The Agreement | Criminal Podcast | Forensic Files

Danny Egipciaco: My name is Danny Egipciaco. I'm from Brooklyn, New York. Phoebe Judge: In 2005, Danny Egipciaco was at work when he got a phone call from a stranger.
The man said he'd gotten Danny's number from a mutual friend, and that he had something
important to talk to him about. They agreed to meet up at a pizza place on New York's Lower East Side.
Danny Egipciaco: I mean, I pulled up to a pizzeria. He jumped in the car and he just pretty much got right to it.
He said, "Listen, I got your number from such and such. And I have a proposition for you."
And I was like, "OK, go ahead." And he just proceeded with basically telling me what the plan was.
Phoebe Judge: The guy's name was Jimmy Burgos. Danny Egipciaco: He was a disgruntled drug courier that was no longer satisfied with
the arrangement he had with his supplier. He was attempting to get his supplier robbed of some drugs.
Phoebe Judge: And what did he want you to do? Danny Egipciaco: He basically was propositioned to me that I get a team of individuals together
to pull this off, basically. Phoebe Judge: Four years earlier, when Danny was 21, he'd been arrested for possession
of cocaine and was sentenced to five years probation. So, he was still under probation when Jimmy called.
But Danny says he was willing to hear him out. Danny Egipciaco: Everything was coming into play as far as my financials at the moment,
you know what I mean? And my safety, and so many things were just playing in my head.
I couldn't just sit there and say, "Tomorrow, yeah, come on, let's go. We can make this happen," or whatever.
Phoebe Judge: Did he say how much he was going to pay you? Danny Egipciaco: Well, he was basically saying that we was going to split whatever came,
half and half. Phoebe Judge: And how much money would that have been? What would that look like?
Danny Egipciaco: It was going to be more than $100,000. Automated Message: This call is from a federal prison.
Phoebe Judge: More than $100,000. That's a lot of money. Danny Egipciaco: Yes, definitely.
And $100,000 is low-balling it because at the end of the day, if it's 10 keys at potentially
wholesale, let's say $20,000 a key, that's over $200,000. So just the potential of the money that was there was the only thing that was even keeping
me like, "OK, maybe this is something that can happen." I don't know. I was open to hearing him out further.
This phone's about to hang up, though. So I've got to — I'll call you back. [Crosstalk.]
Phoebe Judge: Call back as soon as you can, OK? And we lost the call. Because he's in federal prison, Danny can only use a telephone for 15 minutes at a time,
with a one-hour break in between. And when you do talk to him, that automated message bursts in all the time, making sure
you absolutely know that the person calling you is incarcerated. He called us back an hour later and continued the story.
Danny Egipciaco: The next day I went to work, and while I was at work, the next day, he
ended up calling me again on my cell phone. Kind of saying, "Hey, I want to meet up with you again.
Were you able to talk to any of your people?" And I was like, "Yeah, kind of, sort of, but I still
need more information. And I'm working right now." He's just like, "All right, well just meet up with me tonight.
And we could talk some more, or whatever. Maybe bring one of your guys with you or whatever.
And we could talk about it further." Phoebe Judge: They agreed to meet a second time.
And according to Danny, he went to that second meeting just to continue talking it over.
So he was surprised when he showed up and Jimmy said they needed to go rob the cocaine
supplier right then. Danny Egipciaco: And I'm just like, "Wow, this is short notice, basically.
I'm not really prepared. I told you I needed more information." And he just continued to just tell me, "Look, this is an easy thing.
Don't worry about it. Just come through and see the scenery. And it shouldn't be a problem.
Do you have a gun with you now?" There was actually a gun in the car, which was located in a compartment in the backseat.
Phoebe Judge: Jimmy said they needed to drive uptown, and told Danny to park in the parking
lot of a McDonald's on 34th Street. Danny Egipciaco: Well, all along, I'm just saying I'm not committing a crime by going
to see what's going on. In my mind, up until the point that I kick a door down and held a gun to somebody and
take something from them, I'm not committing no crime. So, when I go to meet him at the parking lot, as soon as I parked my car, we was ambushed
by ATF and DEA. And I've been locked up ever since, basically. Phoebe Judge: Danny's car was completely surrounded by various law enforcement officers: the DEA,
the ATF, NYPD, and the State Drug Enforcement Task Force. They'd been waiting for him.
And he was arrested for conspiracy to commit robbery. Katie Tinto: A conspiracy charge is attaching punishment or criminal liability to the agreement
to commit a crime. Phoebe Judge: Katie Tinto is a former public defender who now studies policing at New York's
Cardozo School of Law. Katie Tinto: Obviously we punish you once you commit the crime, right?
You rob something, you steal something, you attack someone. We also punish you if you attempt to do it, right?
You attempt to kill someone. You attempt to do a robbery. Conspiracy is even earlier in the timeline.
If you think about it in that way, is that we then punish you for agreeing and starting
to plan to commit a crime. Phoebe Judge: But what if you changed your mind? Katie Tinto: That's the critique of the conspiracy charge.
That maybe someone is all talk and bravado. Maybe the violence that they say they'd be willing to carry out, actually, the person
wouldn't carry out in real life. When you attach liability earlier in the process, yes, there is some risk that you're getting
