Wayne Greavette /// Part 2 /// 260 | Forensic Files

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[Music] % welcome to True Crime garage wherever you are whatever you are doing thanks
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the business all right everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer let's talk some true
[Music] crime [Music] after Wayne Gravette was murdered his wife Diane sold the farm that they had
purchased and moved to earlier that year she used $50,000 of the money to establish a
reward for information on Wayne's murder and set up a website to help gather information while tips did come in
detective Paul Johnson recently stated that today in 2018 while they have some Persons of Interest there are no
specific suspects and he will not name these Persons of Interest so essentially the case has stalled and they have tried
modern testing Technologies and these have failed to provide any more clues frankly no one knows if this was
something in Wayne's private life or whether it was Rel Rel ated to his business Diane Gravette maintains that
her husband was a quiet hardworking man devoted to his family he wasn't involved
in anything illegal adding they had a good family home she said I know he didn't hurt anybody we didn't rip
anybody off we didn't owe anybody any money sadly Diane may not have known her husband as well as she thought their
kids Danielle and Justin have realized that while they have fond memories of Wayne as a great family man and Dad
outside the home it was quite a different story it seems that quite a few people might have wanted to murder
Wayne Gravette all right yesterday we mentioned Affairs so let's dive in shall we over the course of the investigation
it became apparent that Wayne had multiple extramarital Affairs we know he was often away for work sometimes far
from home but Wayne also had affairs close to home and all of this was news to Diane we don't know the names and
identities of most of these women for obvious reasons but one friend of Diane's later told her that at one point
Wayne he snuck in a bed with her and pretended to be her husband and when she realized that it was not her husband she
kicked Wayne out of the bed but others apparently didn't kick him out and one was Lisa Irvin yeah Wayne had an affair
with her that lasted over 5 years starting back when they both worked at surge when this information emerged it
was especially hurtful to Diane who considered Lisa her best friend Diane says Lisa was at the house all the time
working with her and Wayne and it annoyed Diane that Wayne flirted with Lisa openly but she didn't think it was
anything more than that now after Wayne's death when Diane confronted Lisa Lisa said Wayne initiated the
relationship and she tried to break it off multiple times but quote he wouldn't let her end quote she finally left DNL
and Wayne in either 1993 or 1994 it's a little a little murky Lisa's relationship with other men were ruined
because of her affair with Wayne at the end of the affair Lisa was dating a guy named Rocky and police thought that
Rocky may have been the jealous type and Lisa and Rocky both gave hairs for DNA analysis and there was a man named Dean
whom Lisa was seeing during her affair with Wayne Wayne forced Lisa to dump this guy named Dean saying he would fire
her if she didn't mhm it's possible either of these men could be the culprit but we should mention one thing here uh
apparently according to Lisa Rocky was cheating on her as well you know so he's been labeled this jealous type but he
also was running around behind her back right Lisa stayed in close touch with the gretes after leaving the company and
after ending the affair even visiting the farm at least on one occasion she says she was intensely grilled by the
police after Wayne was killed she admits that she was terrified mainly because her name
appeared in the letter even if it was misspelled police seem not to have pursued the Lisa angle too
much in my opinion because in the documentary that was later made by the the CBC this unearth that Lisa's old
computer uh she still had this in her possession that police had not gone through this old computer it was like a
old work computer yes it contained business and financial records of Wayne's uh eventually after it was
uncovered during the of making this documentary it was then given to the police the police have stated publicly
that they feel that they have thoroughly and completely vetted Wayne's business Affairs but still lacked complete
information about the private side of his life so if he was with many other women on the side perhaps a jealous
husband had had enough aside from cheating is it possible Wayne was harboring another secret both Diane and
Justin told inves ators Wayne was acting odd in the months prior to his death mhm
according to to Diane Wayne became increasingly agitated in the months before acting paranoid refusing to
answer the phone and ignoring jobs that came up and ignoring angry customers well you also wonder too if he's having
all these Affairs was there ever a baby through one of these Affairs that's interesting there could have been a baby
the the other thing too is we talked yesterday that there was rumor or even people on the inside that seemed to
believe that Wayne was doing what we called Bad Business yes and it seems to me like he's dodging somebody and it it
feels to me like the most likely person to dodge while at work while not wanting
to answer the phone would be these angry customers angry clients that he was doing bad business with Diane says that
the uh close to the time of the murder this is pretty weird here that she got a phone call at the house at their home
