H.H. Holmes, Part 2 | Morbid | Forensic Files

hey weirdos I'm Elena I'm Ash and this is morbid [Music] whoa you might hear some faint you
probably won't actually but if you do you hear if you might hear some faint like rain tip tapping on the window you
guys like that Ambiance yeah you guys do like that we've got a lot of people who
are like I love that sound it sounds very calming but I don't know how you don't like the sound of rain it's very
calming um you might not even be able to hear it because we have sound proofing but like
you never know I don't know you know I don't know your life I don't know your ears I don't know what you're doing I
don't know what you're doing okay what are you so I'm just kidding you're a weirdo I love you uh so yeah welcome
back to part two of the H.H Holmes Saga yay so excited to be here we're gonna we're
gonna get into it today so the first uh part was kind of setting it up where he came from his first marriage how he was
a philanderer how he was a schemer how he was a shitty student how he smelled of a smegma
he was a liar and a cheater and a frauder and just he's just an all-around [ __ ] person yeah well now we're gonna
add murder to his repertoire oh what a what a repertoire yeah he's awful and he's gonna get awful lure so and then
he'll get off a list yep he's gonna become one of the most awfuls ever so when we last left you guys he had just
moved to Chicago after he was going to try that whole scheme selling the bodies of the wife and the child of his friend
for the insurance all that stuff and then he just abandoned that and then he's like oh that's why there's bones
buried in my basement you idiots of course I didn't murder anybody except I murdered a lot of people and now I'm
gonna brag about it so figure it out so figure it out but yeah so we left you there so he's in Chicago now
and as if you know the story of H.H Holmes you know that it really does revolve around Chicago Chicago is kind
of like the room where it happened very much the room where it happened Devil in
the White City there he is so once he'd arrived in Chicago he somehow passed the
exam to become a pharmacist wow I would think that that's a pretty difficult exam yeah and he was only one of like a
like a handful yeah people like I guess he had something in there maybe chemistry was his thing and that's he
did a lot of extra stuff with chemistry so maybe he really did give himself a leg up in that department maybe but
maybe it just wasn't great in other things or he just wasn't a good student you know yeah exactly that pretty much
makes sense but he ended up finding work at Holton drugs which was a Pharmacy on the corner
of 63rd and Wallace and it was owned by an elderly woman named Mrs Holton ah imagine drugs isn't it funny to think of
like stores just being named like something drugs yeah just like Fulton drugs right
but she explained to homes that the pharmacy actually belonged to her husband Dr e s Holton but he was very
sick very very elderly you know ailing at the moment so uh HH wants to kick him right down the stairs and take over the
[ __ ] pharmacy yeah the [ __ ] pharmacy kid and she was finding it a little hard a little difficult to manage
this entire Pharmacy by herself she was elderly herself so of course like we said his ears perked up he was sensing
opportunity here and Holmes told her I too am a doctor I thought you were gonna say he said I too am sick and elderly no
he wouldn't lie why don't you believe you believe me he was like you know what I'm a doctor I
have a lot of experience in the pharmacy he did not uh but he's he did pass the pharmacy exam so I think him cheated
something happened there but he was like you know what I'm absolutely certain that I can transform this into just a
thriving business again if you just give it to me without it so not long after he
began work at the pharmacy because she believed him of course yeah she's a sweet woman Dr Holton did die rip um and
he left the store and everything in it to Mrs Holton so he was fresh so the whole home sees
this happening and he's like you know I he's he's angling tone this store so he frames it like he's doing her favor
because he's like you you're old and ailing your husband just died you don't want to run this whole thing so he's
like I'll buy this from you and I'll allow you to live on the second floor and she was like kind my God you are so
nice so she agreed and he did pay her so she did she used the money that she got
by mortgaging the stores fixtures fixtures fixtures why couldn't I say fixtures it's hard it's a I said like fixture
because you have to do like a yeah that's hard you know words are hard uh in the stock and actually
um Holmes bought the pharmacy and he rebranded the entire things as H.H Holmes Pharmacy so he took out the drugs
and he replaced it with Pharmacy well there you go he made it more upstanding he was like you know what I think we do
a little more here than just drugs you know what I'm pretty upstanding so let's change this
um in the early days of him owning this new Pharmacy a lot of the customers would come in and they'd ask about Mrs
Holton because people loved her she was a sweet old lady totally and every time he would say that she went on a trip to
California oh now this wasn't strange because this is something she had said she wanted to do but she never had the
money to do it oh sweetie she's not upstairs anymore and she hadn't returned for several weeks no and people are
still asking where she is and when they would ask Holmes would just be like well
you know she just loved California so much that she just stayed there she's just there you can't call her on the
phone because like we don't have those the 1800s here so like you do this you know deal with it I guess she stayed
with that so there was no actual physical evidence of him having killed Mrs Holton but there's no evidence that
he didn't either and there's probably some circumstantial evidence that points to her probably being killed yeah I
think her disappearance was not so much that she moved away or she went on a vacation to California I think he just
got rid of that whole situation so that the entire building could be his it does
sound like that and it's very on brand with what he would do anyways so it makes sense there you go these are
things that he would do later so it's like it why would we not think that it would
be this time I believe she might be his first victim but what about the boy I thought you thought the boy was that one
I'm like I go back and forth with that one for sure could be his first victim but the you like full-heartedly Mrs
Holton I have very little doubt that he killed Mrs Holton so she's either his first or a second yeah uh but it should
be noted too that there are variations in this story if you're researching this case yourself too like one of the
stories is that the woman Mrs Holton is not super elderly in that he got ownership of the store in exchange for
promising to marry her oh [ __ ] um and either her or her daughter like the story never really makes it clear
because again he confessed to so many different things that some of these stories got intertwined sure but this
seems the one I told seems to be the most correct one okay um but the other story is that like they
both go missing or one of them goes missing and in another version the woman's name is Elizabeth Sarah Holton
who is the doctor and the pharmacy is owned by her and her husband but she's the doctor they said let's go with the
feminist yeah exactly um and that they are a young couple and she decided to sell the pharmacy when
she became pregnant so like that's another story in this version the couple doesn't
disappear and they were actually still living in the neighborhood afterwards so like it doesn't show yeah either way
though he wanted the pharmacy he got the pharmacy and then the two people previously owned the pharmacy were never
seen again so like I think the puzzle piece of Moira is put together I don't think so to quote Spencer Department uh
yeah to me it just you know Mrs Sultan was older people came in looking for her she wasn't he said she went to
California she didn't go to California yeah no matter what he took ownership of that Pharmacy in late 1886. so now the
pharmacy is open and it seems to be running pretty smoothly with them at the helm at the very least uh he he's like
everything seems to be going good so like you know what I'm gonna look for some romance I'd like to point out that he is
still married to Clara yeah uh but yeah there's that so he's turning his attention to the ladies now
when he was in Minneapolis he met a woman named Miss Mirada bellnap murder I think it's murder
um they've sparked up a flirtation and she seemed pretty smitten with him at the time and he made his life sound very
