John Wayne Gacy /// Part 2 | Forensic Files

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[Applause] Welcome to True Crime Garage. Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks
for listening. I'm your host, Nick, and with me as always is a man that all week
he's been calling me the Colonel. Well, he is the captain. >> Well, thanks, Colonel. It's good to be
seen and it's good to see you. Mhm. Smell like chicken. Well, it's shake and bake.
[Music] Tonight we are drinking Mother's Brewing Company's Mil out of Springfield,
Missouri. Milf is a barrelaged imperial stout, 11% ABV. Try some Mother's Brewing Company's Mil Stout today. A big
happy birthday shout out to Saba. Happy birthday. We also want to give a big thanks to Becky in Sandy Springs,
Georgia, and Kristen in Centerville, Georgia. We also have Misty from Lancaster, Ohio, and Ela from Edenberg,
Scotland. And a big we like your jib to Fanny and Sweden. We also have Shawn and
Mike and Hillview, Kentucky. They say our jibs are a cut above the rest. Oh, wip.
And how about Kristen in Hadley, Massachusetts? Kristen says that her jib doesn't drink, but it plays well with
others. >> I don't know if you want to advertise that. >> And last but not least, a big shout out
and thank you to John from Staten Island. John is recommending several beers from the very good people at Yards
Brewing Company. Thank you for everybody for buying us around for this week's show. And if you want to buy us around
for next week's show, go to true crimegar.com and click on the donate button. And if you like to follow us on
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punch a clown and grab a chair and grab a beer. Let's talk some true crime. Thank you, Colonel.
[Music] This is True Crime Garage and this is the case of John Wayne Gasey. [Music]
The Cook County State Attorney's Office tonight denying reports that there is an
investigation underway to find an accomplice to the murders of those 27 people, their bodies found at the home
of John Gasey. Those reports are being spurred by statements of Jeff Rignol, who says Gayy drugged and sexually
molested him at the Gayy home. Gayy himself scheduled to appear tomorrow in court to face the charges in connection
with the Rignall case, but it's doubtful that he will be in court. The ramifications of the mass murder tonight
continue to spread even to people totally unrelated to Gayy, his house, or those he had dealings with. The sad
effects now reaching into Chicago's community of clowns. For hundreds of people in the Chicago
area who used the grease paint, costumes, and antics of a clown, this picture in the Chicago Tribune came as a
shock. It was a publicity picture John Gayy used in his sometime role as an entertainer of children. Now clown
organizations say their image has been damaged with guilt by association. These are members of the clown guild of
metropolitan Chicago. Better known by such names as Snappy, Happy, Wacko, Ho Ho, and Me Too. Pictures show them in
action doing what they love, making youngsters laugh. Even a tiny smile will make their day. Sometimes they are paid
for their work. Often they perform at no charge for charity. But now the first question people ask is, did they know
and work with John Gayy? We have checked uh the national organization which is clowns of America, the Shriner
organization, a number of the organizations within the Chicago area and after checking with these people, we
found that he is not now nor has ever been a member or associated with any of these organizations within this area.
The public might be wondering how they can avoid a person with questionable character coming out to a party. What
would be some of the ways that you could guarantee um the type of people that you're coming out would be reputable? I
believe the main thing would be to uh if they're going to get a clown is to get an organization such as the Vagabond
Clowns or Clowns Metropolitan Chicago, Nairobi Clown Troop, an organization that has a number of members and that
way they can pick from those members. The Clown Guild wanted their story told not because they fear economic loss, but
because of the apprehension they sense from the public. And tonight, they offer insight into John Gayy by analyzing the
way he put on his clown makeup. They say the lines forming his mouth are not rounded, but pointed, giving a harsh,
mean look. Only a true clown could notice that. [Music] All right. Can't make that up, people. That's real
news. >> Let's start off by telling a story that takes place December 11th, 1978 in Dez
Plains, Illinois at a little place called Nissan's Pharmacy. John Wayne Gasey is there and he's busy writing up
a proposal. He has met with the owner to do some remodeling at the pharmacy. He's
taking measurements and shooting the [ __ ] with the owner. And while he's there, he also talks to a handful of the
employees, most of them being young teenagers. Most of the people he speaks with are young females. Uh after the
appointment, John Gayy goes home. On the way home, he realizes that he forgot his
appointment book at the pharmacy. He had he had another appointment that night, so it was important that he retrieved
that book as soon as possible. >> Mhm. Once he got home, he left his black oldsmobile there. And he hopped in his
pickup truck. This is the one with the snow plow on the front of it. And he drove back to the pharmacy and he was
thinking that maybe it wouldn't be a complete waste of a trip if he somehow picked up a, you know, a plow job while
he was out. You know, keep in mind this is winter in Illinois. >> While he is there, he when he pulls up,
he bumps into a young man. This is 15year-old Robert Pest. Now, Rob had seen John Wayne Gasey at the pharmacy
earlier that day, and he had overheard John talking to some of the pharmacy employees, telling them that he was
looking to hire new help and that he started off his employees at $5 an hour. That's $5 an hour for part-time workers.
Now, Rob Pest at the time, he's 15 years old. He's saving up for that magical day
when he turns 16 years old to buy his first vehicle. He's saving up for a Jeep. and he's worked very hard at the
pharmacy. He's making $2.85 an hour. He's asked his boss for a raise and was turned down for such. So, he was
interested in talking to Mr. Gayy about that position. >> Yeah. This doubles his wage.
>> So, as he's outside taking out the trash, now mind you, it's very cold out there. He sees the contractor pull up in
the in the pickup truck. >> He goes up to the window and he says, "Hi, Mr. Gayy. My name is Rob Pest. I've
worked at the pharmacy for quite some time and I heard you're looking to take on some new help. Well, Gayy says,
"Well, I was I was watching you work and you're a pretty busy hard worker. I like
that. You know, while I was there taking my measurements and talking with the with the owner that that's the time when
most of the people would kind of screw around and, you know, they're not under the watchful eye of the owner. So, I
noticed the whole time you kept you stayed busy and you kept working. So, yes, I would like to talk to you about
working for my company. Rob tells Gayy that he should probably get back inside, that he didn't want the owner catching
him while on the clock talking to the contractor about a new job. So, he goes back inside, but before so, Gayy says,
"You know what? How about I wait for you and we can talk after you're done working, and I also have to go inside
and collect my appointment book and take some more measurements anyway." So Gayy
goes back in, says hi to the owner, collects his appointment book. He, you know, messes around for a little bit
inside the store, and then he leaves the pharmacy, and he sits in his truck waiting for Rob Pest. Well, Rob Pest
comes out at the end of his shift. He's talking to Gayy. He says he's very much interested in a position. Um, he
couldn't talk much more about it that night because it was his mother's birthday. His mother was inside the
pharmacy waiting to take Rob home. Well, Gasey says, "You know what? We should probably hash this out tonight. I can't
wait around to to hire the right person. So, how about we talk about the job and
I'll drive you home afterwards." Well, Rob agrees to this. And inside Gayy's truck, John Wayne Gasey explains to the
boy that before we can hire you, you know, we have to fill out some paperwork. We have to fill out the
appropriate tax forms. These these forms are at my home, which it's it's only about 20 minutes away,
>> right? >> And I could drive you home after. I'll have you home in about 45 minutes.