from Bell Telephone Canada MH the caller asked Diane what their business was and
she told the caller about the beverage packaging equipment company MH now Wayne yelled at her to get off the phone and
warned her not to talk about their business to strangers this is weird because it
doesn't seem likely to me that the phone company would be calling or making this
kind of call um it could have just really been somebody fishing for information yeah
was Wayne actually living there working there all that jazz and in fact after Wayne's death Diane did call the company
back and they did deny ever having called the house then we have Justin Wayne's son
said that they received a call just weeks before Wayne was killed from someone wanting their address their new
address claiming they would receive free t-shirts in the mail mhm Justin says he
didn't fall for it and he hung up the phone never giving them the address one time a truck pulled into the
driveway and Wayne ran outside with a pool queue and chased the truck and it drove away so what I'm getting at here
Captain is all of these stories yeah what are you hitting at well all of these stories obviously seem to indicate
that Wayne was Wayne could have been worried about something somebody could have been
looking for Wayne yeah right calling the house a truck showing up and the the odd
thing too is we have the situation with the truck and Wayne chasing it off of the property that's my favorite one I
mean that that's a sign that you're you're paranoid about something mhm so was this
what I have a bit of confusion with though I would like to know regarding the telephone company I'd like to know
more about when that actually occurred when that phone call occurred because the problem that I'm having when I'm
going through Wayne in Diane's life is that it it sounds to me and it looks to me like they were trying to transition
away from being this uh repair company this equipment repair company/ Bottling Company uh it looked to me like they
were trying to move into the the water business into the bottled water business and I understand that that's you know
they're similar yeah this part of the story seems a little murky for me because it it seems on one hand that
this is like their last option we move out to this Farm it has a spring on it and this is this is going to save us
because the packaging and and all that stuff that business is not going so well that's going under that that's what it
seems to me but then it seems like maybe Wayne was still still trying to keep one
foot in that business and if he was scamming people maybe he was going to keep trying to scam people thinking that
he was safe by hiding out on this Farm yeah because the way that all three of these these stories that we just
reviewed all three you know without knowing any dates or any more specifics and these were stories that are relayed
from Diane and from Justin but without it more specifics we are led to believe that these are all incidents that
occurred once they move to this Farm once they move to this 104 Acre Farm they have the spring they're going to
bottle some water they're going to create their own bottled water company right and it it seems strange to me that
somebody's calling to to inquire about what their business is it almost felt to me like when when they moved that they
were leaving DNL behind that they were leaving their old business their old company behind they were going to start
this whole new thing like you said this is last call this is the last thing that
might be able to save us the other thing too 1996 when you think about it m if you started up a a bottled water company
in 96 or I mean even today this could be not just the thing to save you it could
be a lottery ticket yes you know it could turn into a big business yeah a guy I worked for for a while had a
spring on some property and it was at any point they could pull the trigger and this was a million doll idea mhm
well let's talk about some of his work relationships that we do know more specifics about okay starting with the
surge company that we've already mentioned the company that Wayne ultimately left uh this would be because
there was a dispute with the people that he worked with there specifically the owner of the company which was Ed gelic
Senior well technically it was his partner I believe yeah I I if feels like that but
to be 100% clear Ed was the was the sole owner of this company agreed he was the
head hono he was the boss he was the guy that at the end of the day he called the
shots um he there may have been some kind of partner relationship it sounds like to me that Wayne was uh paid a
little differently than most of us he wasn't technically an hourly guy wasn't technically a salary guy I believe he
had some ownership in the in the company well I think they paid him 10% of the uh
profits for the year so his his his work was based off of that pay structure right and their growth of the company
thus making him feel like some sort of owner or at least that he is has ownership of 10% of the company which I
know that when they had their falling out that there was money owed to Wayne yeah which could have been motive well
no but this money was paid so um it really could only be motive if if you didn't want to pay the money right okay
so this money was paid to him and as you were stating he he had some ownership I
didn't have a clear understanding of what that money paid was for but now that you said he had some ownership well
it's likely that that was part of their stipulation part of their their rules you know their contract that if at any
time I decide Wayne you have to leave the company well then Ed and surge in The Surge company has to pay you your
