Springfield Three /// Part 2 /// 98 | Forensic Files

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that's enough of the business everybody gather around grab a chair grab a beer pitch a tent and let's talk some true
crime [Music] police are working extended shifts around the clock trying to find Cheryl
levit her daughter Suzanne streer and Suzanne's best friend Stacy McCall the three disappeared from this house early
Sunday morning the women had attended kapoo graduation ceremonies at Hammond Student Center Saturday night Suzanne
and Stacy had gone to a couple of parties then returned here to Suzanne's home investigators suspect Foul Play the
woman's cars were in the driveway their personal belongings including their clothes and purses were in the house
there was no sign of a struggle we are still asking for individuals that may have had contact with either the mall
girl misser or Miss Le to make contact with our department so we can narrow down the time frames that
we're working with as to physically when was the last time they were seen and known to be
safe the FBI is treating The Disappearance as a possible kidnapping one FBI agent has been assigned to work
with local police more than 30 Springfield officers have been assigned to the case the Springfield Police
Department has committed all manpow available to the investigation of The Disappearance of these three l
the investigations division itself is divided into two teams each team working 12-hour shifts in addition to that the
Department's crisis action team has been assigned to this case along with additional supplemental support out of
the uniform division Glen says police will continue to work around the clock until All Leads have been exhausted
Dennis Graves KY3 Action [Music] News welcome to day two in the garage we are discussing the famous case of the
Springfield 3 The Disappearance of Stacy Mcall 18 years old Susie streer 19 and Cheryl levette 41 this is a much
requested case we're just a little less than 2 months away from the 25-year anniversary of this strange
disappearance where we left off yesterday we started getting into some horrible people that could be considered
suspects in this case when discussing leads in this case we talked about bart streer as a possible lead the brother
that went nowhere we also discussed the boyfriend Dustin and his friends right uh who who had some involvement there
but but not a whole lot going on they are still considered suspects to this day and we talked about a really bad
dude named Steven Eugene Garrison and he kind of Falls in line with whom we're going to talk about today we have a few
people and these are all all considered very bad people that were in the area at
the time of The Disappearance of the Springfield 3 right so first up today let's talk about a guy named Gerald
carahan a St Louis County jury convicted Gerald of first-degree murder and forceable rape for the death of Jackie
Johns who was 25 this was 25 years after the fact I believe he was convicted in 2010 so it took quite a bit of time but
Gerald Carnahan is now safe from all of us he's he's stuck in prison he he was 52 years old when he was convicted so
he'll probably spend the rest of his life in a Cell thank God right so Jerry dingleberry is in prison yes so carahan
by the time he was arrested and convicted he was a family man he and his wife had two daughters uh his family has
told reporters that his wife had no idea when she married him that he was he was
suspected of these horrible crimes way back in 1985 after the verdict was read Bay's
put handcuffs on carahan his defense attorney asked that he be allowed to talk to his family one last time you
know this is nice for carahan but pretty crappy for the rest of us right I mean when he killed Jackie Johns he certainly
didn't give her one last opportunity to talk to her family right so why should he get this privilege well the judge
Captain apparently he thinks a lot like you and I because the judge basically ignored the defense attorney's request
not even answering the defense attorney and The Bays led him out of the courtroom well and we're just looking up
his picture I mean he he he looks harmless he looks like a doughboy well yeah oh sorry well it's believed that
carahan raped and beat Janie John's who was only 20 years old in June of 1985 and dumped her body in Lake in Lake
Springfield they started looking at him as a suspect within a week of the murder
but didn't have sufficient evidence to charge him he was charged in 20 2007 after criminalist said DNA evidence in
Seaman found on John's body matched carnahan's DNA and yes it was it was 2010 when he was convicted yeah but at
least Justice was served DNA analysis wasn't available obviously in 19 in the early 1990s the Springfield Police
Department got a grant in 2003 that let it afford to look at Cold cases such as this one the the
Springfield Police Department tested the DNA from samples taken from Jackie John's body and car but it wasn't able
to make an a match to any known person right in 2006 the Missouri State Police Highway Patrol got a similar grant for
Cold Case analysis and again tested the evidence and got a DNA match to carahan after getting a search warrant to take a
swab of his saliva at trial a highway patrol criminalist testified he didn't know Springfield police sent the same
seen evidence to the lab 3 years earlier which turned out to be almost a stroke of luck because it's possible the
highway patrol criminalist would may not have even retested the evidence had he known about the previous test obviously
he was such a suspect that years later they said hey we got to get a warrant to get his saliva yes yes he he was the
number one suspect they just had no evidence to convict him now and I bet I bet Jerry dingleberry was a sweaty
Doughboy when that was going down well Janice John's walker uh 59 uh this is Jackie John's oldest sister talked about
the impact of the murder on her family and her mother died in 1988 with cancer but Walker says that that's not what
killed her uh saying that her mom grieved herself to death she would sit and cry and cry and it it took a toll on
her right uh stating holidays were never the same Jackie was gone in that that really destroyed the family it weighed
very heavy on all of them throughout the years so did the dough boy get the electric chair well no they decided not
to seek the death death penalty because Jackie John's father was in extremely poor health at the time when they were
bringing these charges to trial and the prosecuting attorney feared that he wouldn't live long enough to see the
outcome of this trial so with the family's blessing they decided to just you know wave the death penalty and move
forward with the case so he could get some closure he got some closure before he he would pass on well that's good
that that's good news from law enforcement right well and I tell you what the thing here that you kind of
have to applaud is they they found their number one suspect they stuck with him for 25 years and build a case around