>> No thanks. >> Rob accepts uh the offer. He's hopeful to get the new job. >> Mhm.
>> And now they're back at John Wayne Gasey's home. Now, at this point, Gayy is going to try to welcome the boy into
his home. And we know Gayy's attitude. By this point, he's probably talking a lot about himself, telling Rob how
important he is, telling Rob that he's a registered clown. >> Sounds like somebody else I know.
>> Yeah. And then he offers the kid a beer, telling him that here at PDM, you will
learn that you don't just work hard, but we play hard, too. >> And I can't just hire anyone. I got to
make sure that you are a good fit. Now, young Rob is eager to get home, but he decides that he's willing to play along
and hang out with his potential future boss and maybe even sit and enjoy a beer with him.
>> Mhm. >> Now, Gayy would walk off and he would go into the other room to collect the
necessary paperwork. Now, when he returned, he had the paperwork with him, but he also had a pair of handcuffs.
>> All right, the famous handcuffs. And in a singongy tone, he would say, "I've got
a trick I want to show you." >> A trick I want to show you. John waved the cuffs in front of Rob's face,
showing him that the cuffs are very much real. John then placed the cuff around his left wrist. And with a couple of
clicks, the cuff was secure around his wrist. And then John placed the open cuff around his right wrist. And click,
click, click. Now both cuffs are secure around Gayy's thick wrist in front of his big beer belly.
He pulled the cuffs apart and the chains tightened. Again, he did it, demonstrating that the cuffs are very
real. Then Gayy lifted up both arms and he quickly turned around and almost instantly he turned back around again
facing young Rob, he asked. But now the cuffs were off. He had performed a real magic trick. Rob says, "How the heck did
you do that?" Gasey says, "I can show you, but first, check this out." Gasey hands the handcuffs to Rob. Check them
out. They're real. Rob checks them out, looking for a trick button or some kind of release, but these are real
handcuffs. Rob agrees. These are real handcuffs. Okay. Gayy says, "I'm going to turn around and I want you to put the
cuffs on my wrist behind my back." Rob put the cuffs on Gayy's wrist. Gay spins around again, facing Rob again,
and Gasey's out of the cuffs. "Wow," Rob thought. He's half surprised at the trick, but he's also probably playing
along with this weirdo because he really wanted to get this good job. >> Mhm. >> All right, Gasey says, "You want to know
the trick? The trick is you have to have the key." >> Well, no [ __ ] >> And he says this as if he's pulling the
key out of thin air. Gasey holds out his hand and in it is a small handcuff key.
Look here. I'll show you how to hide the key between your fingers so that no one
can see it. And I'll show you how to slip out of the cuffs very quickly. Let's start off by putting these cuffs
on you. >> Yeah, how about we don't. >> Gayy secured each of the cuffs to the boy's thin wrist.
>> [ __ ] >> John with his thick fingers starts to hand Rob the key and then he quickly
pulls his hand back away from Rob. Stop playing around, John. Give me the key. Rob watched in amazement, and it
appeared as if Gasey's face was transforming. His eyes fluttered and his pupils expanded and became dark. It was
as if Rob was looking at a totally different person. >> Mhm. >> Rob heard Gasey's phone ring. Rob looked
down as he struggled with his arms, trying to get the cuffs to budge, but they wouldn't. And then he hears Gasey's
voice. Well, we better get you home. Let's get you out of those cuffs. I was just playing around. Rob looked up and
there was the old John Gayy again, his big round face smiling. Gayy took the key and he put it in the cuffs and
unlatched them. Rob tells Gayy, "You scared me. That's some trick." The two agreed to collect their things and go,
returning to Rob's home. But before they could walk out the front door, Gasey said, "You know, let me show you one
more thing. You're going to love this." Gasey had a three-foot piece of rope in one hand, and he picked up a wooden
hammer handle with the other hand. "It's just a wooden handle, though. There's no
hammerhead on it." He very quickly tied a series of knots, and he slid the wooden handle through a couple of them.
"Check this out," Gasey said with excitement, and he placed his contraption over the boy's head and
around his neck. Rob asked, "What kind of trick is this?" Gasey twists the handle a few times, and Rob's face
instantly turns beat red. Rob is choking and the handle is wedged firmly against
his back. >> Right. >> Gasey jumps back and away from the boy. Rob falls to the floor and with one hand
he's trying to get his fingers under the rope around his neck and the other hand
is twisted up behind his back as he stretches, reaching trying to grab the wooden handle. Gasey laughed and jumped
about the room as he watched the boy squirm. The more Rob moved, the more he jerked, the tighter the rope got. Rob
would not survive this trick. Gayy's phone rang again. The first time it rang, he had let the machine get it.
This time, Gayy answered. It was Gasey's relative requesting that he go to the hospital because Gasey's elderly uncle's
health had taken a bad turn and he was dying. Gay said he would be there in about an hour. He hung up the phone and
he carried Rob's lifeless body into his bedroom. He stripped the boy and he folded the clothes and placed them in a
bag. He stuffed one or two pieces of clothlike material into Rob's mouth so fluids would not leak out. He went back
out into the main room. He looked around the room and he saw the two beer bottles. He emptied them and he threw
them in the trash. He grabbed Rob's parka, checked the pockets, and found a receipt for film from the pharmacy where
he had picked up Rob. Gasey threw the receipt in the trash and folded up the parka and placed it in the bag with the
clothes. He took a shower, got dressed, and drove to the hospital. And on the way, he threw the bag with Rob's clothes
in it in a Salvation Army clothing dropbox. That night at 11 p.m., Harold Pest with his wife and two children went
to the Dez Plains Police Department and filed the following missing person's report. Robert Jerome Piest, male,
Caucasian, age 15, slender to medium build, brown hair, brown eyes, tan Levis's t-shirt, brown pants, brown
suede shoes, tan parka, last seen in the area, Nissan's pharmacy. >> Well, just a little PSA, right?
>> Mhm. >> If if some uh sloppy guy, right, >> is telling you, "Hey, I got I want to
show you a little trick with some handcuffs, right?" >> Mhm. You say, "Well, first let me show
you a kick. Let me let me show you a crane kick to the grundle." >> Yes, OB. That's what you do.
>> The thing here that I found interesting was that Harold Pest with his wife and
the two children, they went to the police department and filed the missing person's report.
>> Happy happy birthday to your mother. >> But we're talking about 1978. You know,
we've covered lots of cases where we have missing boys in the late 70s, early 80s and they don't really take these
reports very seriously when you call them in because a lot of times these police go to the effort to go out and
look for this person and then they find out that the kid was just out on his own
doing whatever he wanted to do. He was just running late or, you know, decided he was going to take off for a long.
