The Boy Who Killed His Twin | "48 Hours" Full Episode + Post Mortem | Forensic Files

[music] Harris County, no more. What's the location of your emergency? >> I just killed my sister.
>> Oh my god. >> Tell me what your name is. >> Benjamin Elliot. >> Okay, tell me exactly what happened.
>> I thought it was a dream. I I kicked my wife and I stabbed her. [laughter] [snorts]
Please, I don't want her to survive. Sorry. >> How old [music] is she? >> 17. We're twins.
>> Is she awake? >> Yes. She's like barely alive. >> Is there anyone else there in the house
with you? >> There is. It's my parents, but they're asleep. >> Okay. I need you to go wake them up.
>> Mom. Dad. We're going to have to start CPR right now. 1 2 3 4 1 2 chest. Just
like that. Okay. >> Where's your son? Where's your son? >> Okay. Okay. We got EMS is coming.
>> Okay. Slow down a little bit. 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 >> Can we take over? >> What happened?
>> It was a dream. He said it was a dream, honey. >> What the >> I don't know what
I don't know what I'll do if she was just a dream and then it wasn't >> I'm going to do a search of you real
quick and then I'm going to put you in the back seat out of this rain. Okay. >> What was your first reaction when you
heard about the case? >> I was skeptical. Why does he have a knife next to his bed at night?
>> This is the first study that we did on Ben. I'm Dr. Dr. Gerald Simmons. I'm a
neurologist, sleep disorder specialist. See, these are rapid eye movements. I was asked to review the case of Benjamin
Elliot. The claim was that he was sleepwalking and stabbed his sister. >> We have a video of him right here.
>> Oh, there he is. >> Yeah. Okay. >> You are convinced this was a sleepwalking incident?
>> Yes. >> Are you saying then that he did kill his sister, but he didn't intend to kill his
sister? I wouldn't say that it's impossible for someone to commit a crime while sleepwalking. I just don't think that
was the case with Benjamin Elliot. >> Were you able to find any evidence that there was a problem [music]
with these twins? >> No, we definitely looked into it and tried. The biggest thing that they're
hanging their hat on is the lack of motive. >> My name is Megan Long. I'm one of the
prosecutors on the case. >> [music] >> So, >> this is really hard, isn't it, Mike?
>> I hate this. I hate that she's gone. [snorts] >> This was not Benjamin's fault.
>> I've never thought of him as somebody responsible for this. >> What makes you so sure that you stabbed
your sister while you were sleepwalking? >> I would never have done that. I loved
her. She was my best and closest friend. Heat. Heat. [music] [music] >> [music] >> On the morning of September 29th, 2021,
17-year-old Benjamin Elliot was in a Harris County Sheriff's interrogation room in Houston, Texas.
>> So, what happened, Benjamin? >> You ever have like a really realistic nightmare
or like just everything feels real, but also off at the same time. Benjamin told detective Freder Munoz
that he stabbed his twin sister once with this knife, but had little memory of what had happened.
>> So, you go to sleep. What's the next thing you remember? >> The next thing I remember is like
the feeling of stabbing something. I was in her room and I turned on the light and I was panicking and I tried to
stop bleeding with the the the pillow. So I run in my room and I unplug my phone and I dial 911.
>> No more. What's the location of your emergency? >> I stabbed my sister. >> How many times did you stab her?
>> Just once. >> I heard the 911 call and I screamed. >> What's going on? I don't you what? And I
went to go move into the bedroom. As I moved, I I saw Megan and she was uh really not.
She was uh gray. You know, >> Michael Elliott remembers calling out to his wife Kathy.
>> I I heard Michael yell, "Oh my god." >> I was trying to figure out what's going
on and Michael said, "The police are here. >> Where's the brother at?" >> And I just
arriving paramedics took over CPR. >> They took Benjamin out of the house. He was shocked. He said it was a dream.
>> What the >> What did you make of that? >> I don't I mean I just I couldn't believe
it. I mean, I couldn't >> Not that Ben, you knew. So, it would have [clears throat] to been that he was
>> something would have had to happen. Benjamin, his parents say, sat handcuffed at a police car for three
hours while police, confronted with an apparent homicide, took control of the crime scene.
>> I just want to see her. >> We can't. No, we can't see her. >> Nobody would tell us if Megan was okay,
what was going on. >> Take a picture for me. Let me see something. >> Can we see something?
>> No, sir. The Elliott say they felt isolated by the police and eventually called a longtime friend who is also an
attorney. >> He went and got some information and he told us that Megan had died.
>> It was news police didn't share with Benjamin. >> Is she okay? >> Benjamin asked Detective Munoz several
times if his sister was all right. >> She is okay. >> But the detective withheld the truth.
>> Yeah. Last time I I know about she was uh being checked out by the EMS. >> Authorities say this is a textbook
police technique to keep a suspect talking and they wanted Benjamin talking about his feelings for his sister.
>> So, how's your relationship with Megan? >> Good. She's my twin sister. I'd do
anything for her. >> No rivalry there? >> No. >> You guys have any recent fights or
anything like that? >> No, we're pretty close for siblings. Benjamin, who spoke to police without a
lawyer, said he loved his sister and described what he says he remembered before the stabbing. Phone records show
he was scrolling the web. And Benjamin says he thinks he fell asleep somewhere around 2:30 or 3:30 in the morning.
>> Where would that phone be at right now? >> Somewhere at the crime scene. Benjamin provided Munoz with his iPhone
password and permission to search his phone. >> Have you ever been diagnosed with an
emot illnesses? >> No. >> Benjamin said there were no problems at home and said that he was looking
forward to college. >> I'm thinking about mechanical engineering. I'm taking the SAT I think
Friday. No, Saturday. And let me ask you, the knife that you had in your hands, >> where'd you get it from?
>> From my dad. He had given it to me that day. It was like a Air Force survival
knife. I was really enamored with it. Benjamin and Megan's parents had a big collection of knives and gear. The
family is big into camping. Kathy is senior manager with the Girl Scouts of America. Michael is a stay-at-home dad.