exciting which like at the time it kind of was he was traveling all over the place
um and because at the end of 1886 mirada's life was small it was kind of unexciting she was in a small town you
know like I've never really seen the world yeah she lived with her parents in Minneapolis and worked in a music store
it was like a cute little existence but like to her that wasn't enough she didn't feel like she was getting out
there I got that so Holmes seemed very enticing to her and he was very Charming so and he also represented himself as a
very intelligent man he's a doctor like that's like whoa hey I mean that's like you're young and you're getting it and
he's also a business owner in Chicago um so Holmes knew all of this and so he wrote to Murda and courted her very
aggressively first through letters and then he did it in person like he was really playing the long game here and
after only a few months of talking back and forth he took a bold move and he proposed to murder and the two ended up
being married January 28 1887. oh okay um he's still married to Clara I was like how does they just didn't realize
in this District because it was like another district oh I think it was just in the 1800s and they like there's no
electronic records happening there is the 1800s I keep forgetting that I'm like why didn't they know why didn't
they just look it up on the computer why didn't they just like write that down somewhere so Murdo was very excited
about this marriage but I think that excitement would have been slightly tempered if um he did let her know that
he was still married to a woman named Clara that'll usually do it yeah strangely two weeks after he married
Murda Holmes filed a divorce petition in Cook County Supreme Court against Clara
stating that quote on the 28th day of June 1883 in the city of Ann Arbor in the state of Michigan the said Clara a
mudget wholly disregarding and in violation of her marriage vows covenants and obligations committed adultery and
had carnal knowledge with one JM Downer what so he's claiming they should divorce him Clara and he yeah after he's
already married a second Woman by the way he's now filing for divorce against Clara saying Clara committed adultery
like sir you were number one you did that super duper backwards you [ __ ] hypocrite like you are
in the throes of adulterous behavior and you were saying she was she adultered years ago what it's a lot he he's doing
he got married to another woman like are we clear Molina that's his right that's
his right he's a man so and he's a doctor it gets even weirder in this divorce decree he also had put
in there this he had put in there he further represents to your honor that he has ever since the time of said marriage
conducted himself as a true kind and affectionate husband you dirty little liar during that time has Faithfully
discharged all of his duties now do you remember when he abandoned her several times with their child lived off her
money alone and beat her to the point of black eyes do you remember I remember a
call does any of that ring as true kind or affectionate nor no nor oh well he also added into the decree that their
six-year-old son Robert quote is now living and is under the care custody and control of your orator Hermann Webster
mudget that simply wasn't true and never was wait so he was saying like I take care of the child like he literally had
put in the divorce decree that that child is now living and is under the care custody control of him and that's
not at all he had been with Clara the entire time also that's so easy to prove at one point he tried to go get Robert
and take custody and she was like no [ __ ] and then and it didn't happen right but he's now having it put in the
decree that Robert is in his custody I don't know if he thought he would get more money or something like that or
something but like you're an idiot and again so easy to prove like you go to his house
does he have a child's bedroom yeah the like the end the end and then also you don't want that child so you're just
doing that to be an [ __ ] oh for sure but how many parents do that oh my God they don't actually want custody of the
child they just want to do it to hurt the other people what and it's like [ __ ]
you yeah so they looked and no one could ever find a JM Downer either that Clara
supposedly had carnal knowledge with what is it by the way they [ __ ] oh God no knowledge is [ __ ] that's [ __ ]
uh he likely didn't existence like he he likely did not exist no Holmes was a lying sack of [ __ ] but it doesn't really
matter anyways because he also failed to show up on and follow up on any of the administrative requirements and the
petition yeah and the petition like I hear that but like and the petition just lapsed it was eventually dismissed by
the court for quote default of appearance of complaintant it's unclear whether Clara ever even
received notice of his intention to divorce her I don't even think she knew he ever wanted to divorce her so he
didn't get divorced you know this is giving a little bit Sheena and Raquel he makes this fake tro except it's not a
tro and it doesn't even show up for the [ __ ] hearing he doesn't that's where my head's at except he except he
actually like should have just divorced Clara like why are you not getting divorced yeah why are you married like
several women at a time that well he's the sand of all in it all though so like he said obviously that's
exactly what you think of with HH Holmes but like his marriage to Clara Holmes's
relationship with murder started off like that of like any couple in love she helped him run the pharmacy and she
became very just like impressed and enamored with his work ethic because he was really running this [ __ ] like she
thought wow what a cute family we are like I'm helping you run your Pharmacy in Chicago and we're so successful and
she later said quote ambition has been the curse of my husband's life he wanted to attain a position where he would be
honored and respected he wanted wealth and again we see the Hallmark of his behavior is always based on money he's
gotta be there's gotta be Capricorn in this chart I'm pretty I think his birthday he's a cancer like uh son but
I'm like there's Captain Money Motivated Money Motivated and to a false but in the spring of that year Murda actually
became pregnant and the bulk of the work she did was shifting you know off of her
and her husband had to kind of like take a bigger role back in the pharmacy see I
want to be excited for her but I feel like it's gonna end bad no you definitely don't want to be excited for
this whole thing but um she was separated from homes a lot like she was kind of she had to be in
the back right like she could do office work so she was just kind of relegated away from the public too and she was
wondering yeah yeah she got lonely so her parents moved from Minneapolis to Wilmette a small village about 15 miles
outside of Chicago I love that they were like we'll be with you I will come and hang with you and after they had like
settled in there Murda moved in with her parents and gave birth to their daughter
Lucy cute at first merta's parents were very suspicious of H.H homes well because this all came about very very
quickly married baby business and I feel like parents they know it's like he went
after young women yeah at the time and he and he went after young men for like schemes and stuff so he he was always
going for people who he knew he could con like young and unexpected older people I feel like like elderly people
fell for it but and somewhere in between like the parents of the whole generation
were like something is sus about you and I don't know is and he didn't exactly endear himself to them despite his wife
and child living in the house he was barely there like he never came to visit so they were like do you want to see
your infant child no no okay well literally never came to see them that's good um immediately they began to
question the kind of man that their daughter had married and had a child with and soon though he was able to
charm his way into their good graces I'm not sure how but it took a lot of jewishing on his part it was mainly when
they saw the ways that he like he wasn't around all the time but he showered Murda and the baby with gifts an
adoration every time he would be there so he would love bomb a lot of the time he was there when he was there he was
there he was just never there and he also that was beautiful you know poetry he also always had an excuse for
his long absences it was never just like oh whatever [ __ ] it like you're working
it's always like oh my God I know it's just like running a farm running a business you know I'm just such a such a
businessman business money look at this briefcase like I'm very important meanwhile there's nothing in it and