>> But this this one's a little weird because he's leaving work and his mom was at his work
>> and he just never made it home. And I like that they went in there with the whole family, you know, and they're
telling the officer, "No, this kid is missing." You know, Harold explains that the kid has been gone for hours. It's
his wife's birthday. They were celebrating. Rob wouldn't have missed that. And he had even called the
pharmacy to see if Rob would be there. He was not. He spoke to the owner and the owner said, you know, that that it
is possible that Rob might have talked to a contractor or something like that about a job he had heard from the other
kids. Well, he got the phone number for the contractor and Harold had called to ask the contractor about Rob. Well, he
ends up getting the answering machine. Harold left a message on John Wayne Gasey's answering machine very likely
right around the same time that Gasey was attacking the boy. >> But we've all been there. You know what
I mean? >> We We've all been there. No, I mean, we've been all been in Rob's shoes on
the idea that, you know, let's say you're talking to somebody about a job. >> Oh, well, we'll just sit down and have a
chat. And then you realize the conversation is not going to be about the job. >> Yeah.
>> It's going to be And then you just sit there like, "Okay, what the hell am I still doing here? Just
>> please let me leave. This is >> Is this guy looking for a friend or to hire me?"
>> Right. Yeah. I think I also think when you're about that age, you know, the the
14 to 16 17 year old boy age >> Mhm. >> I think you know the you definitely get the creep factor by certain guys.
>> You do. You do. Um but I also think that when you see at that age when you see a
successful adult, you have this opinion of them without even knowing them that they're some kind of upstanding person.
Um the next morning the police call John Wayne Gasey's home. They speak with him
because he's at home hosting a meeting amongst other businessmen that he's, you know, working out some jobs or details
of an upcoming job. >> And Gayy basically says, you know, I don't Yeah, I was at the pharmacy. I was
there for a job. Um I didn't remember talking to any boys. Um I talked to some of the teenage girls that were there. I
might have maybe a boy asked me about some shelving in the back or something like that. He goes, you know, he he
comes off like he's trying to be helpful, but he's not providing any information. He's not seen the boy that
they're talking about. >> Well, that that evening, uh, Gayy takes the body of Rob Pest. He loads it into
his 79 Oldsmobile Delta 88 and he drives it to I to the I-55 bridge over top of the Dez Plains River.
>> Okay. And Gayy gets out of the vehicle. He opens up the trunk. He hoists the boy's body up into his arms and he
tossed the body into the river. >> The the plus size model was good at shot foot.
>> Well, after the officer learns the name of the contractor, he decides that there's some kind of evidence. There's
enough evidence after talking to people at the pharmacy that there's a good chance that this John Wayne Gayy
character probably talked to the boy and for whatever reason he's not, you know,
admitting to that, telling us the truth >> or he doesn't remember doing so. So, he
decides to run a background check on Gayy the next day. >> Oh, imagine that. >> Yeah. And he was surprised to find that
Gayy had served time for committing sodomy on a teenager years earlier. Soon after the discovery, well, the officer
worked very hard to obtain a search warrant for John Gasey's house. It was there that he believed that he would
find Robert PS. >> So, once they get the search warrant, they're going to search
the Pogo's Pogo the clown's house. >> Pogo's Playhouse. >> Oh, god. >> Um, yeah. So, Gayy was not home at the
time of the search. And so, they conducted their investigation. They went into the home and they're looking for
items to point to whether Rob Pest was at the home or if he's still there. Now, they don't find Rob Pest there. Some of
the items that they found that were confiscated from Gasey's home were the following. A jewelry box containing two
driver's license. >> Uh neither of them Gasey's. They also found a couple of rings. Um one of them
it include an engravement on it. And this was from the Maine West High School class of 1975 with the initials JS on
it. They found a box containing marijuana and rolling papers, seven pornographic movies,
>> marijuana, >> pills including volume, a switchblade knife, a stained section of rug,
>> color photographs ofarmacies and drugstores, an address book, a scale, books about by and gay lifestyles, a
pair of handcuffs with keys, >> a nylon rope, a 3-ft long wooden handle with two holes drilled in, each end of
it. A small starter pistol with with uh gun caps, basically like like blanks. Uh
they also found police badges, some sex toys, a hypodermic syringe, and an unlabeled small brown bottle. They found
clothing that was way too small for John Wayne Gayy. And they found a receipt for
a roll of film with a serial number on it. And this was from Nissan's pharmacy. Three automobiles belonging to Gayy were
also confiscated. >> Jesus, guy's a baller. >> Including the pickup truck that we
discussed earlier. It's >> that plus-size model money. >> As well as his 79 Oldsmobile and a van
with PDM contractors on its side. Now, within the trunk of the car, they found some pieces of hair.
>> Uhhuh. >> I'd like to talk about the receipt that was found, right? right? You know,
there's >> so we should assume that that was the receipt of the boys. >> Well, that's that's what their thought
is. So, their the police their thought is, you know, this comes from Nissan's pharmacy.
>> This is where uh the boy was. However, Gayy was there, too. So, we can't prove
that this receipt belonged to the boy. You know, Gasey could have bought film at some point at the pharmacy. So what
they do is they take the receipt and they go back to the pharmacy and they start discussing this receipt with a
bunch of the employees. Well, they talk with one employee and her name is Kim Buyers. She's a cashier there. She's a
teenage girl. Well, Rob Pest was was a pretty popular kid. I mean, he was very wellliked by everyone. He was
good-looking kid. Uh I think he, you know, he was he was a kid that the the the girls kind of chased at high school
a little bit. >> Sounds a little bit like the Colonel. Nothing like the curdle. Anyway, they're
talking to these different employees and this Kim buyer says, "You know what? That night was a particularly cold night
and the door here I'm, you know, the cashier is up by the door usually." >> And every time the door would open, all
that cold air would rush in. So Rob being a nice guy, he offers to let her borrow his parka, his jacket.
>> That's a gentleman. >> Yeah. He says, "That's a gentleman. That's how it's done." Instead of
standing up here and shivering your butt off, you know, here, wear this parka and
you'll be warm for the evening. >> Let me keep your butt warm is what he said. >> Well, Kim Buyers, she had a bit of a
crush on Rob. So, she had purchased some film from Nissan's pharmacy, and she purposely put the receipt in the jacket
pocket because she thought, you know what, he'll find the receipt. He'll know that I left it in there by quote unquote
mistake, and he'll he'll come and Yeah. He'll come and talk to me >> and maybe >> that's a smart move.
>> And maybe he'll ask me about the film. Maybe he'll ask me, you know, what what
am I am I into photography or whatever. >> And so it's >> do you want me to take your picture?
>> It's there that the police learn that there is no way that that receipt could
have ended up in Gayy's home unless Rob Pest and his parka were at Gasey's home at some point that evening, which this
is going to give him probable cause to do another search, maybe a more in-depth search. And also, so let's get to that
and let's get to the surveillance of John Wayne Gasey right after this quick beer break.