I know that if I had not given him that knife, this would not have happened. And I um
[music] after 2 hours in that interrogation room, at 11 a.m., Munoz finally revealed
that Megan was dead. >> I think the gun Megan did not make it. He and Megan are so close, you could
never picture anything bad happening between them. >> Longtime friend Drew Whitaker was
stunned to learn Benjamin was in police custody. >> He was very protective of her.
>> She says her family and the Elliots have been closed since 2005. >> Ben was very engineering focused.
Whitaker, herself an engineer, described Benjamin as soft-spoken, smart, funny, and a bit nerdy. While Megan was
sensitive, [music] wrote poetry, and loved to draw. As a teenager, Megan had been diagnosed [music] with autism. And
how did she feel about Ben? She loved him. She looked up to him. You would see her walk up next to him when she would
feel uncomfortable and just kind of stand by him. Did he ever get tired of having to take care of N?
>> I think he was proud of it. Like he liked he liked being a protector. >> The Elliott say the twins seemed happy
in the weeks before the stabbing with their [music] eldest child, Elizabeth already off at college. The twins toured
separate universities. >> Megan at this point had started coming out of Michelle as well. She was finding
her voice >> and she had found friends online and she had a [music] YouTube channel where she
was doing art. The night before Megan's death, father and son spent hours playing popular video games such as
Survive the Nights. It was in that video game that Benjamin noticed a [music] militarystyle knife that his father said
resembled one that he owned. Michael offered to give it to Benjamin. >> Unfortunately, I went and got the knife
out. >> The Elliots remember heading off to bed. Was there any, you know, any problem at all between the
twins? [music] >> The Elliots, like police, couldn't make sense of why Benjamin stabbed Megan, but
police had the teenager's confession, the bloody knife he used, along with a disturbing detail discovered at autopsy.
Megan hadn't been stabbed just once. She had two stab wounds. Benjamin Elliot was charged with the
murder of his twin sister. [music] After several days on suicide watch, 17-year-old Benjamin Elliot was released
on bail. His parents were there waiting for him. >> I saw them put him out and he just kind
of stood there on the sidewalk and I went, "It's okay." >> I went up to him and and he seemed I
told him I said, "Hey, Ben." You know, and and he seemed like like he didn't see me. He was surprised to see me.
We started driving and we we were asking him if he was okay and we were getting very
very quiet >> quiet like you know single word answers. >> So Michael pulls the car over um and
stops and and he gets up comes around and takes his face in his hands and he says he's like hi
>> we love you. Hi. And he just >> Yeah. And I saw him kind of sort of awake. >> And then he just hugged us.
>> Yeah. >> The Elliots knew they could never sleep in their home again and had already
moved in with Kathy's mother. >> Ben was worried that he might walk around. He was worried that he might do
something and he wanted to make sure everybody was safe. >> The Elliots were worried, too.
>> The first two nights I slept in a chair. >> Yeah. >> In front of the door. >> The couple even installed an alarm on
Benjamin's door. >> Because his attorneys had asked them not to speak with their son about the night
Megan was killed. They couldn't ask him the burning question, why? >> There's never been anything wrong with
him at all. >> Where my mind went to was a mental health >> something. Kathy's father was
schizophrenic. She now feared her son might be. So did Benjamin's lawyers Wes Rucker and Carrie Hart.
>> So we had a psychiatrist sit down with him. I fully expected her to come back
and say he's got schizophrenia or he's severely bipolar. When she calls me up, she said, "Wes, he's fine." It blew my
mind. >> They came to suspect that Benjamin experienced something else entirely.
He was actually sleepwalking when he killed his sister. Had either one of you ever had a case quite like this?
>> Never. >> No. >> You have a twin um causing the death of the other and the last thing you think
of is this a sleepwalking case. >> But Benjamin had told police that I stabbed his sister. It felt like a
dream. And his lawyers say that sleepwalking defenses have been used successfully in the past.
In 1987, Canadian Kenneth Parks drove his car 14 miles to his mother-in-law's home, beat her to death with a tire
iron, and stabbed her. He claimed he was asleep the whole time, and a jury believed him. And in North Carolina in
2010, Joseph Mitchell strangled his four-year-old son and attacked two of his other children, all while
sleepwalking. A jury also found him not guilty. >> The big question here is just whether
Ben Elliot in fact killed his sister while he was sleepwalking. >> Correct. >> Adjusting here.
So Benjamin's lawyers reach out to Dr. Gerald Simmons, a neurologist and a sleep disorder expert.
>> When I first was approached, I was very skeptical. >> The next question is, did I even want to
deal with this? My first reaction to this is, you know, well, who else are they going to go to? I
mean, within the field of sleep medicine, this is what I do. Simmons wanted to do a sleep study with Benjamin
to test if it's possible Benjamin could experience something called a parasomnia.
>> In general, think of a parisomnia as an abnormal behavior that occurs during sleep,
>> like sleepwalking. >> Sleepwalking would be a parasomnia. >> Simmons asked if Benjamin had a history
of sleepwalking, and his lawyers say he did. When he was about 10 years old, Benjamin's older sister, Elizabeth,
found him sleepwalking by her bedroom door. There was also a sleepover with childhood friends the night this photo
was taken. When Benjamin was found asleep on a couch eating a donut. When they woke him, he seemed surprised and
confused. Simmons also learned that there were other members of the Elliot family who sleepwalked. the likelihood
genetically is higher to have uh parisomnia, specifically non-remp parisomnas if there are other family
members that have had that. >> My uncle apparently used to sleepwalk when he was a teenager. He would go out
into the garage and you know with the tools and apparently he walked in on my mom one time when she was in the shower.
>> Kathy also had an aunt who once walked out of her house while she was asleep.
ran out into the woods in the middle of the night and was waking up in the middle of a thunderstorm outside.