10% right you know not just for that year but pay you your 10% for the company so anyway let's just refer to Ed
Sor as Ed is that going to be too confusing because there's an ed Jor or little Ed that we'll talk about uh as we
go let's call him old man Ed Ed Senior Ed Senior okay Ed Senior and he's a he's a wacka
do but yeah um yeah that's I mean I don't know how else to say it I mean he is he is is on another planet well and I
hate here's here's the thing though I I kind of think Ed Jr or little Ed is a wackadoo as well um yeah the wackadoos
don't fall too far from the tree Wackadoo tree I hate to I hate to come at our victim here but for somebody that
worked so long with both of these individuals and was part business partners with one and had such a long
relationship with one I almost wonder was Wayne a wackadoo as well he was chasing after trucks with a pole stick
his property and he was moving to a property that had a spring to have a to bottled to have a bottle water C I think
are some wacka do ideas man I don't know I don't know what planet you're living on let's go with this because this
sounds more polite can we agree that Wayne I don't give a [ __ ] about being polite well he's I mean he was murdered
and his family members probably will listen to this when we title it Wayne Gravette I do give a [ __ ] about being
poite towards him yes but but yes I mean but also this is a situation where not only do you have a business owner but
you have a very close relationship and Ed Senior was kind of a mentor SL Father Figure type to Wayne so they had a very
close Bond MH and I just want to clean this up before we move on can we agree rather than Wayne being a wackadoo he
was sounds like the the type of man that marched to the beat of his own drum yeah
that sounds yeah that sounds more accurate to me yeah and I think his family would agree to the with that as
well and you're right about this Mentor maybe even fatherson type relationship between Ed Senor and Wayne Gravette
because Wayne was like 18 he's working at the seven up Bottling Company this is when he meets Ed Senior and at some
point Ed moves on to um creating his own business this surge company and eventually he will bring Wayne on with
him because Wayne was a hardworking dude he knew his stuff right and regardless to the beat of the drum that he marched
to everybody that knew a hardworking drum though said he was a hardworking dude and he was extremely intelligent
when it came to this industry when it came to working on these things being a part of the bottling industry so they
were very tight they played poker together they were drinking buddies they were you know B
uh working relationship all of that up until 1993 this was when the relationship just
went kaput and actually you can there there are several well I don't know if several there's at least one interview
but there's versions of this interview out there with Ed Senior and you can hear the way that he refers to their
working relationship he refers to it as a marriage pretty much because it was that lengthy and that close of a
relationship to the point where he says this is when we got our divorce was in 1993 this is when we parted ways well
that's what it is I mean we deal with that all the time you know with the podcast getting bigger and bigger I mean
feels like we're married sometimes at some point they brought on Diane Wayne's wife as an employee of the
company Ed demanded that Wayne fire her this seems to be what led them down the road of them partying ways uh whether it
be Wayne got difficult to work with I can tell you this the vibe I get from the interview with Ed Senior that I've
seen several versions of listen to some versions of he seems a little difficult to get along with even on a good day
yeah he's he's laughing the whole time in the interview which comes across as a little strange because he is talking to
the victim's family but they're also you you could argue that they're family friends in a sense so the way
he's going to talk to them is going to be different and maybe he's trying to ease up some of the tension because
there are they're talking about the murder of their father um but he does laugh sometimes where it's just like
this is a little strange well and the whole purpose of bringing up Ed Senior and then Ed Jr is a couple things
because when we when we dive into this investigation the investigators have outrightly stated that that it's either
business or personal that led to this bomb being mailed to his home but it seems like law enforcement is an
agreement with us where we find that this is probably done by a male more likely done by a male so if it's going
to be personal relationships it's going to be coming from a jealous husband or boyfriend and that but if it comes from
the business angle that it's still coming from a male they've cited that it could be from business with the spring
water you know the upstart that they were doing could be with DNL or it could be with the surge company and I think
when you break down the Simplicity of the thought that your suspect your perpetrator May lie within one of those
businesses is this if it were someone in connection to the spring water it would
to me either be one of two things uh future competitor you know somebody that believed that that he was going to steal
some business from them or or maybe a a a conservationist right but yeah and if you look at the letter though if you
think that the letter means anything I would argue that it seems like there's nothing to do with a spring and also
just because you have a spring you are a very far like I said I worked for a guy
