The Barbie Doll Killer /// Part 2 /// 654 | Forensic Files

[Music] thank you [Music] [Music] thank you welcome to True Crime garage wherever
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r-u-n beer run and that is enough of the business all right everybody gather round grab a chair grab a beer let's
talk some true crime [Music] thank you [Music] but we knew that it wasn't we knew that
Rosie wouldn't just climb out of the window at that late at night and just leave
and go throw herself in the river because we know she wouldn't do that Rosie tapia's sister and family never
believed her drowning was accidental her mother discovered Rosie missing just before 6 a.m Sunday the window of her
bedroom opened screen removed now autopsy results reveal Rosie was probably sexually assaulted before
drowning in the Jordan River Canal where her body was discovered by a jogger it's
just so sad because somebody could be so sick to take a baby from her room from her security
and do such a wrong thing to her what are we supposed to do keep our kids locked up our windows locked our doors
locked put bars on our window to keep our kids from being stolen and and tossed in a river they're following this
up with additional statements and interviews of the victims and also Witnesses because it's big
uh it's becoming more a larger investigation than maybe it was initially one of the Avenues under investigation
reports the demand was seen hanging around the apartment playground a man who carried Rosie home Saturday after
she fell off the slide she said that guy was sitting on one of the benches just watching the kids
and why would a guy just watch kids if he didn't have no kids he's probably seeing who's gonna hit
next [Music] none of the kids are safe you know until they find this person who did this
families who live here are now living in fear after the abduction sexual assault
and murder of six-year-old Rosie Tapia relatives and neighbors are now taking no Chances with their own children I let
my kids run around here and I want this guy caught because I'm scared that it might happen to my son or my daughter or
my other son Cara Hansen's daughter was nearly abducted about a year ago so what
kind of precautions are you taking with your children just sitting outside with them while they play
making them come in when I go in just not letting them play outside by themselves
around 8 PM authorities brought in a team of bloodhounds to try and track down where Rosie went into the canal
police suspect the child knew her abductor and right now there are a few suspects but very little to go on a
neighbor who lived two floors above Rosie's window reported hearing a scream yesterday morning and other neighbors
say a strange man had brought the girl home from this playground Saturday night after she fell I don't believe it's
somebody we know [Music] um hopefully it's not because it'd be even more devastated to know that
Rosie's death comes one week after this woman's daughter was abducted and raped from the same apartment complex this
woman says the property managers told her to keep it quiet now right now the our main concern is our security if
we're going to have to live here I think there should be better so it'll be either better security
or more security security is now everyone's concern but for Rosie's family the priority is getting the
killer in custody for somebody to do this he had to have a sick mind very sick mind to do something like this to a
six-year-old girl what began as a tragic drowning is now being called a murder here's what we
know little Rosie was discovered missing just before 6 a.m yesterday police say her bedroom window was open and the
screen removed a jogger discovered her body in the Jordan River canal and an autopsy performed today indicates Rosie
had been sexually assaulted before drowning in the river [Music] foreign [Music]
this still unsolved homicide of six-year-old Rosie Tapia it's amazing to me Captain that all of these years later
this case is still unsolved but as we said yesterday there is some meat on the bone so let's go through some of the DNA
evidence the suspects that are involved here as well as our offender profile now
a quick recap of the case we have our victim's mother who checks in on Rosie at 2 30 a.m now she is
sleeping in her bedroom with her four-year-old sister and four-year-old brother by 5 45 AM Rosie was missing
from her bedroom this is discovered by her mother the bedroom window was open the screen was removed and the
girl is missing the police were immediately notified and a search was initiated by approximately 10 a.m the
victim's body was located by a man who was out walking his dog the body was floating in the Surplus Canal about a
block from the apartment where she was taken the autopsy revealed that Rosie had been sexually assaulted this is an
open and active case in the Salt Lake City police department is seeking information in this case one thing that
I found a little strange here Captain when reviewing the information back from 1995 was that Salt Lake City was
experiencing something that the rest of the country really was not so the serious crime rate and when we say
serious crimes we're referring to things like murder rape burglaries violent crimes things like that the serious
crime rate fell nationally four consecutive years in a row from 1991 to 1995. in fact dropping two percent
Nationwide from 1994 to 1995. but the opposite of that was Salt Lake City Salt Lake City at the time ranked third
amongst large cities in the U.S for an increase in serious crime in fact the crime rate in Salt Lake City itself
climbed a whopping 16.4 percent so while Nationwide we are experiencing dropping rates Salt Lake
City at this time was was experiencing something completely different Rising rates and Rising significantly probably
due to high sodium diets well let's dive into the timeline of the investigation and that will lead us to some suspects
along the way days after the funeral service for little Rosy Tapia we have a Barbie doll that was found left at her
grave site this Barbie doll was collected by her mother her mother collected several items that were left
at the gravesite and it's not uncommon for things to be left in Memorial to victims or even to loved one ones that
pass from natural causes and Rosie's case you had your typical things like pictures grievance cards
candles stuffed animals things of that nature that were left at the gravesite but one item in particular that was of
particular interest to Rosie's mother was this Barbie doll that was left at the gravesite now a bunch of these items
that were left at Rosie's gravesite the mother the family collected them and maintained these items for many years to
come the Barbie doll that was collected by her mother will actually become part of this investigation decades later
that's going to lead us to 2002 captain in November of 2002 an unknown person left a rock
on Rosie tapia's grave with a note written on it now we do not know what that note says but we what we do know is