she's opens and it's just like a moth flies out but he would say that things were busy at the store and there was so
much to do in Chicago and making it seem you know like that he was just up to his
neck and work and he was just trying to support his little family and according to Eric Larson
um who I will um Source his work in our show notes Holmes is Manner of dress and
how he would frequently give a lot of gifts and like he was always about the material things that really gave off and
especially back in those days like that he was a man of importance like he gave off that air to everybody dress for the
job you want that's the job you have that's the thing he was very concerned with that like he always wanted to
present himself as being a man of importance a man of means a man of power and it honestly went a long way to
making her parents at least be eased a little bit thinking well he's going to take care of them yeah I guess so as
this is happening he is now thinking about that Infamous Murder Castle that everybody knows about
because now he's in Chicago he's settled there he's in an apartment near like above the pharmacy
but he wants more and he's got grand grand plans and during the later Decades of the 19th century Chicago was going
like there was a huge population boom a lot of people were moving West for work and opportunity and like a bigger
brighter life kind of like how everybody's like oh my god let's go to California and become stars like it's
the same kind of thing California New York Chicago same Vibes yeah exactly as a result new buildings were popping up
all over the city because like people were coming in the economy was starting to Boom people were trying to make way
for a ton of residents to be living their big apartment buildings and since arriving in Chicago and starting work
Holmes had been eyeing this empty lot that happened to be across the street from the pharmacy and finally in the
summer of 1888 he managed to buy it and at the time he registered the deed under
the false name h.s Campbell this is the beginning of him using many many aliases
to get many many things also can I just know it wasn't 1888 Jack the Ripper uh yeah so they were operating at the
same time that's so cool like two of the world's most [ __ ] notorious serial killers operating at the same time and
it's opposite ends of the world it's like so really wild crazy that's why a lot of people think there was some like
layover between the two really like a lot of people thinks H.H Holmes is Jack the Ripper and I think okay Vice Versa
oh um I think we talked about it in the episodes yeah it's a I don't know Theory
it's a theory I was like I was like we mentioned it but but we didn't go super into it because I don't I one I haven't
looked too I haven't looked hard enough into that theory to be convinced by it yeah and I don't want to give a full
opinion on something that I haven't given the full court press to well and it kind of seems like at least from what
I know HH uh Holmes is like operation of murder is very different than Jack the Rippers right it is and he is he's
mainly money vote motivated with his Engineers but right liked killing as well like hhomes like killing and he
liked killing women yeah he did enjoy that and it did it wasn't to me H.H Holmes isn't just a I kill for financial
gain sometimes it's I killed because I wanted to kill right or I killed because this [ __ ] was in my way essentially
yikes like not that's essentially no I would say yeah and it's like that's how he kind of presented himself as like she
was a problem yeah so ouch she had to go damn and the way he would talk about it
was very cold like that like well she became an issue so down the Chute she went crazy and he was very like
intricate about the ways he would do it to me it doesn't really line up so far with what I've seen between the two
cases because of mainly because of the two I think environments with which they were killing in are so vastly different
that their methods of murder don't add up together but I don't know if that has to do with the environments yeah the
person tailored himself to those environments right um but who knows I mean when we talked
about it in um when we talked actually when we talked about uh it with Tobias he made a
valid point of like it which we always thought but like I'm like oh in White Chapel if it was like somebody like H.H
Holmes who dressed like a man of importance all the time and was very like showy he would stick out like a
sore thumb and it's like so I don't know but then the reports of Jack the Ripper
that he did look a little fancy so it's like but you don't know you know like we've come through a lot of different
theories with that and it's like it could be mistaken it could be I don't know I just hate the unknown
it's an interesting Theory and I will look further I'm you know what I'll probably look further into it by the end
of this series because I would like to touch upon it more by the end but I definitely want to look further into it
and look at some dates and look at you know because I know there was some possibilities that HH was out of the
country at certain times and that maybe Jack had left at certain times and it would be how [ __ ] crazy would it be
if he was it was because 1888 is when Jack ended right 1888 Jack was still going oh he was still going okay
um but but he did like I think this is when he was coming to an end so which is interesting because this is really when
when started beginning going right here so that is interesting it definitely is I'll be I'm excited to hear what you
have to say once you are yeah we're into it I definitely want to look further into it for sure the Divergence there
and we'll talk about it don't worry uh it's really not a Divergence though because it's all the same cool uh but so
we were saying that by the summer of 1888 he had registered this lot across the street from the pharmacy under the
false name h.s Campbell so this is when Holmes committed the first murder that he would wholly admit to okay he claimed
he killed a friend and former schoolmate named Dr lecock now he did this because uh this man had
a large life insurance policy and he said he lured his friend to Chicago under some kind of [ __ ] pretense
gave him quote an overwhelming dose of laudanum and killed him that way after his murder Holmes took the body of
leecoch to Grand Rapids Michigan he did this because it would look like Lee Cox had died accidentally in his home and
then he collected the Forty thousand dollars from the life insurance policy kind now this is one of the murders
people waver about because he loved to talk about murder in Mayhem when he was caught and he really wanted to make
everybody like you gotta know I'm a [ __ ] monster like he wanted you to know he was like let me tell you how bad
I am he doesn't need to make us believe he is a [ __ ] monster that's the thing like
he had he has no need to exaggerate and yet he does all the time it's very strange but either way there is mention
a lot in his youth like in his early days in any research you see of a classmate at college named Robert
leacock now he was actually the one that Holmes claimed helped him originally come up
with the idea of Faking a death and using a medical dead body to claim Insurance fraudulently so it would be a
little poetic of homes to then use that plan on his friend who he came up with it with but take it to another level and
just murder him for it like it would be something he would do that's a lot and when he confessed he said quote like the
man-eating tiger of the tropical jungle I roamed about the world seeking whom I could destroy
dramatic that's him yeah that's him that's him and his mustache uh now for the Des so this all began
this is what began the Murder Castle idea was what he said okay he said after this whole scheme after he went through
with it he got the money he was ready to go he said I had this Grand idea for a Murder Castle and according to Holmes
the design and the purpose of it really came to him all at once after this this was like the igniting thing he had like
an epiphany yeah he said he originally envisioned a massive three-floor building three stories up the first
floor would have retail shops pharmacies jewelry shops clothing stores in his words he said it would be quote to
generate income and allow him to employ as many women as possible that he could then that he could then murder okay the
second and third floors were going to be apartments for rent and he was going to
have his own very fancy apartment in the giant corner you unit of the second floor like essentially kind of like a
penthouse exactly and he would have a large window that he could gaze over 63rd and Wallace I just got distracted