All right, we're back. Big cheers to Dom over in England driving the bus. Cheers
to you, mate. John Wayne Gasey was called into the police department and he was told of the articles that they had
confiscated. Now Gasey was enraged and he immediately contacted his lawyer. The police basically had nothing to arrest
him on and they eventually had to release him after some more questioning about the PS boy's disappearance. Gayy
was put under 24-hour surveillance. And if anybody knows anything about this 24-hour surveillance that John Wayne
Gasey was on, >> uh, it's it's I hate to make light of a of a terrible situation, but it's the
stuff that it's a comedy to me, right, Captain? I mean, >> I don't know what you're talking about.
>> Gayy would he would he would purposely, you know, drive fast so he could lose
them. He knew he knew he was under surveillance. M >> um he would he would lose them. And uh
there were other times where he would tell them, you know, I know you guys are having trouble keeping up with me. So if
if you if you can't keep up, I'll be at this place in a half an hour. Just meet me there. And then he would drive off
and lose them. And sure enough, he would be where he said he was going to be a half an hour later. One of the times
that he lost that he lost him, uh, they called the the airport because they were
worried that Gasey would fly out of the country and leave this situation that's going on. Because by this point, you
know, they're convinced that they're going to find the PS boy either at his home somewhere or that he had done
something with the boy. Now, they they call the airport and put his name on some kind of list. And it turns out they
find him. He's two blocks away from his house. He's he's looking at Christmas trees at at a lot somewhere, right?
>> You know, and there was one situation. >> What's happening? >> One situation, the the police car breaks
down and these are unmarked police cars. >> But the police car breaks down and Gayy
stops his vehicle. He gets out and he goes up to the officers and he says, you know, what's the problem with the car?
Said the car broke down. He said, "Okay, well, uh, since, you know, why don't I just give you guys a a lift? You can
ride with me u for the remainder of the day until you get a new car." >> Right. What's fascinating to me is you're under
surveillance, uh, for this missing teenage boy, and the cops at this point are probably assuming that this teenage
boy is dead. >> Mhm. >> And And you're just going about your business, you know, just buying
Christmas trees. >> Yeah. Nothing's happening. >> Yeah. And the other thing that's going
on here, remember we talked about that one ring that was found in Gayy's home. And they end up believing it had the
initials JAS on it. They believe that the the ring could have belonged to a guy by the name of John Sik. This is
somebody we talked about yesterday. Um the situation here is they also discovered that three former employees
of Gasey's have also mysteriously disappeared. Now, the problem with this situation is these cases were reported
in Chicago. They weren't reported to the Dez Plains Police Department. Remember,
the Pest family went to the Dez Plains Police Department to to let them know that Rob was missing,
>> right? >> And it wasn't until then that a Dez Pelain's police officer ran a background
check. >> Say that three times fast. >> Yeah, I couldn't I couldn't say it once.
um they run the background check and they see that Gayy, you know, he has this sodomy charge.
>> Had the Chicago police ran his background check with these other missing people and some of these cases
they were, it was believed the last person who had seen them was Gayy. U we might have been able to cut this list a
little shorter. So, they don't have the evidence, but now they think that Gayy could be responsible for the murder of
anywhere between one to four persons. The thing here is after they searched his home, they called in some of his
friends. Now, these were I say friends, but they're also people that worked for John Wayne Gasey.
>> And two of the people that they talked to, and we mentioned these names yesterday, is David Cra and Mike Rossi.
Um, remember we had the discussion, we wondered if they were the same person, just using different names. You know,
sometimes when they tell these stories, they make up fake names to >> uh for potential victims to to hide
their ident, >> but the jury's out and they are >> they're different people. >> All right.
>> And the reason why the reason why I got confused was they had similar stories.
They both worked for John Wayne Gasey. Uh they both told police that at one time or another they had done projects
for Gayy at his home. And this included digging trenches in the crawl space as well as lifting up floorboards and
digging trenches under there. Uh they had also >> I'm glad the colonel figured it all out.
>> They had also poured concrete for him. Um remember Michael Rossi was the boy that was driving the missing guy's
vehicle, >> right? Um, and David Cra, now David Cra, he was with John Wayne Gasey the night
that Gayy returned to his home after the first search was conducted and he walked
roomto room with John Wayne Gasey as he inspected the things that the the police
may have taken and what they looked through. >> Right. And during this interrogation
process with the police, David Cra tells them that Gayy the first place he went to in the home after you guys searched
it was the crawl space where I had dug those trenches before. >> Right. So at some point we need to check
that crawl space. >> Yeah, that's exactly what the police want to do. They want to get in that
crawl space. They they didn't dig around in there the first time. Now, the police
also make a lot of statements about saying like you were saying, he John Wayne Gayy's giving us rides. You know,
our car is breaking down and he would just kind of stop by and talk to us and I think even took him out to dinner and
and and a few odd things like that. And the police had to keep reminding themselves like, yeah, this guy's a very
charming guy and he seems like on the surface just completely innocent, but there's all these there's all this
evidence leading to the fact that he's not. >> Mhm. >> So, they had to keep reminding
themselves, we're police officers, you know, we have to keep doing our job. >> Yeah. And the police now, they're
becoming frustrated because this surveillance that they're conducting, they're kind of looking like like fools
in this whole situation because it it's like I said, it's comical. Um, so >> we'll talk about the fish dinner, right?
So, do you know much about this? >> I I know just a little bit about it. You're talking about when he invites the
the guys, the officers that are surveilling him, >> right? There's Right. >> They're out front of his house.
>> Yeah. And he's at this point he he knows he's under surveillance. He's already
talked to the cops multiple times, but he cooks them a fish dinner. >> Mhm. >> Right. So, they're like, "Okay, well,
we'll go in the house." Now, this is after they searched already, >> right? >> But as they're eating the fish dinner,
because, you know, the fish has, you know, >> an odor, >> a odor, I think, because there was a a
secondary odor. >> Mhm. >> It really drew their attention to the odor in the house.
>> Yeah. And and as they're eating this fish dinner, they're going, "Something stinks in here."
>> Yeah. >> And it's not the fish. >> Yeah. And I think one of the officers said that it wasn't something that they
outwardly noticed immediately, but it was one of those situations where as the longer they sat in the home, every time
the furnace would kick on and start blowing that hot air around that they would notice this this foul stench.
>> Yeah. This funk. So the police they are frustrated due to the lack of evidence
uh that they've collected regarding the disappearance of Robert Pest. >> Uh they decide to arrest Gayy on
possession of marijuana and Valium. Uh during this time during this arrest now Gayy is awaiting action on some other
charges. Remember yesterday we talked about Jeff Ringnol. Now, this guy, he is the one that was abducted by Gayy and he
went and he he went to the area that he was taken from and he was looking for the vehicle that that he had gotten
into, >> right? >> And he found the vehicle and he wrote down the license plate. Well, he took
that plate to the the police and once he got their John Wayne Gasey's name from them, he filed sexual assault charges
against him. >> Good for him. So, at this time, unbeknownst to the investigators, we
have this this other charge, this sexual assault charge, >> right? So, they they have him in custody
>> and they're going to keep doing more searches, but then what comes from that?
>> Well, they they're also interrogating Gayy at this point, and he's already lawyered up.
>> What the cops don't know is that Gayy has already confessed to his attorneys.