people who might not have actually carried these serious crimes through. Phoebe Judge: And in Danny's case, there's this whole other layer of weirdness and complexity.
Danny Egipciaco: It was all imaginary. Phoebe Judge: Not only did Danny not go through with the robbery, there's no way he ever could
have. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. Katie Tinto: First off, the entire plot is imaginary.
So the drugs that are supposedly in the stash house are imaginary. The disgruntled drug courier who wants to rob his dealer is an undercover agent.
And so you have these people who are brought together, by this opportunity that the undercover
agent presents, for something that didn't actually exist before the undercover agent
suggested this crime. Phoebe Judge: Jimmy, acting on behalf of the task force, had made the whole thing up.
And all he had to do was get Danny to agree. It's called a reverse sting or a stash house sting.
Katie Tinto: And that's kind of a shorthand for when the government acts as the person
who sets up the sting, or for example, the seller. As opposed to if an undercover officer is buying drugs from someone.
If he's the seller, that's called a reverse sting. And a stash house is a form of a reverse sting because they're the ones setting all the terms,
right? They set the amount, they set the factors, what you need to do. Phoebe Judge: Did Jimmy ever wear a wire?
Danny Egipciaco: Yeah. There's two conversations that were had inside of the vehicle, were both recorded.
Phoebe Judge: OK. So that's how they could kind of say, "Listen, you were intending to do this."
Danny Egipciaco: Yeah. Basically when at the time, I mean, I'm speaking to what I assumed was a criminal.
So the things that I'm saying to him, the boasting, or the agreement, is just me yes-ing
him in a sense of, I'm not thinking I could literally go to jail just to sit here and
tell this person, "Oh yeah, sure. All right. I'll look into it. Yeah. I'll think about it."
In all reality, I was just trying to get the conversation over with, and be able to go
back to where I was at, and sit with my own thoughts. And really be able to analyze the situation.
And I guess the fact that there was a gun inside of the car made it further seem like
we was prepared to pull this off, had this opportunity been real. Phoebe Judge: Because of the nature of confidential informants, we don't know what Jimmy's instructions
were, or if he was told to target Danny specifically. We can see from court records that Jimmy had been indicted on drug charges of his own,
and appears to have avoided a more substantial prison sentence by agreeing to cooperate with
the government. Katie Tinto: The confidential informant finds people willing to do this, right?
They go out and search for people who are vulnerable to this opportunity. So that makes it a little bit more problematic than a lot of undercover policing where they
hear about a defendant, or a suspect, wanting to do a crime first. Phoebe Judge: Katie Tinto has seen cases in which the confidential informants end up working
really hard to convince their targets to say yes. Katie Tinto: I know of one case where the person started to resist a little, the suspect
seemed to be kind of getting cold feet. And then the undercover agent said, "I'll change the split."
Meaning, "I'll take less of a share of the imaginary drugs and you can have more of it."
So again, making it more of an enticing opportunity. Phoebe Judge: All the informant needs is agreement.
Then, their work is done, and their target is in very big trouble. Before his trial, the prosecution offered Danny a deal: plead guilty and serve 15 years
in federal prison. Danny Egipciaco: I'm like, "I'm going to sign 15 years of my life away for something that
I really never did." I mean, just for having a conversation with somebody, and showing up to a location, and
I'm going to sign away 15 years of my life. I'm like, "No, I'm going to go pick my jury, and I'm going to let the jury find me guilty."
Phoebe Judge: Danny's lawyer wanted him to take the deal. Danny Egipciaco: One of his favorite lines was, "The feds could indict a ham sandwich."
Phoebe Judge: But Danny wanted his day in court. Alida Egipciaco: It was horrible.
I mean, you can only imagine my struggle to keep myself together in the courtroom.
Phoebe Judge: Danny's mother, Alida. Alida Egipciaco: He kept telling me, "Don't worry, mom, nothing is really going to happen
here because this was all a set-up. There were no drugs involved. So they really don't have a case on me."
Phoebe Judge: So he was pretty confident that someone would figure out this was a big mistake.
And it would just be a big mistake. And he would come home. Alida Egipciaco: He was very, very confident that that was the case.
And that's why he decided to go to court, and through the jury system, and all that.
Because he felt very confident that someone was going to see through this. And yes, that he will be released.
Phoebe Judge: At the trial, the prosecution explained to the jury that because Danny was
on probation, he should not have had a gun. And they presented other items found in Danny's car: gloves, the ski mask, and two hats.
The jury deliberated for two hours. Danny was found guilty, and sentenced to 25 years in prison.
You've been in prison now for — Automated Message: This call is from a federal prison.
Phoebe Judge: You've been in prison now for a decade? Danny Egipciaco: Yeah, over 10 years.
Phoebe Judge: He went in at age 25, and he'll come out when he's 50. When you meet new people, how do you explain what happened to Danny?
Alida Egipciaco: When I meet new people, I don't usually talk about my son. I think that's a way of sort of protecting myself, because I find that every time I mention