this guy and even though it's Justice delayed it's not Justice denied um and the family did get some closure uh here
here's carnahan's criminal record all of these convictions are crimes in 1993 or
1994 and he served time for all of these charges back in the 9s uh first we see second-degree burglary of a business as
well as arson at the same business uh he was also convicted of attempted kidnapping of a girl in Springfield
assault of a law enforcement officer H attempted kidnapping and tampering with evidence in 1993 carahan was charged in
Green County with attempting to abduct an 18-year-old girl her name was Heather starky so carnahan's victim type
certainly includes the teenage girls uh Stacy and Susie and we see kidnapping and rape charges these women obviously
were kidnapped so so this disappearance of the Springfield 3 fits carnahan's Mo well but our problem here is that there
were so many people that contaminated the crime scene or where they went missing from that we can't there's
nothing that we can test to compare it with this you know Doughboy and and we know that he was living in the
Springfield area at the time he was he was living there at the time of The Disappearance but really other than that
you know his Mo and and his proximity to the crime you know being a rapist and a
killer we really have nothing else on on Gerald Carnahan but we know he was out he was a free man at the time and he was
certainly capable of of these terrible things mhm next let's talk about Larry D Wayne hall now Larry Dwayne Hall he he
is a twin he has a brother Gary Hall um and nothing wrong with twins and the two
of them lived in uh the Missouri area the thing here is though it it's not so important when you talk about Larry Hall
where he lived because uh he was in he was one of those traveling guys he he did those Civil War
reenactments MH and uh if you look at pictures of him you see he's got the the mutton chops there yeah his his mutton
chops are a reenactment of just a horrible crime on his face mhm the main reason that Larry was a suspect he
actually didn't live anywhere near Springfield but he had a similar vehicle that match the description of the
eyewitnesses yes remember we talked about the the Dodge Van that the the older woman had reported being a green
color uh the the paper boy saying it was a brown and then everybody coming forward and next thing you know it's
purple black white tan every other color in the in the rainbow or or I don't know
if if those colors are in the rainbow the thing here is though but he was he was a traveling guy he traveled around
doing these different Civil War reenactments uh a lot of the times he was traveling with his twin brother now
the thing here is exactly what the captain said his vehicle matched that van but but this Larry Hall
guy is an interesting dude because he is actually only convicted of one murder and this would be uh his victim was
Jessica roach she was a 15-year-old girl she was last seen with her sister Mindy
as the two were going to the store in Georgetown Illinois uh her sister said that she was walking down the road with
her bike when the sister returned from the store she called out for for Jessica and she was not there she got no answer
and a bus driver that was passing by he did you know he actually saw the bike lying in the middle of the road which he
thought was extremely odd because you know first he probably thought somebody could have been hit um but the thing
here is he ends up police police end up talking to Larry Hall about this and it's several years after the fact but
they suspected Hall and many other possible abductions disappearances and murders but didn't have a whole lot of
evidence other than being able to place him somewhere near the crime scenes and so when they talked to Hall about this
situation they showed him a picture of of Jessica roach and as soon as they showed he's one of these Captain I I
hate to kind of go off on the side thing here but he's a oh he's really trying to
just stick to the story man I don't I don't really like going off on tangents he's a really Rare Breed for me like
when I've seen interviews and stuff with him he he comes off like extremely emotional um almost like even even
almost maybe a little remorseful and we don't typically see this with people that that we we throw into this group of
having they suspect that Hall may have killed as many as 30 or 40 people and and the thing here is when they show the
picture of Jessica roach to Hall he he like immediately turns away and he just starts ball like not just crying he's
balling like a baby and the thing is he immediately admits to killing her wow and then on top of that he in this
emotional state you know they kind of broke through the shell when they showed him the picture they get him talking and
in this emotional state he starts like confessing to other things he's like yeah I killed her and I killed you know
all these other girls too and but they but then they you know they hit a wall with him in this interview and they
can't get any more information about these other girls he doesn't name them he doesn't give them places uh really
nothing to go off of it was kind of seemed to me like he really needed to kind of get this off of his chest
somehow well I'm one of the few people that don't actually believe that most serial killers remember everything of
their victims where a lot of people say U most serial killers can just they can bring up every detail of every killing
yeah or the majority of them I I I don't believe that's the case for even as much
as 50% of them um I I go back and forth on that but with a person as far as Larry Hall goes
I could see that maybe he doesn't recall the names because some of these people he may not have known their names right
uh a lot of these people he didn't really stalk he kind of just would see somebody walking down the street and
opportun and pull them off of the road yeah and pull them into his van which this always frustrates the [ __ ] out of
me because in so many cases like you take like even Mara Murray for example like the opportunist kill we see it time
and time again it is very rare it is very rare but yes we do see this it's not that rare I mean we're talking about
Larry right now Ted Bundy was one right no no but I mean as far as a percentage goes as far as serial killers go a lot
of them are opportunist Killers but as as a when you compare it to how many regular people are walking around on the
planet there's not that many of them and and what they mean by it being rare is that your chances of you being in a
vulnerable state when when you happen to cross paths with that person it's mathematically not likely to to to
happen to most of us right but we know that Larry confessed to one crime but the other crimes that he confessed to
there was no names right or dates or places so is he just a oneandone type killer or I mean is this all just kind
of horse Malarkey well here's the thing when when reviewing you know some some people have gotten together and they've