the Salt Lake City police department has publicly announced this event as well as
that they are seeking the person that left the rock that left the note that wrote the note they want to speak
to this individual now that was 20 years ago that that rock was left on the grave
site we don't have any report indicating that that person ever came forward or that
they were ever able to locate the individual or if they were able if they were able to locate or identify the
individual if they spoke to them so we don't know what has come of that piece of information but what's interesting to
me is years later decades later they decide this Barbie doll that was left at the gravesite is important to the
investigation and back in 2002 they knew that this rock with the note left on it was important to the
investigation and made that clear to the public at some point seeking this individual
so is there a connection between the Barbie doll and The Rock it's difficult to sit here and say we don't know the
information that was left in that note but what it does do because initially when I hear about this Barbie doll and
it being a big deal and then we're going to have it tested and all that stuff I go well it could be a nothing Burger
because people leave stuff all the time and is it possible that somebody brings their daughter to leave some flowers at
the gravesite and the daughter has a toy with them and decides well I'm going to
leave this toy for her but what we do have with this rock in this note is that obviously somebody's
trying to communicate with their family or law enforcement through that grave site so it puts a
little bit more uh value or more it puts it as a higher probability that maybe somebody was trying to make a statement
by leaving some kind of doll at the grave site I kind of LeapFrog something on accident here in our timeline so I
want to make sure that I include this now before we get too far along good job dumbass but there was a lead
that they were trying to follow up on early on in this investigation and I want to make sure that we include this
Captain because we don't know if this information could be paired with something else in the timeline or a
suspect in this timeline so the lead that they were working on early in the investigation was what they
were referring to as an elusive truck this was a truck they were trying to find they were trying to identify this
truck trying to find the owner of this vehicle this elusive truck we don't get much in the way of a
description other than something that could be a very key identifier on the truck was the truck had a mountain fuel
logo on it and this was spotted by multiple individuals in the Heartland apartments complex where Rosie lived
Mountain fuel records indicate that no employee visited the complex in the days prior to Rosie's death
and the truck is described as old so the detectives have come forward and they said we're looking for this truck
it's described as an older model truck we've checked the records of mountain fuel
they have no employees in the area in the days surrounding the murder we think that maybe this vehicle had been sold at
one point and somebody else is now driving this truck around so back to our timeline
this will take us up to 2012. and we are getting this information from Jensen privateinvestigations.com they have a
brief article on there that states that just days after an arrest was made in another murder case
unfortunately this was the murder of Sierra Newbold this arrest led to the Topia family
wondering if the man accused of murdering Sierra if this could possibly be linked to
their daughter's murder that took place 17 years prior the details of this are eerily similar so in
both cases we have an abduction and then a murder When comparing Rosie tapia's case to
Sierra newbold's case both girls were taken from their homes both were sexually assaulted and then drowned in a
Jordan Canal it's strange but also super creepy when these cases sound it sounds
like the same case just a different victim's name we talked about the Surplus Canal where Rosie Tapia was
found well unfortunately this other girl who was similar in age similar victim type to Rosie
unfortunately experience a very similar situation we have Sierra Newbold where the perpetrator of that crime entered
the home and exited the home through a sliding glass door and then of course we have Rosie's case where the perpetrator
came in through the window it appears likely that the offender in Rosie's case exited the home the same way that they
entered the home I would like to get a little bit further confirmation on that because I think when we talk about a
basement apartment Captain you can start to see the complexities right when trying to remove a child or remove a
victim in that manner right now you've got to climb back up and and get through that
window with your victim some people have wondered if there might be two persons involved in Rosie's case that would
certainly make it easier to transport the victim yeah easier to transport the victim but also easier to maintain
control of the victim well the man that was arrested in the other case was Terry
black he was arrested for multiple crimes but one of them was the murder of Sierra Newbold and the special
investigator Jason Jensen is interviewed here and goes on to tell us a little bit about black saying that
they looked into Black's criminal record which spans throughout four states Jensen investigations was able to
determine that yes in fact this Terry black was living in the state of Utah when Rosie was killed they go on to say
that he was a Salt Lake County resident at that time and they want to be clear here saying so you can't rule him in you
can't just automatically rule him in but you also cannot rule him out in Rosie's
case until we have some more information yeah because one we could test the DNA if we have a full sample size of that
DNA but also this could be a serial killer with the same Mo like we said the crimes are identical with just different
victim names sadly in this same article here Captain we have Lewin Tapia Rosie's mother who has been up front and
center has been the face of this investigation since day one and kudos to her for reminding everybody
about this case because again I didn't see a great deal of coverage locally when this first case broke and
really it wasn't until these other organizations stepped in that you start to see all of these stories coming out
and it now goes on to become a national story and today 2023 we have a ton of information and a
ton of stories about Rosie's case on the Internet thanks to the help of these other entities now luinetopia in this
article is quoted as saying I'm just hoping I find out before I go she's referencing finding out who killed her
daughter and she adds I will be up in heaven with her but I still won't know who took her well now this is going to
bring us to 2018. and I'm going to read some portions of this article that came out this is when we get informed about