by the palace like I kind of want that I know you don't want this one no now this
was all the normal Logistics of a building it seems yeah like that seems like a very normal building it's great
except all the women and it seems innocuous to a certain extent sure pretty normal seems like some kind of he
seems like a piggy guy who just wants to like hire women he's like Doug Dimmadome
there you go well this part was important to him like that it was important to him to have a
very front-facing business model a very front-facing looking building that yeah no one could question but what was more
important to him was these Macabre little details that were going to be hidden inside the bones of the building
they were much more important and much more exciting to him in particular to us they're [ __ ] horrifying to give you
an idea some of the features he wanted was a giant shoot that was what would extend from one of the apartments on the
second floor all the way down to a secret chamber in the basement that would seal off
then he also wanted a large room in his own personal apartment that you would have to walk into and then there was a
walk-in vault in that that was airtight with iron walls oh why would you want that also how do you talk to the
contractors don't worry about it he also wanted gas jets throughout the entire building that would be controlled only
in his personal office so he could turn on gas and just gas you anywhere he wanted to no one's going to notice that
in the blueprint nope he also don't worry we're gonna get to that he also wanted a large basement with secret
storage chambers inside that would seal off okay and like you said your first thought is
how you gonna get this built my guy right how are you gonna do this well he wanted this all to be very practical
from the sense of his murderous intentions obviously he needed easy ways of disposing of and hiding dead bodies
he was not willing to bend on any of this this was his vision but he also wanted this psychological aspect to it
like he knew this was all there but no one else was going to know this was there he knew the gas jets would be
there but the guests wouldn't and he loved the idea of this like whole like I know but they don't kind of thing and it
all just fed into his desire to like just [ __ ] with people yeah and also kill people but he knew like we do that even
though he wasn't willing to bend on any of this he was making this happen he knew that um these curious design
aspects draw a little suspicion from any architect like you said perhaps so without any kind of skill set in
designer building he actually began drawing up plans for the building himself that's really crazy yeah that's
the thing that kills me with him he's one of those people that you're like you could have done something great if you
would just put your mind to it like you weren't a brilliant guy but you had a working you had hard work ethic when you
put your [ __ ] mind to it but nothing terrible causes exactly and it's like like this like you're learning a skill
set yourself to do it would ask you something but you're accomplishing a skill set to build a Murder Castle
because you're scared someone will figure it out what a wild [ __ ] like like this too like this is just real
like what this is real and what's so there was a population boom in Chicago like I said at the time people were
moving over there and it meant that there was going to be no shortage of Labor like people were going to be
wanting to work on these kind of things but there was again still that problem that these workers were going to ask too
many questions friends so even though he had put together the blueprints and he was gonna have
somebody help him he devised a strategy that would allow him to get the building constructed
without any suspicions the plan was he was going to constantly change the Architects buildings laborers none of
them were going to be able to get a clear or complete picture of what was being built they wouldn't be able to ask
any questions because they were only going to get bits and pieces of it I feel like that's like that's such a
gamble to take his whole life was a [ __ ] gamble everything he did was a gamble I'm just thinking of like work
we've had to do on the house and I'm like wow I can't imagine being like okay you finished that now I'm gonna call
someone out like you just and what he would do was he would just not pay the person and be like [ __ ] you you're
you're fired like just bring someone else in and be like okay start working on this you're creating so many issues
for yourself and they would just be more confused really like they'd just be like
what and not realize how weird all of this was together and also due to the lacks inspection processes in Chicago at
the time and the limited protections for Laborers he was going to be able to get
away with not really paying right buddy like it really wasn't going to be an issue like you were saying two people
are so desperate for work that they're probably not asking that many questions exactly that's the other thing he's
banking on that but it is a really like cunningly smart thing to do to one start
the blueprint process yourself to make sure you get all those weird things in there right then hire Architects have
them work a little more on it than fire them before they're done hire another one to build off that other thing hire
fire that one bring in laborers to start building this little extension fire them
when they're done with it hire another one to do that one like that way you're getting it piece milled together and
nobody can fully get a full picture of what's Happening Here maybe they know a shoot is in there but they're like
what's that shoe for and you're like a little garbage bye like it's just no one can really get into the like
nitty-gritty of what's happening it's like you're giving everybody a little piece of the puzzle but like but nothing
that they can jump off of exactly the construction of the quote-unquote Murder Castle which he was calling the Holmes
Castle yeah began in the summer of 1889. again partially working from Holmes's own design Blueprints and also working
from plans partially developed by local Architects um two of which were Charles Berger and
Edward gallner the labor and materials were going to be from Aetna Iron and Steel
Holmes was ready to begin using this Murder Castle before it was even started though like he was like let's go before
the foundation had even been completed he was already making plans to get this thing going
early in the construction he actually approached a bricklayer named George Bowman and he approached him with a very
strange proposition I'm not just a bricklayer just doing his job yeah I know about HH Holmes and Bricks yeah now
Bowman later said he asked me if I wouldn't like to make money easier than what I was doing and of course I told
him yes yeah who wouldn't and according to Bowman he said a few days later he came over to me and pointing down into
the basement said you see that man down there well that's my brother-in-law and he's got no love for me neither have I
for him now it would be the easiest matter for you to drop a stone on that fellow's head while you're working and
I'll give you fifty dollars if you do it what fifty dollars well at the time oh we're
talking about yeah I know I gotta keep remembering girls that's a loss I'm like fifty dollars that's it
for the murder of a man it's honestly unknown what the purpose of this kill proposition was to be quite honest he
probably just wanted to see that he could do it he that's because he wanted to either make money oh that's from some
Avenue by doing this or he was just honestly asking to see if Bowman was a guy he could trust I think he was
looking for a guy he could trust but either way Bowman quit and never returned to the job smart man he was
like bye no thank you trust me though not everyone working the job site was so kind and willing to run away from this
man in April of 1889 Holmes met um excuse me and um it was in it's later than April
in 1889 I had the wrong month Holmes met a carpenter by the name of Benjamin Pizza I think it's Pizza I think you're
right at first pyzel's job was to take care of the horses that were going to be used on the construction site because
again we're in the 1800s uh but oh my God we are we are but over time he actually gained Holmes's trust a lot and
he became like an assistant to homes like a personal assistant pythal was a little like homes he had a history of
petty crimes misdemeanors he's kind of an air dwell and eventually it all caught up to him and he was arrested for
passing bad checks in Indiana while he was out where while he was still working for homes those stand-up months so
