room's not as large as one would would expect to see but they find the bodies of of children and of a woman
and they are lying face down on on sleeping bags now all of the victims had been shot in the
head the police are pretty frightened by this discovery and shocked to say the least but now they're going to move room
by room throughout the home they're kind of expecting that they could encounter a
killer that is hiding in a corner somewhere in one of these rooms with a gun ready to kill whoever finds them
yeah Psycho Killer so as they move room to room they make their way to what what
is in fact the man of the home uh the man of the house it's his office and this is John list it's his office and on
the desk they they see a series of letters and they find an envelope that is addressed to John List's pastor this
is Reverend Eugene Ray Winkle the letter is dated November 9th 1971 and it reads
dear Pastor I'm very sorry to add this additional burden to your work I know that what has been done is wrong from
all that I have been taught and that any reason that I might give will not make it right but you are the one person that
I know that while not condoning this will at least possibly understand why I had to do this I wasn't earning anywhere
near enough to support us everything I tried seemed to Fall to Pieces true we could have gone bankrupt and maybe gone
on welfare but that brings me to my next Point knowing the type of location one would have to live in plus the
environment for the children plus the effect on them knowing that they were on welfare was just more than I thought
they could handle I know that they were willing to cut back but this involved a lot more than
that with Pat being so determined to get into acting I was also fearful as to what
this might do to her continuing to be a Christian I'm sure it wouldn't have helped also with Helen not going to
church I knew this would harm the children eventually in their attendance I had continued to hope that
she would begin to come to church soon but when I mentioned that to her she just blew up and stated that she wanted
her name taken off of the church rolls again this could have only given an adverse result for the children's
continued attendance so that is the sum of it if any one of these had been the condition
we might have pulled through but this was too much at last I'm certain that all have gone to
heaven now if things had gone on who knows knows if that would be the case of course mother got involved
because doing what I did to my family would have been a tremendous shock to her at this
age therefore knowing that she was also a Christian I felt it best that she be relieved of the Troubles of this
world that would have hit her after it was all over I said some prayers for all of
them from from the hym book that was the least I could do now for the final Arrangements Helen and the children have
all agreed that they would prefer to be cremated please see to it that the cost are kept low for mother she has a plot
at the church Cemetery also I don't know what will happen to the books and other personal
things but to the extent possible I would like for them to be distributed as you see
fit some books might go into the school or church library originally I had planned this
for November 1st All Saints Day but travel Arrangements were delayed I thought it would be an appropriate day
for them all to get to heaven as for me please let me be dropped from the congregation role
I Leave myself in the hands of God's justice and mercy I don't doubt that he is able to help us but apparently he saw
fit not to answer my prayers the way that I hoped they would be answered this makes me think that
perhaps it was best as far as the children's souls are concerned I know that many will only look at the
additional years that they could have lived but if finally they were no longer Christians what would be
gained also I am sure many will say how could anyone do such a horrible thing my only answer is it isn't
easy and was only done after much thought one other thing it may seem cowardly to have
always shot from behind but I didn't want any of them to know even at the last second that that I had to do this
to them JN got hurt more because he seemed to struggle longer the rest were immediately out of
pain John didn't consciously feel anything either please remember me in your prayers I will need them whether or
not the government does its Duty as it sees fit I am only concerned with making peace with God and of this I am assured
because of Christ dying even for me PS mother is in the hallway in the Attic on the third floor she was too heavy to
move signed John so very obvious captain that John list murdered his wife three children
and his mother before writing that letter on November 9th 1971 yeah after after he wrote the
letter he turned on the music he locked the doors and he left the house the police obviously looking for Mr list who
is now a mass murderer they did some checking into his background because they had some
evidence regarding the letter that he left them or for the pastor more appropriately of what led him to
committing these crimes and he talks a lot about uh being a Christian and going to church and however ultimately he
commits a very unchristian-like act um to solve his troubles and not wanting to put his family through any troubles well
maybe discuss this with them first right he Cho he he chose to get a redo and didn't give them the option for that now
what it appears to me to be Captain is that this family was living well beyond their means and this has got to be um
primarily his fault he's the man of the house he's the one that's in charge of paying the bills and probably setting a
budget for the household his wife did suffer some type of illness and I don't have that specifically here in my notes
but I know that she suffered some type of illness that caused there um maybe even some dementia uh from her where she
would she would act out at times and this was a big reason why she was not attending the church like he had
referenced in the letter he does mention his oldest daughter in the letter saying that she had kind of
fallen out of the church that she wanted to get into acting and that caused him to question her Christianity yeah and he
also thought that maybe the more she got into acting the worse that would get for
her Christianity correct and that if had he not done this act uh when he did maybe she would not have been received
into [Music] heaven apparently Not only was he overspending and spending beyond the
means of their income mhm but the mother lived with them because this was such an
expensive home that he had to go to her for money uh whether it be for the down payment or to pay the mortgage probably
both yeah but the agreement was that she would live in an apartment that they basically furnished in the Attic of this
Mansion quote unquote Mansion she lived there and he apparently at some point lost his job
and rather than informing his family of this it was for it was for many many months every day he would wake up he
would shower he would get ready for work he would dress in a suit and tie and he
would leave the house and he would go to a local bus station and he would sit there and he would read all day long and