this Barbie doll that was left years ago at Little Rosie tapia's grave site this
is from 2018 People magazine the headline could a Barbie doll hold the clue to solving a 23 year old cold
case they go on to say the mother of a murdered child discovered a Barbie doll at her grave site 23 years ago and kept
it in a glass case it has been more than 20 years since six-year-old Rosie Tapia
was kidnapped from her Salt Lake City Home assaulted and killed her body was found in a canal off of the Jordan River
several hours after her disappearance Now 23 years later the Utah Cold Case Coalition is asking the public for any
tips related to a Barbie doll which was found on top of the girl's grave shortly
after she died in 1995. quote Rosie's mother went back to her grave regularly she went back and found this doll there
which was a bit unusual and kept it in a glass case this whole time in September
of 2017 we should point out here that this Utah Cold Case Coalition is not a law
enforcement entity okay they are victim Advocates they assist victims families and trying to further the investigations
keep the investigations in the spotlight in the media and help raise money and resources to possibly finally solve some
of these cases so this is where you see from a media standpoint anyway this case
take a 180 degree turn from where there's not a whole lot being reported on Rosie's case until you get Jensen
investigations until you get the Utah Cold Case Coalition involved and they've really helped to climb to the
mountaintops and keep shouting and shouting and shouting from the mountaintops about this case since then
yeah but we also all know how it works when there's a case take the Brian shaver case guy walks into a bar he's
seen on camera never seen on camera leaving the bar is he inside is he outside there's like a little creepy
factor that Sparks our human interest and so I think in this case when you start going well
there's this creepy man that returned her home returned Rosie home the day that she was kidnapped that that kind of
Sparks her interest and then when you find out that there's this Barbie doll that might have some significance and
then you can start picturing your mind's eye This creepy Barbie doll that's found
at the grave site I think it really Sparks our human interest to go I want to know more about this case so in
September of 2017 the Coalition approached the Salt Lake City Police Department with that Barbie doll
and they asked them to test it for DNA but unfortunately they say they basically did not get a response or we
can assume they at least did not get the response that they wanted since then the Coalition decided to move
forward on testing the doll without assistance from law enforcement they go on to say that there will be two phases
in the test the first phase extracts the DNA that they're hoping to find and the
second which is the more costly portion identifies the DNA so this article comes out in 2018
so when they say last year they're referring to 2017. they say that the group was able to pay to get the DNA
extracted from the doll which did include male DNA the group believes that the doll known
as a pretty hearts Barbie could be a valuable clue in the case and they're hoping someone will come forward with
any information on who may have left it there quote we thought we'd give the public a
chance to say I left that there or hey that's my doll it went missing now I know where it is so what they're saying
here Captain is they've taken on this without the assistance of law enforcement it's a two-phase process in
2018 they're saying we've already paid for phase one phase two is the much more costly much more expensive part of the
investigation right we're making an announcement publicly this came out in People magazine it was on the internet
it was it was in every newspaper that you can think of and they're saying we just want somebody to come forward let
us know if you left the Barbie doll there because if somebody comes forward and we're like we can prove that they
had nothing to do with the case well we can move on and we don't have to waste resources and money on identifying
who left it there what's interesting to me Captain was the way that this Barbie doll is described
it was described as used okay so I wanted to know what used meant right I'm assuming it's not in its
packaging well all my toys all my toys growing up were used but take it a step further I was told by somebody very
close to the case that it it's described as used because it was clear that it it
was not only not in its packaging this was a Barbie doll that was likely sold the year
prior to her murder and had obvious signs of wear and tear that it was played with
this could be looked at as a creep Factor it could be looked at simply as maybe a child did this but there were
some chew marks on the feet of the Barbie doll yeah I think a lot of this to me just points to the idea that
a child is there their parents are showing their condolences and then the child leaves the Barbie and look maybe
the child doesn't remember leaving the Barbie maybe the parents don't remember the child leaving the Barbie as said
they were able to determine they were able to just to extract some male DNA or DNA that included male DNA from the doll
now what we do know is we sit here five years later after this article came out five years after they asked someone to
come forward claim to have left the doll or know who left the doll yeah and nobody's come forward so that means one
of three things there's only three possible outcomes with that a the person that left the doll is
completely innocent and just never heard the public cry for information right B the person is who left it wants to
remain anonymous for any number of reasons a lot of those reasons I would say would
be suspicious or three you mean c keep in mind the stall was left in 1995. people think
you're a genius given the victim's age it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that
a friend or a loved one or even just somebody being sympathetic from afar from watching on TV or from the
neighborhood maybe another young person close in age to Rosie left the doll there
and now fast forward to 2018 all those years later they were just so young they don't
recall leaving the Barbie doll at the gravesite right so to me there's only three reasons why
somebody wouldn't come forward one of those one of those is suspicious [Music] thank you
[Music] all right we are back thanks for joining us cheers everybody cheers sippy sippy on your cup
look I I hate to poo poo on the parade but I'm not so concerned with this Barbie
doll as I'm concerned with this man that brings her Rosie back to the apartment after she has an accident on the
playground yes air quotes accident on the playground got kicked in the back because there's the other side of that
debate is that it never happened that the person brought Rosie back but she was not hurt wasn't crying was not in
need of assistance and this person might have just been looking for some kind of