Holmes actually bailed paitzell out of jail yeah that's his right hand he paid the amount in bad checks by the way he
bailed him out with bad checks failed the man sitting in jail for bad checks out of jail with bad checks is nothing
but a poet uh piedcell failed to return to Indiana for the trial so now they were just like now babe nothing could
happen they're like we're out Jay-Z and Beyonce On The Run together they're as thick as thieves together because now
they're the boss and the assistant it's like the assistant to the regional manager from the office there you go now
after a year or two the unpaid bills and the schemes and the lying and the fraud
it started to catch up with Holmes that'll happen unfortunately for the most part though individual laborers
many of them were immigrants they had no way of getting the money owed to them that's so funny yeah and that sucks he
just got away with that but remember he's using Aetna Iron and Steel for the supplies that's a major company who
doesn't give a [ __ ] about your feelings so they sued his ass and when he didn't
pay his debts they were like we're [ __ ] taking all this back dude but when they sued him in the fall of uh in
the fall of 1889 he tried to use like usual [ __ ] tactics and excuses that he did to get out of paying them
and one thing he did was he changed the deed on the property to make it look like it was owned by his mother-in-law
yeah so he said he wasn't responsible for the debt because it was in her name how do you just do that he just did that
like what for the most part like so literally he had first registered that deed under a false Alias right but
that's and then when he started getting in trouble he just shifted it all into his mother-in-law's name and was like
these are her deaths I don't know what you're talking about but I love that and like nobody was like yeah dude like
clearly you just did that yeah that's the thing back then you could do that easily you can shift it out like Who's
Gonna Catch You you know you just like write her name in there and you're like there it is you just like check up it on
the previous writing rub it off exactly so for the most part all his like legal [ __ ] was handled by his lawyer Edward
Marr who actually did manage to successfully like push off creditors for a while but he was and he was honestly
his lawyer till he was like executed essentially damn um and he did manage to help him out in
this scenario I think they just like kind of backed off a little bit because it was under her name that was going to
be an issue but you wouldn't think this Murder Castle would be like you would think that this would be a very long
process of building this thing it's huge and with all this complicated it's an annoying long project there's all the
constant turnover of workers and Architects there's legal troubles now associated with it but the actual
construction of the building happened really quickly really it was literally like pretty much done by the end of
1889. Why wow yeah like a year or excuse me it was done by 1890. okay so like um
two-ish years yeah and I think they were putting like finishing touches on it until 91 but it was essentially like
livable at that point um Holmes had already moved Murda Lucy and her mother the one he had thrown the
deeds into into the large Corner apartment on the second floor I think that's how he was able to get away with
doing these kind of things was he would then don't worry about it don't worry about it I'm handling it here's your
beautiful Penthouse yeah like here you go it's like a Jada Essence Hall look over there exactly so yeah they all got
to live on there and a short time later he sold the drugstore across the street the original one that he got from Mrs
Holton um and the new owner who bought it he was like oh like you're gonna love it
here you have no competition there's no other drugstore like you're the only Pharmacy like I'm telling you this place
is gonna be a booming it's great like don't worry about it and he was like oh great business see you later bye he
turns around and opens a new drugstore on the first floor what an actual douchebag yeah but that's a perfect
example of why you don't just have a an agreement By Word of Mouth he's such a dick yeah like he's just such a dick
yeah he does things just to be a dick because he's such a [ __ ] voice he loves it now among the first few because
again you don't know which one is his first murder victim that's so crazy but among the first among them
um in Chicago was John dubry and it was actually one of his investors in the Murder Castle
it was a man that homes owed money to dubry have had actually arrived in Chicago to see the ad the complete
completed construction of the castle and to get his money that he owed uh this was on April 18th 1891 because like I
said in 91 it was like dunsky sure and he hadn't even entered the building when he actually dropped to the ground
outside the pharmacy and began convulsing oh according to Benjamin Nixon who was like uh I think he was in
the jewelry store on the first floor he might have even um owned it I think he saw Holmes rush
outside to debris side and quote port a dark liquid down debris throat and he died immediately
one on the street I wonder so did wood homes have anything to do with his convulsions beforehand or no idea or if
it was just a happy accident that he was able to pour something down his throat that would kill him instantly holy [ __ ]
I don't know but debris death may not like he didn't get any money from it but he didn't lose any money
either well yeah because he's gonna have to pay him yeah get money out of it and he would have
had to pay a small fortune to him I mean he was an investor in the thing that was
a lot he was essentially alone on the castle right he didn't have to pay anymore right so he didn't get money out
of it now during the construction of the castle and into its first year he was engaged in a lot of schemes like little
schemes you know like the the snake oil salesman kind of schemes like he would sell mineral water to people and say it
would like cure all this [ __ ] but it was just vanilla infused tap water sounds
kind of good um he would con widows out of their pensions you know he was very into that
he's such a yeah like low down [ __ ] ass he is a low down just dirt bag yeah he really is I mean he's capable of
murder so obviously but like so low down then every way though the little like like
but he was still very committed but while doing these schemes he was committed to his murder-for-profit idea
that was his main thing right and in 1891 shortly after everything was done Holmes approached a woman who did his
laundry and he had he had a proposition or oh God and she was the laundress um for like the actual castle
um and he I know he would pay the one he said I'll pay you six thousand dollars that's a lot back then I'll give you six
thousand dollars to take out a life insurance policy in the amount of ten thousand dollars which is even more and
she was like why the [ __ ] would you pay me to do that like I don't understand why would I do that and he said well
then after you die I would make four thousand dollars Prof profit on the investment and in the meantime you can
spend the six thousand dollars however you want you just get six thousand dollars free and clear
and this woman was really young and her job as a laundress really didn't make her any money so she was going to
absolutely agree to this she was like of course I want six thousand dollars right
now nothing is ever that good like he had her but then he apparently leaned in close to her and softly said
don't be afraid of me and if that was Thomas Shelby sign me up like I will buy that life insurance does
he say that to people like no but I just thought that's something that Thomas Shelby would absolutely do like he has
that Vibe okay like I'm not afraid but this is Herman Webster mudget who smells like scrotum exactly so she immediately
said something about him just I that was off it scared me and she was like I immediately declined the offer anybody
that says don't be afraid of me for out of the blue no reason I'm afraid and I think he was trying to
do the like don't be afraid of me like you know what I mean like aren't I charming and like being so on the nose
that like but you're like you actually are scary like that's what I meant when I said like if Killian Murphy is leaning
into you and saying don't be afraid of me I'm like I'm not you know what though I would still be afraid
Harry mother s could walk up to me and say don't be afraid of me and I'd be like you know
what Harold it's been a good run it's been a good [ __ ] run but Herman Webster mudget says that to me and I'm
like I would run so far away so that this lady was like absolutely not he just like what is wrong with you yeah
