The Burger Chef Murders, Part 2 | Morbid | Forensic Files

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you get your podcasts hey weirdos it's me it's Elena what's going on how was your day I hope it's
awesome that's all I wanted to say no I'm just kidding this is a message because I think a couple of episodes ago
we talked about how we are going back to the OG way of doing things we're doing two episodes a week two big old honking
delicious juicy episodes with one listener tale a month just as a little Cherry a little glitter on top of a
crazy month and we're going to keep doing that but I think we were also debating what days would be best for
this new two episode a week Cadence because we figured you know from Wednesday to Monday is a long wait for
us and for you too much we'd all be sad we don't want that so we finally came up
with a good Cadence we're gonna drop episodes on Monday and Thursday from here on out so Mondays Thursdays that's
when they'll come out on one degree plus then a week later you will get them Monday and Thursday for everybody else
so that's what we're gonna do you deserve consistency we want to give it to you I
know we didn't do that in the first like three years we were like willy nilly whenever you get episodes here it is but
you know we're in that consistency train and we want to stay on that and yeah I think this is going to work for
everybody it just feels better we don't want that big chunk of time between episodes you don't either
um so yeah that's what we're gonna do Mondays Thursdays new episodes we're excited about it it lets us really put
more time and effort into these episodes which is what they deserve and what you
deserve and we [ __ ] love you and I can't wait to see you every Monday and Thursday I know I won't see you I
realize that I won't even hear you but it feels like I will and you will hear me so we're all in this together we're
best friends thanks guys Mondays Thursdays hey weirdos I'm Elena I'm Ash and this
is morbid [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] last night live in Somerville and Somerville kids and we got to meet some
of our [ __ ] podcast babies it was beautiful it was elegant you're you probably saw a picture it looks like the
Last Supper but awesome the Last Supper but better but awesome because there's no Brutus oh oh the
Ash's microphone is literally attempting to assault her it's falling off of the table Mikey to
the rescue please he's gonna fix it all right we're back in better than ever and
owner's had a correction it's also it's Judas I know it's Judas Brutus says the Caesar one I you know Judas Brutus
they're all betraying people yeah I like Caesar dressing am I right yeah that's my hot take a small take today love I
also love Caesar dressing as long as it's not too fishy yeah that's [ __ ] foul sometimes we should get one that's
like oh that's a lot of anchovy oh my gosh I was gonna say do you know why I wanted to tell you something it's really
hard to tell you something that you don't already know that you don't already know no it's a lot of souls
coming out today I am we are both on like three hours of sleep yeah because we we got to party hardy with our
[ __ ] friends yeah it was wild like I got to be an adult and go out and by party hardy I mean Elena ordered a
Shirley Temple just like a straight up Shirley Temple I know yeah nothing added to it and it was great I'm happy about
that you know what Madison taught me last night Madison from um obituary which you should go see and buy tickets
to plug plug they are amazing she taught me to mix and I think it's a Harry Style
song to mix um Diet Coke and red wine and um Cabernet specifically sounds like absolutely disgusting in the
towel and I was like I trust you I took a sip life-changing it's it sounds [ __ ]
crazy it's so good I just hate diet anything it doesn't but it doesn't end up tasting diet because the I mean I
like Diet Coke I was gonna say I literally hate the taste of Diet Coke well you could do it with regular Coke
yeah it almost has like a sangria Vibe oh that's interesting yeah you should you should try it you should try it try
stop copying me oh oh yeah I got yelled at I I accidentally because I don't look
at any like I usually don't see any comments because I'm just like uh I don't go on the internet anymore but if
you go on the internet to post what we want to post exactly how you get that bread I'm out and I happen to be on
Instagram and I got one of those like Banner notifications and it was somebody on a morbid post being like hey has
anyone else noticed how [ __ ] annoying Elena is that she just repeats it all the funny things that that Ash says in a
like different voice and I was like they said has anyone else known yeah has anyone else noticed how annoying Elaine
is and I was like why are you here I was like what did that get you sometimes I wonder if people think that's kind of
like endear me to them and I mean like oh my God like I know she sucks you're so nice for saying that it's like no no
Ash [ __ ] hates you yeah [ __ ] pots like I got like whatever it's like pit us against each other I'm
like what kind of work do you think Ash is gonna like you for that like ash is like we ride a dawn for each other like
if you're not like we could like punch each other in the face one day like we never have we never but we could and
then Elena could call me and be like hey I need you and I'd be like what time yeah let's go like I'm here actually so
who's Kyle we taking who's how are we taking I feel like I can't say that because I've never seen that movie
that's a great movie but is that the town but yeah yeah it is the town hey look at me yeah so I just you know I
just was like wow okay you need to um you need to sign out of The Morbid account I do need to because then you
don't get those Banner notifications because that was the problem I don't go looking because whenever I do I
accidentally that's the only thing you'll see is now you'll miss all the nice things that people say yeah which
is sad and you only will see that one nasty one because they always make sure to be like you know has anyone noticed
that Elena is annoying and I'm like okay um so sign out of that but then you might need to also because I need to do
this you might need to unfollow morbid which is so sad I'm so sad but I follow morbid because like it's my podcast
say it yes my podcast oh my God you're so annoying you're so annoying but so I'll like scroll by and it gives you
like that like little like two or three comments I always see the meanest thing why can't Ash speak yeah and I'm like
because brain damage okay I don't know those are always the ones that show and I'm like Wow Instagram like that's fake
as [ __ ] why do you just show me the mean one I saw one recently that was like Wow
has a podcast but she can't [ __ ] talk all right well there's two of us for when I can't talk and I just gotta ask
again I know we've all asked this before what's wrong with you like who does that
like who just goes like what do you get out of that like that girl who was like has anyone noticed that Elena's annoying
I'm like even if you gathered an army of people that were like we are the Riders
of Elena being annoying and you started a group and you had meetings and like you had like a special handshake that
you did like do you feel good like what what else what are you getting out of it
