Psychopath Murderer’s Story Shocks Police | The Interrogation Room hosted by Vivica A. Fox | Forensic Files

(tense music) - He has absolutely no idea why the police want to talk to him. - [Vivica] Observing the signs.
- I think when he is brought into the interview room he's quite a cocky character.
The fact there's been a sudden shift in emotion. These are all leakage signals and red flags.
- [Vivica] Detecting changing stories. - Marvin, just spinning outta control here.
- [Vivica] Spotting when to hold back. - He describes it almost as a scene from a Shakespeare play.
- He wants one last kiss before she reaches out and touches the face of God. - [Vivica] And when to close in.
- Marvin, stop. I know you're lying. - I'm Vivica A. Fox. And I'm about to take you on a journey
to uncover the secrets of the interrogation room. As an award-winning actress, I know how to play a part
and convince audiences I'm someone else. In the interrogation room, a suspect must play the role of their life
to convince detectives of their innocence if they wanna make it out of that room with their freedom.
- [Darren] The game's up. They never ask a question they don't have the answer for.
(tense music) - [Vivica] Wednesday, January 24th, 2018. In Jacksonville, Florida,
46-year-old Marvin Williams has been arrested. Hungry and agitated, he complains about missing lunch
and demands to know why he's been brought in. - [Vivica] Two days earlier, Jacksonville police received a call
asking for a welfare check to be carried out on 61-year-old local hairdresser,
Cassandra Valentin. (sirens wail) - A check of the residence revealed that the victim,
Cassandra Valentin, Black, female, was deceased inside. - [Vivica] Police arrived at a gruesome scene
and found Cassandra dead, lying in a pool of blood. She had a broken knife in her neck.
Cassandra shared her home with fiancé Marvin Williams. (somber music) - Marvin can't be located.
The police assume he's gone into hiding and might be responsible for the murder.
A warrant is issued for his arrest and an online appeal is made for information of his whereabouts.
But two days later, he's found, out in the open, at work, not even hiding at all.
But the police get a further surprise. When they approach, Marvin tries to run away.
Marvin's behavior is confusing. Is he guilty or innocent? Hopefully time in the interrogation room will tell.
(door unlocking) (door squeaks) - So, Williams walks into a police station. He gets taken into an interview room.
He has absolutely no idea why the police want to talk to him. No idea whatso... He doesn't know why he's there.
- [Ciolino] So you always want to establish the fact that they have at least a primary education,
that they could read and write basic English, and that they understand everything
that's being said to them right now, in the moment. - [Vivica] With the suspect in the interrogation room,
this investigation begins as most murder investigations routinely begin: with the focus on the suspect's background,
his close friends and family. - [Maleary] Officers will always talk to the next of kin, the nearest relative.
Those people that have got vital information to establish why there has been a murder,
why there's been a homicide. They could hold the key to a case, especially if there has been history of domestic violence.
- [Vivica] Marvin does have a violent past. He spent time in prison for armed robbery
and domestic battery against Cassandra, his on/off girlfriend for the past five years.
However, in more recent times, Cassandra was convinced that he'd changed, and had agreed to marry him.
- You don't wanna focus too quickly on a family member or a significant other, okay?
Because occasionally there'd be somebody else who had motive to kill them that you're unaware of at that moment.
- [Ciolino] Everybody in the world's looking for Marvin. Everyone in town knows why he's there.
But Marvin apparently doesn't know why he is there. He's like, I have no idea. What's the problem?
- [Vivica] But if Marvin really had no idea why the police were looking for him,
why did he run? - [Ciolino] From law enforcement perspective, if you're innocent, you're not running away from the police.
From Marvin's perspective is, "Hey, I'm on probation. "I don't want to get grabbed by any cops."
So we call that one a draw. You have a girlfriend here? - [Darren] I think when he's brought into the interview room,
he's quite a cocky character. He's no stranger to being arrested or prison. So, just in terms of his posture,
the way he was sat, he stretches himself out on the chair as best he can. And again, that's quite an arrogant way to behave
in a police station when you're suspected of a crime. So I think right from the outset,
you've got somebody that's kind of not gonna be really compliant with the officers.
- The police believe Marvin Williams could be responsible for the brutal murder of his fiancée,
Cassandra Valentin. But Williams hasn't seen her for three days, and appears to be unaware she is dead.