information to later use well because initially everybody in the apartment complex goes
hey we know who this guy is he doesn't have any kids he sits at the park he plays guitar for the kids he's
kind of a strange weirdo so if he's at the park multiple times then probably pretty likely that he knows who Rosie is
it's probably pretty likely he knows where her apartment is but it's very strange to be a guy playing guitar at
the park for kids and watching kids when you don't have any of your own so here this becomes a big problem for
the investigation and from the Salt Lake City Police Department's investigation from that side
early on in the investigation they said that they had identified this man and for clarity purposes we're going to call
this man the Good Samaritan right the guy that's what he's been referred to in multiple Stories the guy that brought
Rosie home to her apartment that night said that she was hurt on the playground they say that they identified him as a
man who had a son that was a divorce a so he had his son part-time right and he played guitar at the playground and
often his son was there with him so you have and you heard it in our sound clip leading into today's storytelling of the
case that people were suspicious of people in the park or people at the playground why
would a man be sitting there by himself why would he be there without a child old flicky flicky Pito people were
suspicious of that and rightfully so well police say we moved on from the Good Samaritan because we identified him
as a man who I believe he was a truck driver or worked out of town for a portion of his schedule he's a
divorcee with his with his son has his son part time lives in the apartment complex
and was known to play the guitar at the playground by the way based off of his work records
they show that he was out of town when Rosie was abducted and killed the problem with that then becomes Guitar
Man and the Good Samaritan cannot be the same person we again we don't have the details
did he leave on a trucking route at midnight right and so then we know that from from the time period that she was
abducted that he wouldn't have been around but he could have been able to bring her back to the apartment earlier
that day I like you said I think it's it's very unclear if this Good Samaritan and this this uh
divorcee truck driver if they're the same person right is Guitar Man in the Good Samaritan the same person there
have been people that have come forward and said no we know who the guitar guy is just like the police says and we are
saying that's not the same person so then in retrospect they go back and they look and unfortunately even though they
said they were able to move on from the Good Samaritan very much like a case that we very recently reviewed there's
no documents backing any of that up they can't say who spoke to this man there's
no documents backing it up showing that that they positively identified the Good
Samaritan man so many are pointing out a problem with that having moved on from the Good Samaritan too quickly that
maybe maybe they misidentified him and that those two individuals are not one and the same but what we do have is
Rosie's sister answered the door and talked to this man the problem is he's wearing a hat he's wearing glasses he's
almost like incognito and then when they release a sketch of this individual he looks like an alien human from Men In
Black right right well difficult to say he he could be a an alien in Disguise or
he could be the man in Black right it's a it's a Men In Black type situation the guy the description is
basically take a face and put big sunglasses and a hat on it and that's your your sketch that you get
yeah in the face before we move on too far from the Barbie doll though Captain I do want to point out that the uh
you're a little too obsessed with dolls of all the things that they paid for again nobody ever came forward taking
credit for leaving the Barbie doll we should point out a couple of things here that the Coalition the Cold Case
Coalition has pointed out saying that they have received numerous calls about Barbie dolls left at gravesites for
other murdered girls including some in other states and they go on to say that they don't know if there is any possible
link between any of the cases but they do say the time frames we've been contacted on are fairly close together
although in different states could it be the same person I don't know could it be
a certain type of Predator I don't know could it also be totally innocent possibly well no and think about uh True
Detective the One season there was these handmade woven uh dolls that were given to these
victims so when they go to investigate these murder crimes and they go look through
uh the rooms of the victims they find these handmade dolls to me that that would be a link but a
Barbie doll is such a common item a lot of these people that are showing respect
to these victims by leaving flowers or just visiting the grave site if they have a child with them
I could totally see a child going well I'm going to donate my doll and I could also see that being a a situation with
Rosie's case where the parent might not have even known that their daughter did that and look I
have pretty good memories of of things I've done and you'd think that this would also be a memory that would stick
out to you going to go visit a grave when you're a little kid but I have friends of mine that they can't remember
[ __ ] from when they're a kid in 2019 the Utah Cold Case Coalition released a sketch of a possible suspect in Rosy
tapia's murder according to a press release the sketch is based on a neighbor's recollection the neighbor
lived in the same apartment complex where the six-year-old lived when she was abducted and murdered the neighbor
claims that he was up early saw a teenager coming from the same direction as the canal where she was later found
at first as the captain pointed out yesterday this neighbor thought that the teen was wearing pants of two different
colors but then realized the pants were wet this is interesting this is is the lead and the sketch that we talked about
yesterday this is the one that comes out but it doesn't come out until 2019. now some of these reports state
that this neighbor because you're sitting here going well why would this individual wait so long
to tell anybody about this this neighbor person I don't know if it's a she or he
but they claim that they did give this information to the Salt Lake City Police Department back in 1995 but there was
little to no follow-up on it at all the witness described this teenager as a 16 to 17 year old boy who is Hispanic
with a slight build and a narrow face with high cheekbones he says that he was seen wearing denim jeans a white shirt
and a medium length gold chain baller now what's interesting is that police get this sketch
and they hold on to it for a period of time I believe it was like two months the reason why this sketch is
so important I've looked at this in comparison to the Good Samaritan sketch the man that returned Rosie right