put together a potential victim list for Larry hall now I think the numbers could
be exaggerated a little bit because when you look into these when you look at all
40 of them there were several of these cases let's say five or six of them maybe as many as nine or 10 that you
have other suspects in in these cases right the problem with a lot of these cases that are listed in this 40 is some
some of these people have never been found uh which makes things extremely difficult uh where I believe that he
probably did commit more than one murder I I wouldn't be shocked if he's somewhere in like the teens to the 20s
because he seems like somebody that wants emotionally he wants to confess but only for selfish reasons only to to
to relieve himself of the burden that he's carrying around not because he wants the not because he wants the
recognition of being this prolific serial killer or not because he wants to actually help anybody else out but he
would give he would give vague details of stuff that he probably could recall you know there there was one situation
regarding a Disappearance in 1991 uh where he says you know when talking to investigators he he admitted
to picking up a woman in Claremont which is on the west side of Indianapolis and
he states that you know what I don't I don't know her name I never knew her name uh all I remember is that she
didn't want to go with me and she had to be forced now he doesn't say that he he
killed her or what he did with her but they but then they do know that a girl named Georgia shrie uh 37 she was last
seen in that area almost at that exact time so it's a bit of a coincidence right Captain yeah my big question
though here is that he you know Larry's claiming that he's traveling around with
his twin brother Gary first of all twin brother Gary Larry and Gary hey hello don't do that don't don't name your kids
Larry and Gary not when they're wins it's not acceptable well and I think I know what you're getting at here Captain
you you're implying that maybe the two of them were guilty together in some of these crimes right um they most
certainly did travel a lot together driving all over the United States if you look at the crimes that they think
that Larry might have committed uh you basically could chop the United States in half right down the middle and
everything on the east side he's about in every other state with a potential victim um I do know that Gary didn't
attend all of these events with Larry uh so it might be possible that this was something that he did on his own but you
did touch on something interesting there because that you know it's stated and and you and I both kind of hate this
this when they bring this up but uh Larry is is stated to have a pretty low IQ um and I think they I think they put
his number around 80 and I do want to my caveat to everybody out there there's different 's different IQ tests out
there so so different scores mean different things on those tests but what I've seen reported is 80 now do we know
that that is right who knows but I'm about 65 I wonder you know it's been put out there that it is it possible that
somebody had to teach this to Larry maybe when he was younger you know may maybe he was a part of an abduction uh
where somebody else was involved and perpetrated the abduction at a young age and this was something that he took a
liking to um I have heard one there's an author that wrote a book on him called I
believe it's called urges and the author refers to Larry Hall as like a savant where he's pretty you know kind of dumb
at everything else but but this might be something that he's worked on and perfected over the years almost as like
a autism or yeah yeah like yeah well a savant you're just kind of good at one or two things and you know he apparently
is good at if if he is guilty of 30 or 40 people he's very good at abducting and disposing of people without getting
caught if your mud and chops aren't legit then you're a piece of [ __ ] well and I also want to lay to arrest things
that you know so just so people are clear that he's not a oneandone killer that there is some validity here to that
he he could have been involved in other cases we have that of Tracy rler uh she was 19 years old this took place in 1993
she was a freshman at Wesleyan University in Maran Indiana now she was last seen around 8:00 p.m. one night
traveling to the supermarket and she had not been seen again now this was a murder that not only Hall confessed to
but later recanted the confession to further more to add more evidence to the possibility of that just about 8 or nine
days later in that same neighborhood he was he was pulled over because he was harassing two female students that were
walking home he was and they were scared because this other girl had already gone
missing they report the situation to a security guard the security guard tracks down this van and pulls him over and
sure enough it's it's Larry Hall driving the van right right right the P Green well here's here's another situation
here Captain okay this took place in May of 1994 okay now Larry Hall is pulled over
so two years after yeah pulled over by a police officer after he was trying to coax some girls to get into his van and
when he's pulled over they search the van and listen to the the unusual items that they find in in his van they find a
spray can of starter fluid fluid a cotton mask and cotton balls a cotton a plastic tarp some knives and some rope
uh and the officers also found newspaper articles regarding The Disappearance of
that Tracy reeter that we just previously discussed what's odd about that well it's odd because you could
probably spray the starting fluid into cotton balls or a cotton mask and hold it over somebody's face and all right
subdue them and pull them into your van um it these seems like the when you're driving around in a rape van what what's
odd about finding those items I see what you're saying saying it it very much fits Larry Hall's van all right so what
happens with this Larry Hall character yeah and I don't want to go through all of the potential victims because we
would be here all day and night but the thing here is that's interesting is after he is sentenced to life uh for for
the death of Jessica roach we have a situation where his brother remember old G old old G bear he comes forward and he
starts saying that his brother lair uh is probably one of the most prolific serial killers that this country's ever
seen that that he believes that that his brother has been pulling girls and women
into the van for for 20 some years yeah hey what way to bring this up after the fact jackass yeah and well and by the
way I think he's the most prolific serial killer of all time and he killed all these women and guess what I'm
writing a book about it yeah well I I might have stretched that a little bit it was more like 10 or 15 years but
anyway that that's the claims that Gary comes out with after the fact now we we have a weird situation here where Larry
then retaliates and he says you know what um I'm sick of covering up for Gary for all these years oh yeah see what did