that had a spring he would always talk about how if they wanted to pull the trigger they would mhm and well when you
work for the guy and your my job was to help him make money at all his companies
M so don't you think I said well let's pull the trigger right and you know what his reply was you know how much work
that's going to take so it became it went from well I do know how much work it's going to take and I can tell you
why because if you stop what you're doing right now you go to True Crim garage.com you can order a case of
purified True Crime garage spring water and guess what not only did the captain package it and ship it I put it in the
bottles myself I got I got four hoses that come off the side of my home don't trust that water don't trust that water
it's it'll get you high as a kite that water is a crime let me tell you no but so it went from well we just pull the
trigger and we're multi-millionaires too there is a lot of red tape and so I even
think if you go from like this activist standpoint where you're going to take this uh spring water again if you think
the letter has any relevance than where where in the letter would that you know Point toward towards uh
some activist trying to stop him from bottling this water again it seems I I think you're really hitting on something
here because not only did I do I believe that the letter was more of a way to increase the likelihood of Wayne
actually flipping that switch and exploding the the flashlight right but the reference of Le and the reference of
he doesn't just say the the letter writer doesn't just say Lisa and Joe it says Lisa and Joe your delivery man
right references his name and attaches it to a title or to a job well here's a question that I have though we know that
Lisa came from Serge right do we know if Joe came from Serge because one of the interesting things with Ed
Senior you know Wayne's business partner let's say mhm is in his state statements
when he's talking to his when he's talking to Wayne's daughter and Wayne's son he says I live on this property that
I have to sometimes shoot deer M but I can't even shoot them right so I have to Brin somebody else
in um and that makes me wonder and that doesn't make me wonder did he make the bomb uh I think he would hire possibly
somebody to do this and it's just such a weird statement and and if you can find that online I just
think that's something um I think that's very telling regarding Joe I'm glad that you asked me that
because all along the way here I felt like not only did Lisa come from The Surge company and go to DNL but also Joe
did as well and I believe that I read that somewhere but when I went to backtrack when I went to look back and
try to confirm that I had read that somewhere I couldn't find it again when you try to pull a job Rule and back it
up that's right and you know we review so much material for this stuff sometimes it's hard to remember or put a
put a place on where you believe that you've read something my guess is yes that this is more of a Michael Scott
type situation where he's working for Dunder Mifflin and I think he quits or he gets fired or whatever he goes off
and starts up the Michael Scott paper company and he's trying to pull some of the employees and take them from Dunder
mithin to come work for him and his new company and he's trying to steal and siphon off some of their clients as well
right so that would be the motive for Ed Senior is that hey we're not working together anymore we don't have this
close-knit relationship anymore you're trying to undercut me you're trying to steal my business um and you made things
difficult on me anyways by leaving so I want you dead well and you but I think you're also trying to point out that the
letter mentions Joe and mentions a title job title for Joe and would Ed Senior have known Joe would would Joe have
worked for him at any point right my guess is is just that yes and that leads us back to one of the biggest questions
in this whole case does the letter mean something and if you believe that the the letter does mean something then
which you have to because Lisa and Joe are not just named by chance they didn't just pull those two names out of thin
air and it happened to do something with Wayne's life no this was all something from before from before the spring the
bottled you know water business so therefore when you talk about if this is work rated is it related to Spring Water
to DNL to The Surge company I think you can rule out the bottled water I believe
so too and I think you have to stick more with packaging if this is business related it's coming from DNL or The
Surge company right but DNL is basically kind of offshoot of the surge stuff so but again that would be the motive for
Ed Senior mhm so then what about Ed Jr what's his motive um I to be honest with you I don't know that I understand 100%
what either of their motives would be but a possibility here is once Wayne left the surge company mhm we have Ed Jr
who had been in and out of the surge company for years he's brought back to the surge company and he basically takes
over Wayne's position working for his father Ed Senior right and so Ed Senior actually he brings up this idea that
possibly they had multiple falling outs he didn't like his son at all his son didn't like him which is hilarious cuz
you named your son after yourself and then that's funny when that works out that way well he liked him the day he
named him right and then uh he grew up to be an [ __ ] just like you and so at some point they have these big falling
outs and so Ed Senior thinks that maybe it was I will get rid of Wayne this will
look bad towards my father because they had a falling out of their business possibly my father gets arrested for