>> Yeah. And here's a video of him right here. >> Simmons conducted two sleep studies with
Benjamin in his sleep lab 6 weeks apart. In each, Benjamin was hooked up to machines that monitor just about
everything his body did as he slept. >> This is brain wave activity here. So, we
did the sleep study. >> I saw that he had obstructive sleep apnnea. Obstructive sleep apnea says
Simmons is where the airway becomes partially blocked creating a disturbance in the sleep pattern. So he's sleeping
struggling a bit to get breath and that could be the trigger. >> Yes. >> A trigger that Simmons says could cause
a sleepwalking episode. >> Particularly when Benjamin's brain waves enter what is known as a nonrem slowwave
sleep. Now he's in slow wave sleep. >> This is slowwave sleep. >> Sleepwalking will typically occur in
non-REM slowwave sleep. >> During the sleep studies, Benjamin did not sleepwalk, but Simmons observed how
quickly Benjamin entered that nonREM slowwave sleep. >> So it was 11 minutes from the time we
turned off the lights until he was in slowwave sleep. This is important because on the night
Benjamin stabbed Megan, his phone activity [music] stopped at 4:17 a.m. It was just 24 minutes later that he was
on his phone calling 911. >> I just killed my sister. >> What you looking at? Simmons says the
fact that Benjamin is able to reach [music] slow wave sleep so quickly means it's possible Benjamin was sleepwalking
during [music] that period of time his phone was inactive. >> I thought it was >> Do you believe Ben killed his sister
without even realizing he was doing it in his sleep? Yes, Ben definitely killed his sister.
He did it. There's no question. He's the one that had the knife and he stabbed her. But I believe it was part of a
parasomnia. He didn't do this voluntarily. There was no motivation. >> Dr. Simmons findings [music] took
Benjamin's parents by surprise. >> It's scary as hell. If that can happen to us, then that could happen to anybody
with with the sleep problem. He realized he was sinking the knife into something or someone
and then woke up and realized it was his sister. After sleep expert Dr. Gerald Simmons
made his assessment that Benjamin was sleepwalking when he killed his twin sister, the Elliots were hopeful
prosecutors might drop the case. >> At that point, we thought it might not go to trial.
But in April 2023, a year and a half after Megan's death, a grand jury indicted Benjamin Elliot, then 19 years
of age, a first-degree murder. >> We just didn't think that what we saw was sleepwalking.
>> Megan Long and Maroon Coutani would handle the prosecution. It wasn't Long's first sleepwalking case. In 2019, she
successfully convicted a man who claimed he was sleepwalking when he shot and killed his wife. And Long told us she
herself was a sleepwalker, as were her children. Still, Long disputes the Elliot's claim of a family history since
she says neither of Benjamin's parents have been sleepwalkers. From our conversations with our sleep expert,
family history of sleepwalking is a factor. It's more prevalent when it's um like first-degree family members, so
your parents. The prosecutors hired their own sleep consultant, psychologist Dr. Mark Pressman, who concluded
Benjamin was not sleepwalking when he stabbed Megan. He says sleepwalkers become aggressive only when someone
physically interferes with them. and they respond by hitting or kicking or throwing furniture, but that's that's
that's like a reflex, you know, an instinctive reflex to protect themselves. And he points out that
Benjamin would have had to have unchath the knife before he used it in the stabbing, which Presman believes is a
complex conscious action, not an unconscious one. The next thing I [clears throat] remember is the feeling
of stabbing something. >> He also says it's unusual for a sleep walker to recall details the way
Benjamin did to authorities after he stabbed Megan. >> He remembered the feeling of the knife
going into the neck. >> Okay. So that's a memory. Okay. Should be able to have that memory.
>> Aren't there sometimes pockets of memory? >> Not in these cases. No. >> Dr. Simmons disagrees. He says Benjamin
told police what he could recall. >> If he was trying to fabricate this or just use this as an alibi, it would have
been just as easy for him to say, "I don't remember anything." Instead, he's I interpret it as he's trying to be as
honest as he can. >> But Pressman felt he had enough information to make his determination.
>> You didn't think you needed to talk to Ben? >> No. Prosecutor Long knew she needed more
than an expert's assessment to convict Benjamin, especially because she couldn't identify a motive for murder.
No one had witnessed any problems between the twins. >> Is there no motive because he was
sleepwalking or is there no motive just because no one's willing to come forward
and tell us? and they think they could convince a jury that Benjamin's actions were intentional that night, stabbing
Megan twice. One wound was 4 in deep and severed her corateed artery and jugular
vein. >> So, he's saying that he stabbed her in the neck, removed the knife with where
she was stabbed, blood would be coming out of her neck. You should see some sort of blood spatter on the walls, and
there isn't any of that. Benjamin had told police he used a pillow to stop the bleeding.
>> And I tried to stop bleeding with the pillow and it was behind her. I like to
did that. >> Long doesn't believe that. >> I think he wanted to cover her face. I
think maybe even muffle if she were to scream or anything like that. The only way for there not to be that blood
spatter is it had to be there when he took the knife out. It wasn't there for life-saving measures. But he's calling
911, so he's not trying to hide what he had done. Right. >> I think at that point when he's making
that 911 call, he realizes, I can't hide what I've just done. [music] >> What's your name?
>> I just killed my sister. >> Coutani claims Benjamin is whispering on the 911 call.
>> I stabbed you in your neck. and is suspicious why he's not yelling to his parents for help.
>> Please, I don't want to die. >> I think he's whispering because he doesn't want his parents to come to
[music] the same reality that he's now living in, that he took his sister's life. I think that that's why he doesn't
awake them before calling 911. I think that's why he doesn't scream in the house when he realizes what he's done.
And they argue Megan was already dead by the time Benjamin called 911. >> Okay, sir. Can we
>> can we take over? >> By the time EMS got there, she wasn't breathing on her own. She had no
heartbeat. Our medical examiner said that with the wound that she suffered from, she would have been dead within
minutes. Benjamin's interrogation raised even more questions. They say, especially when Benjamin described his
house as a crime scene. >> Benjamin Elliot is asked by Deputy Munoz, "Where's your phone?" Benjamin
Elliot responds with, "It's at the crime scene." And to us, that was significant.