I say you're exactly right and at some point he he says you know I'm going to have to tell you what actually happened
he also but the weird thing here is he actually throws another name into the into the serial killer pool at at the
same time he says you know what I kind of uh some of these murders were committed by a guy and I can't remember
the name and and it's fair that I don't because we don't even know who this guy is or have any evidence on his name was
Mar it was lar gar and Mar this was somebody that would not have been related to them it was Barry Larry Gary
and Barry but he claims that he was with this other person who committed some of
these these murders as well so um a very interesting story regarding Larry Hall and his well and you like you said with
his low IQ maybe he learned it from somebody maybe he learned it from his his his stupid brother he's interesting
because his van fits the description first of all second of all there would have been two of them possibly there
could have been two of them which would have you know I I I think it would be difficult to abduct three women all at
the same time and I think if you had if it were two versus three it would certainly be easier uh to pull off in my
mind so that makes him a very interesting suspect and he's somebody that these the the armchair detectives
should look him up because if you have a a girl that's anywhere from the age of 15 to about 32 of an unsolved crime in
your area and it was took place in the 80s or the early 90s uh and it's on the eastern half of the United States
there's a good chance that he might be considered a suspect in in in that in that case MH all right I'm I'm so over
Larry and Gary uh why don't you go paddle your canoe down the river and uh we'll get back to this case right after
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today all right and we are back cheers everybody probably the most interesting or maybe the let's say someone who looks
like a more likely suspect than some of the other creeps that we have been discussing m is a guy by the name of
Robert Craig Cox now because of the Relentless persistence By Janice remember that's Stacy McCall's mother
another major and promising break in the case occurred a tipster from the state of Florida called in after seeing the
case on the national news and giving the authorities the name Robert Craig Cox adding him to the list of suspects as it
turns out the caller was the brother of Sharon zelers a 19-year-old teenager allegedly murdered in 1978 by Robert Cox
yeah and Shannon was on her way home from working at Disneyland or Disney World Disney World and uh she was
abducted yes uh at the time Robert was in the vicinity celebrating his recent graduation from basic training to become
an army ranger Robert Cox was staying with his parents at a hotel nearby it was quite late that night and Robert
headed out on his own while his parents were wanting to get some rest sometime later Robert returned to the room
covered in blood his parents rushed him to a hospital the blood was coming from Robert's tongue which was partially
bitten off he told the staff that he bit off his own tongue yet the medical examiners concluded that it's
improbability due to the direction of how Robert's Tong tongue was taken off m 2 Days Later police located the body of
Sharon zelers who was reported missing after not returning back home after work her body was only about 100 ft from the
hotel Robert and his family were staying in Sharon's body was stuffed into a manhole at a sewage pumping station the
coroner ruled that she had been beaten on the head about 14 times with a blunt object because of the strange story of
Robert Craig Cox about his tongue and the connection of him staying so close to where the body was found the police
interviewed him he told police that he had accidentally bitten off his tongue when a big black man hit him during a
fight outside of a skating rink and this rink was really close to where she used
to get cigarettes at like a convenience store grocery store mhm yeah it was an all night grocer grocery store and she
would often stop there on her way home from work now the thing here is Cox said that after the fight at the skating rink
that he drove around in his car he got lost and returned to the skating rink where a stranger gave him a lift back to
the hotel yet no blood was ever found in Cox's car the Good Samaritan could never
be found and deputies working at the rink at the skating rink said No Such fight had occurred mhm the police spe
culated that Cox had abducted zear forced her to drive to Sandy Grove then lost his tongue as he tried to assault
her they said Cox good for her yeah well they said Cox being a well-built Army Ranger who had just completed basic
training probably flew into a rage and beat the girl to death no murder weapon was ever found police were unable to
charge him after this incident Robert traveled with the Army to California where where in 1985 he was charged and
convicted on two separate occasions of abduction and assaults of women well then that's the sad thing about this is
you know when you have these monsters it's like if they would get caught early they'd be off the streets and it would
save so many lives in the first of these two cases in California Cox stalked a woman and grabbed her when she got out
of her car he held a knife to her throat the woman struggled and then the process
in the process bad cut her hands bleeding all over his car she persuaded Cox to take her to the hospital when
police showed up he fled the police later found handcuffs and an arsenal of weapons in Robert Cox's home in the
second case Robert Cox abducted gig Wickham at gunpoint from the Monterey Airport parking lot from the trunk of
his car he grabbed a double bag filled with automatic weapons and survival gear then he instructed her to drive him to
the mountains she escaped after she got Cox to stop by her friend's house so she she talks him
into stopping off on the way at a friend's house and then things you know go badly for Cox good for the girls uh
police arrest Cox after he had held the friend hostage at gunpoint threatening to kill this friend uh and then kill
himself well just let the friend go and uh you just kill yourself yeah that that
would have helped us all out well it was after he's brought up on these charges that Florida you know the the
authorities there they're like okay well we have all this circumstantial evidence
but now we really we know what he's fully capable of so Florida was able to indict him for the murder of Sharon
Zeller along with the tongue thing uh and hair and blood samples found near the victim these were compatible with
Robert Cox uh Cox testified that he bit through his tongue during that fight So eventually Robert he was taken to trial
right in which he was found guilty and I actually think that they had a good a really good case here uh they also had a
bootprint of his a map showing convergent Paths of the defendant and the victim uh the night that she was