he's trying some [ __ ] so it's like when people say like I don't bite I'm like yeah I figured because we're all humans
here yeah exactly so in 1890 like the year before yep after a long bidding and like crazy process it was announced that
the next World's Colombian Exposition would be held in Chicago and it was going to be held between May and October
of 1893. so this timing was supposed to coincide with the celebration of Christopher Columbus's arrival in North
America holy [ __ ] uh the world's Exposition was a huge fair with all the fair accoutrements
um and it was held in and around Jackson Park it was going to be celebrating the
scientific and technological advancements of the modern world it was so funny to think about very mustache
twisty and bowler hat wary and old sport kind of Vibes you know like everyone's got a cane loves it yeah it just feels
right Parasol's in the air yeah okay exactly the fair was going to be a massive spectacle it was going to very
much draw in hundreds of thousands of visitors to Chicago visitors it was going to be a huge huge Boom for the
local economy it was a huge win for them to get it here and a huge win for Mr yeah for Chicago in Holmes he was
probably pretty psyched about tourist dollars coming in like regular ones like you know there was going to be a lot of
Boom in the account economy that's good for everybody but he was not one to waste opportunities that were just going
to stroll into his life especially if it involved bringing unsuspecting women into his orbit exactly so he was like
well this is even better like this works for me so so that's when Ned and Julia Connor arrived in Chicago no they were
in need of work a place to stay and somebody they knew was like you should check with this guy H.H Holmes he's got
a new building I'm sure there's employment opportunities in it there's also places to live like he's a perfect
guy to go to and apparently they were right because he had a jewelry store on the first floor and he happened to need
somebody to work there it was crazy oh wow so Ned was hired like on the spot to work in that jewelry store and they
ended up moving into an apartment in the Holmes Castle better still Holmes was like Julia can
work in the pharmacy with me oh God and I can train her to keep the books like you guys just got two jobs and one
that's wild and then Julia's sister Gertrude moved into the city a few months later and he was like I'll employ
her as well wow what a great guy such a nice guy oh and that's so sad too that they probably were like wow like how
lucky are we yeah and like what a kind guy like he's just like ready to help people who come into the city now to Ned
things felt like wow we've been really struggling and this is finally falling all into place but he said that but
there was always something about H.H Holmes that he said made him uncomfortable was it Justin like it it
was probably the smegma uh he seemed overly interested and attentive to Julian Gertrude yeah I grossed him out
made him feel weird that feeling he continued to feel some type of way about homes as they started become better
acquainted and he said he kept noticing stranger and stranger Behavior he was just an odd guy and he said on one
occasion Holmes was like I got something to show you Ned and he was like okay and
he showed him that large Vault that he'd installed in his uh his apartment and he
showed him another one in the basement and he showed him one in the basement and said Ned step inside no and Ned
stepped inside and he closed the door and before he closed the door he said I just want to show you how well this is
soundproofed oh my God and so he shut the door and he said I shut the door and put my ear to the crack but could only
hear a faint sound and he was immediately worried and put off by the fact that Holmes had made a point of
showing him this weird secret vault and then demonstrating to him how it locks and how by the way Ned no one will hear
you in here he let him out of it so terrible but this was definitely a just so you know this is where I can put you
we're moving out in two and a half minutes goodbye bye now over time during this whole thing because remember Holmes
is paying a lot of attention to Julia like it's getting weird so things between Ned and Julia are becoming
strained right because she's kind of fallen for it again AJ Holmes is very Charming he's got it all he's he's these
women are being told the world they are seeing the world they are seeing him as this very important guy this very
wealthy and connected guy and at the same time they're making money exactly now they're arguing a lot Ned and Julia
and you know he was really having trouble with how much attention was being paid to her and how she was
seeming to like it and he later told reporters I finally told her we could not go on that way I told her that I
told her on a certain day we would quit that she could go her way and I would go
mine and when that day came I did not go upstairs to our room but stayed downstairs and slept in the barbershop
oh that's so sad so when the months let followed this Ned tried to get his relationship back on track he was like
we were fine before right this is ruining everything this guy literally came in and just like took complete
control of it and Gertrude her sister left the city a while later so like she wasn't around anymore so that was just
Julia and he was trying to fix it but during this time Holmes suddenly offered out of nowhere to sell Ned the pharmacy
what on the first floor he does not even have like Pharmacy experience well and he was like I want you to own the store
like not be a pharmacist but I want you to own the business and of course Ned is like hell yeah are
you kidding me and he's like this is going to be the thing that's going to improve me and Julia's relationship I'm
going to be a business owner like I'm going to take her attention but unfortunately the business made things
worse because Holmes had sold it to him knowing he hadn't paid a [ __ ] dime to any of his creditors and now those debts
sorry Ned those are your debts you haven't heard at all so now not only is he struggling to keep this thing afloat
but he's now having creditors coming after him for money but he did that he didn't do no now the issues between Ned
and Julia were made way worse by the fact that Julia had actually given birth to a daughter named Pearl Pearl um so
any divorce would include a pretty unpleasant custody agreement between the two of them so it was getting the
Discord it's just getting worse very contentious but things were not improving between them the pharmacy was
being a huge money pit and a big struggle on both of their lives so Ned told Holmes I took a job with a jewelry
company in downtown in Chicago I don't want the pharmacy I want out and a short time after he'd left the castle Ned made
one final attempt to try things to make things work with Julia but by then she was engaged in a full affair with Holmes
very uninterested in Ned Julia refused to get back together and Ned packed up his things and moved to Gilman Illinois
and he filed for divorce and he signaled his intent to gain custody of pearl I hope he did
keep hoping that so by the Fall why you say that to me so by the Fall Holmes had
moved murta and Lucy yeah his wife and child you might remember yeah were they living Sorry were they in his apartment
or were they in the oh they were in here in his apartment uh remember he's also married to Clara still yep and murder
and he's also having an affair with Julia yeah so how does he even keep all the names straight yep so uh well don't
worry he moved Murda and Lucy his wife and child um into a house several miles away okay in downtown Chicago and he was
just spending most of his time at the castle where murder didn't know it but he was having a full-blown affair with
Julia Connor so this affair was super intense like very passionate very intense and Holmes kept telling her I'm
going to marry you I'm going to marry you and it's like my guy you're married to two other women you're not even
supposed to be married to the woman you're married to and Julian knows that he's married and it's like if he's
telling you he's gonna marry you do you really think that means that much to him
no no so he's constantly promising he's going to marry her but once Ned left Chicago
suddenly it all yeah because it's not as exciting yeah all of a sudden he'd lost interest the
risk of getting caught was gone there was really no there's no confirmation fruit anymore right and he's
uninterested by it that's so [ __ ] so by November of 19 of 1891 Julia told Holmes that she was pregnant
again yeah oh remember Pearl is Ned's child yes yes no I know but she's pregnant again oh no uh so said now you
have to marry me he doesn't think so Holmes was like okay and then he was like yeah I guess I do