also why are you doing a census on my post that's the thing and it's like on my post that's annoying in the mail I
don't need it on my post but and also that that person followed me and I was like all right well hate following is a
thing that people love to do well it's a it's a hate following it's like you love
me I was literally like sounds like someone protests too much though I don't think you find me annoying I think you
like me I know it's like it's one of those things where you're like oh my God you shouldn't pay it any mind like of
course but sometimes you just gotta vented out which that's the thing it's like normally like we've really gotten
to a point years through this that we don't pay it any Minds like the constructive stuff sure but like totally
just people being dicks like that like that's not constructive at all like you can [ __ ] yourself that's just but like
like listen to it that kind of [ __ ] is like you're just you're being an [ __ ]
for the sake of being an [ __ ] and I don't know what you got out of it but I sure hope it gave you some kind of jolly
because I hope it sounds like you need it well also you're just like creating a negative space for yourself and yeah
like I speak from experience if you put things out into the world that are negative even if you're not talking [ __ ]
like even if you're just talking negatively comes back to you it's true and then you're just attracting negative
negative karma is the thing man attractive that's why we're and and you know it took like a while to get here
but that's why we're in a place where we're just like you know what whatever and we're also in a place of
just like we're gonna keep trying to like build people up that deserve to be built up like that's why we shout out
different creators for you guys to go check out and you're also because that's what queen of that I don't even do that
as much as you like you're so philanthropic no it's just fun and it's really fun to see when like like
especially on Tick Tock I've been seeing it lately and it's like really making me
happy you guys like [ __ ] kill it yeah because like morbid listeners will go follow these people that we mentioned
right and then they'll be like oh I got I came here from morbid and it's so fun to see because then it's like they are
and they're always like oh I'm so excited to have found this this is so fun and it's like I love like blowing
those people up you know what that's called Community that's called Community that's called by brothers in Christ hell
yeah that's what we are that's called my brothers and Buddhism you guys are the real ones so don't think that we take
like the the is an Elena annoying ones as like our listeners that's that's yeah exactly like you guys are the real
ones we know who you are we know that we know who this community is we met a lot
of you last night it was so cool it was wonderful that you guys are magical that
will never not be cool yeah so we know who you are so don't worry they don't represent you but anyways I just wanted
to put it out there that like you know if you're doing that kind of [ __ ] on the
internet like you might you you should probably reevaluate where you sit in life because that's a really pathetic
thing to do one more thing what I just have to tell you if you're doing that I'm literally just picturing you sitting
in a crusty basement picking your toe cheese that's actually very true that's exactly because I'm like you're not
happy and I know you yeah fungal infection and I'm sorry about it but because all the times in your life that you have
talked [ __ ] like that or been somebody like that when like you're younger all that it was always in the worst [ __ ]
times of yourself it was never when you were happy it was never when you were a fulfilled person and that's why I'm just
like wow that's sad no I can honestly that's a bummer for you I have never written a nasty comment yeah somebody
else's Instagram I'm so strange what the [ __ ] is wrong with you have I sub tweeted many many many people in my day
abso [ __ ] lutely but I'm not going on podcasts being like Oh one time in our breakup stage and he texted me
and he was like did you just [ __ ] sub tweet me and I was like I don't know what the [ __ ] you're talking about like
I don't even know what a sub tweet is true are you okay he's like we dated for a year and a half I know you're the sub
tweet Queen of the century like I don't know him look who are you and then I'm like wait I love you married oh love I
know what a what a wild drive so lots of Wild Ride [Music] a few days before Christmas Janelle
Matthews disappeared from her home there were no signs of a struggle no eyewitnesses no DNA recovered but what
if the answer had always been there what if a true crime fanatic had been talking about the case was more than
just an obsessive fan the groundbreaking True Crime podcast suspect is back with a new story that
attempts to separate fact from fiction and one man's True Crime Obsession from a motive for murder he says don't work
with me officer Edgerton I've buried more people than you'll know he's providing information that hadn't even
been released to the news yet he's just a good liar that he can convince the juror that he wasn't involved follow
suspect wherever you get your podcasts hey Prime members you can binge the entire series ad free on Amazon music
download the Amazon music app today all right so we're in part two of another case we're in part two of The
Burger Chef murders this is a really sad one yeah it is um it's a bummer it's technically still unsolved which is
always a hard pill to swallow I love it though when you say technically because then I get a little flutter yeah because
it's like we got a pretty viable suspect I never I don't think I ever knew that yeah that's a pretty viable one sorry
did they come about recently or have they been no it's been out there and we'll talk about them but it's one of
those things where you just can't pin it it's like like probably because they um
washed down the crimes yeah that might have something there was that whole whole nonsense like didn't investigate
for like a minute yeah for for a solid minute but brief period of time but bye so at the end of the of part one I was
talking about how you know they really had exhausted the few leads that they got and the state police had actually
publicly stated in this case we've got to hope that the killer Killers may have told someone who has a conscience who
will come forward so they're not even hoping now that the killer has a conscience they're hoping that the
person that the killer tells this to they have a conscience and they come forward also some killers are like
pretty good at Secrets yeah so that's you should probably that tends to be like one of their their main traits I
feel like they should explore other avenues yeah investigative work you never want to hear investigators go well
the thing we're banking on is that this guy just straight up confesses to someone you might be waiting a while and
not only that confesses to someone that has a conscience it's like that's a lot I don't want to rest all of my hopes and
dreams on that I'd rather rest it on like you investigating the case same you know but either way that sucks so I had
mentioned it before but in 1978 Speedway police were dealing with a lot more [ __ ]