last seen alive they found blood in his motel room uh blood in her car uh but because of Unfortunate Events the ruling
was eventually overturned as Cox sat on death row awaiting execution for the beating death of Sharon zers the Florida
Supreme Court decided that that the puzzle had not yet been solved after all they claimed that the jurors were
mistaken and the Seven justices ruled that Cox's uh on Cox's automatic appeal that there was not enough evidence to
actually convict him of this right right so they reversed the conviction yeah how
much more do you need a picture of him doing it a video of him doing it yeah yeah I mean you have he's missing up
he's missing part of his tongue you have blood and hair evidence you have a a bootprint you have a map showing that he
was you know taking a route that that she would have been on um so you know after the after this was overturned uh
some of the jurors came forward that had originally convicted Cox and one of them
stated you know Robert Cox is a killer Robert Cox killed Sharon Zellers uh Robert Cox will kill again because you
have provided him the opportunity right and another one said that if he walks there will probably be more victims and
the blood will be on the hands of those seven justices right but so if the jury is coming out and saying all this stuff
and and so these justices are coming like who got to them who got to the justices right somebody had to get to
them right yeah I I don't know I don't know how this whole thing went down it really makes no sense to me like I said
well maybe he has uh like a father of power or something well like I said I thought they had a really good case
there uh he did end up serving some time you know because he was waiting there on
death row during the process of his appeals right um but what happens is after they overturn the case they then
have to send him back to California to serve time for those crimes uh that he committed before he went to Florida and
one of before he went back to Florida sorry right one of the things that was pretty interesting to read was how he
wasn't that popular with the inmates uh because he had that you know just the piece of the tongue missing MH yeah and
well see afterwards Robert Cox is released and moved in 1992 where his parents were living which was
Springfield Missouri this is just months prior to the disappearances of the three
women the Zeller family still mourning the loss of their daughter in the release of Robert they were keeping tabs
on any news relating to him right and that's why they reached out to they reached out to Stacy McCall's mother
years later after this hit the national news now while living in Springfield Robert had a few jobs uh during his time
in the area he was employed as an underground utility worker on the south central side of town uh this is an
occupation that many believe could help him con his way into an unsuspecting person's home right potentially
kidnapping them uh he was also a mechanic at a used car lot and the interesting thing here Captain is this
is where Stacy McCall's father was working uh the Mcall family believes that it is
it is quite possible that Robert Cox would have seen Stacy when she visited her father at his job Robert was
interviewed and he was questioned by police and he had an alibi for the night that the Springfield 3 went missing who
was his Alibi his girlfriend confirmed that he was with her that entire evening and night and that they had attended
Sunday morning church services the following morning sounds like a bunch of well here's here's the thing here 3
years later in 1995 Robert was arrested in Texas for holding an armed a weapon to a 12-year-old girl since then he's
been serving a life sentence for aggravated robbery in the state of Texas now later Robert's girlfriend back from
1992 now his ex spoke to the Springfield Police Department and she recanted her entire statement about his Alibi she's
stating that Robert had threatened her and told her what to say if they came forward and questioned her of course
right and then you know she also claimed that he wasn't you know that good and bad because of the half Tong thing oh
wow the thing here is though police have stated more than once that Robert Cox should be the prime suspect in the case
of the Springfield 3 yeah definitely now in an interview with Springfield police
Robert said I can't tell you that said I can tell you that I know that the three
women are dead and the person who committed the crime had experience and that they are buried
somewhere close to Springfield well here's what we do now we know that he's capable of it 100% we know that he was
100 uh we know that he was in the area y right and uh we know that he's lying about The Alibi so you're creating an
alibi anytime you create an alibi I don't like that yeah and the weird thing here is that after the girlfriend states
that you know you know she says he threat he threatened me and I had to say this well then very quickly his parents
rush to his defense and say no no no no he was with us that night right um so this guy's got an answer for everything
but I can't believe either alabai uh when we see the first one very quickly fall through and then the parents rush
to to his defense where were the parents if if they were are correct about their
dates I I do believe he stayed with them from time to time but I don't believe that they're correct about about their
dates because where were they when he was originally questioned about this now regarding well well here hold on a
second because here hear me out if you're a parent listen to this the captain's going to give you a little
parenting advice if your son don't you tell me how to ra my kid yeah no hear me out this is good advice here here it is
if your son or your daughter is a is a piece of [ __ ] douche canoe right right t-shirts for sale on the website
shameful if if that is the case and they murder somebody and there's enough evidence to lock their you know bastard
ass up in jail for a long time and then then a couple stupid white guys I'm betting they white white Oh I thought
you talking about us well we are stupid and white um but if they let you go as the parent I
understand that you don't want to have a murdering kid and I understand that you
don't want a piece of [ __ ] douche canoe kid but you don't take them back you're
exactly right you go stay the hell away from me yeah I you're I don't know what happened yeah I don't want you to living
at my house either you know or furthermore down the block from me I mean yeah it the murder the thing is you
know you you think your kids are good people most people think their kids are good people until you're on trial for
Mur but the murder does get overturned however we still have those two cases in California this guy's guilty of
something we know that and and the thing is son or no son I'm a Live and Let Live
person and I try to give people Second Chances and I try to be forgiving of those around me when they make mistakes
the problem here is I don't want this animal living with me I don't want anything to do with this guy and