>> Okay. Well, the attorneys think that he's suicidal because during these confessions, he's telling his attorneys,
you know, for many years, I've been the judge, jury, and executioner of many, >> and I'm going to be the judge, jury, and
executioner of myself. >> Okay? >> So, the attorneys believe him to be suicidal, and they want to put him in
the hospital. This ends up leading to more police interrogations with Mr. Gayy. During these interrogations, Gayy
starts confessing to murder. He does state that he had killed someone, but it had in fact been in self-defense,
>> of course, >> and that he had buried the body underneath the the garage. Well, they've
not started digging yet. Uh but this guy still wants to talk >> and he starts telling them, you know,
>> this is something that's happened more than once. Um, I've I've And they start
really digging on him now because he he they suspect him of as many as four. That's all they were expecting to hear
about was four. And at some point, >> homie, that's a lot. >> He starts saying, well, he starts saying
it's probably more like 30 people. >> Jesus. >> Uh, and he states that he buried most of
the remains in the victim of the victims beneath the crawl space of his home. Uh,
I want to take you through these confessions here a little bit. Okay. All right.
>> Um, the first confession, it takes place, he says that this took place in uh 71 or 72.
>> Well, it's a little strange though that you showed up to the garage today, full
clown makeup. >> That's my normal get up nowadays. >> Um, he he says that this murder took
place in 71 or 72. I believe it was in in the month of January. He said that he picked up a boy at a bus station and
they decided to drive around, smoke some pot. they were going to go back to his place, eat some food, you know, have
lots of drinks, and >> he had he had a couple magic tricks to show him >> and and just party. And he said that
they then engaged in consensual sex. He says that he woke up the next morning to find the boy, the young man, standing
in the doorway of his bedroom holding a knife that the guy had taken from Gasey's kitchen.
>> Mhm. He says that the guy tries to attack Gayy and Gayy defending himself gets the knife from the guy and he
stabbed him several times killing the guy. >> This is the guy that he buried in the
garage. It was a boy. >> Okay. >> The other situation is he starts talking about um remember we had uh Bukovich his
his employee >> old Bkovich. Well, remember they had the dispute about the money.
>> Um, he tells a story that he decides to when when Buckovich and his buddies come
over to try to collect the money. >> That he said, "You know what? I'll pay you as soon as I can." Uh, we ain't got
nothing to do. Why don't we, you know, drink some booze, some beers, hang out and party? He said they partied all
night long. And he's not sure what happened, but when he woke up the next morning, there was a dead boy. YOLO with
pogo >> on his floor. >> Um, so he had to get rid of it. >> This is Yeah. Odd stories from John Wayne Gayy.
Yeah. So, those are his stories about why they might find some dead bodies in his home. On the first day that the
police begin their digging, they find two bodies. One of the bodies is that of John Buckovich, uh, who was buried
underneath the garage. I believe in this situation, Ga Gay even like put an X on
the floor and said, you know, dig here, >> right? >> Um, he was going to kind of lead them to
some of the bodies. The other body that they found was in the crawl space. As the days passed, the body count grew
higher. Some of the victims were found in with their underwear still stuffed lodged deep in their throats. Other
victims were buried so close together that the police believed that they were probably killed or buried at the same
time. The police had removed a total of 27 bodies from Gasey's home. >> Jesus. >> They also started finding bodies in the
Dez Plains River. Four in total. One of the bodies found in the river. Well, they could easily link that body to
Gasey because that man's identification was one of the IDs found in Gayy's home.
>> Right. Right. Right. One of the victims found in the river was unidentified, but
he had Tim Lee tattooed on one of his arms. A friend of the victim's father had recognized the Tim Lee tattoo while
reading a newspaper story about the discovery of the body in the river. >> The victim's name was Timothy Aor. Now,
uh, he was such a fan of Bruce Lee that he took Lee's last name and he added it to his first name to make the tattoo on
his arm. >> So, it was just a really bad idea for a tattoo, but glad that they identified him.
>> Soon after the discovery of all of these bodies, the house was destroyed. Um, it
was basically reduced to rubble. Um, unfortunately among the 32 bodies that were discovered, that of Robert PS was
still unaccounted for. Pest was still missing. Finally, in April of 1970, the remains of Robert Pest were discovered
in the Illinois River. His body had been lodged somewhere along the river, making
it difficult to find this body. And at some point, it must have become dislodged and carried the corpse to the
Dresden Dam, where it was eventually discovered. >> Go with me on this theory, though.
Right. So, the first guy he talks about, we already know about the guy that he picked up in Chicago, right? The one
that he he he raped. >> The guy that got away. >> The guy that got away. >> Now, think about Gayy's first story.
There's some things that make sense here. Yeah. You You picked up a a boy. You sexually assaulted him. You raped
him. >> Mhm. >> He wasn't dead. And when that boy comes too, that boy grabbed a knife and decided he's going
to kill the bastard that did this to him. >> I see. I see what you're saying. There's
there might be some truth to what went down. And actually, one of the bodies that was found uh in his home, they
believe that. Now, keep in mind, a lot of these people were very decomposed by the time they find them. But this person
had uh evidence of having been stabbed to death. you know, where you have the the markings on the ribs uh from the
from the knife. >> Yeah. So, I mean, maybe there's some validity there. I would suspect myself
that John Wayne Gasey probably killed in Iowa. >> Um it's it's possible. Um the other
thing here too is when Gayy was confessing, he said that, you know, I killed about 30 people. He he estimated
that there might be about 30 people in his home that they would find. and he said that I threw the last five bodies
in the river. Well, they only ever recovered >> four >> four bodies. Um, you know, and then we
know how many they found at his home, but there still could be that missing victim out there from when he was in
Chicago. >> Police have a lot of bodies to work with here, and they're going to start using
dental records and other clues to help identify the victims who were found on Gayy's property. All but nine of the
victims were finally identified. >> Oh, that's still a lot of people. Yeah. And even though their searches had
ended, we have a trial to deal with regarding John Wayne Gasey. In February of 1980, Gasey's murder trial began in
Cook County, Illinois. Jury members consisted of five women and seven men. Uh there was a change of venue requested
and what ended up happening was they did not grant the change of venue. Instead,
the judge decided that he would select jurors from another city and have them bust in.
>> Very odd. It's just like Casey Anthony. >> Yeah, that that was one of the weird
coincidences that we came across. And he chose the the city of Rockford, which another coincidence, was 90 miles away,
almost the exact same distance as chosen in the Casey Anthony case. Mhm. >> Um the defense is going to say that John
Wayne Gasey is not guilty by reason of insanity. Uh three psychiatric experts appearing for the defense at Gayy's
trial testified that they found Gayy to be a paranoid schizophrenic with multiple personality disorder.
>> Now, I want to talk about this for a little bit because during some of his confessions, Gayy kept bringing up
another name and this name was Jack Hanley. He said that Jack Hanley had committed some of the murders and he
even gave a full personality profile of Mr. Jack Hanley >> now. But it was very clear to the people
that he was talking with that Gayy was talking about himself. He was >> Jack Hanley is himself.