than they normally did this super small Midwestern town was really being pushed like to the limit of
its resources we mentioned in part one that there was these random horrific bombings yeah that were seeming and were
ended up being connected to uh the murder of a woman and that woman was 69 year old housewife Julius skifers she
was shot to death under very mysterious circumstances the bombings that followed were just
more stress and mystery added on to this whole thing they happened in sept on September 1st three bombings happened in
Speedway that Saturday there were two more and then another one the next day and the last one happened the following
day at Speedway High School oh my God so it was just constant a bombing is like one of my biggest yeah and they just
don't know they were being put in like uh trash cans and stuff and at the high school I think they were found in like a
gym bag like somebody picked up a gym bag and it exploded oh my God and like people were wounded by shrapnel like it
was tough and you said they went unsolved too right the bombings they did for a while so these crimes were taking
up all the resources in time that this really small town PD had to offer um they were not able to muster up a
whole lot more for anything else and as November turned to December state and local police were really just grasping
at anything that could take the Burger Chef case forward they just had nothing often but they were not entirely without
leads because Speedway police were continuing to receive leads from the public from telephone calls letters and
in the end they actually produced at least 36 leads that they could deem at least slightly credible which isn't a
whole lot but really the best leads that they had were the tip from that young couple who had been approached by those
two men in the parking lot of the Burger Chef because they were talking and this
was up because they went neck and uh because and this was like an hour or so before the robbery and kidnapping
occurred so this was a pretty good witness statement to have the police department didn't have a sketch artist
on Chef Rocco on Chef on staff I didn't even catch I'm tired I need more caffeine uh but they they also didn't
have the funds or resources available to get a professional one right so detectives found and hired Robin England
who was an art student at Ball State University Ball State also was the niece of one of the investigators on the case
and they were willing to to create sculpture busts from the descriptions that were provided by the witnesses and
those Witnesses later said that the bus were quote between 95 and 100 accurate wow bus are always so interesting to me
these buses are a very interesting looking bus oh I will say I saw that little stuff that little glimmer in
Europe they're very interesting looking um and a composite drawing was made from
the bus and it was circulated throughout the press okay now and then again we have
the witnesses saying that these are very accurate so that means that the composite images are pretty accurate 95
to 100 that's huge right and they were at one point we're going to see that they were able to find a couple of guys
that literally are like dead ringers for these guys and somehow they weren't able
to place them in Speedway at the time of the murders and it like shocked me are they an assessment no so photographs of
these bus were circulated around the media and a statement from State Police Sergeant Chuck Hibbert was released
saying we are not calling these two men suspects we just want to talk to them yeah it's off the Record it's fine
um so but beside these witness statements and witness accounts this was really the biggest evidence they had was
these composite images so detectives hope that publishing them was maybe gonna jog
someone's memory around that time someone from the public that was around the Burger Chef had maybe caught glimpse
of these guys and seeing the composite image was going to make them go oh [ __ ]
yeah I did see them and they were hoping this person would come forward help with
an ID however the image is definitely prompted people to call in about 600 calls to police wow none of them
produced a concrete lead not one now do you think that was because the tip sucked or do you think that was because
the police department sucked I don't know that's the thing combination honestly that is that's kind of the
theme of this case everyone sucks it's like could it have been solved if they just did their jobs better yes and it's
like yeah I think so I think I said it last time or it might have been after we finished recording if they hadn't
cleaned up that crime scene they could have dusted for Prince and obviously maybe couldn't have done a lot with them
back then but now yeah boom boom we'd have them and it's like at this point we have no idea what evidence was left at
that scene nothing there could have been DNA at that scene there could have been
anything at that scene there could have been hell there could have been a phone they could have taken a Polaroid
photograph of themselves at that scene and left it on the floor of the counter and it was thrown away yeah we literally
don't know there could have been boot prints a mural painted on the wall by one of them we're going here like it
could have just I'm I'm just an artiste you're like there could have been a Razor scooter belonging to him with the
murderers that had DNA on it and they parked it but you know what there could have been I'm saying we don't know
because they just cleaned it all up and threw it away it could have hit one of those detectives in the angle yeah he
didn't even [ __ ] know it exactly we don't know that is the most frustrating thing it's not that they like oh there
was blood and they cleaned it up it's like we don't [ __ ] know we have no idea what evidence was at that scene
that could have absolutely nailed these [ __ ] and it makes me crazy well if one of them had a beard too you're like
I know that [ __ ] was shedded I know your [ __ ] was not taken care of it was shin
oh so as 1978 came to an end the murders were kind of starting to fade out of the
papers that's [ __ ] people are starting to move on nothing's happening in the case from the brutal killing of four
years yes in town and when I say people I mean everyone but these poor victims families who are still sitting there
waiting for [ __ ] Justice and police are just hitting wall after wall after wall the reward money that the Burger
Chef Corporation put out there unclaimed just sitting there and apparently even the typically very chatty jailhouse
informants could not help push anything forward and they were actually there's a
quote in the Indianapolis Star that said the Marion County jail whose prisoners are usually a gold mine of information
about crimes in Central Indiana had not yielded a single good tip about the murder wow like that's pretty wild now
with the public kind of fading away from this case the headlines are fading away
investigators are now desperate to keep it in the papers keep the public engaged
keep the pressure on these they yeah they know they have to make up for what they've done right like what they
haven't done for their negligence so the in the the Indianapolis Star actually set up this new system and with this
system readers could submit tips or other information anonymously okay which always helps I feel like it always gets