furthermore I'm not going to lie for you to keep your ass out of prison yeah and
when when you're done talk like that because he only has half of a tongue the guy is guilty okay that that poor girl
was beat to death and in the process she took half of his tongue well right okay
sorry but regarding the statement that he gave to police about that you know stating that he knew that the three
women were dead that he believed that the person that committed the crime had experience and that they were buried
somewhere close to Springfield those are all very kind of vague stat STS and very cocky statements
in my opinion the police did take these statements of course very seriously and still do but also they have reservations
on the validity due to Robert toying with authorities with numerous lies and his constant attention seeking yeah and
he did an interview you know his question and there was an interview I think the 48 Hours of the disappeared or
whatever had a little bit of it I wanted to see the whole thing so i' like to know more of his story there there's
been a local reporter that has covered this and I can't think of her name but she's done a lot of good work on this
case for many years now like I said we're coming up just two year two months away from the 25 year anniversary she's
done a lot of good work on this case and I believe it was an interview with her that she conducted and that's where he
stated you know I know that they're dead and I know that they're buried somewhere around
Springfield uh you know why I partially why I say that those are vague statements is being so far away from you
know TimeWise from the crime it's very likely that all three of them are dead it's probably most likely and it's
probably likely as well that they're buried somewhere around the Springfield area uh this is where you you wonder if
he's just he's just an attention seeking jerk you know because it's like oh well
if they're found buried you know you know months or years from now around the Springfield area then everybody's going
to go yep that Robert Cox he he did it he did it or he knows all about it uh and he he seems to like the attention he
likes being interviewed he likes talking to people he likes throwing out these shocking statements yeah but like like
we said there's all these things that kind of line up and to to think in this small town to have this kind of
disappearance of three people three women in the middle of you know in the middle of the night disappear Into Thin
Air basically mhm and you have this animal running around and he just was just recently there it's just seems to
be too much of a coincidence well and the other thing too is I mean look at look at hiso on three different
occasions okay let's say he's only guilty of the two that he was actually convicted of but on those two occasions
alone and the third one that he suspected of in Florida he was basically driving around looking for a victim it's
not too far-fetched to think that maybe may he was driving around and saw Stacy Mcall driving that night or saw Susie
streer driving that night and followed him back to the house right or when they were walk they were walking around at
some point too I also think the thing is like we said with his occupation he has
you know chances are he was driving some kind of van mhm and then also by working
at the used Card Lot he would have access to other vehicles as well well at the time he was just working the one job
as the utility worker but you're right he would have he would have used a van for that type of job he regardless he
would have had access to his own vehicle or his parents' vehicle from living with
them at the time uh the thing here too talking about his sort of shocking statements there are reports out there
that say that Robert has said that he will tell the truth about Cheryl Suzanne and Stacy once his mother passes away
but he doesn't he won't do that until she passes away because he doesn't want to cause her grief or severe
disappointment can make that happen just let me know where that [ __ ] is well here's a news flash to you Mr Robert Cox
you're serving life in prison in the state of Texas guess what it's too late buddy you've already caused your mother
plenty of grief and plenty of disappointment I shouldn't called her a [ __ ] now yeah it's not her fault that
he's a monster the thing here to but the thing that I don't like about her is that if they're trying to cover up for
his ass I mean maybe they're telling the truth saying hey we were with him that night well then he has an alibi
congratulations M but well they either lying or mistaken you know what I mean I doubt that that it's the truth I just
don't I don't my gut tells me it's not the truth there uh but I do want to be certain to throw this out that regarding
the statements about his mother passing away and that he's holding withholding information until she does uh those
statements cannot be confirmed those are those have been kind of rumored statements right and based off those
statements uh we've had some a lot of people kind of looking for where Maybe they could be buried yes and this is
actually something that they came up with through the tip line and they've received multiple tips about this over
the years that indicate that the bodies of Cheryl Suzanne and Stacy are buried underneath the Southside parking garage
of Cox Hospital uh which you know was being built within the timeline of their disappearance uh just to throw this out
there I don't think that that we need to but you know it's the Cox Hospital we were just talking about Robert Cox mhm
coincidence it's not his hospital just happens to beep name yeah it's a creepy coincidence in 2010 a reporter using her
own money hired a mechanical engineer with a very respectable resume and track record uh he specialized in using radar
to scan underground uh sure enough the tips that were coming in you know that said that
various people might have been buried in the area uh they may have panned out a little bit because while scanning the
garage the engineer noticed three anomalies uh sadly though he couldn't definitively say if they were actually
bodies or not only that they resembled things that he had found in graveyards before when scanning graveyards yeah and
they actually took up a petition on this right sign a petition well because there's a lot of people in the area that
want the they want someone to to do the work and go down there and figure out if
these are in fact bodies now the police they are still skeptical and they are not entirely convinced enough to take
samples uh from the concrete to help further the investigation in this specific area and would rather not cause
destruction to the property of a very busy Hospital well it couldn't be that expensive and I think you look if you
dig it up and you don't find anything fine okay you know you made a mistake it cost you a little bit of money and maybe
they could take up a collection for people willing to help pay for that I think that but at least you'd get