Not many 17-year-olds would respond with, "At the crime scene." Most people would say, "At my house, in my room."
>> And there is more, says Coutani. His demeanor and his behavior is very calm. Certainly not the type of behavior you
would expect from somebody who comes to with a knife in their hand and their sister uh dead in the sleep of the of
her own bedroom. >> Could he be in shock? I mean, realizing what he had done, isn't that possible? I
think based on his response to Deputy Munoz in a couple portions of the interview, we can tell that he's not
necessarily in shock with what the consequences of his actions were. >> During the interview, Benjamin told
police that his sister had struggled with her mental health. >> My sister had um a pretty severe depression for a
while. To prosecutors, that suggested maybe everything wasn't so perfect in the Elliot family. [music] A contention that
Benjamin's lawyers find ridiculous. They say investigators made virtually no effort to learn about the Elliots or
Benjamin. >> They don't have a clue about this kid. They weren't even curious. >> He would know what was going to happen
to him if he killed his sister. There was nothing for him to gain. There was everything for him to lose.
There's just no reason why he would have done that. >> Before trial, prosecutors offered
Benjamin a 30-year plea deal. He turned it down. >> The tragedy is now the family lost their
daughter, but they're now losing their son. He's on trial for his life. >> [music]
>> All right. >> He's a victim. >> He went to sleep. He woke up and he he found out he had killed his sister.
>> After struggling [music] with Megan's loss, >> see, >> the Elliots now face the possibility
they could lose Benjamin, too. >> It's a nightmare that happened to all of us. >> All rise for the jury. Benjamin's
first-degree murder trial began on February 18th, 2025. >> You tell your colleagues, "I have a
client who killed his twin sister and we believe he was sleepwalking, and they think you're crazy."
>> But with no evidence of any problems between the twins, Benjamin's lawyers hope they could convince a jury that
sleepwalking is the only explanation. Even prosecutors knew the lack of motive could be a problem. I think our biggest
hurdle going into this trial was the why. >> So, you made sure you had jurors who at
least be open to the idea they may never know why Megan Elliot was stabbed. >> Right.
>> In his opening remarks, Maroon Katani made it clear that while there was no motive, they had their murderer.
>> He calls 911 at 4:41. Hello. Hello. I just killed my sister. >> I stabbed her [music] with a knife. Oh
my god. >> He's whispering. >> Prosecutors told jurors about Benjamin's behavior during [music] that
interrogation. >> And you'll see his demeanor in the interview, >> pointing to Benjamin's reaction when the
detective tells him Megan is dead. >> Sorry to tell you this, but Megan has succumbed to her injuries. And the
defendant says, Witnesses offer details about her wounds, the lack of blood spatter, and
the prosecution's theory that Benjamin covered Megan's head with a pillow while he stabbed her. And Benjamin's father
was surprised to learn that prosecutors would ask him to identify Megan's body for the record.
>> This is a photo taken from an autopsy. Sorry. >> [laughter] >> Yeah, that's [clears throat] Megan.
No further question drama. >> After the prosecution rested, defense attorneys Carrie Hart and Wes Rucker
took over. >> Good morning. >> Making their case about sleepwalking. >> And this is not a ruse.
This is not some defense to get Ben off of a tragic tragic set of circumstances.
This is a real phenomenon. >> And that call Benjamin made to 911. The defense says that's evidence he was
desperate to save Megan. >> He's saying things like, "Oh my god, >> I thought it was a dream.
>> I thought it was a dream. >> I don't want her to die. >> I don't want her to die." He's trying to
do CPR. >> Family friend Drew Whitaker told the jury about Benjamin's devotion to Megan.
Ever noticed that if the sweet kid or the tender kid change into somebody else? >> Absolutely not.
>> Appearing by Zoom, childhood friend Anan Singh told the jury about that sleepover
when he found Benjamin asleep and eating a donut. >> Just the sheer confusion on his face.
Like he genuinely seemed baffled as to how that happened. Benjamin's great aunt, Martha Knight Oakley, a
psychologist, told the jury about her own sleepwalking history, including finding herself in the woods one night.
>> All I know is I came to in the bushes clutching my dog. >> But the defense team star witness was
Dr. Gerald Simmons. He testified for four hours detailing the science and sleep studies that convinced him of
Benjamin's innocence. >> It totally fits in line with a process we call sleepwalking violent behaviors.
>> On rebuttal, prosecutors called their own sleepwalking expert, Dr. Mark Presman.
>> I concluded uh he was not in a sleepwalking state. >> How did you come to that conclusion?
>> He had memory. He is said to have come out of the state much faster than any sleepwalker could ever do.
>> In closing arguments, prosecutors described a deliberate murder. >> Benjamin Elliot walked into his sister's
room with this very knife and he stabbed her in the neck twice. There's no blood
spraying in the room. You know why? The only thing soaked in blood is the pillow
that he muffled her screams with. >> Benjamin's defense attorneys push back. you if you're trying to cover something
up, you're not calling 911. You're not begging for someone to help your sister. >> And they appealed for justice.
>> You do not convict a young man, a 17-year-old, because of how he looks or because how he answers interrogation
questions. >> But prosecutor Megan Long had the final word, and she suggested the family was
involved in a cover up that began with calling the friend who is a lawyer. >> And look, I'm a mother. I understand
wanting to protect your children. I get it. But you can't let them get away with
it. They have been protecting him [snorts] from the get-go. >> Long didn't leave it there.
>> They want to say that this family life was perfect, but we don't necessarily know what happens behind closed doors.
>> And what she said next stunned the courtroom filled with the Elliot family and friends.
>> I want you to look in this courtroom. There are so many people here for Benjamin. There is not one person here
for Megan. >> The judge let the prosecution continue. >> You have to be her hero. He knew exactly
what he was doing. There's been no remorse shown here in this courtroom by him. >> After 4 days of testimony, the case went
to the jury. >> We took a vote immediately. Jurors were divided. >> It was split 7 to five.