him, everything keeps coming back. And that affects me a lot. Emotionally, I mean, physically.
I've had to stop driving because I'm very nervous. So I try to put it, I won't say on the back burner, but just out there somewhere, where
it doesn't affect my job and the things that I have to do. Phoebe Judge: Reverse sting cases often carry long prison sentences because the defendant
is charged for the full quantity of the imaginary drugs. And drug charges often have mandatory minimums.
Add a gun or a previous conviction into the mix, and you're looking at a very long time
behind bars. From the government's point of view, what are they hoping to achieve?
Is the whole point here getting dangerous people off the streets, stopping the crime
before it could potentially start? "These people," they say in their heads, "These people might not have committed the crime
yet, but they're on their way to committing the crime. And this way we can stop them before any more harm is done"?
Katie Tinto: Yes, that's the argument. That these are people who, frankly, did agree to commit the crime, right?
They did show up on that last day. They did bring weapons. They were able to find guns, either in their possession already
or through the black market. And so these are people who, because they are legally guilty of offenses — possession
of a gun, conspiracy charges — they deserve to be punished. It's a different question, I think, to say, "Is this how we want to catch criminals?
Is this how we want to punish people? And imprison people?" It's a different type of policing to suggest that we should catch people who are about
to commit crimes, or we know are very close to committing crimes, or will commit crimes.
Versus who can we tempt to commit a crime? Danny Egipciaco: You've got to find yourself a routine, because there's nothing set.
I mean, you wake up, breakfast may be at six o'clock in the morning. And then from there, I personally go to work out.
I got my hour of workout in in the morning. Then I come back and get to my emails, and things of that nature.
You get leisure time, and things of that nature. I mean, three hots and a cot is what they tell you.
That's pretty much the only thing that's guaranteed here. Phoebe Judge: Three meals and a bed.
Danny Egipciaco: Yeah, pretty much. Phoebe Judge: In prison, Danny has spent a lot of his time reading legal books, and trying
to find ways to appeal his case. He also started a website called reversesting.org, where he's collected testimonials from other
men in his situation. Is there anyone else there at your same facility that's been charged with the same thing?
Danny Egipciaco: Actually, I have an individual that I'm a roommate with — I'm in a 12-man
dorm — and one of the individuals that I'm here with is from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
And he just recently received 15 years for the same type of crime. Phoebe Judge: Do you ever think about what if you had gotten kind of a last minute text
message or phone call from your girlfriend saying, "Hey, I need you to come" — I mean,
if something had happened and you hadn't taken that drive? Danny Egipciaco: It is what it is.
Harboring ill will, and sitting here, and stressing myself out about what has happened
is not going to get me anywhere. I continue to fight, I continue to improve myself mentally, physically, spiritually.
And I just continue to make myself a better person, so that when I get out there, I'm
prepared to make better decisions at the end of the day. Phoebe Judge: I would imagine sitting where you are, to dwell on what could have happened
would actually maybe drive you crazy. Danny Egipciaco: I mean, yeah. I mean, a lot of things could drive you crazy.
The fact that I have a niece and a nephew that I've never spent any time with. The fact that I'm not there to help my mother out financially, or to be there
and spend time with my brothers, or my family. And not be able to pursue my dreams.
And there's so many things that I could think about, that could sit here and agitate me,
and drive me crazy. But, I choose not to dwell on that. Phoebe Judge: His mother Alida visits him as much as possible.
And they talk on the phone every single day. Alida Egipciaco: My thing is, God knows why this happened.
Let him be the judge. Let him be the one that decides what's going to happen in Danny's case.
And everybody else's case that was involved. Particularly that C.I. that set him up.
Phoebe Judge: Do you have fantasies ever about the day that he gets out, and what you'll
do on that first day? Alida Egipciaco: Constantly. Constantly, I see him coming in through the door, and that's what I pray God, to let me
live enough to see that day when he walks through this door. And there will be a party that weekend.
Definitely will be a big party. We're looking forward to that. Phoebe Judge: Criminal is produced by Lauren Spohrer and me.
Engineering help from Rob Byers and Russ Henry. Julienne Alexander makes original illustrations for each episode of Criminal.
You can see them at thisiscriminal.com. Criminal is recorded in the studios of North Carolina Public Radio, WUNC.
We're a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX, a collective of the 13 best podcasts around.
Shows like Radio Diaries. Criminal listeners might especially enjoy their episode "Serving 9 to 5," in which they
give tape recorders to prison guards at the Polk Youth Institution here in North Carolina.
It's a fascinating behind-the-scenes look at what it's like to spend so much of your
life behind bars, because that's how you pay your bills. Go listen. Radiotopia from PRX is supported by the Knight Foundation and MailChimp, celebrating creativity,
chaos, and teamwork. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. Jingle: Radiotopia, from PRX.