answers mhm the thing here is I'm not certain I don't have an idea of how much it would cost uh I looked at the scan
reports that they put out and I and I'm uncertain of how deep these anomalies were uh but it it seems to me like
depending on the depth that you might be able to just drill a hole and pull samples from from that hole possibly
rather than digging up the whole area you're exactly correct well thank you uh the thing here is like I said you
know a lot of people in the area want this to be done and furthermore there have been people come forward and said
you know what I'll pay for it you know including for them the engineer and this reporter said you know we'll use our
money we'll you know we'll we'll donate our time as well and and pay for this for the city to have it conducted well
because you have the family you know this is a tragic event for the family for one so you need closure for them and
family and friends and all that stuff but closure for the community mhm you know I mean cuz once this happens in '92
I mean people start locking their doors more people not so friendly well not only that I mean the crime the crime as
far as it's concerned on a national level it's often referred to as the Springfield 3 it's the the the case is
damn near named after your city well now I feel bad for calling that you know Springfield 3 on our show should have
made up a different name that's on your head my friend the thing here is though Captain um you know we this is a very
strange disappearance to me we we have a crime scene where there's no evidence it
seems like nobody saw anything I do feel like that there's a lot of good suspects
a l lot of good candidates that are possible abductors I think that we've talked about um you know most of them uh
one thing I do want to point out kind of a side note that on September 27th 1996
7 all three women were declared dead by the state of Missouri and I guess this is kind of a state law that uh five
years after someone goes missing the state can then declare that person dead so their their official date of death
would be listed as June 8th 1997 now some of that has to be done because of you have like probate courts
and things like that when people pass away you have next to Kin and things that can't go into the proper order
until someone's legally declared dead um unfortunately with it being almost 25 years since the case I think we're
probably talking about three murder victims here uh I I I I don't know worldwide how how long it goes I believe
I remember reading about somebody being returned or found 24 years 23 or 24 years after being abducted or held
captive so it's Poss possible it's possible but it's been a very long timeline uh for these women to have been
just disappeared you know of finding them well and I think it's it's very sad when you have two teenage girls you know
becoming young females and and what what they would be able to do with their life
and then you have this this mother that just recently became a single mother and
she seemed to be you know kind of a person that was you know take charge I'm going to take this uh this little tiny
house that's maybe a little bit beat up and I'm going to fix it up and I'm going
to do something with my life empowering I think anytime there's an empowering women it's a good thing and uh somebody
took that away from us and and away from our community mhm so my thoughts here on
this case captain my initial thought when I looked at this was it looked to me like somebody that
knew uh the either the girls or the mother mhm and I'll tell you why I really thought that because at first of
first of all we see no signs of of a forced entry into the home it's almost as if somebody knew how to get into the
home or was let into the house um the other thing that really made me kind of back up that initial thought that it was
somebody that knew them was the was the strange and lewd phone calls after the fact and the reason why is because when
I hear that somebody had just recently moved into the home I didn't think that it was was easily accessible to find
their phone number and that that therefore it would have had to been somebody that knew the situation of the
house would have been led into the home knowing that a man or men did not live there as well as knowing the phone
number that could have been unlisted because they had just moved in the problem is we we did later learn that
Stacy McCall's mother found the address and the phone number in the phone book so uh you know somebody that did not
know them could have gained access to the house somehow by conning their way into the home or being a utility worker
claiming that you know I don't know that you could say your poers out because they probably flipped on a light when
they came and heard the knock at the door right um but the thing here is the other thing that threw me off
was was the phone calls afterwards because you think what kind of weirdo commits this horrible crime and then
would want to potentially gets caught because they're calling after the fact and then the more and more I got to
thinking about it the less that seemed unlikely and and I'll tell you why because you know we covered back in
episode 35 we covered Dorothy Jane Scott and remember she received phone calls all the way up to her abduction and then
her family still received phone calls many for four years I believe after the abduction in that same episode we talked
about a a victim named Amy bck and her family received phone calls for like 20 years after she disappeared with
the Long Island serial killer it's believed that he used the victim's own cell phone to call the victim's sister
and make threatening phone calls to her after the fact so I don't think it's that crazy you know when I first looked
into this I thought we were probably looking at this ex-boyfriend and his friends as being good suspects because
there were three of them and they seem to have some kind of motive and might have been able to get into the house
right they would have known that there was no man there um the other thing too is I also wondered if it was somebody a
little more that that less that didn't have an axxe to grind I wondered if maybe they hadn't changed the locks when
they moved in that if somebody would have had a key and knew that women lived there and they were some sicko and
decided well this is an easy target for me right the thing here is though the more that I look at this I feel like a
guy like Robert Cox kind of fits this case better than somebody that knew them I think I personally think that if it
wasn't somebody that knew the victims I think that we might have the the the main guy or guys on our list that we
talked about today and yesterday and I think a guy like Robert Cox could have saw one of those young attractive women
driving around or walking around like you said followed them back to the house and it may be something as simple as two
girls coming in late at night one of them didn't lock the door and he sits outside and he waits for all the lights