>> Could they reach a verdict? I was a sleepwalker and one of my own children used to sleepwalk too as a
young >> several of the jurors who decided Benjamin's fate knew a lot about sleepwalking.
>> You know someone who was a sleepwalker. >> Absolutely. Yes. Had a had a family
member. Yes. On my mom's side, my grandfather. >> But even with their experience, they
were deeply conflicted about Benjamin. And we spent a lot of time with the interview by the detective.
>> I'm taking the SAT, I think, >> Friday. >> He talked about how he was going to go
take the SAT. >> He just seemed to not have a lot of remorse. >> It didn't take them long to come to a
unanimous decision. >> All right. >> My understanding is that y'all have a verdict. Is that correct?
After 4 hours of deliberations, >> we the jury find the defendant Benjamin David Elliot guilty of murder is
charging the indictment signed by the foreman of the jury [music] printed by the foreman of the jury.
>> I remember hearing guilty and I was completely shocked. >> Benjamin Elliott, who did not testify at
trial, later spoke to 48 hours inside the county jail. No, I feel like this has been a
I don't know, a miscarriage of justice. Like it's I am not guilty of murder for my sister Megan Elliot.
>> Benjamin, now 21 years old, said he and his family were appalled by the way prosecutor Megan Long ended her closing
argument. >> There are so many people here for Benjamin. There is not one person here
for Megan. >> That was crazy to me. >> What do you mean? >> Everyone in that courtroom was there for
Megan. >> I understand wanting to protect your children. >> And his parents were outraged by the
statements made by prosecutors hinting to problems within the family. >> We don't necessarily know what happens
behind closed doors. >> They were lying. >> Yeah, it was horrible. They waited until
the closing when they knew that nothing could be said afterwards >> to to pull out these outlandish
implications about you don't know what happens behind closing. >> Yeah. She knows damn well there's not a
shred of evidence that anything unoured was happening in our house in our family.
Benjamin and his parents had little time to let the guilty verdict sink in. >> Does he have to say hug?
>> Yes. >> They were back in court for sentencing the following day. >> And he is the one that went into her
room that night and snuffed the life out of her. Prosecutors asked for 40 years,
but a member of the jury asked the judge for leniency [music] because he worried
about Benjamin's family. >> Stand up, Mr. Elliot. >> Judge Denilo Lo told the court he
[snorts] wanted a sentence that he could live with. >> I sentence you to 15 years in prison. At
this time, you will go with the >> The request for leniency says Benjamin makes him wonder if a few jurors have
more doubts than they wanted to admit. If you believe that I crept into my sister's bedroom and murdered her while
she was asleep, why would you possibly want leniency from that person? That person is horrible.
>> Are you that person? >> No, I'm not. I'm not that person. I mean, I'm I try to be genuine. I try to be honest.
Um, I'd like to think of myself as a good person. >> Benjamin says authorities misconstrued
everything he did. >> Started with that 911 call. The prosecutors say you were whispering on
the phone. Were you? >> No. That's ridiculous. I wasn't whispering. >> I don't want to get sorry.
>> I was panicked. I wasn't screaming into the phone cuz I'm just not a I don't really yell.
>> And Benjamin insists that as soon as he realized what he had done, he was trying
to help Megan using the pillow to try to stop the bleeding. >> The state says that you didn't use the
pillow to try to stop the bleeding. You did it to keep her from screaming. >> What do you say to that?
>> That's crazy to me. And there's absolutely absolutely zero forensic evidence for
that at all. >> And what about his seemingly calm demeanor throughout the police
interview? >> The plan is I'm taking the SAT. >> You're talking to a deputy and you're
talking about SATs and colleges. >> I'm trying to get my mind off of things. >> I've had some issues with school stuff
sometimes where >> I think you can see it in the conversation. I keep pretty much
steering the conversation away from what happened. I don't want to think about it.
>> As for learning Megan had died, Benjamin says he just shut down and that he was
desperately hoping she'd be okay. >> Do you feel you're guilty of anything? >> No,
>> you don't. >> No. No. I I don't think this is my fault at all. I used to blame myself for it
because it's like, I mean, I I was the one holding the knife, right? But I mean, I've come to realize
that I'm not, you know, I couldn't have done anything any different than what I had done.
>> And Benjamin says he misses his twin. It's really hard that she's not here. >> Isn't it hard to know that it's because
of you she's not here? >> Yeah. Yeah. It's really hard. We did everything together. Like we we
were we were very very close. And she was a wonderful person. She was an artist.
the way she looked at the world, she looked at it with like a creative mind. So she would just see just beautiful
things everywhere. >> New CBS next Saturday. This is the parking garage right here.
>> A man is found murdered in his car. >> I saw a body, a [music] person sitting
in a driver's seat. How do investigators catch the masked killer? >> Look at him just coming around the
corner like that. [music] >> Who painted cameras to hide the crime? 48 hours is all new next Saturday on CBS
and streaming on Paramount Plus. [music] Welcome back to Postmortem. I'm your host, 48 Hours correspondent and Marie
Green. And joining me today to discuss the season premiere episode of 48 Hours is 48 Hours correspondent Aaron Morardi.
Erin, how many seasons has it been for you now? >> Okay, I was trying to count and I think
it's 35, which means isn't this your first full season? So, you have a little bit to catch up with me. [laughter]
>> All right. I'm working on it. I'm working on it. I still with all those seasons under your belt, this is quite
an episode. I don't know if you've done anything like this one before. It's the perplexing case of Ben Elliot. He
murdered his twin sister Megan in 2021. They were both just 17 years old at the time. Now, Ben maintains his innocence.
He admits that he stabbed his sister, but he says he was sleepwalking and he did not intend to harm her. [snorts] So,
this is one of those episodes, Aaron, that throughout the hour, my mind kept on changing about whether or not, you
know, I felt it was intentional. I felt that, you know, whether or not he was guilty. I just I couldn't really decide.