How does an attempted robbery fall through yet one of the robbers involved in federal prison? In 2005, Danny Egipciaco was supposed to participate in a robbery of a drug supplier’s stash house and make off with $100K–$200K. In the end, the robbery never happened and Danny spent the last ten years in federal prison. How does that happen?

Music in this episode: “Talk Samba” by Boom Boom Beckett “Barbagil” by Boom Boom Beckett “Sentence Ends” by Cahill Locksmith “Ray Gun, Faster Faster Brighter” by Blue Dot Sessions “Black is the Color” by Podington Bear

Criminal is a show about people who’ve done wrong, been wronged, or gotten caught somewhere in the middle. Hosted by Phoebe Judge. Part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. https://link.chtbl.com/n33u0HsA

Say hello on Twitter (@CriminalShow), Instagram (@criminal_podcast), and Facebook https://www.facebook.com/ThisIsCriminal/.

Sign up for our occasional newsletter, The Accomplice https://bit.ly/accomplicenewsletter.

We also make This is Love and Phoebe Reads a Mystery.

Artwork by Julienne Alexander http://www.yssrs.com/.

Check out our online shop https://store.dftba.com/collections/criminal.

Episode transcripts are posted on our website https://thisiscriminal.com/.

Episode [#] originally published [DATE] [link to the specific episode on thisiscriminal.com]

Brief Summary

Danny Egipciaco's conspiracy charge stems from a reverse sting operation, leading to a 25-year prison sentence for a crime he never committed.

Key points

The Proposition. Danny receives a shocking proposition from a disgruntled drug courier.
The Arrest. Danny is ambushed by law enforcement during a planned robbery.
Imaginary Crimes. The entire plot against Danny was fabricated by an undercover agent.
The Long Sentence. Danny is sentenced to 25 years for a crime he never committed.
A Mother's Hope. Alida dreams of the day Danny is released from prison.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

It was all imaginary.

Danny describes the nature of the conspiracy charge against him.

5:44WatchNov 5, 2022

Tension

70/ 100High tension

More from Criminal | A Podcast About Crime

Solve the Crime

Read a real case one clue at a time, then see how your call held up against the investigators.