he would come home at the end of each day now I'm sure at times he was probably looking for work because he did
ultimately find work but once he had the family was so far behind on its bills and behind in in debt uh that he chose
to take the lives of his family and like I said give himself a redo but not give
anybody else the option of this and as sad as it is I mean it's it's horrible and it reminds us so much of the William
Bradford Bishop case that we discussed when we covered uh the FBI's most wanted list it's a guy that did the same thing
to his family and to his mother just a couple years after this took place uh with the list family he shot John L shot
all of his family members with a 9mm gun and like he said in the letter from behind in a very cowardly way leaving
them displayed in the ballroom and the mother up in the attic where this ties to the case to the case of Janet dealma
It's Tricky it's really tricky to say but I feel like we needed to cover this and to uh give somewhat of a detailed
description of this crime because it would be rare when you research the Janette case when you research her case
it is rare to find any mention of her case without them referencing the list murders or John list and his family well
one because in this area these are the two biggest probably murder cases ever in this area and they're happening less
than one year apart both on un solved at the time of the investigation and then you have books
that were found it seems to be that there were things found within the list home that would suggest that the oldest
daughter the one that was getting into acting and that John said was getting further from the church right that she
may have been involved in some witchcraft or Wiccan type activity now it has been referenced from
her Diaries uh entries that she made into her journal and books and materials that were found within the home this is
the tie this is what ties this to the Palma's case when you talk about Satanism and the possibility of
Witchcraft even the possibility that that Janette herself was involved in witchcraft books yes MH were these books
and that's it right yeah that well really that's it and that's what's sad is that this is reported that oh the
police now going to widen their investigation into the list murders because of janette's case however it's
it's a lot of what we've seen before and what we suspect with some of those newspaper articles regarding things that
were found at janette's crime scene was that there's some sensationalism going on here oh yeah and F first of
all Mr list you use my friend use a p [ __ ] but this has nothing to do with it his daughter probably was interested in
probably some spirituality stuff she probably was doing some research uh Curious you know just because you have
some books on the Shelf about a subject matter doesn't mean that you're into that right you know what I mean like if
somebody went to the Colonel's house right now right the alarm would go off okay right but but they get past the
alarm okay to get past the five dogs or whatever you got two dogs Mr dog lover leave the dogs alone please if you into
my house you break into my house I would like to have my dogs when I get there well one might bite your head off but
then they get to the Bookshelf right P all the porno mags they get to the book show there's no porno mags but go ahead
you know just because you have all these books about serial killers and mass murderers and all that doesn't make you
one that's my point and I think is it just the naive of the of the 70s where they just jump to these crazy
conclusions or or is it what you said during our break if it bleeds it leads yeah and I mean it's sad but that's the
truth you know you you talk about some of the biggest murder cases serial murder and otherwise throughout the
history of the world and what we've seen time and time again it sells newspapers
and magazines and people do TV shows about it and two guys sit in a garage and drink some beer and try to figure
things out so we're part of the problem I guess we're part of the problem yeah maybe I shouldn't have highlighted that
for everybody but in this situation 1972 uh neither of us were around and they this is sensationalism in my
opinion for these newspaper articles in reality what we do know is this is there
any chance that these cases are have any involvement in one another other than being from the same area in the same
time period no I couldn't find anything to suggest that that that the Liss family even knew the dma family yeah the
other connection that people were trying to make was that the oldest list daughter was into Witchcraft and they
did seances and they did witchcraft um activities arts and crafts with witchcraft uh up at Devil's skull
and so that therefore that maybe she was Loosely connected to Janette and it's it's just not true right there's there's
really no evidence that there was any kind of activity that happened at Devil's Devil's teeth is the is there
any connection no there's no connection with the list murders but when you research this uh you know I kept on
hearing about these murders and they might be connected so we thought it was important to go through it at least
especially if we're going to reference them later but it's one of those things captain that you have to in this case
you have to get over the fact that they're not connected to the list murders and you have to get over the
fact that there's it's leaning towards that it's more likely that Witchcraft and Satanism was not involved in Janette
the Palma's murder and once you get past those two things those those little mountains there and you venture on then
you have to question I think that's when you can start to see what maybe really truly happened here why did she
disappear why did she go missing and ultimately why was she killed and are there other cases that are connected to
this one yes and that leaves us here Captain we have so much more to get to there's been speculation that if this
was not witchcraft or Satanism could it possibly have ties to the mafia could this could she have been killed by a
stranger or a friend or a boyfriend was this ultimately some kind of cover up involving the
police and this is going to lead us down the road of looking into some other murders that may be connected to
janette's Case and we also have plenty of suspects to discuss as [Music] well all right thanks for joining us in
the garage and telling a friend we had no clue this was going to turn out to be four episodes it kind of a last minute
punt situation right Captain we got into this we're like holy moly there's a lot
here on the surface it doesn't appear to be such but there is a lot more to get to We Appreciate everybody joining us
this week in the garage if you want to continue the chat go to True Crime garage.com we have our blog there
there's room for your comments and your questions there on our website all right
until next week Colonel you be good and Captain you be kind and everybody please
don't litter [Music] [Applause] [Music] you can let about your Master Chef dreams when you find a professional on
Angie to tackle your dream kitchen remodel connect with skilled professionals to get all your home
projects done well inside to outside repairs to Renovations get started on the Angie app
or visit angie.com today you can do this when you Angie that and