there's not the Good Samaritan sketch is not descriptive enough really to compare
it to anything I've heard and read people say that the sketches look like they could be the same person
frankly I mean I don't think it's you can compare anything to the Good Samaritan sketch no because he looks
like a undercover alien but no I think this is actually the the biggest and best lead that we have and
it it sucks that it took so long to one compile this sketch and then to release the sketch because again I'm going to go
back to the initial investigation this becomes very difficult for law enforcement because you have basically a
small town in this apartment complex so you would see a lot of individuals so to jog your memory and go oh yeah
there was a teenage boy that would walk around the complex to draw jog your memory
10 15 years later to try to identify somebody that you might have only seen a few times that if
this sketch was released two weeks after the murders I think you'd have a lot of
people coming forward and saying well that looks like Ricky or that looks like Steve or that looks like whoever it's so
difficult and we've talked about this before we've talked to plenty of detectives that say time is everything
we bring it up all the time time is the killer time is the killer of evidence time is the killer of solving these
cases and the detectives would tell you if early on in the investigation have we
just spoke to this person I think the outcome would have been different had we just found this piece of the puzzle
early in the investigation instead of all these years later I think that the outcome would be different I agree with
you here Captain I think that this is that piece of the puzzle this is that person that had they just had this
information and maybe they did again this person is saying that I gave this information we
don't know it's difficult to say we can only base it off of the reports we are seeing but had they had this information
back in 1995 maybe we're not sitting here talking about an unsolved homicide and the reason why I state that is
because this 2019 sketch of wet pants man may be the most and best tip that they've got all along and this is going
to be the best way of crowdsourcing this case so there's some backstory that comes
along with this composite sketch and that is that when the composite sketch was released by The Police
this man who is reported his name is Dan contacts the police department and says
that sketch looks similar to a friend of mine he was a friend of mine back in 1995 and he's still somebody that I stay
in touch with to this day right now we're no longer close but we were back in 95.
and he says what's even more strange about the sketch is that prior to it being released his friend
had called him and said hey I heard that they're putting together a sketch of somebody that they think is a suspect in
the rosie Tapia case and this Dan individual says yes that's what I've heard as well
and the friend of Dan says to Dan wouldn't it be funny if the sketch looks like one of us well I'm sure they
probably shared a laugh and it seems like a dumb statement I don't know why any of that would be funny when we're
talking about the murder of a six-year-old but right Dan calls police and says look my friend called me before
the sketch came out and said wouldn't it be funny if it looks like one of us now
the sketch comes out I think it looks like my friend right the one that thought it would be so hilarious well I
guess guess I'm guessing he didn't find it to be too funny when it does come out
and it looks like him there is some reports out there that uh this individual states that I've seen the
sketch it does not look like me in that person's opinion this person to their credit
did agree to a DNA swab and so did the Dan individual agree to a DNA swab I know that the unnamed individual
friend that they did in fact collect his DNA one one of the things that we have or
one of the things I've seen reported is that that Rosie Ellie's put up some kind
of struggle and so they believe that they could get some DNA from underneath her fingernails I've referenced once or
twice that we spoke to somebody very close to the case and I was not aware at the time when
speaking to this individual that this unnamed person the friend of Dan that had wet pants
what's that the guy that could be Mr wet pants possibly could be Mr wetpants I did not know that this friend of Dan had
agreed to a DNA swap yeah I didn't see that reported but this is one of those weird scenarios where you were actually
able to talk to an individual that's really close to this case so some of the stuff that you're putting out in this
episode I'm hearing for the first time as well so what happened is this and I'm going to go through our interaction
together because I did not know this in advance my reaction to him telling me this information was I said look I've
reviewed I'm no Detective but I've reviewed a lot of homicide cases here in the garage with the
captain and it's my experience that guilty people don't so willingly offer up their DNA and he said to me
that's exactly right Nick but keep in mind when he offered up his DNA there was a big question mark out there
whether DNA existed as evidence in this case at all right in fact there was police on record more than one occasion
stating that they did not have DNA so I said to him either that's some great strategy by the police to not release
that they have DNA or there's something weird with the DNA evidence yeah well like we said uh one of the
Destroyers of evidence is time but also water I think that's why you see some of
these cases even if there are these brutal murders but the victim is found in water it it becomes way more
difficult for law enforcement to put together the pieces of the puzzle to solve the case now let's stay in the
year of 2019 here as we continue on our timeline because this directly impacts what we were just talking about in 2019
new details about the case were released by the Salt Lake City police department
but this was done in an episode by investigation discovery Network the Paula Zahn
on the case on on the case with palazan and the episode about Rosie tapia's murder was
titled she's gone for the first time in Rosie's case the case had gone National on on a big
national scale here Beyond even what the national scale that it hit in 2018. again I want to point out all the good
work that the Jensen investigations have done and the Cold Case Coalition because
they're the entities that made this a national story when this case did not get a whole lot of local media coverage
they changed that 180 degrees once they stepped in so and they've worked directly with the
Tapia family on this case all along don't dismiss the power of palazan well don't dismiss the power of these
victims advocacy programs these um non-profit organizations that exist what was shocking to
Rosie's mother when she watched the paulazon case and the Tapia family was participating in the making of that