this and now Wayne's gone my father is in jail and I get to take over the business myself and that's that's
something that is suggested during this very strange interview as he's laughing multiple times lot more to get to after
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[Music] today all right cheers MIM I'm enjoying some true crime garage bottled water straight from the hose it's
fantastic in the course of their investigation into Wayne's death the CBC and Wayne's family brought to light a
murder that could be related and this is Paul henin he was murdered on May 16 2002 under mysterious circumstances Paul
knew Wayne he worked in the same packaging industry and even bought parts from Wayne and used to play a regular
poker game with Wayne and others in that industry Paul was at a pub the evening that he was murdered and was dropped off
by a taxi just after midnight at his apartment although some Reports say it was at his company
Warehouse regardless he was stabbed 14 times and left for dead police found his green 1997 Chevy pickup nearby a few
days later and found a palm print and several DNA profiles in it but the case has never been solved apparently at the
time the police never considered whether the two murders were connected they said
that a large amount of money went missing around the time of Paul's murder they believe that Paul knew the people
that killed him or the person that killed him and it was personal and not connected to Wayne all we know is that
Paul and Wayne knew each other worked in the same industry and were B both murdered in unsolved cases about six
years apart yeah but way different kinds of murders one is from a distance not being able to
see ones up close stabbing this is somebody that does not mind getting their hands dirty and quote unquote a
large amount of money missing you know we don't know what that money was what it was tied to but uh or how much it was
but that is always listed when anytime we look up or look into Paul hinton's murder yeah the the difficult thing here
for me though is the records of Wayne and how he kept his records for his business and and having
it be a small business MH we're never going to know if there was a chunk of money missing or money that was supposed
to be paid back to somebody we we might just not know because of how the books were kept well and from my understanding
that is that Wayne operated his business when he was out to repair something install something sell something to
somebody he operated under a 50410 payment method and what that meant was that the client or customer would
pay 50% upfront when they agreed to have the work done 40% upon the completion of
the work or the delivery and then 10% would later be build 30 days out mhm the problem with this is not so much the
billing method but we have individuals including his family and co-workers and people that worked for him that said
that it would not be terribly unusual for Wayne to do something off the books right and this is where the thought
comes in that maybe Wayne conducted quote unquote bad business with people meaning he could sell somebody something
sell some equipment or prep something or do some work for somebody and say you know what just pay me under the table
and the thought of the bad business is maybe he was charging people for things up front and because it was on the DL he
would never deliver he would never come through with what they agreed upon and he would just pocket the money and
Paul's hit could have possibly been a hit and that kind of G leads us into this idea of a man came forward that
worked in the industry and he said Hey look $5,000 $10,000 that's no big deal in our
industry mhm but it could get you killed yeah some people will kill somebody for
five to $110,000 well and the rumor that he States is that he heard that the bombing was a hired job and they hired
the Hell's Angels well there there are actually several biker gangs let's say or biker clubs or group groups whatever
you want to refer to them as that have been rumored to have been involved in Wayne's death I think the strange thing
here to me Captain is I wonder personally if this just is like Wayne drove a Harley he he had he had a Harley
he was a motorcycle guy is this like the is this one more way to kind of tie this
in because and and Wayne was a loud man he was kind of a [ __ ] talker mhm so is this where it comes from well and he
he was at bars and poker games I to me I I feel like if he got loud or aggressive
with somebody in a biker club that that person would have just straightened him out right there on the
spot this isn't something that I I I can't believe that any of these type of gangs would be like oh well let's just
sit on this for months or years and we'll send a bomb to his his family's home and that being the key word family
in there because with a lot of these situations including you know Irish mob Italian mafia All That Jazz if you if
you are in one of these gangs even if they are a violent gang or if they are a mob or Mafia that will do things uh
violently causing someone's death at the end of the day these men regardless of how violent they are they are
individuals that have families themselves and the way that the the thought is of
most of these individuals would be that they wouldn't risk harming somebody that
was innocent to settle a debt or to gain revenge on someone well I agree with you
mostly on that I do want to bring up the idea and it even states in the letter had a hard time finding you so if you
need to settle a score and you can't find that person that this maybe is not so much a counter a cowardly way but
that you just can't make contact with this individual and so is this something they would do and then that started