to turn off and he waits a 45 minutes or an hour afterwards probably assumes that
they've all gone to bed by this point he can catch them off guard and he happened
to go up to the door and it happened to be unlocked he let himself in turns on the TV to create some kind of white
noise effect or maybe that has something to do with the dog I can't figure that part out the lining up of the purses is
weird to me too because I can't can't fully grasp if that was something that was done by people that just happen to
walk into the house afterward you know that could have been in the police said maybe nine or 10 people were in there
right or all the girls put put their purses together for whatever reason but but it's still weird to me because I
believe that all three purses were in one bedroom which would be weird that the mother would leave her purse in the
daughter's bedroom or the daughter leave it in the mothers to me it almost strikes me as you know like when you s
when if these guys when they're in there trying to gain control of a situation they have to kind of calm down their
victims and and one thing that sometimes they will do is claim like well I'm just
here to rob you I'm not here to take you anywhere I'm not here to do anything terrible to you so let's get I need
everybody to get their purses you know what I mean that kind of thing now we know that the purses weren't ransacked
because there weren't Keys taken there weren't money taken it it's been reported that maybe up to $700 was in
Cheryl's purse right and that's the other thing why I think that these three boys didn't did not do it they they
couldn't stop themselves from selling gold teeth for $30 to the pawn shop right I don't think that they would have
between the three of them been able to stop themselves from rifling through the purses and taking cash money yeah one of
them would have yeah well and maybe the TV too was just turned on for for light yeah I mean like you couldn't find a
switch or whatever the the busted uh front porch light always gets me is weird yeah yeah well in this Cox guy
it's like I want to call him something MH you know it's I I don't know what it's called it's it's right on the tip
of my tongue yeah I don't really think with the three boys I don't look just because
you're able to steal stuff from a grave doesn't mean that you're able to actually kill and and and bury three
individuals uh I I don't know but I think this Cox character I wish you'd come forward and and say more and uh you
know maybe he will one day and maybe the community and the family members will get some closure cuz like I said I mean
it's just it's you know it's tragic that it's women but also women that were just
in their Prime of of really creating a life and a future for themselves well the thing here is too what I would like
to see happen is I would like to see law enforcement really stay on to Larry Hall
and his brother Gary Hall not just for the sake of this case of the Springfield 3 but it looks like Larry's certainly
guilty of a lot of other things that we are yet to know about and he seems like he somewhat wants to talk and get some
of the stuff off of his chest he's he's confessed to things recanted he's confessed to things where he's not given
names or places or dates I think at some point if you pressure this guy long and
hard enough that I think that he will open up and talk and maybe we can get some of these get some closure for the
families and get some cases off of the books the the other thing too is don't forget about the Brother Gary he seems
to want to talk even though he's throwing all the blame on his brother Larry let's let's get him to talk as
well because maybe he can help us out even even if Gary's not guilty of anything maybe he can help us out with
with cases involving his brother and to the brother and to all the families really we're we are sorry for your loss
and and hopefully one day we'll get closure and and I don't understand why the police department wanted to say hey
look we're going to do testing on this Con and at least uh to figure out if this is yes or no M and so that they can
move forward and like I said the community can move forward as well all right recommended reading for this week
for this week we are recommending warnings unheeded by Andy Brown this is really an incredible story Andy Brown
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it's warnings unheated by Andy Brown and you can pick that up by going to True Crim garage.com and click on the
recommended page we have all of our books that we're recommending there and you can purchase those through the
Amazon Banner all right it's getting hot in the garage hot in the hot thank God it's warming up though it's getting hot
in the garage and the captain needs to cut the grass I'm not cutting the grass that's way you
cut the grass we want to thank everybody for joining us in the garage this week and until next week go by the douche
canoe shirts and be good don't be a douche canoe and buy good well well don't be a douche canoe and buy the
douche Cano shirt that's right and until next time be good be kind don't let her
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Springfield Three /// Part 2 /// 98

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High school graduation is to be a time of celebration. Thinking of the memories created with friends over the years and an acknowledgement of accomplishments. June, 1992 - Suzanne Streeter and Stacy McCall just finished high school and planned to spend the first few days of summer with friends. They stayed the night at Suzanne's mother's home. Sometime between 2:30am and 8am the three women disappeared. They are suspected to have been kidnapped and murdered. Outside of several possible serial killers living in the area police are left with very few leads. Tonight we examine the very strange disappearance of the women that now are known as the Springfield Three.

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Brief Summary

The episode examines the unsolved Springfield 3 case and potential suspects, including Robert Craig Cox and Larry Hall.

Key points

The Disappearance of the Springfield 3. Three women vanished after a graduation party, sparking a massive investigation.
Gerald Carnahan's Conviction. Gerald Carnahan was convicted of murder decades after the crime, providing closure to the victim's family.
Larry Hall's Emotional Confession. Larry Hall breaks down and admits to killing a girl, hinting at more victims.
Larry Hall's Criminal Profile. Larry Hall is suspected of multiple abductions across the U.S., raising serious concerns.
Cox's Criminal History. Robert Cox has a troubling past with abductions and assaults, raising alarms about his behavior.
Robert Craig Cox's Alibi. Cox claims he was with his girlfriend during the Springfield 3 disappearances, but doubts arise.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

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1:56WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

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