episode but when she watched it she for the very first time says that she learned that they did have DNA in her
daughter's case says quote I did not know that they had DNA from her fingernails I asked them a long time ago
if they had DNA from her fingernails and they told me they didn't have any end quote now you think you're being
cooperative with this production company you would think that well first of all you'd think Warren we're going to
disclose all the information to you before we release it to the public but also maybe that we're going to let you
watch watch it before it comes out let you watch the documentary early before the information comes out to the public
the if you're going to play the numbers here the numbers would tell you the statistics would tell you
that the overwhelming majority of the time this kind of offender is known to the family knows the family or knows the
victim right my suspicion here is if in fact they had good DNA evidence and that's what I think we need to hone in
on here in a second if in fact they had good DNA evidence if there's a chance that they thought
that the perpetrator may be known to the family they may have withheld this information from the family as well as
part of their investigation right which which does make some sense according to police statements on the paulazon
episode Salt Lake City police said that they have more than 60 samples from different persons in this case now it's
also been reported that they could not enter or compare the DNA that they found in Rosie's case to DNA on CODIS that it
did not meet the criteria for being able to upload it or compare it to the coded database yeah most likely
meaning it doesn't have enough markers correct which the point I was going to make that I had
a little brain fart earlier I heard it it smells we have an eyewitness that is saying that this Mr wet pants is a late
teenager this is a horrific crime this is the type of crime that even if this is his first crime
this is probably a murderer that's going to continue on the path of being a horrific murderer
so you would think at some point he would either get caught for this or like you said get caught
in a home and then get charged with breaking and entering but it all depends on where he was arrested did they
collect DNA and like you said if there's not enough markers then you can't even compare that DNA but it
wouldn't surprise me if this individual was in prison or has been in prison for another crime or attempting another
crime like this so here's what I can tell you here's what I've learned very recently sell it to us colonel
the DNA stuff let's set that aside for a minute so we know that the DNA was collected from the friend of Dan
Dan not only tells police this guy my old friend resembles the sketch that you're now putting out but he also said
this weird statement to me a month or so before the sketch came out wouldn't it be funny if it looked like one of us now
we have this situation where we learn a little bit about this friend from Dan now Dan is very important and could be
key to this investigation for a couple of reasons one he's saying that my friend
Dan was young of course roughly 17-18-ish let's say around the time of Rosie's murder his friend would have
been 16 at the time so that fits with the sketch of wet pants man who he also Dan is saying this man looks like Dan at
one time dated Amelia the older daughter the 18 year old daughter that was watching the kids that
night and as the captain had talked about on our last episode The ex-boyfriend Dan
was an ex-boyfriend he was somebody who had gone into the Tapia apartment on more than one occasion to meet with his
girlfriend Amelia and when he did he would do that via that same window that the offender came in and abducted
Rosie Tapia but it even gets more deep gets more deep because he says his friend was aware
that he would use this window to climb in and out of the Tapia home right this guy has intimate knowledge of the crime
scene intimate knowledge of the family he looks like the sketch and it's been pointed out to me by the
person close to the investigation that this individual may have only given his DNA swab willingly voluntarily because
he may have been led to believe or was under the assumption at the time that they didn't have DNA evidence in Rosie
tapia's case right or look maybe he's also aware that they do have DNA but it's just partial and so maybe he is one
of these narcissists that's like hey well try your luck with this partial DNA not every criminal's so smart either
most of the time that it's the opposite and maybe he just felt pressured enough that he submitted the DNA just to get
them off of his back right and cross his fingers and hope that he would get lucky
what's difficult though is now we sit here a couple years later and where it sits where the case sits is there is a
100 000 reward in the rosy Tapia case that money is not meant for a witness to come forward after all of these years
who saw something and just forgot it and didn't and decided not to come forward when you put together a substantial
reward like that that tells me that the people putting together the reward believe that there are other people that
are aware of what this person did this money is a nudge this money is encouraged meant to turn on that
individual that you may have been protecting out of fear for all of these years well no I would bet money
of this douchebag is saying things to his friend Dan oh what would it be funny if we looked like the sketch and Dan is
obviously close to the victim in in the sense that he dated the older sibling so
he knows the family so if he's making weird statements to somebody that knows the family knows probably a little bit
about the investigation probably knows a little bit about the crime what other weird comments has he made to other
individuals maybe at a bar when he gets drunk maybe at a party what other weird statements has he made
to other people that weren't connected to the family and weren't connected to the crime
so as far as the DNA goes what we've been told where the kiss case sits now is the DNA collected from the victim is
being sent off for genealogy detection work that the DNA collected from the Barbie
doll is being sent off by the private entity for genealogy detection work those statements came out a while ago so if
there's been any movement or advancement and and guess what I have personal experience and can tell you those are
not fast investigations the genealogy stuff can take six weeks six months 18 months two years it can be a long and
difficult process and you're not always guaranteed results so we don't know exactly where that stands other than
we've been told it's been sent off in both cases by two different entities yeah or sometimes they get results back
that then take more leg work to connect the dots the thing is with the DNA that's collected from the victim and
we've seen this in plenty of other cases too Captain you can usually use those if
it does not have enough markers to fit the criteria for CODIS it likely has enough markers that you