making me wonder the Acton home what was the name of the company again Acton home
Pro uh products okay neither one of us can talk today um does that does the ahp stand for something possibly some form
of um biker gang or something well so there there's a couple of thoughts in and around this whole Theory itself is
that could this be linked to a biker gang could this have been a hit the other thing that people have considered
and discussed was was Wayne getting into some hardcore drugs and was drugs the link to his actual murder yeah he was an
avid pot smoker and he was known to sell pot to people but family and friends say
never heard him talk about anything of a harder drug or or anything like that now I went down all of these
roads when looking into this case and if if we go into each one of these we could be talking about this case for
four or five hours M if anybody wants to look into those angles I recommend it however take this with you along the way
or consider this before going down these roads what I found when we cover these cases and in my you know long history of
reading about true crime is usually Captain I find that when something is linked to a biker gang to the mafia or
to drugs it's pretty easily connected by police they may not they may not know the exact culprit they might may not
know the individual or the exact individuals responsible right but usually in these investigations you can
get the vibe from investigators from the detectives fairly early on that they they know they they they'll say hey we
believe this is drug related right they know the entity that's responsible right
and without any exact proof of him having doing any harder anything harder than marijuana I mean look I've seen it
I've seen investigators go down that road to and it just it usually doesn't pan out there's usually something very
obvious from the get- go that it's one of those things and I think when we have limited time here to discuss the
possibilities and discuss discuss the theories MH I think that spending too much time on those there just doesn't
seem to be enough there for me right and this guy that came forward I think he might just believe the rumor he heard I
think everything that that we have here is something linked to Wayne's work all right so let's get into your your
thoughts your opinions well and what I mean by that is not necessarily solely related to his work what I mean is that
something I believe whoever sent this bomb to his home whoever's responsible for this I believe that the the tension
whatever led to this individual taking this action it happened during the course of his time with surge or his
time with DNL and the reason why I say that is simply because of the names Lisa and Joe listed on the letter right and
also the letter is also indicating hey you've done work for us before we're looking for you to do work for us in the
future blah blah blah you see what I mean it it feels like there's something in that time period of his life that is
a connection there it could be the problem with this case is there's so many possibilities and what I mean by
that is to simplify them it's either business or personal personal Affairs who knows how many Affairs this guy had
MH and then when it comes down play on player when it comes down to business I really feel like it's DNL or surge but
at the same time it feels like to me that working for the surge company and his owning his own company of DNL
allowed him to have some of these Affairs as well so I firmly believe that it's something based around those to be
honest with you Captain at the end of the day I kind of feel like Ed Senior and Ed Jr might be the ones here and the
reason why I say that is for a couple of reasons we have two individuals that seem to have been inquiring about
Wayne's address MH if you look at those composits and I now mind you I'm looking
at pictures of Ed Jr and Ed Senior from 2016 2017 but if you can kind of play back
the tape go 20 years ago these guys kind of look like the composite drawings right especially Ed Junior right and
there's two drawings and to have two individuals that work together that are related to look like the drawings that's
kind of a coincidence yeah I mean when you look at the structure of Ed Junior's face his haircut and his his neck the
size of his neck MH that looks to me like the composite of the younger man what I would say label as the younger
man of the two composits the older individual appears to me to be a Ed Senior from 20 years ago it's a similar
style hair similar style face the only difference is I you there are there are glasses being worn by the person in the
composite drawing and I can't say for certain if I recall if Ed Senior was wearing glasses now I saw and you have
as well and I've listened to interviews with both of these individuals senior and Junior the thing is when I'm
watching these or listening to him I do need to keep in mind I've only seen edited versions of these interviews this
is not like watching them start to finish right it's edited versions The troubling thing for me here is while
both of them seem somewhat candid when they sit down and are willing to talk with the families and talk with the CBC
regarding these uh regarding this murder both of them do do two things that I I find are intriguing they both
say I couldn't have murdered him in fact I couldn't kill anybody at all and then
two both of them es especially Ed Senior Ed Senior seems to spend a lot of time telling them of what roads he would go
down other possible suspects yeah and and even naming his son as one look he might just be trying to be helpful or at