people to talk more um and what they said was some of you may not realize you hold valuable
information that just may add Aid police in solving the crime and it said that it
said do not sign the letter but put a five digit number at both the top and the bottom page then make a jagged tear
across the bottom of the sheet just above the number okay sounds like that seems like a lot
that's very intricate can I just write in a lot of people are going to be intimidated by that a lot of people are
gonna [ __ ] that process yeah I'm gonna be honest if I I'd be like oh okay and then I'd read like put a five digit
thing okay like you know it's start and then it would be like also make this Jet
and I'd be like I'm out like that's the third thing you asked me to do about you
know what that reminds me of and I don't know if it will make sense to anyone else it reminds me of the instructions
for a Scantron test oh that's absolutely going to make sense to everyone listening I feel like like that like
yeah you gotta have what I'm saying yeah yeah like your teacher would be like okay fill in this bubble with this
specific pencil do not fill in the bubbles that are colored like this and you were like I have so much anxiety
right now write your name up here write your name on the bottom write your class
number here right your class number here don't you dare write your class number here write my name over here and you're
like can I just take the test like but what's my name what's my name though I don't understand so the stars are reward
desk immediately started receiving letters off of this because people were apparently not intimidated by it okay um
we're all like we would suck at this but in 78 they were like we're fine with it
I mean um yeah you know they had to do a lot of [ __ ] [Music] so some weren't like super detailed uh
like one came from Johnson County from a man who said that he saw a suspicious Man Who Bore a striking resemblance to
the clean-shaven man and this man was standing alone on Stones Crossing Road on November 18th that's it all right
just like saw this guy that looked like that guy without a beard standing on a street on that day over
there I guess I saw him I saw him on that night and he was standing and he did so I don't have a beard that man was
not sitting he was standing and I imagine that these robbers I imagine they were standing so I'm like
did he looks cage closed my friends it's like you're just waiting for him thanks
for that I guess like we'll keep that in mind that that road contained a man that
was standing contained so then there was other ones that were a little more detailed one came from a Greenwood gas
station attendant he wrote in saying that he actually recognized those bus as two men who'd short changed him in the
early morning hours of November 18th I have something to say oh if a gas station attendant tells you something
listen yeah they know like in a criminal investigation I feel like they know yeah
just hit a criminal events or an urban legend the movie when that poor man was just trying to
scream someone's in the back seat oh that man and she was being a dick she was being such a [ __ ] that's one of
those situations where you're like you had the day you deserved girls I don't know what to tell yeah man is so
sweet so sweet I think he was just try to tell you something and he's a gas station
attendant yeah he knows he knows they have seen some [ __ ] they're harbingers they tell you when evil is a foot and
you need to listen think about our friend at the gas station he knows what the [ __ ] hell yeah he always knows
what's and he has all the [ __ ] drama hell yeah he does so listen to your local gas station it's true but if
they're informing you about a crime and this guy is saying that on November 18th
in the early morning hours he was shortchanged by two men who looked like those bus and of course you're gonna
remember that yes because and he said it was strange because these men bought twelve dollars worth of gas for their
black Chevrolet so he was able to provide that and he said but they attempted to pay with a five dollar bill
and two singles what so they attempted to pay Seven dollars for twelve dollars worth of gas
I think he thought like that they would they probably thought that he would just
take the five thinking it was a ten yeah they could leave before he noticed which
like wow you're an [ __ ] I the fact that you just broke that down so easily because like because at 10 and two
singles so it's like I think they just did it to be dicks and like hoped he wouldn't notice but I'm like no she's
smarter than you now he immediately pointed out this error and he was like I think you gave me the wrong Bill and
they were like oh okay so they went back to their car they got the money but then
he said they both quote spewed obscenities at him while driving off what the [ __ ] and it's like okay stole
his gas to me that's a pretty credible tip yeah because that's already a crime and they seem like the kind of pieces of
[ __ ] that would do something awful right so maybe track down like if you're that
big of a piece of [ __ ] you you're a piece of [ __ ] through and through [ __ ]
so the tips from the uh Speedway police hotline and the Indianapolis Stars reward desk they prompted hundreds of
responses but really only a handful actually produced viable leads that they could even chase down and then when they
chase down those leads nothing even the viable leads they chase down nothing so after two months of Investigation
there was still not even a clear motive for this crime because the robbers had seemingly gone into the Burger Chef to
rob the restaurant right but if that was the case why the [ __ ] did they kidnap
and murder four teens there like why did they do that and it's like we always hear the robbery gone wrong explanation
for these kind of situations but this was really wrong like this went really wrong and not only really wrong
but they took them far away well that's the thing I feel like that's not that's not even a
typical robbery gone wrong they're just kind of like presumably shoot them and leave them there that's the thing that
would be in that's a robbery gone wrong that they just start shooting right and everybody is at the scene right very I
mean typically robbers aren't in the habit of executing people in the middle of the woods like pretty rare for that
to happen so the best explanation that detectives could have come to was that something had thrown them off their plan
that night that they went in there ready to rob that place in some unexpected thing happened that threw the whole
thing into just Shenanigans and the only difference that night that they could come to was the presence of Mark flemons
he had switched shifts with another employee investigators started to theorize that
flemen's knew or could at least identify one one or more of the robbers oh who were thrown off by his presence and
killed all of them in a panic I don't agree with that I I think they're they're looking at
that theory from the wrong angle in my opinion I don't think it was that Mark knew these people I think it was that
they went in there thinking there was four specific people that were going to be working which it also was a uh girl
who was supposed to be working in Mark's Place I wonder if they went in there saying okay there's three girls there's