You know, Amarie, I'm with you. I was conflicted as well when I first started on the story. I thought, well, that's a
novel defense. Um, you know, but I thought of it as a defense, but I have really gone 180. The problem here is our
judicial, our criminal judicial system that is based on adversarial uh sides. Uh, the courts want to find guilt or
innocence, guilt or not guilty. Um, in this case, we know he did it. He, you know, Ben Elliott admits he stabbed his
sister, but we don't know why or if he intended to. And the other problem with this case, which you and I will talk
about, is this is a young man who never shows a lot of emotion. >> Absolutely. We will get into his
demeanor, but before we even sort of get into the case, we'll just remind people
that if you haven't actually listened to this episode of 48 hours, you can do so.
You can find the full audio version just below this episode that you're listening
to in your podcast feed. Go take a listen and then come on back for this conversation. Okay. You actually have a
pretty unique perspective here. Um you are a twin, which I'm just learning. >> I am a twin. I have a twin sister. We
are not identical, but we are very close. And so this case hit me hard. It was hard not to look at this case as a
twin. I can't in a million years imagine hurting my twin. It's the person I knew
before anybody. Um, and in this case, there didn't seem to be any problem between these two people. So, how do you
make sense of that? Yes, the prosecution argues that Ben intentionally killed his
sister and that he wasn't sleepwalking, that this was just sort of an excuse, something that he made up. but they
never really established a motive. And me as the viewer/jur watching this, that bothered me. What was so troubling about
this case is that not only was there no evidence of a motive or a problem between these twins, everyone uh that
the prosecution talked to said that that Ben loved his sister and and loved being
her protector. she was she had been diagnosed um as autistic and he according to the witnesses wanted to
protect her. But here's something else to think about. They couldn't find any evidence um on either one of the twins
phones. You would think if there was a problem between the two there'd be some kind of text uh trail. Uh another thing,
this is a young man who used his phone all the time. if he was just going to use sleepwalking as a defense, an
excuse, wouldn't you think he'd do some research? They didn't find any. Uh, so I found
this all so troubling because again, the prosecutors say he's a danger to society. That's why they charged him
with firstdegree um and and fought to get him convicted of firstdegree murder. And yet there's
no evidence other than the act itself, which is pretty awful. Uh that that he really intended to do this.
>> Mhm. I I think that though that that would have helped me as I was watching the hour if they could give me a re the
why even though they don't really have to. Um but the other thing that I kept on thinking about as as I was watching
the hour is just how much do you know about sleepwalking? I think immediately what comes to mind is sort of this
visual of this person walking with their eyes closed and their arms out sort of zombie like not you know somebody doing
sort of complicated tasks but I have to say I have heard some crazy things about
people you know could be an urban myth but I mean cooking a turkey while sleep walking and that all that sort of stuff.
>> Well you know it's not crazy for someone to to actually cook while they're sleeping. I learned that. Um so just so
that people understand what it is there's a large category uh called parasomnio and sleepwalking is one of
those um so is sleep eating or if you want to say sleep cooking um and it really happens and it's more common than
I realize it is. Uh but crimes committed uh while you're sleepwalking is less common although it does happen. Here's
the real problem Amarie and it was a problem reporting on this. There are no usually no witnesses to somebody
sleepwalking and so they sometimes have to kind of guess about what happens during those episodes. So we have
experts because they were used in the trial uh both on the defense side and on the prosecution side and both sides
agree that parasomnia sleepwalking does occur. They also agree when it occurs it
it occurs during a period of your sleep which is nonrem slowwave sleep. Um and it's when you're almost like in a
twilight zone between sleep and being awake. But then the experts disagree. And here's the problem. You have the
defense witness saying that there are pockets of memory and that's why Ben Elliot could remember stabbing, [snorts]
but the the states witness says there are no pockets of memory. The fact that he could remember stabbing his sister
meant he was not sleepwalking. And you know what we're talking about here too is not just sort of like stumbling
around your bedroom, right? We're talking about a very violent act. I do the experts have any opinion on what
might cause someone who's normally not violent to act out violently in their sleep? Dr. Pressman, the prosecution
sleep expert, said that something has to happen to the sleepwalker. somebody has
to interfere with their movement. Uh but again, because in most of these cases, there are no cameras, no witnesses, they
don't know exactly. We don't know what happened in that bedroom. Did Megan wake up? Did she put a hand up to try to stop
him? We don't know. Dr. depressment. Um he said something along the lines of, you know, he knew that he wasn't
sleepwalking because he came out of it quickly. And I just sort of thought, how did he know how quickly he came out of
it? Because there were only two people in that room and it certainly wasn't the expert.
>> Exactly. He's claiming that the fact that Ben said, "I remember stabbing her meant that he had come out quickly to
have that kind of memory." Uh, Dr. Presman says he shouldn't have any memory of it. The prosecution actually
used uh the fact that Ben had some memory against him by saying that Ben had actually killed his sister earlier
and had time to come up with uh a story. Uh and then calling 911. >> Again, as you point out, Emory, there
were no cameras. There were no witnesses. We don't know and the experts don't know. Mhm. So, here's kind of like
my journey uh with Ben, right? Initially, I just thought, you know, his presentation is a little odd. And it
starts with that 911 call. At this point, you've listened probably to hundreds of 911 calls. You know,
sometimes people are frantic and yelling. Sometimes they are very measured and controlled. They want to
get the information out. Ben had this soft whispery voice. It just was a little odd.
>> Well, and it was odd to the prosecutors. That was part of the trial. The in fact,
the prosecutor imitated the phone call in front of the jurors and was whispering. And that's fair to an extent
because certainly when you listen, as you did, Amory, it does sound like he's whispering and he may have been. But I
also want to point out that when I met Ben Elliott in the jail and interviewed him, he is very soft-spoken. Yeah. And
he doesn't show a lot of emotion. And what he said to me was uh that he wasn't whispering. That that's how he talks.