the same time he might be trying to steer uh the spotlight away from himself well law enforcement did say that they
gave certain suspects polygraphs but they weren't going to go into that information now Ed Jr claims that his
father brags about taking a polygraph and passing that well he says in one of those interviews that he gave several
polygraphs right but we don't know that that's what happened and Ed JR says that
they never even brought up the word polygraph to him yeah so a curious thing here is we have Ed Senior telling the
CBC he says well you know they asked me uh about DNA they ask me why they would have found hairs of mine on the farm on
now mind you they just moved to this Farm 6 months before his murder mhm at senior has never been to this farm so
why would they find hairs of his on the farm and he States well you know that he
would this guy was was was a crook all the time playing games whatever he would steal my baseball caps and wear you know
I'd have a hat missing and then the next day I'd see him wearing it right and I thought oh well I need a new hat so he
has an answer for why they would find hair at his farm well he has an answer for everything what I think's a little
telling there though when we go back to many of the cases that we've covered but
let's look at one specifically the West Memphis 3 case we know the what was it a
page of nine questions that the FBI formulated for the local police and invest investigators to ask people while
they were canvasing the neighborhood one of those questions was why would DNA or
why would evidence of you be found at the crime scene my where my head goes with this Captain is what if during the
course of Ed Senior being interviewed they're not telling him that they found his hair there right they're simply
stating why would we find your hair at the crime scene why would we find your hair at their farm and he has an answer
for that why why isn't again this is a edited interview but why isn't that answer going well I was never at the
farm that's the answer they're looking for to clear you I was never at the farm so you wouldn't have found my hair there
right no instead he has a way to get his hair from off of the top of his head all
the way to that farm that he's never been to the other weird thing too is when Ed Jr's
talking he says and I swear during the course of the interiew interview I heard him say that he had
drove by the farm on one occasion MH and he he references that oh I said to myself that looks like a nice place but
we have both of these individuals saying that they lost touch with Wayne for about three years right but you drove by
his home and how did you know where he lived and then you have let's back it up even more you have Ed Senior he says in
interview oh I kind of lost track for him completely for 2 years well they didn't work together they had their
falling out over three years before his murder he says in that first year he was
keeping tabs on Wayne because of what I reverenced earlier the Michael Scott situation where Wayne is taking his
employees and trying to take his clients and customers as well MH and so he kept
tabs on him for about a year Well likely Ed Senior could have have known that Lisa left and went to work
for Wayne without keeping tabs he could have known that Joe left and went to work for Wayne without keeping tabs but
having kept tabs he 100% would know this mhm what about what did did you hear the
slip in Ed Jr's interview where he's where he talks about the falling the last falling out between him and his
father and he says that they got into some type of argument and he says I never saw my father act that way before
I never saw him that mad right and he said to me that I will do the same and then Ed
these are Ed Junior's words talking about his father saying Ed Senior said I will do I will do the same or the same
thing and then he cuts himself off and he says he basically said he would kill me right was he about to say that that
his father told him the same thing that happened to Wayne is going to happen to you
right which is weird like and it's almost like he catches himself and stops that statement now it could have been a
slip of the tongue did I say every word perfectly today no every sentence perfectly today no maybe on episode
975 but but maybe if I edit for six hours but what I'm getting at it seemed like almost a weird slip there to me
that there's weird slips in both of their interviews yeah I think and and the thing you pointed out especially
with Ed Senior Ed Jor does it a little bit too but Ed Senor does that crazy laugh at the end of every statement well
I also believe he's wearing a hearing aid so that could affect uh how he's delivering uh his message on certain
things true so so you know be cautious of that but I think what would be really interesting especially during this
documentary if they could have got Wackadoo one and Wackadoo Jr into a room and see what kind of chemistry would
happen and what kind of stories they would tell and what kind of slip-ups they would they
tell but you said something that I fully agree with both stated they couldn't kill somebody well sending a bomb you
are killing somebody but you're not doing the ACT yourself right uh you ask senior who's smart enough to do this oh
my son could he could do anything so uh so that kind of feel like a slip as well but also the thing that really
bothers me is the fact that senior can point to Junior and say um he could have done this and this is why he would have
and then Junior basically says the same thing about his father and maybe they did some um investiga you know here's a
here's my big thing about this investigation that I don't like they had several suspects and they would said you