have to marry you so he was like yep I'll marry you but on one condition and she was like what is that and he said
you're gonna get an abortion oh my God and he said and I'm gonna perform it oh god oh no Julia reluctantly agreed
and several weeks later she was on an operating table that he had put together in one of the empty apartments on the
second floor of the House of the castle that's dirty she's on the table he poured chloroform onto a rag and held it
to her mouth and nose to sedate her but he should have only had to do that for like a second instead he just held it on
there held it into place and continuously dripped more and more chloroform onto the rag while it was on
her face she struggled to get off and tried to fight him off but after several minutes of this horrific torture he felt
for a pulse and she was gone as well as The Unborn Child wow wild that he could do that to a woman carrying his child
too it gets worse oh he then walked into Pearl's bedroom oh no and did the exact
same thing to Pearl oh a child who was likely about five or six oh my god oh I hate him so much or maybe not
even she might have been like four oh my God now once everybody was dead Holmes contacted a man named Charles Chapel who
homes uh knew was a trained articulator what is that a person trained in stripping the flesh from human bodies in
preparation for medical instruction which I never asked yeah uh he'd make them into an articulated skeleton
essentially great Charles Chapel asked absolutely no questions when he was led to An Empty Apartment in the castle
where a dead body was he knew Holmes was a doctor and he just kind of accepted the claim that he had been doing some
kind of dissection and he wanted this body cleaned so we offered him 36 dollars to clean the body make a fully
articulated skeleton and skull and he was like sure so Chapel returned the body afterwards and he homes sold her
skeleton to the heinemann Medical College Chicago no one knows what happened to Pearl
but when investigators excavated the basement of the castle they did find the bones of a child between the what they
think is the ages of four to ten years old oh so it could have been her sweet Pearl now in the days after this Julia's
neighbors Mr and Mrs John Crow who worked who lived in the in the castle asked about her and pearl where did she
go where did they suddenly disappear and no one else in the building had seen them for days and finally they caught up
with homes and they were like what happened and he was like oh Julian pearl left early for a planned trip to
Davenport Iowa um obviously like you didn't she tell you and they were like I don't know
about that but they were like okay I guess we have to just accept this explanation right and it was only after
his arrest that they learned that Julia had never gone to Davenport oh they didn't learn until after he was arrested
and then imagine like obviously they have no reason to yeah so in January 1892 a new family moved
into the Connor's old apartment the Julia Ned Connors apartment and Pearl and when they arrived in to move in
they found it completely the way it was the dishes were still out on the table Pearl's clothes were laid out on a chair
oh my God it was like they had just walked out one afternoon and never returned which is because what happened
what happened great Holmes explained to them that Julia the person who had lived
here before her sister had become ill a few weeks earlier and she and pearl had had to leave right away to tend to her
and according to Holmes there was no need to pack up their belongings as Julian Pearl were well provided for and
would not be coming back I'd be like yeah that's great but like you're the landlord you should have worse
yeah like what the [ __ ] like I have to just like take all this [ __ ] out of here
now and move mine in yep now he gave a different version of this story to others when they asked because of course
he's giving three different things about what happened to Julia and pearl it's also like maybe you should stick with
the same story brother yeah I mean glad you didn't but yeah when others asked he
claimed that Julia had briefly come back in early January to settle up rent she told him and at that time quote
announced not only to me but to her neighbors and friends that she was going away yeah she didn't say that to anybody
though but apparently he knew ahead of time that Julia had mentioned to others that she had plans to visit her sister
in Iowa at some point so the story would seem legit he had planned this all out [ __ ] he also vehemently denied any
claims or rumors that he had any kind of inappropriate sexual relationship with Julia they were just friends what are
you talking about yeah for sure even though like it was very clear like very very clear like Ned knew everybody knew
but he later said quote that she is a woman of quick temper and perhaps not always a good disposition may be true
but that any of her friends and relatives will believe her to be an amoral woman or one who would be a party
to a criminal act I do not think okay Jan um so that happened in the spring of 1892
Benjamin pyzell his assistant there not this [ __ ] he traveled to Dwight Illinois
which is a small village about 25 miles from Chicago I found this interesting because immediately for some reason I
thought of him like I made the little quip about him being like assistant to the regional manager yeah and then wife
traveled to Dwight Illinois that is funny um but he went there because he was getting treatment for alcoholism but uh
Ben was uh Benjamin yeah he was doing that at the Keely Institute and while he was there receiving treatment he met a
young woman named Emmeline segrand and at that time she was working as a stenographer for The Institute what's
this sonographer yeah the like typer right person um takes a transcription and pyth cell
was just taken by her beauty like he saw her away just like oh my God so when he
returned home from to Chicago after the treatment he told Holmes All About This Magnificent beautiful young woman girl
shut your mouth oh he did this on purpose he knew that Holmes would be seriously interested in this he was
doing his job as his assistant I found you a pretty young thing but he's oh I I'm here I am thinking
that like he's in love with this oh no he said she's just she's just beautiful you should kill her hey she's this
beautiful young woman you would probably like her oh my God so he knew that he would be very interested in this and he
was right he loved the idea of a beautiful woman almost as much as she loved the idea of killing a beautiful
woman so Holmes wrote to Emmeline and based only on pietzel's description he wrote to her like wow heard pietzel's
description he was like gotta write to this girl very King Henry VIII very much and he offered her a job at twice the
salary she was making now as a stenographer at the Keely Institute so of course she was like uh yeah like
twice the salary or anything he would sign up for that so she arrives in Chicago she finds a room at a boarding
house and she begins work as Holmes's assistant with the ABC copying company which is one of his sham businesses that
was operating on the first floor he had a [ __ ] ton of those he had like a closing company yeah right and he had he
had like a glass bending business down there that was a sham too but the landlady of the boarding house she was
staying at called segrand a very pretty girl and was a favorite among the borders so she seldom went out with any
of the young men so she's known very much so as a beautiful woman but apparently she immediately liked
Holmes he was all over her praising her constantly spoiling her with attention and gifts and the landlady later said
she was greatly infatuated with Holmes and never ceased talking about him I did not like him he could not look one in
the face to me this signals a little bit of a difference to the he didn't look you in the eyes thing he wouldn't even
look you in the face yeah like this guy there is a little there's something there there like that's different than
the strabismus kind of situation where he can't like focus on your eyes exactly he wasn't even looking you in the face
it's also like all these women are taken with him the women that are taken with him work beneath him exactly so it's
that whole like power oh like man and power kind of yeah but the women who are like I don't know I always thought he
was going to murder someone yeah we're just the ones that are doing their own thing right and it wasn't long until he
shammed his way into a romantic relationship with poor Emeline now other employees noticed like at the castle in
the different businesses they noticed and everyone around them knew something was going on one of Holmes's Castle