one boy and the boy is like a 16 year old we can take them and then when they went in there and they saw now there's
two strong like you know there's two like teenage boys that threw everything off I
don't think it had to do with Mark knowing who these criminals were because why would the only people that I would
think you would know are like his fellow high school that's the thing I'm like I
don't know that I think this is the work of two high school students no exactly but even with all of that it's still
like that even if they came in there and they saw what they were not expecting to see
which is apparently an extra boy instead of an extra girl because that's just my
random speculation I can see that like throwing everybody off but like to that extent yeah not to
that's exactly it not to that extent it's just that there's a lot of unanswered questions in that I feel like
that's a theme of this whole yeah every time you think you're like oh well maybe
this happened you're like no that doesn't make sense but maybe this is one of those things too that it's like
it doesn't make sense none of it's senseless so like maybe that's what it is that was very
profound thank you I thought so too so by March of 1979 really the problem you know the territorial thing between
between the Departments The Fragile egos it was again causing problems for the Burger Chef murder investigation and
there was a lot of confusion among the press that was happening on March 7th the Indianapolis news reported quote
Speedway police chief Robert Copeland and all his officers were ordered by his police Commissioners and State Police
not to talk about any aspect of the November slings so they're essentially saying there was
a gag order put on them right but then when reporters asked more about this um and they were told by the State
Police Superintendent John settle or Shuttle excuse me this is the first I've heard of it we don't dictate to anyone
we try to cooperate in a case like this those are two very conflicting things yeah that's that's opposite day baby and
then in the same vein a spokesperson for the governor's office said quote gag orders are the authority of the judicial
system right which implies that unless a judge has issued that check that gag order you're not under a gag order
so it's so wild without and there was no explanation for this so it seemed like Copeland's you know gag order quote
unquote really was nothing more than just an attempt to avoid questions like and they didn't and not take on more
scrutiny or deal with more scrutiny from the Press basically not wanting to confront the fact that they had made
zero progress in this case and that it was botched from the start and he was like if I just say there's a gag order
nobody can talk about it and it won't bring any Focus to the negligence that we have committed because that's the
thing he just doesn't have answers so no I can't say anything it's like but you're just lying and making people
believe you less you put a gag order on himself and he did you don't have anything to say don't say anything don't
say anything at all because what could you say if you don't have anything to say but then he just lied and I was like
that's like a liar he lied right out of his face and into their faces [ __ ] up brother but whatever so investigators
thought they actually found that had actually caught a break in April okay they finally something popped
two men were arrested in Chicago on murder charges and they were discovered to Bear a pretty uncanny resemblance to
the composite sketches yeah we are here we are now on April 24th Milwaukee Police because it was in charges were in
Milwaukee Milwaukee Police arrested Stephen Coffey and Norman Pepin these were two criminals from Somerville
Massachusetts I was there last night we were there last night oh my God they're [ __ ] stomping grounds there it is uh
so they were arrested for attempting to cash 300 in Travelers checks but those traveler checks had been stolen from
Travelers Not not just a random person but one of two men killed in a quote execution-style killing
oh yeah the previous day they had been flagged as being dead ringers for the composite uh sketches execution style
killings oh yeah it gets even crazier so on Monday April 23rd they met three men
this is what happened they met three men at a Milwaukee Holiday Inn they were in
the city for an engineering conference and the four of them went to a disco as you do loves it now on their way back to
the motel they pulled off the side of the road and they robbed these men at gunpoint Jesus they took them to a disco
and then rocked them and what's even Wilder about this is they then quote forced them to lie down in a ditch and
shot them to death dude does this sound familiar sure does now miraculously one of the men survived wow and he called
the police and was able to identify these two and he had been shot yeah holy cow now based on their resemblance to
the sketches and the fact that this was very very similar made them lie down face down in a ditch before shooting
them that all that like similarities to the Burger Chef case uh they had coffee and Pepin extradited to Indiana I don't
blame them because they were like yeah we gotta at least look at this you gotta talk to y'all there they appeared before
a judge and they had to wear paper bags over their heads because they couldn't jeopardize a lineup
and it would have tainted a lineup to have their faces out there I love that crafty crafty solution and don't you
love that visual yes I do it's so weird it's it feels wrong now unfortunately apparently when they looked at the
timeline of everything police announced on May 1st that coffee and Pepin were no longer people of
interest in the Burger Chef case did they give reason just like the timeline didn't match up but I'm like okay but
like why like I need I need you to say because they were in Chicago when this happened well and that's and it's like
yeah the timeline didn't work I'm like what about it well and also it's like I don't know if I trust you with this case
I know that I don't yeah I don't know about that yeah girl me either I just don't know about that yo no say yeah but
by October of that year investigators once again found themselves just completely leadless on this whole thing
and it seemed like the Burger Chef murders were really fading out of the the Forefront here they were fading out
of the press people weren't taking as much interest and on October 2nd the Metropolitan Board of police
Commissioners voted unanimously to fire police chief Robert Copeland oh [ __ ] and
they voted to do this because of his lack of leadership on the bombings and the murder of Julia and then also the
Burger Chef murders so all the recent crimes all the things that he failed to lead his Department about all of his
jobs and so he was fired and then after that there was a bunch of dismissals or transfers of like at least a handful of
other law enforcement officers that had some something to do with the Burger Chef case wow so they got either
transferred out or they were just dismissed that's interesting that some of them got transferred out and some got
distressed it's a very strange I also don't know about that I don't know about that now yeah so
years are going by at this point right tips are starting to dry up they're coming in but they're not really doing