>> But then why didn't he scream out to his parents? That was the other thing that
kind of bothered me. I thought like why is it that the parents are finding out what's happening, you know, when the
like cops are showing up? Like why wouldn't he say, "Oh my god, help me." >> Well, you know what, Emry, that is such
a good question and it's certainly what the prosecution pointed out. Like why did he call 911? Why did he keep his
voice down? He didn't want his parents to know. And that's possible. But can I just point out here's where my
experience as a twin comes in. Uh so when you are a twin, whether you're identical or not, you have a real
closeness. That is who you share everything with. And I just want to throw out that possibility that as a
twin, he was calling 911 because he was thinking of his sister and then didn't think about calling his parents until
the 911 operator asked him to. It's a possibility. As a twin, I see that as a possibility. I think the other thing
that really surprised me about this episode is just how many people are familiar with sleepwalking. because I
kind of went through it's nowhere close to sleepwalking but my husband talks in his sleep and when we first met it would
be sort of this mumbly stuff that I couldn't understand but it's definitely progressed over time but I mean one of
the prosecutors was a sleepwalker her children jurors knew sleepwalkers I I was like how many people are
sleepwalking and then I also thought could that have an impact on you know whether or not they thought he was
guilty or innocent because I don't I don't know. Do you know if their familiarity with sleepwalking had an
impact on how they decided this case? >> I think Emory, it was a double-edged sword. In one hand, it helped the
defense because because you had jurors who knew that sleepwalking exists and they heard
during the trial that Ben seemed to have a a history of sleepwalking. The other side of that uh sword is though that
committing a crime while sleepwalking is very rare. Uh none of the people who were familiar with sleepwalking knew
someone who committed a crime. And I think that's hard for someone to believe that even jurors who knew that people
sleepwalk to believe that someone could actually commit a terrible crime like this. Uh they also heard testimony for
doc from Dr. Presman who says that >> during sleepwalking you can't >> have conscious thought um and made a big
deal that in order for Ben to have stabbed his sister he had to pull his knife out of the sheath and Dr. Presman
testified that that was too much of a conscious thought. Uh and yet you and I know um that there have been cases
[music] where somebody has driven uh and then committed a crime while sleepwalking and the jury acquitted that
person of murder. >> Welcome back. Uh let's dive into the really chilling body [music] cam
footage. When first responders arrive on the scene, Ben is giving Megan CPR compressions. His parents, uh, Michael
and Kathy, they are there. They are distraught. They are confused. They ask police what has happened to their
daughter, Megan. Well, Emory, at first glance, when you see that body cam footage and you see these parents asking
and the police are saying, "We're not going to tell you." It seems cruel at first glance, but you have to realize
that they're walking into that house not knowing what happened, who exactly was involved. They just know someone inside
that house was involved. Maybe they all were. And so until they could really understand what happened, they did not
want to share any information. They didn't want anyone in the house sharing stories, getting a story together until
they could figure out exactly what did happen. It really makes more sense when you look at it from the vantage point of
these investigators walking in cold. It it does make sense. I imagine for Michael and Kathy though, as this whole
thing sort of continues to unfold, they then decide that they're going to call a family friend who happens to be
an attorney. Now prosecutors use that decision a little bit against them, frame it like it's a very suspicious
thing to do. Well, and we see this over and over again in these cases, Amarie. So the
family wants to know what to do. Most of the time they've never been involved in
a situation like this. So they had a friend who was a lawyer and and in fact that lawyer helped them find out what
happened to Megan. That's how they found out that their daughter had died. But then at trial it was used against uh the
family by the prosecution. And we see that happening over and over again in cases. Um the prosecutors said that the
family um had conducted a cover up from the and I'm quoting the get-go, you know, from the very beginning because
from the prosecution's viewpoint, if you have nothing to hide, why are you calling a friend who's a lawyer? So
Ben's family, you the his parents, they're already going through this heartbreaking experience. But now part
of the prosecution's narrative is and they're involved in a cover up. Their head must have been spinning. Can I just
tell you this was one of the most emotional interviews I've done with parents as you can imagine. They have
lost a daughter. They are they feared they'll lose their son. They for the first time I found out that they thought
maybe he had schizophrenia. They really seemed and they said to me that they really wanted to know what happened. So,
they were very upset with the idea that anyone would accuse them of a cover up. And they point out that Ben was willing
to talk to the state's expert, sleep expert, but that the state sleeps expert did not want to talk to Ben. uh that
expert felt he had enough information by looking at the reports and and every evidence in the case and did not need to
talk to Ben was what what he said to me. So the family was devastated with the claim that they were trying to cover up
because that's not how they saw it. The jurors really got to see Ben Elliot's police interrogation.
I'm curious as to, you know, what they felt about his demeanor and what you felt about his demeanor because you
spoke to him. >> That's the hard part, Emory, in these cases. Um, we are judging people by how
they act under the worst moments of their lives, but we've never met those people before. So, it's a very tough
part of any criminal trial to try to figure out how do you judge the demeanor of somebody. The Ben that I saw on
police cam footage was very similar to the Ben I met uh when I saw him in the jail. uh he was a little more animated
with me because apparently his grandmother was and is a fan of mine. Um uh and so he did say to me kind of that
his grandmother under different circumstances would be happy to know that that I was the one who interviewed
him. So I saw more of a open talkative Ben. But through most of the interview, the Ben we saw in police cam footage was
pretty much the same guy I interviewed and his parents told me the same thing that that is who he is. I did talk to
him about um his affect and the fact that he was talking about things that seem so unrelated to what had just
happened to his sister. You see him during the interview with the the detective talking about, you know, he's
just been taken from his home after stabbing his sister and he's talking about taking his SAT. That struck me
when I saw it and he said to me that he had just shut down. He didn't want to believe that he had done what he had
done to his sister and he was trying not to think about it. So Erin, the other thing that really jumped out at at me
that bothered me, tell you the truth, is that he calls his home, he calls it a crime scene. Did Did you get a chance to
ask him why would you call it a crime scene? Well, I did. Um, and his answer was because it was a crime scene. I
mean, we hear him in 911 saying he's stabbed killed his sister. So, um, he clearly thought it was a crime. Um he
said he knew that they would cordon it off. I mean he kind of knew what the police would do. Um so he did not find
the fact that he had used that term unusual. So you know that was just some of what the jury um had to consider. Um
but there were other pieces of evidence that swayed them. What were kind of the big pieces of evidence for the jury?