tenants Dr Maurice Lawrence told the inter-ocean we felt that she was be she was to be more pitied than blamed he was
apparently very kind to her always buying flowers and presents for her and taking her to the theater and places of
entertainment they always they nearly always ate their meals together in his office having them sent up from the
restaurant on the first floor so they're living this like beautiful life of eating like lunches together and
buying or things taking her out very much like just showering her I'd like to realize he is married to Clara he is
also married to murder he has a child Lucy he was carrying on affair with a woman named Julia who had a child named
Pearl who was also pregnant with his child he murdered Julia and that child in Pearl and is still married to Murda
and Clara and Clara has a son with him George Robert Robert why did I say George I was like we were like actually
yeah absolutely now which is just like what the [ __ ] so at this point he would
have had three children at this point he would have had three children okay okay
um or no he would have had two children because Pearl was not his but she was pregnant Julia yeah but he just says
Robert and Lucy oh and Lucy yes you're right you're correct yeah um so he's Robert
Lucy and he would have had Julia's child so yeah he would have had he would have
had a child technically absolutely what a [ __ ] [ __ ] actual piece of [ __ ] uh and murders just across town yeah
like a few miles away and he's carrying on this like very public Affair and she has no idea and according to the
everything she doesn't know okay and if she did she was like [ __ ] you now in the
winter of 1892 Emmeline told several people she would be returning to Lafayette Indiana to visit her parents
for a few weeks before Christmas now according to her cousin Dr B.J segrand who'd visited with her very
shortly before she was scheduled to leave he said Miss Mr Grand was changing her feelings towards homes
like something happened that turned her off don't know what maybe he leaned in and said don't be afraid don't be afraid
of me because then several days passed and no one in Inglewood had seen or heard from Emily Instagram no when the
wife of Dr Maurice Lawrence the tenant in the castle who had that other quote asked like about her two homes he simply
said quote oh she's gone away to get married oh what this obviously was a little
weird because uh she'd never dated anyone but him it was pretty clear that they were in a relationship and Emily
never mentioned leaving early and no one ever heard of Emeline being engaged to someone else
also she said that she was very put off about how he spoke about it he was very anxious appearing
he couldn't look at her when he said it he was very monotone he didn't want to talk too much about it and now this is
the second woman who's just up and left him uh out of suspiciously yeah and it's
to her it felt like he was hiding something and scared it was going to come out if he said too much yeah like
he was really hiding something here and so the next day she notices that she sees homes and two
of his assistants carrying a heavy trunk out of the castle and loading it into a
wagon one day after that Holmes left Chicago for the house in Wilmette where Merta
and Lucy lived and murdered his parents because remember he's married with a child two times over I just want to keep
reminding you of that he went to his wife's house when he returned a few days later he
made a point of showing Mrs Lawrence in particular who had asked about Emmeline he showed her an envelope that
he'd got containing cards announcing Emily's supposed wedding to Robert Phelps on December 7th 1892. as if she would
send him a wedding invitation or announcement well a few weeks later emmeline's trunk arrived at her parents
house in Indiana it had all her clothes all her belongings that she had taken with her when she left for that job
and according to Eric Larson's book her parents hoped that she'd sent the trunk trunk because she must now be marrying a
wealthy man and she doesn't need all this old stuff didn't say that but her cousin BJ pointed out that Emmeline was
in the habit of writing her parents two or three times a week right if that was the case she definitely would have
written and she had not written so you think the big trunk was all her things that they moved out oh no I think she
was in that big trouble and they disposed of her along the way I think she so whatever the case the
trunk arrived that was the last time that her family got anything from her now according to Holmes's confession
leader Emmeline quote had become almost indispensable in my office work and the idea of losing her to an unknown fiance
and Dwight was unacceptable so he stuck with that so he said I endeavored upon several occasions to take the life of
the young man and failing in this I finally resolved that I would kill her instead
um I don't think so so he claimed he lured Emeline into the large vault in his office and closed the door causing
her quote to suffer the tortures of a slow and lingering death Jesus Christ what is worse about this is it's very
likely true yeah I believe it was he tested it out with uh Ned the name Phelps which is supposedly her fiance's
name was a known Alias of Benjamin beitzel which he was using around the time he
would have met emelina at the Keeley Institute oh [ __ ] never existed and then people would have been like oh yeah like
she did talk to a guy named Phelps now two on January 2nd after she disappeared the fall in uh 93 Holmes asked Charles
Chappelle for help now do you remember Charles Chappelle is the articulator uh-huh and he said
Holmes sent him a trunk containing a young woman's body to be stripped of Flesh and articulated now a few weeks
later the LaSalle Medical College of Chicago received a delivery of a nicely articulated skeleton
oh no when police searched the castle after he was arrested inside that large Vault that they said he said he put her
in they found a woman's footprint in the enamel on the wall and it was made with
so much force that it was unable to be wiped off oh my God she was trying to escape and like kick her way out of
there was true so brutal and he was selling their articulated skeletons to medical
colleges those medical colleges must have been haunted as like what the [ __ ] and that is where we are going to end
for part two I didn't see that coming you [ __ ] because we're gonna get some more trust we have a lot more
coming and it's a lot so we're gonna and I want to look into the the Jack the Ripper thing a little more for part
three I want to like to see if I can get into that a little more yeah so uh hang
tight okay but he's he's just gotten started and he's already this bad so awesome Yep
so that is part two of HH Holmes we have the Murder Castle being built we have it
being in full operation so far we haven't seen the um the little Macabre element all the Macabre elements being
used we've seen that Vault being used quite a bit yeah we have we have seen that a lot yeah but I'm scared there's
yeah there's a lot that's about to happen and I'd like you guys to hang tight and I'm scared about the bricks of
it all yeah just just hold on to your butts you know okey dokey smoking well we love you and we hope you keep
listening and we hope you keep it weird you already know the drill you don't don't do don't ever
don't move to Chicago or anywhere for that matter and build a Murder Castle [Music]
foreign [Music]

In part 2 we talk about the infamous "Murder Castle" and begin to dive into the crimes committed there. Holmes' brutality and savagery knew no bounds and now he has a whole building to do it in.

Thank you to Dave White for research assistance!

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Brief Summary

H.H. Holmes' manipulative schemes and murders escalate as he builds his infamous Murder Castle in Chicago.

Key points

Holmes' Pharmacy Scheme. Holmes takes over a pharmacy after the elderly owner struggles to manage it.
The Marriage Proposal. Holmes proposes to Mirada Bellnap while still married to Clara.
The Divorce Decree. Holmes hypocritically files for divorce against Clara while married to another woman.
The Infamous Murder Castle. Holmes begins plotting the construction of his notorious Murder Castle in Chicago.
Building a Nightmare. Holmes designs a building with hidden chambers for his murderous intentions.
A Shocking Proposition. Holmes offers a bricklayer $50 to commit murder, revealing his manipulative nature.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

He's just an all-around [ __ ] person.

Describing H.H. Holmes' character.

1:25WatchMay 12, 2023

Tension

85/ 100High tension

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