>> Jack Hanley is another version of John Wayne Gasey. >> Mhm. During the opening statements, uh
they presented evidence uh by the prosecution that left a stunning impression on the jurors and the
courtroom spectators. Many of them saying that they had learned some of the details of Gasey's killings for the very
first time. Uh Gasey's defense lawyers stated that Gasey's actions were irrational and impulsive and that he was
insane and no longer in control of his conduct. The prosecution brought its first witness to the stand. This is
Marco Buckovich, uh the father of John Buckovich. >> Mhm. >> He was the first witness of many that
included the family and friends of the murdered victims. Some of the eyewitnesses broke down into tears on
the bench. Following the friends and family of the victims came the testimony of those who worked for Gayy who
survived strange sexual encounters with him uh with their boss. Some of his ex- employees told of his mood swings and
how he would trick them into being handcuffed. Others told how he constantly made passes at them while he
was at work. >> And in typical fashion, the prosecution is going to come out and say, "Well, we
found him to be sane." >> Yes. His their experts say that John Wayne Gasey is a sane man. Um very much
to the surprise of everyone in the courtroom when the defense started their case. The first witness that they called
was Jeff Rignol. Remember, this was the person that was abducted by John Wayne Gasey, right?
>> Um it was expected that he would have been called to testify on behalf of the
prosecution. However, uh Rnall had previously mentioned his encounter with Gayy in a book and the prosecution
believed that it would damage their case if they took him on as a witness. So, they didn't call him. Gasey's defense
asked Rignol while on the stand if he thought that Gasey was able to control himself. And Jeff did not believe so,
considering the savagy savagery of Gasey's attack. >> Right. Right. Right. Test.
>> But you know, John Wayne Gasey talks about this later in life too that if you're going to say that somebody like
for somebody to do what he did, if you're going to try to say that that's sane >> Mhm. then you don't want to be on the
same side of the fence as as that person. >> Yeah. >> And and I and I think there's some
validity to that. I mean, if you're capable of murdering this many people and burying them in your crawl space,
you're crazy, right? >> You know what I mean? So, but the the problem with our our our system is that
we we make that lenient if the person was insane. >> Mhm. >> And it should not be. It should be, "No,
we we do think you're crazy, but you know, you're going away forever." >> Well, and what the prosecution was
trying to do was they were trying to point out the clear difference to the jury between the difference of being
abnormal and and insane. You know, they're saying Gayy is not your normal dude. Uh but he's not he's not legally
insane. We must hold him accountable for his actions. Um now Jeff Ricknall he did
not test his testimony did not last very long because while on the stand he broke
down while telling the court the details of his rape. Uh Rnall was so stressed out that he began to vomit and cry
hysterically and he was eventually removed from the courtroom. Now in an effort to prove Gasey's insanity,
friends and family of Gasey's were called to the stand. Gayy's mother told how her husband abused Gasey on several
occasions. At one time whipping him with a leather strap. >> Yeah. Well, that's the razor the razor
belt we talked about. >> Mhm. And Gayy's sisters told a similar story of how she repeatedly witnessed
her brother being verbally abused by their father. >> Yeah. But that's that's no excuse. You
know, you become 18 years old, you're you're responsible for your actions. Well, after the court proceedings were
over, uh, it only took two hours of deliberation for the jury to come back with its verdict. They found John Wayne.
>> Well, that's after one hour of eating and 1 hour of a coffee break. >> They found John Wayne Gayy guilty. Gasey
was found guilty in the deaths of 33 young men. And as one of the people in the court stated that he had the
singular notoriety of having been convicted of more murders than anyone else in American history and Gayy
received the death penalty. >> Right. And it's strange to me uh talk about a mom being an enabler which we
talked about in the Casey Anthony case. >> John Wayne Gasey's mom still never believed that he was guilty of the
crimes. >> Right. Um, and I wonder how much of that is that she believes that her son was
insane. >> Okay. >> You know, that he was not guilty by reason of insanity. >> Well, diving into the sick, twisted mind
of uh John Wayne Gayy, we we actually when we had an apartment together, we actually remember those documentaries
they started coming out with, not documentaries, but reenactments, I guess. >> Yeah. They would do a movie of like a
serial killer. >> Yeah. Dmer and I think we watched Dmer together. And I think we watched and I
think we watched uh Gayy together too. >> Did Gasey had the the the big guy that
played in um >> Peewee Herman's Playhouse? >> Yeah, he was uh uh Buckton. I can't
remember his first name, but uh Francis Buckton, the guy that paid to have the bicycle stolen.
>> And >> yeah, >> he was also the he played center for the basketball team on Teen Wolf.
>> Oh yeah, great movie. >> Wonderful movie. >> But great actor though. underrated cuz
if you watch that I I'd recommend it as far as entertainment if you if you're into this thing and you kind of want to
get a glimpse into maybe what some of the visual of you know with the Pogo the clown and all that stuff. It was an
interesting movie and I think he did a great job you know uh Francis did a great job acting the part. Uh it's not
very factual. I actually rewatched it while you know preparing for the show. >> Okay.
>> It's not that factual. There's a lot of stuff that they kind of miss on. >> Um, and I think that, you know,
Hollywood up, but it is we I think we watched that when we had an apartment together. But something that I thought
was really interesting going back over this and something that I've kind of never thought about too
much or never really made my ears perk up is this idea that you know normally it's like okay John Wayne Gasey saying
well okay so h there was this other guy and then we start thinking that well maybe that's split personality
but when he starts talking later in life before, you know, his death, he's going
to start talking about other people involved. >> Yeah. >> And other accompllices. And every time
that he's like talked about it in the past, I never really put much weight into that.
>> Mhm. >> Yeah. During the 80s, during his time in prison, he starts bringing up, you know,
that there were other people that helped me with these killings. You know, there
there were two or I think at sometimes he's he's quoted as saying there were two people that helped him. Uh other
times I believe he said as many as three people that had >> no I think I think the total not I think
uh one of the interviews I watched he said four. >> Okay. >> And during that interview he actually
named name names. Now again never put much weight to this until you know one of the accusers talks about that well it
wasn't just John Wayne Gasey there was another guy there. >> Yeah. Jeff Rignol. Uh he was the one
that was abducted and got away. And he would later state that he believed that there was another man present at Gayy's
home that night that he was attacked. >> Right? Which starts making you think, well, there's some validity. And if you
listen to the trailer, we we talked about how police work saying, well, we're denying that we're looking for
accompllices. But there seems to be like there was some evidence to point that there might
have been during some of the attacks. And I would just argue to say this is a guy that was throwing these huge parties
watching these stag films and also these big parties where they're doing, you know, orgies.
>> Mhm. >> And I'm I'm there obviously there's a big stretch from going to that to having
somebody be a compliment of murder, but I'm just saying what kind of what kind of people what
kind of sick people was he running with? And I think we should play this news clip because I think it will explain the
situation in better detail than what we can. [Music] >> Larry, >> he was known as the killer clown. John
Wayne Gasey murdered 33 young men and was executed in 1993. But we're learning the Gayy story may not be over. New
details of the investigation have only recently come to light and may show Gayy didn't act alone. 33 years after his
arrest, there are still lingering questions about John Wayne Gayy. Terry Sullivan was on the prosecution team.