can rule some people out from those 60 that you've collected and you can keep some people in but you can't
conclusively link it to one individual now we talked about early on how there were statements given by police that yes
the FBI is working to put together a profile on the offender but then they've never made that profile if it exists
public so in those cases when able and I think we can hear Captain I like to do what some people think is very arrogant
of me but guess what you go get your own show and you can do what you want on your show this is our show so I got 50
of the same wow I like to put together our own I like to put together our own profile here for you in the garage and
I'm going to use some expert information to piece that together I'll start it off
with the lesser of the experts that would be yours true the colonel now it's been my experience in the cases that
we've reviewed that are similar to Rosie's case that we are usually talking about a
younger offender and it's not terribly uncommon in fact the numbers would suggest that it is more common
that the offender in this type of case has a similar or the same ethnic background as the victim so what I'm
saying here is when you can see and review this case on a map the first thing that jumps off the page is the
person that abducted killed and placed the body and left the body in that canal did not need any means of transportation
other than their own two legs to commit this crime sometimes that's an indicator
that your offender is either too young to drive or of a younger age and does not possess a vehicle of Their Own
now while we don't have the FBI profile to talk about we do have a clinical psychologist Steve Kramer who evaluates
sex offenders for the Utah State Prison System and back in 1995 he gave the following information saying that the
Killer is a quote very impulsive person one who does the first thing that comes into his head without thinking of the
consequences right the statement goes on to say most pedophiles are smooth operators who control their environment
to gain access to Children he may marry a single mother to get at her kids or befriend children at a playground
Rosie's killer is different from this he can't even initiate a conversation he's
probably a withdrawn loner type of person this was a real cowardly act should I get my profile no I spent hours
and hours on my profile well I would like to continue along with some information from Kenneth Lanning book
and we know that Kenneth Lanning was involved he was the special agent from the FBI that was involved early on in
this investigation and I think this gives us a possibly more complete profile picture of our offender from
page 84 of his book love bombs and molesters he states that most child molesters do not abduct their victims in
most offenders who do abduct their victims do not kill them statistics bear this out then if you fast forward to
page 1 14. Kenneth Lanning learned from BSU research that the primary but not the only reason some child molesters use
violence and abduction to control their victims was that they lacked the interpersonal skills to do otherwise to
put it rather simply here captain please do what Landing is stating after his years of expertise in his years in in
working on these types of crimes is that the persons that abduct and kill typically are doing this because they do
not groom they do not have the ability to groom and victimize the victim over a period of time
there's somebody that lacks those skills what's interesting is cross-referencing
that with what Steve Kramer the clinical psychologist for Utah State Prison System back in 95 said that this killer
is very impulsive person he does the first thing that comes into his head without thinking of the consequences and
to me this all goes in line with our composite sketch of wet pants man who was described as 16 to 17 and goes along
with the experiences that we've seen when reviewing these cases here on True Crime garage that this type of case fits
the profile of a younger offender of a local offender likely lived in the complex or very near the complex and
likely did not possess the ability to drive a vehicle legally or have an actual vehicle we're not just making
this stuff up look at the close proximity from where the victim was found to where
she was abducted back in 1995. yeah and the profile I worked on for hours if not
days was this individual it's a giant piece of [ __ ] and I'm convinced I there's just a gut feeling
of mine that that this horrible individual has made weird comments about this case such as I might look like the
sketch wouldn't that be funny those are weird comments so if you have heard somebody that has made weird
comments about this case turn their name into law enforcement and let them do the
due diligence to rule them in or out unless this individual was picked up for a burglary or something else shortly
after 95 I think what we're probably dealing with here like you said Captain somebody
knows something that's 100 because a person that carries out this level of violence a person that carries out this
level of victimization is incapable of controlling themselves they will have and victimize in the future
likely in domestic situations where they will add violence bring violence into their home against their spouse their
children other loved ones so somebody out there very likely knows something remember there is a reward for
up to one hundred thousand dollars in Rosie tapia's case someone somewhere has information that can help solve this
homicide no fact is insignificant no details too small if you have any information please
call 385-258-3313 that number is answered by representatives of the family and not
law enforcement or you can email who killed Rosie gmail.com again this is monitored by Family Representatives
foreign [Music] thank you guys so much for joining us here in the garage and this would be a
great example of a case that could be shared on social media to to spread the word get people talking and maybe we
could make a difference Colonel do we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners we do Captain and
very fittingly so our recommended reading for this week is Lou and JonBenet a legendary Lawman's quest to
solve a child Beauty Queen's Murder by John Wesley Anderson John Wesley Anderson himself is a former homicide
detective turned author after retiring from a 30-year law enforcement career and he was good friends with Lou Smith
and this book is about Lou Smith's investigation into the still surprisingly so still unsolved homicide
of Little John Benet Ramsey make sure you check out Lou and JonBenet by John Wesley Anderson you can find that
recommendation and many more on our recommended page on our website truecrimegarage.com and if you want to
join us live make sure you get a ticket at True Crime garage.com click on the Live Events link and that's how you can
get a ticket hope to see you there and until next week be good be kind and don't litter
[Music] thank you