The Devil's Teeth ////// Part 2 of 4

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Episode 180- This case begins with a teenager who goes missing. Several weeks later in September of 1972 a body is discovered atop a cliff, above an abandoned quarry in Springfield, New Jersey. Later it was determined this was the body of the missing teen, Jeannette DePalma. Along with the body it is said that cult related items were recovered from the area. Her body was said to have been resting on a makeshift altar in the woods. The murder of Jeannette DePalma is very bizarre and is still unsolved. This case is not known to most outside of the state of New Jersey. We gather in the garage to try to shed some light on this cold case.Beer of the Week - Secret Stairs by Trillium Brewing CompanyGarage Grade - 4 and a half bottle caps out of 5

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Brief Summary

The episode discusses Janette DePalma's 1972 disappearance, investigation, and theories linking her death to witchcraft and the List murders.

Key points

The Mysterious Disappearance. Janette Dama, 16, goes missing after leaving home, leading to a frantic search.
A Shocking Discovery. Six weeks later, Janette's body is found in a wooded area, raising many questions.
Witchcraft Rumors. Investigators explore links to witchcraft and possible cult involvement in Janette's death.
The Altar of Logs. A makeshift altar was found around the body, raising questions about its significance.
Conflicting Accounts. Different accounts from officers and a teenager lead to confusion about what was found.
The List Murders Connection. The investigation into Janette's murder is widened to include the infamous List murders.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

She had resigned herself to her daughter's death weeks ago.

Mother's statement after daughter's body found

7:08WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

60/ 100Some tension

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The Devil's Teeth /// Part 2 /// 180 | Forensic Files