anything leads are definitely nowhere to be found and the case is really going cold at this point then in December of
1984 Indianapolis Star journalist Dan luziter I think it's luzad or a loser I thought
you said a loser and I was like I don't think I think it is okay um he received a call from an inmate an inmate from the
Marion County Jail finally they're Chit Chat all righty now this inmate was in there after being arrested for a ton of
thefts uh this man said that he had information about the Burger Chef case he said it's going to be a great story
and I will happily give it to you as long as you're willing to help me out no and so Dan was like yeah I don't know
how I can possibly help you because I'm a journalist like I'm not a judge so like I don't know what to tell you but
he was like you know what it's worth finding out at least what he has to say so he made his way down to the Marion
County Jail to talk to him now at this point the Burger Chef murder case is six years old
and at this point like every single detail had been told retold in the newspapers they've been had been turned
around had been lied about had been retracted all this just been through the mud it has through the thick of it but
it was I guess this reporter Dan he said that there was something about the story
that he was tell that this guy was telling him that seemed truthful like it seemed real okay and he said more
importantly the man claimed to know the identities of who was responsible for the murders well so we got it here and
he said one of those people has already been dismissed by investigators maybe that's why they were transferred
and then he said the other one was a name that he had actually heard but that he this reporter had never heard before
but the police definitely had this guy's name was Donald Ray Forrester now Donald Ray forrester's name like I
said didn't ring a bell to Dan but it definitely rang a bell with the speedway area police because since he was a teen
Forester had been very familiar with law enforcement he was a petty criminal disorderly contact conduct like petty
theft reckless driving those kind of things what did I say in the beginning I said this is not their first rodeo no
way there you go I knew it but then after all these Petty thefts and these little crimes he definitely escalated to
a violent crime in 1977. so right before the burger Burger Chef murders he was arrested for quote
assault and battery with the intent to gratify sexual desires holy [ __ ] which is
a mighty escalation yeah that is now Forrester had actually been out on parole when the Burger Chef murders were
committed and he was arrested again for rape in April of 1979. were the two female victims checked to
see if they had like any signs that they had been raped it didn't seem like they
had been nothing that I read suggested that they were okay um but he had been sentenced to 95 years in prison wow so
good so Dan lucider um he went on like a research Deep dive on the Burger Chef murders and on Donald
Ray Forrester because he was like I gotta try to make a connection here and then he finally contacted Forrester who
was actually serving out a sentence at Pendleton Reformatory [Music] so they find he finally got him to agree
to meet with him and the meeting was June 24th 1985. now at that point Forrester had already been questioned by
investigators about the Burger Chef murders he had failed to polygraph tests and but he was saying that he knew
nothing about the case nothing about the crime it's so funny because when somebody I'm rooting for fails a
polygraph I'm like it means it made a hot dog in a trench coat and then when somebody I'm like I don't know about you
they did it be like yep that was it I know it's so true but so this reporter though was like because he again he's
saying he knew nothing about the case this reporter is not going to give up hope though because he's like there's
some connections here the timing is making sense he was out on parole during that time he had just escalated to a lot
of violence yeah and he committed another act of violence after yeah it's not like his name was just pulled out of
thin air you know but when he's going to meet with him he's like I have to be realistic about this he might not give
me anything so when he went he asked Forrester he said did you commit the murders and
Forester said I did not but then lusitor began just like Dan he met he began like pondering aloud he's
like you know I just wonder why why did these murders occur you know and I guess
Forrester who was not asked directly this just gave an answer and said it was drugs drugs and homosexuality
what what and he went on to say he was innocent but he said he did know who committed the murders and he said I'll
give you that information if you get me a new trial for the rape charges that I'm in here for Dan is like one more
time for the people in the back I'm a [ __ ] journalist I can't give you a new trial dude I can write you a bomb
ass sorry yeah that's all I got man maybe I could put a good word in with my editor like I don't
know it's just like are you kidding me so but over the next few weeks Dan luziter spent hours and hours and days
and days just investigating Forrester and eventually he got to interview forrester's ex-wife oh [ __ ] oh yeah now
his ex-wife she told lucider um and she told loser that you need to bring detectives to this house okay so
he did he brought detectives and she led them to shell casings that were hidden in the couple's septic
tank that matched the ones found in the burger ship murders I don't even know where my septic tank is but they do how
like yeah what yep why so then does that mean that they weren't flushing their septic tank I have no idea how that
works you're like don't ask those questions no I have no idea you're like what's a sub I'm like I don't know what
they were doing but what the [ __ ] but lucider brought this information to Forrester and was like hey
um yeah like uh do you want to say anything about that and he was like oh no I'm still Innocent but then he kept
he was like coily giving pieces of information that you were like you why would you know how do you know that but
he kept saying he wanted something in return and Dan again is like I have nothing to
give so detectives were called in here to talk to him and detective spent weeks with him they drove him to locations
around with that they thought might be connected to the murders they brought him to a hypnotist in Akron Ohio but he
would not admit to doing it and he said he'd never been there he had nothing to do with it investigators were so
frustrated at this point but eventually he did provide the names of two men that
he claimed were the killers but detectives interviewed these two men and they immediately knew he was lying
and also like oh you just took the shell casings for them yeah they didn't make your [ __ ] stuff to tank all these
years when they they were like as soon as they sat down and started talking to them the two men they were like no no
like this is this is a lie right so by November of 1986 now nearly eight years after the Burger Chef murders occurred
detectives were just done they were like Dan Ford or Donald Forster is not gonna
do the right thing he's not going to confess of course not we just have to try to get some evidence to like force
it and then they were stunned because they received a call that year saying that Donald Forester wanted to