know we we would find out their aliis look sometimes with these cases is The Alibi is willing to lie for the
person at the time but if you go back later and start redigging will that person then tell you I don't know if he
was there or not would that alibi crumble mhm well that's what makes this case interesting and unique compared to
a lot of other cases that we've covered the whole thought of The Alibi what kind
of Alibi do you need when a random package shows up that turns out to be a bomb very good point and the thing here
too is back to the hairs back to and this is Ed senior's words this is not me just coming up with this this is them
saying well not making up some words why would we have found your hair at their farm and he says well he he had all my
old baseball hats you know my old ball caps he he would take them and they probably had some hairs in there well
guess the whole thing when we talked about what evidence could we find in the letter the packaging the bomb itself
there were two hairs that were found underneath the tape on the box itself on the packaging for this bomb what do we
have here we have Ed Senior explaining away why his hair would be found at the farm we also have Ed Jr that later
States look they came to me asking me a whole bunch of questions they asked me to submit DNA they asked me to submit
hair samples I answered some of their questions I refused to give them DNA I refused to give my hair samples I told
him if you're knocking on my door then you're way off the path right just give them your hair man right give them your
hair if they're way off the path and both these dudes got money you know I know I know at least Ed Senior does I I
I feel like Ed junor probably does lawyer up give him your hair quit being Shifty it's it's weird too again again
with the whole thing of Ed Senior Throwing Shade any chance he gets he's sitting in front of the children of his
dead friend of his murdered friend one-time friend M and he says you somebody that he even States was more of
a son to him than his own son yeah and he says he was a pig he was he was a womanizer he was he was a thief he was a
criminal you know he was a crook he and what he's doing in my opinion is he's pointing out a million reasons why it's
anybody else other than him to the to the damn point that he would even take his own son throw him under the bus and
say my son's smart enough to do this I don't think that he did I don't think he has it in his heart but I went down that
path myself is what he says yeah and on top of that the thing that you just pointed out is key here just because
these two individuals say I couldn't have killed anybody guess what that's exactly who they are looking for who the
police are looking for if the P if the psychology of past bombers translates to this case that's exactly who they're
looking for someone that doesn't have the ability to strangle someone stab someone shoot someone face to face mhm
or even have the guts to be in the same room with them when this goes down well let me just tell you something the jury
they deliberated they're back from lunch my friend the verdict is out J the verdict is
in you guys are wackadoos well you you know what is wacky is it throughout the course of the short interview with Ed Jr
he constantly says this the phrase I was blown away that blew me away over and over again when he's talking about
things related to his father and related to the case right and it's weird to me and I know that it's likely just a slip
or maybe it's just a common phrase that he uses often throughout his life but we're talking about a murdered victim
who was blown up right was it a subconscious slip right [Music] no recommended reading this week but if
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garage next week until then be good be kind and don't litter [Music] [Applause] [Music]
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Wayne Greavette /// Part 2 /// 260

Part 2 of 2

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Husband and Father Wayne Greavette received a gift unexpectedly. It was a neatly prepared package delivered to his mailbox. The package was brought into his home. Wayne opened the box with his family in the room. Inside he found a large flashlight and letter. Wayne flicked the ON switch of the flashlight and BOOM it exploded! Beer of the Week - Clockwork Tangerine by BrewDog Garage Grade - 4 and a half bottle caps out of 5

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Brief Summary

Wayne Gravette's murder involves extramarital affairs, business disputes, and mysterious circumstances surrounding his death.

Key points

Wayne Gravette's Murder Investigation. After Wayne's murder, his wife Diane offered a reward for information, but the case stalled.
Wayne's Extramarital Affairs. Wayne had multiple affairs, including one with Diane's best friend, Lisa.
Strange Phone Calls. Diane received odd phone calls before Wayne's murder, raising suspicions.
Family Ties and Tensions. The relationship between Ed Senior and Ed Jr raises questions about motives in Wayne's murder.
Mysterious Murder Connection. Paul Henin, a friend of Wayne, was murdered under mysterious circumstances. His death raises questions about potential connections to Wayne's case.
Suspicious Business Practices. Wayne's business dealings raise suspicions of bad business practices, potentially linking him to unsolved murders.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

I know he didn't hurt anybody.

Diane Gravette reflects on her husband Wayne's character.

4:46WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

65/ 100Some tension

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