>> Well, you point out demeanor was a big one. the number of stab wounds because
the prosecution did make a big deal about it and one of those wounds was very deep and the prosecution said that
that goes to the idea that he intentionally stabbed her. >> The prosecution also talked to the
jurors about the fact that according to the prosecution there should have been blood spatter. She was stabbed in the
neck. And the prosecution, and this is all just their theory, there was no proof of it, but the prosecution
argued that the pillow that was near Megan had been used by Ben to keep her from yelling and that kept uh blood
spatter from hitting the wall. But Ben had said to use the pillow, but he says he did it to try to stop the bleeding.
Mhm. Near the end of it was during their closing, the prosecutors told the jurors, "Well, we have no motive, but
you never know what goes on behind closed doors." And I think that really struck the jurors. So, the jurors
initially were split uh 7 to five, but then ultimately they all come around and it's a unanimous decision, right? They
find Ben Elliot guilty of firstdegree murder. I I just thought like maybe a lesser charge would have been more
appropriate like manslaughter or something like that instead of first-degree murder.
>> Yeah. I should also point out so when you say 7 to five, it was seven people initially were for guilty and five for
not guilty. Um when you see that these are young people and a young defendant, you might think, well, do you really
want to do first-degree murder? This his twin. But what you have is a 17-year-old
teenager who's dead. and you have two stab wounds. And I think the prosecutors, they believe he had the
intent to kill her and that's first degree and that's why he was charged with that. Um, and I should also point
out with the jurors that even though there were five initially who thought that Ben might not be guilty, they all
came around to a unanimous decision of guilt and were satisfied with that decision at the end.
Well, you say that um we know that prosecutors wanted a sentence of 40 years, but this might give us a little
window into what the jury was grappling with because a member of the jury asked for leniency.
It makes you wonder. Well, leniency according to the juror because he felt so bad for the parents. But I I do want
to leave you with this idea of what Ben said to me, which I thought was interesting.
Ben believes that some of the jurors did have reasonable doubts. Um, and he points out that the judge could have
sentenced him to 40 years, but instead chose to sentence him to a much shorter period of time. And he said to me, if
people really thought that he had killed his sister in cold blood, wouldn't they
want him locked up for the rest of his life? We'll remind people he got a prison sentence of 15 years. That makes
him eligible for parole in 2032. He will still be a young man, uh, 28 years old if he if he does get parole at that
time. >> And I do want to add, Emory, that um, Ben is appealing this verdict. >> How are his parents and her parents as
well, how are they coping? I it occurred to me that they probably barely had a moment to sort of get over the shock of
Megan's death and and even begin grieving for her before they had to pivot and think about Ben.
>> I have not spoken to them recently, but I did speak with them this summer, and
they are, as you can imagine, just devastated. When you speak with them, you can feel their pain. Um, and and
they're a little bewildered to this to this day, wondering why there wasn't in their mind more of an attempt to find
out what really happened in the early morning hours uh to Megan. They miss Megan. They worry about Ben. They have
an older daughter. And I noticed through the interview, they just held hands through the whole thing. And so I said,
>> "Oh my gosh, you guys, you're getting through this together. this and they said we couldn't have gotten through it
without each other and that was very touching to me. >> Absolutely. Well, this is unlike one
that I've seen so far on 48 hours. Uh I think you're going to take the viewers on kind of a bit of a roller coaster and
I'm curious to see where everyone lands once they watch it. Thank you so much, Erin.
>> Thanks so much, Emory. I think we're going to have this in our hearts for a while, too.
>> Indeed. Before we leave, Aaron, you have another podcast. Can you tell us about
it? >> It's called 15 inside the Daniel Marsh murders. Um, this is again one of those
cases that it's really hard to shake. This was not only a thrill killer, but he was just 15 when he killed two people
that he did not know, two strangers just to know what it felt like to kill someone. Uh, so it raises all kinds of
of important questions about what do you do when you have a 15-year-old killer who then is diagnosed as a psychopath?
Um, do you keep him in prison the rest of his life? What do you do? And the impact on the the victim's families.
It's it's a a very moving and chilling podcast. So, you can find 15 on your favorite podcast app. If you like this
episode, please rate and review on Apple Podcast or on Spotify.

Watch "The Boy Who Killed His Twin" and then join "48 Hours" correspondents Anne-Marie Green and Erin Moriarty on "Post Mortem" as they discuss the case of Ben Elliott, who admits to stabbing his twin sister when they were teenagers, but has an unusual defense.

00:00 The Boy Who Killed His Twin 42:00 Watch the "Post Mortem" podcast

Crime. Social justice. Impact. "48 Hours" investigates the most intriguing crime and justice cases that touch on all areas of the human experience including greed and passion. "48 Hours," which premiered in 1988, has developed a rich history of original reporting and impact journalism that has helped exonerate wrongly convicted people, caused cold cases to be reopened and solved, and along the way changed lives.

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Brief Summary

Benjamin Elliot stabbed his twin sister Megan, claiming sleepwalking; he was convicted of murder despite defense arguments about his mental state.

Key points

A Chilling Confession. Benjamin Elliot calls 911 to report he stabbed his sister, claiming it was a dream.
The Sleepwalking Defense. Experts debate whether Benjamin was sleepwalking during the incident, raising questions about intent.
A Family's Nightmare. The Elliot family grapples with the aftermath of the tragedy and the implications of sleepwalking.
Chilling 911 Call. Benjamin admits to killing his sister during a tense 911 call.
Trial Begins. The trial for Benjamin Elliot, accused of murdering his twin sister, begins.
Sleepwalking Defense. Benjamin's defense claims he was sleepwalking during the incident, raising questions about intent.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

This was not Benjamin's fault.

A prosecutor's statement about Benjamin's responsibility.

3:01WatchNov 14, 2025

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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