chat with them so no one understands why or what led this to happen but Donald Forester sat
down with these detectives on November 10 1986 and he gave a detailed confession of the murders so what do you
mean that this is unsolved so and these were things details that only someone who was there that night could have
known like he described the positions of the bodies the wounds they suffered one of
the things he said was that Daniel Davis had been shot in the cheek and that had
never been released to the public so why didn't did he get her and that's a pretty spit well he's in jail for 95
years oh right uh so so yeah but did he have to like well he also told investigators that the gun that was used
they threw in the White River which makes sense that they never found the gun that's a big old River and he
also confessed that it was he it was him who had shot Ruth Shelton and Daniel Davis oh my God he admitted to the two
which also makes sense because Jane and Mark were the ones that were found further away so not only did he confess
but he's confessing correctly saying I'm the one who shot the two that were found
on the ground holy [ __ ] yeah it's like this guy did it and did he say who he who he did it with her he wouldn't give
them the name now so according to him the murders quote resulted from an effort to collect a large debt over a
cocaine deal that involved one of the victims and the crime said been committed by
multiple people obviously now this was not seeming to be the real story because if we look at the four
people involved like the four victims it doesn't add up so everybody was like I don't know about that but in 1981
Jane freit's brother James was arrested on cocaine charges oh so you think maybe they went there to
like [ __ ] with his sister yeah to like intimidate him and he actually said at the time of his
arrest that he suggested that Jane's murder could have been connected to his arrest cocaine [ __ ] oh no no it doesn't
look like the investigators followed up on it at the time though in 81. what the
[ __ ] were they doing it was in 81 right like only a few years after a couple of
years after the murders that that he was arrested Jane's brother and at that time
he said to investigators guys I think this might be the reason that my sister was killed and they didn't follow up on
it like and now this guy is sitting here saying it's a cocaine deal and is there
any notes or anything like uh but that's like wild that they just didn't follow like yeah I cannot imagine
a more poorly [ __ ] handled case than this no well all the way through seriously because it's like it's also
once you look at the scene you're like yeah that actually makes perfect [ __ ] sense exactly you're like okay now I see
that's why they didn't take the ring that's why they didn't take the cash they took the money out of the thing
they got what they wanted and then they got to that and that's what it makes sense yeah that's brutal yup now based
on this whole thing police now connected the murders to the huge drug ring that had been operating in Speedway at the
time okay uh it was run by a guy that Forester actually implicated as the individual who planned the whole thing
in the first place yeah because he was running it so he wanted his money exactly now in exchange for the
information forced there was granted immunity from prosecution for this because he was already for 95 years but
he was only going to be granted that if he hadn't committed the murders which he
already confessed to okay so they kind of like played a little game yeah and two weeks but this kind of backfired
because two weeks later he recanted and he said that he had been coerced to confess by police and that they
threatened to you know they threatened all this stuff and that he was when he was sent back to prison he was going to
be labeled an informant and like that was going to get him killed so that was him getting scared that he confessed
right that he told all this [ __ ] about a huge drug ring yeah and then when he went back in that they were going to
like clearly make him pay for it exactly so now the confession is recanted and investigators are looking for anything
that can tie physically forced or to these murders I mean that confession is great because he gave the details that
only someone there could know but they have nothing physical and then it's like if he's saying it's he was coerced into
that it's their word against him because then he can say well they gave me those
details exactly but so they're trying to come up with anything and they came across a charge from 1969 where
Forrester was actually arrested for sexually assaulting a 14 year old girl wow he's a piece of actual human garbage
yup in a wood area off Stone's crossing road which was about a mile and a half from where the Burger Chef murders
occurred wow now for some reason he was never sentenced for sexual assault oh good but it kind of proved that one he's
a piece of [ __ ] and two that he's familiar with the area that they were found now unfortunately district
attorney Stephen Goldsmith didn't think this was sufficient to prove his guilt which I can kind of see if I was on a
jury I don't know if it's just not enough that's the thing now his confession and then the recanting of
that put the district attorney in a really bad position there's one hand that's like the D like
I said the details it's a near certainty that he is one of the killers a near certainty but on the
other hand this story had unraveled and been told and retold and [ __ ] around so many times that it was now really
difficult to tell what was true and what was lies and what was manipulated and what wasn't but the fact that he knew
the details of like one of them being shot in the cheek when that's never been released and they all believed like he
100 is one of the killers like that is it but it just makes proving it yeah completely uphill battle and the biggest
problem that the district attorney faced was that so many people had been involved in the investigation and had
contact with Forrester and all of them had received varying versions of the story and none could settle on just one
version of the story yeah so it was like no one could even settle on like this is
the narrative and then what makes everything worse is that the territorial stuff and the ego stuff had completely
plagued everything about this case over the years had led to so many miscommunications tainted evidence
missing evidence there was going to be a mistro if they brought this 100 it was 100 100 it was such a tainted
investigation from the beginning from the start exactly it was now on December 20th 1986 D.A Goldsmith called a meeting
with investigators from all the agencies involved in this case together they combed over forester's statement it was
1200 pages 12 yeah 100 all the statements that he had made Holy Cannoli and after
reviewing everything Goldsmith's held a press conference and he made an announcement he said after careful
consideration of this entire thing he would not be pursuing charges against Donald Ray Forrester for the Burger Chef
murders so bad for those families they must have had Hope For The First Time in like so many years and then just have
that ripped away from you and he said that it like killed him to not do it but he said too many years have gone by too