>> I felt that from the beginning that uh that there may be loose ends. It was such a huge case and especially at the
time. >> The idea of a Gayy accomplice was raised from the beginning by Jeffrey Rignnull.
He is one of the few people who survived Gayy's attack. He said another man was at Gasey's home the night Gayy raped
him. Attorneys Robert Stevenson and Steve Becker have been trying to help families of victims find answers.
They've been getting tips from the public and they've uncovered information that they say shows someone else may
have been involved in some of the killings. >> There is significant evidence out there
that suggests that not only did John Wayne Gasey not operate alone, may not have been involved in some of the the
murders and the fact that he was largely a copycat killer. For this story, we're
focusing on two of Gayy's victims, Russell Nelson and Robert Gilroy. September 15th, 1977.
Gilroy sends a letter to his girlfriend from a mailbox not far from Gasey's home. Then at 6:00 p.m. that same day,
Gilroy is supposed to meet other kids at a bus stop for a trip to equestrian school, but he never shows up. He was
never seen again. But according to Gasey's receipts in court records, Gasey's plane ticket
shows he flew to Pennsylvania September 12th and didn't return until the night of the 16th, the day after Gilroy was
last seen alive. Could someone have been helping Gayy? Listen to this recording of a phone conversation between Gayy in
prison and a friend in Chicago. >> Well, I wasn't even in Illinois when 16 of these so-called individuals
disappeared. A month later, October 1977, Russell Nelson disappears. According to
testimony from his mother, Russell went to a disco on North Broadway with a friend who was several years older. The
friend called the family to say Nelson just disappeared outside the disco and that he would look for him if they'd
send money. He called me two or three times a week and threatened me for money. He said he was staying down here
to look for my son. Russell Nelson's brothers went to Chicago to look for Russell and met with
the friend who was asking their mother to send money to help search for Russell. The friend offered Russell's
brothers a job with John Wayne Gasey. Russell Nelson's sister-in-law recently told us the family is anxious for
answers. >> I would like to have if anybody else is involved in it justice for what they
have done to him or it could have been somebody else out there. >> And another possible connection to Gayy.
It turns out a few months before Russell Nelson disappeared, Gayy did work at a drugstore just blocks from where the
friend lived. >> I think it tells us that John Wayne Gasey was using other individuals to
procure young boys over state lines. >> According to Becker and Stevenson, the friend is still alive and now living in
another state. >> If in fact Gayy um had other accompllices or people who knew something that was going on, uh those
people should be be brought to justice. It's scary in and of itself that there may be others out there. There's
something else mysterious about the cases of Robert Gilroy and Russell Nelson. While Gasey was known to use a
rope and board to strangle his victims. The autopsy reports for Gilroy and Nelson show they died from asphixxiation
from suffocation, not strangulation. The report says that each had cloth in their
mouths. >> They claimed that I strangled each and every one of them. Liure strangulation.
Put a rope around their neck and strangle them after they were handcuffed. If that's so, then how come the autopsy
reports don't match that, which tells you there had to be more than one person. >> In fact, 13 victims were listed as
suffocation. Another serial killer case may offer insight to Gayy's mode of operation. In Terry Sullivan's book,
Killer Clown, a detective asked Gayy where he got the idea for the torture board. Gayy replies, "From Elmer Wayne
Henley." Henley and another boy helped serial killer Dean Coral, whose case has a lot of similarities with Gayy. Coral
abducted, raped, tortured, and murdered 28 boys, mostly teenagers, in the early 1970s in Houston. He often used
handcuffs, and strangled his victims. >> They do follow Coral's mode of operation
almost identically. And one of the most significant parts about Coral is that he
used two much younger individuals to assist him in gathering up and and luring in his victims.
>> Nothing as far as killing or recruiting or or bringing. We we had no evidence.
We thought about it, but we just never saw any evidence. >> Gasey's defense lawyer, Sam Emiranti,
says he doesn't believe any of it. He says Gayy confessed to everything early on and after years in prison, began to
change his story. >> I uh used to talk to Gayy about uh maybe somebody else uh committed the offense.
Maybe Gayy was in some sort of stuper or drug state or alcohol state and didn't know what was going on around him. And
uh we sort of uh would plant a seed in John's brain as to what happened. He would look at us say, you know, maybe,
you know, maybe you're right. Maybe that's really what happened. >> Becker and Stevenson will be taking
their case to law enforcement. >> These individuals did end up in Gasey's crawl space. So, we're just looking to
find out the the whole truth about these cases and we follow these leads to this
point. >> If these individuals were waking uh working with John Wayne Gasey to procure
young boys, they should be held to justice. The scope of the Gayy case is as complex as it is disturbing. And
after three decades, there are still questions that haunt investigators as well as the families of victims still
looking for answers. >> All right. Thank you, Larry. >> So, what do you think about everything
that uh they were reporting on there regarding these the you know, the two victims that they talked about? You
know, Gasey's might have been gone during one of the, you know, off in Pennsylvania.
>> Yeah. I don't know how much, you know, I got a plane ticket, so that proves I was here. Nah, you don't have
anybody that saw you. >> Not only that, he could have the boy could have ended up at his house the
next day once he got home. >> Yeah. The the reason why I feel that there is some validity to this is one,
they investigated it. the prosecution thought there there was maybe some ties and the fact that there was, you know, a
victim >> that talked about it and and so that makes it to me a lot more like a situation with like the Johnny Gosh type
thing >> where it's like, well, here's this guy that was predominant and and trying to
raise his social status and he was around people that had social status and was there some kind of weird weird sex
ring going on. I don't know. I I think there is some evidence to to to show that.
>> Well, and I'll tell you what, I'm going to kind of present the thing from both
sides of the fence here on on the potential case that there was an accomplice or accompllices.
Um, the thing is we have a couple of guys that work for John Wayne Gayy that knew he was a weirdo. They said, you
know, he tricked me into handcuffs and he came on to me and he did all this weird stuff. He would have these weird
parties, but I also, even though I knew the guy was a weirdo, I I pro, you know,
I did work at his house, uh, digging trenches and lifting floorboards and and these different projects, and I did it
without asking any questions. Um, that does seem a little weird to me. Could they have been rounding up people off of
the streets for Gayy and he's he's paying them, you know, 200 bucks a person or or or something of that
nature. Possibility. Um >> Right. So then by saying, well, I dug ditches and stuff, you're implementing
yourself less. Right. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I and I don't want to and now I'm going to talk about it from
the flip side here. >> Mhm. >> I don't want to discredit any victim. you know, this this Jeff guy, he was he
was abducted. He was taken to Gasey's home. He thankfully gets away. Uh he's the one that says he saw another man
there. Uh but let's keep in mind, Jeff was blacking out. He was going in and out of consciousness this entire period.