The Barbie Doll Killer /// Part 2 /// 654

Part 2 of 2

www.TrueCrimeGarage.com

In the middle of the night someone took little Rosie Tapia from her bedroom. Hours later her body was found nearby. Days after the funeral services someone left a Barbie Doll on the girl’s grave. Could this doll hold clues to finding her killer? Rosie’s case is still open and unsolved. The person(s) responsible needs to be held accountable so that this will not happen to another family. There is a substantial reward offered in this case. If you have any information please call 1-385-258-3313 or email whokilledrosie@gmail.com - This phone line and email address are answered and monitored by representatives of Rosie’s family, and not law enforcement. No detail is too small. No fact is insignificant. Someone, somewhere has information that can help solve this crime.

Beer of the Week - Pavement Double India Pale Ale from Foam Brewers

Garage Grade - 4 and a quarter bottle caps out of 5

Recommended Reading - Lou and Jonbenet; a legendary lawman’s quest to solve a child beauty queen’s murder by John Wesley Anderson

Join us @ BrewDog DogTap Columbus located in Canal Winchester, Ohio - Saturday, April 29th, 2023. Ticket information and sales available on our website www.TrueCrimeGarage.com

Brief Summary

The episode discusses the unsolved murder of Rosie Tapia and the ongoing investigation, including DNA evidence and a significant Barbie doll found at her grave.

Key points

The Tragic Case of Rosie Tapia. Six-year-old Rosie Tapia was abducted and murdered, leading to a community in fear.
Barbie Doll Clue. A Barbie doll left at Rosie's grave may hold vital clues to her murder.
The Mystery of the Barbie Doll. A Barbie doll left at a gravesite becomes a key clue in a murder case.
New Sketch Released in 2019. A new sketch based on a neighbor's recollection is released, reigniting the investigation.
DNA Evidence Revealed. Rosie's mother discovers DNA evidence from her daughter's fingernails during a documentary.
The DNA Dilemma. Investigators struggle with DNA evidence that doesn't meet CODIS criteria, complicating the case.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

What are we supposed to do, keep our kids locked up?

Discussion on safety after Rosie's abduction.

4:08WatchMar 8, 2023

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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