many mistakes have been made in this case and I don't know if we're going to be able to solve it no well nothing like
like legally solve it exactly like ever I think everybody kind of knows what happens at this point and it's like
that's horrible for the family that they had that hope but at the same time I'm glad that he realized that they didn't
have enough because if all those families had to go through trials exactly opening all of that and then to
have end in a mistrial or not guilty [ __ ] that exactly that's the thing because it's like if they had gone
through with it it just would have tainted it further exactly so it's like I understand why he was like it's really
not worth it to do this oh it's such a bummer though I know it bummed me out so much it's like because I know he did it
now in 2003 oh [ __ ] 25 years after the murders um Rachel and John Shelton who are the
parents of Ruth Shelton they gave an interview about the still unsolved Burger Chef murders and they said at
first I was convinced that it would be solved that's what her mother said and she said I guess we sure don't hold our
breath about it it was a very long time ago which is like so sad because that's just like like just throwing our hands
up like No One's Gonna Do it now they had both hoped the killer would have been caught but then when detectives
told them that they didn't have enough evidence to prosecute the suspects John Shelton said to be honest I don't even
want to know their names yeah like whatever and today the Burger Chef murder case is open but inactive
it's so hard because it's like now there's no evidence it's just sitting there and all the evidence that they do
have all the notes all the statements and everything it has it's in a five drawer file cabinet and six and a half
foot wall Locker that's at State Police District 52 office just sitting there just not being touched it's been years
since they've pursued any leads and most of the original investigators are actually all of the original
investigators on the case have you ever retired or died yeah and the Burger Chef
restaurant chain was actually sold to cke restaurant Holdings in 1982 and it is now Hardy's restaurant which I didn't
know I don't know if I have I heard of Hardee's Hardee's it's like burgers I think oh okay yeah
um and today the old Burger Chef Restaurant on Crawford Crawfordsville Road and Speedway sits empty isn't that
chilling really changing but then at the same time it's like what would you want
to see go up there I know other than a memorial like no it's true like something I know it should be like a
park yeah I feel like yeah you know but in the end we're just left with this nothing this
frustrating void of information that we know if more investigatory like due diligence was done from the get-go and
people didn't walk into this thing with a preconceived narrative in their head and they had actually taken even one
[ __ ] photo of that scene that this all could be different is mind-boggling but now we're sitting here and they're
trying to solve this case that was just completely erased from the beginning they erased it right from the
beginning and literally they magic erased it away yeah and it's like and then it and then they're trying to like
you know right from the get-go they're all sitting there being like well I think these kids just you know uh they
decided that night to just steal all the money out of the safe and then took off
together like that was their first Theory and it's like with no prior past of any kind of [ __ ] with no criminal
past like it's just like okay I see you I see you and then later they theorize that it must be Mark the only black
employee that was taken out of that restaurant that day who knew the killers and that he was the reason that they
were all killed and it's like with what [ __ ] evidence you have no evidence to back that up you're racist like we're
just gonna go with Mark being the problem here I don't think any of them were the problem here no I think I think
they were all victims and I think I do think that if Jane's own brother suggested that his the cocaine stuff
could have been to do with it like his sister's murder yeah I think we should listen to them right they're telling
some follow-up questions on that and he's not bullshitting it's not like her his brother her brother is being like Oh
No but he's he's simply saying like probably out of guilt like probably out of like anger and sadness and like grief
like this could have had something to do with it like investigate it and they were like why would he say that other
than to be like please like exactly this he's not gonna implicate himself even further no he brought it like that is
that's a [ __ ] brother yeah absolutely like regardless of what he was doing in his personal life or any like the the
cocaine stuff it's like that he was being a brother yeah like he was being a brother and being like I'm gonna put
myself out on a limb here and I want you to investigate this because I think it could have something to do with it and
they just ignored him oh and then you have Donald Ray Forrester sitting there giving that
exact same story and saying it is because of cocaine right and a debt that would need it to pay and it's like
that's seems to me to line up wow yeah it's a very frustrating case and also if that is if that is the case
with the whole cocaine charge it's like why did you like you didn't need to involve his sister in the Burger Chef
Restaurant no it's like [ __ ] up deal with it directly no it's really [ __ ] up that's but it's scary what money will
do to people and drugs yeah money and drugs mixed together yikes it's like a bad bad combination oh
my God that's so scary drug rings I think are one of the scariest [ __ ] things on the planet because it's truly
ruthless yeah that's why I'm just like okay bye-bye uh yeah with that being said uh we hope you keep listening and
we hope you keep it wait it's weird it's not a drug ring because we're scared bye
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Burger Chef part two is here y'all and it comes with a bittersweet....or really just bitter conclusion. When we last left you, the police had done LITERALLY zero work to secure the crime scene or really investigate at all. But someone would come forward with new information. This person shared details with the police that only one of the killers would know, and yet this case remains unsolved.

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Brief Summary

The episode discusses the unsolved Burger Chef murders and the flawed investigation surrounding them.

Key points

New Episode Schedule Announced. Mondays and Thursdays are the new drop days for episodes!
Live Show Experience. Elena and Ash share their excitement from meeting fans at a live show.
The Burger Chef Murders Part Two. Delving into the unsolved mysteries surrounding the Burger Chef murders.
The Frustration of Negligence. The investigation is hindered by police negligence, leaving families without answers.
Gag Order Confusion. Conflicting statements from police create confusion about a supposed gag order.
Arrest of Suspects. Two men resembling the suspects are arrested, but the timeline doesn't match up.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

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6:36WatchMar 16, 2023

Tension

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