Is there a chance that he is misremembering? That he doesn't he doesn't fully understand everything that
he thought that he saw during this situation? >> Yeah, it's possible. We also talked
about there were several people that said that, you know, once Gayy got you in the handcuffs that he almost he he
turned into a different person almost like he was possessed to the point where he even slightly looked different
>> where where they didn't even recognize him. Um >> Jack Hanley. >> Yeah. >> So, but here's the verdict on that
though, >> right? John Wayne Gasey, Jack Hanley, one and the same. Both douche canoes.
>> Yeah. So >> that's one full canoe right there. >> Um the thing is too the the other thing
is with Gayy >> we see at the very beginning his defense attorneys now I got to point this out
because this is a strange situation. His defense attorney uh was a private was not a private he was a public defender
for several years >> a colonel >> and he decided to go into private practice. Well unfortunate for him his
first client was John Wayne Gasey. Can you imagine? Can you imagine that situation? But the situation is this.
You know, when his attorney tells Gayy says, "You know what? You've got to be insane to do this, and we're we're going
to recommend that we we state that you're not guilty by the reason of insanity. I believe Gayy ran with that."
He's like, "Oh, yeah, that's a good idea. I didn't think of that. Oh, remember my good friend Jack Hanley who
who did a lot of these murders?" So, it seems to me like we have a situation here where somebody might have presented
some information to Gayy and he's saying, "Huh, I've been stuck in prison for a while. Um, my execution date is
drawing near. How about I get creative like Mr. Ted Bundy?" And you know, can Bundy started confessing to things
towards the end? What if Gayy thought, "Well, I can concoct some stories and buy me some time,
>> right?" Yeah. Again, the reason why I have some validity or why I feel there's
some validity to it is one, the prosecution thought that it was possible and the victim.
>> Mhm. >> And this is going to bring us up to um his execution. >> Yes. On May 10th, 1994, John Wayne Gasey
was executed at Statesville Correctional Center in Crest Hill, Illinois by lethal
injection. Mhm. >> His last meal consisted of a dozen deep fried shrimp, a bucket of original
recipe chicken from KFC, a pound of fresh strawberries, and French fries. Now, I'm guessing here, Captain, what
actually happened is he that's probably what he requested. He probably got some fried chicken from the prison kitchen.
Uh his execution was a minor media sensation. There were large crowds of people gathered for the execution party
outside of the penitentiary. Uh there were several arrests during those execution parties uh for public
intoxication, open container violations, and disorderly conduct. Vendors sold Gayy related t-shirts and
other merchandise, and the crowd cheered at the moment when Gayy was pronounced dead. According
to reports, Gayy did not express any remorse. His last words to his lawyer in his cell were something to the effect
that killing him would not bring anyone back. It is also reported that his last words were, "Kiss my ass." Uh, which
which is not really what he said while he was, you know, lying there waiting to die.
He can you imagine? You're the prison guard. you're going up and going, "Well, we're we gota poke you."
>> Yeah. And this >> kiss my ass. >> They say those are his last words, but you know, he didn't actually give a
final statement, but those were his last words in the sense that when he was being led to the execution chamber, he
looked at one of the correctional officers and said, "Kiss my ass. Kiss my ass." Well, worse than that,
several of Gayy's victims that were found buried in his home still to this day have not been identified,
>> right? And that's that's a tragedy. >> Yeah. And we have a situation where I believe that uh within the last 10 years
or so, they did identify one of those unidentified victims. Um there was a situation in 2013 where there was a man
that was always believed to have been murdered by John Wayne Gasey, but he was found living in Montana. Um, so that
made him the fifth potential victim found alive in the past two years between 2011 and 2013. The investigators
tracked him down, this was after um, basically what happened with him was he the last time his family spoke to him,
he had stated that he was going to be hitchhiking from New York City out to California. Mhm.
>> And they thought because they had never heard from their son for all these years
that he may have been passing through Chicago and got picked up by Gayy somehow. Um unfortunately for the
family, they were they believed him to be a victim for quite some time. Uh but found that he was living in Montana all
these years later and he did reunite with his father. Unfortunately, his mother passed away believing he was a
victim. >> Right. But he didn't he just didn't like his family anymore. >> He just Yeah. He he decided to leave
town and he never, you know, reconnected with his family. He he actually didn't even know that he was considered to be a
victim of John Wayne Gayy. >> Well, I want to personally thank you, Colonel, for uh sharing the stories that
will give me nightmares about Pogo >> and John Wayne Gasey. Do we have any recommended reading for the week?
>> We do. This week we're recommending John Wayne Gasey, Defending a Monster by Sam
Amarante. And now Sam is the public defender that turned into his private practice
>> and he became John Wayne Gasey's attorney. And he wrote this many years later. Um but I'll give you a little a
little clip here. Um he answered the phone one day. Sam did and he heard Sam, could you do me a favor? This is how the
story began of what now has become part of America's true crime hall of fame. It's a gory, grotesque tale. It's almost
like a Stephen King novel. And I'll tell you what, one thing that I find that's hard to find in the true crime genre.
You know, so many of these books are written by former detectives or former FBI. They're not true authors. They're
not true storytellers. >> Uh Sam would you would think would fall into that category having been a lawyer
and then going on to become a judge. However, this story, it really it reads like a Truman Capot book, you know,
where it it reads more like a novel, more like a like a story. So, I highly recommend John Wayne Gasey, defending a
monster, and you can pick that up by going to our website, true crimegar.com, and click on the Amazon banner. Thanks
to everybody for listening. Thanks for the fivestar reviews. And thank you for telling a friend about the show. And we
hope to see all of you back here in the garage next week for another episode. And until then, be good, be kind, and
don't live. Heat. Heat. [Music] [Applause] [Music]

John Wayne Gacy /// Part 2

Episode: 106

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John Wayne Gacy was liked by most who knew him. He was a sharp businessman who had spent his time building up his contracting company, hosting elaborate parties, and entertaining children at hospitals. People thought of him as a generous, friendly, and hard-working man. However, there was another side that few had ever witnessed... Or at least lived to tell about. For several years John Wayne Gacy viciously tortured, raped and murdered more than thirty young men, who would later be discovered in his home and in the local river. This is the story of a community leader who was called the most hated man in America. He also has earned the name "the killer clown".

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Brief Summary

John Wayne Gacy's case reveals his horrific crimes, including the murder of Robert Piest and the discovery of 33 bodies in his home.

Key points

The Case of John Wayne Gasey. Exploring the chilling story of John Wayne Gasey and his heinous crimes.
Gasey's Sinister Trick. Gasey lures Rob Pest into a dangerous situation with handcuffs.
The Search Warrant. Police obtain a search warrant for John Wayne Gacy's house, suspecting foul play.
Confessions of a Killer. Gacy confesses to multiple murders, claiming self-defense in some cases.
The Discovery of Bodies. Police uncover a total of 27 bodies in Gacy's home, revealing a horrific truth.
Discovery of Bodies. Four bodies were found in the Dez Plains River, linked to Gasey.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

You just have to hire one.

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0:13WatchOct 21, 2025

Tension

85/ 100High tension

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