Could police have the wrong man? - [Ciolino] You want to be careful before you marry yourself to
that person as the subject of your investigation. 'Cause you could be wrong, and we see a lot of wrongful convictions
in the United States. - [Vivica] Coming up, Marvin and Cassandra's relationship
is put under the microscope. - I think Williams fits into the stereotype of a typical abuser.
- [Vivica] And Detective Zehler drops a bombshell. - January, 2018. In Jacksonville, Florida, detectives are investigating
the brutal murder of Cassandra Valentin. Marvin Williams, her fiancé, is in police custody,
but seems completely unaware that Cassandra is dead. - [Vivica] Why would Marvin storm out
over an argument about football, and disappear for a week or two? What does this say about his relationship with his fiancée?
- [Lee] I believe that there was a mutual attraction between Cassandra and Williams,
because if you look at the age differential, he was 15 years younger than her.
Batterers that are younger men pursue much older women because, believe it or not,
some are looking for a mother figure, they're looking for the lost mother in their lives.
They're looking for a woman who will protect and care and nurture for them. He's someone who just came outta prison.
Most inmates seeking re-entry do not have the resources for housing, food, or shelter.
Well, who does? Someone who's established, someone who has a place to live, someone who has a job,
and someone who can put bread on the table. Even if they're 15 years older than you,
what a perfect setup. And she, in turn, may have had a, I guess, a psychological dependency on him.
I think he made her feel young again. She was 61, and she probably felt alive.
You know, the expression 'how Stella got her groove back'. It could have been something along those lines.
So they kind of mutually fed into each other's needs at that time. - [Vivica] So far, Marvin doesn't seem cagey
or careful with his answers. If he was guilty of Cassandra's murder, would he be so quick to reveal
that they'd had an argument and he stormed off. But if he knows nothing of her fate,
why isn't he more curious about Detective Zehler's line of questioning? - [Maleary] The officer's asking lots of questions
around the relationship between him and Cassandra. At no point does Williams say,
"Why are you asking me these questions about Cassandra? "What's the problem? What's the issue?
"Why am I here? What's it got to do with Cassandra? "What's got to do with me?"
He never inquires about the welfare of this person that he proclaims to love. - [Lee] It also reveals something about his character
as one of indifference, as one who doesn't care, as one who's not concerned about his intimate partner
whom he purportedly had not seen since Sunday evening. There's something wrong with that picture right away.
- [Vivica] The police play along for now, but they suspect the worst. They know Marvin has had a long history
of violent and manipulative behavior. some of it directed towards Cassandra. - [Lee] I think Williams fits into the stereotype
of a typical abuser in that, number one, he exhibits a lot of the dimensions that we find on the power and control wheel.
The power-control field talks about things like using male privilege. It talks about things like isolation.
It talks about sexual abuse. It talks about physical abuse. But in terms of isolation,
let's take that one concept, for instance, how she was isolated from her parents and her family
and her friends because of him. The record suggests that some of her sisters and cousins
would not go near her when he was around because they sensed something about him
that just wasn't right. I think one of her family members described him as pure evil.
- [Lee] So because of how violence works in relationships, if the offender or the batterer can isolate his victim,
that's the perfect segue towards power and control and doing what he wants to do to her
whenever he wants to. - [Vivica] Detective Zehler decides to narrow in on Marvin's argument with Cassandra
and how it might have escalated. - [Vivica] Marvin has suddenly changed his story.
The argument wasn't about football. It was about his past violence towards Cassandra,
something for which he had served time in prison in the past. - He objects to her "catching a major attitude".
Well, to me that suggests that he wants to exert control over what she can talk about
and when she can talk about it. In other words, she's not free to discuss even her own prior victimization,
because we're over that. That's done and over with, so let's move on with our relationship.
So that too is another measure of his exerting power and control. - [Vivica] Detective Zehler now questions his movements
after the argument and his story that he stormed out. The plan is to trap him in another lie.
- One of the tactics used by Williams was that his phone was dropped in water. I would suggest that that's a deliberate act.
And he states that he was trying to dry it out with rice. And I think there was a hope
that the police wouldn't find the evidence contained within that mobile phone.
- [Vivica] But if Marvin is trying to hide something that's on his phone, it's too late.
Unknown to Marvin, the police have already recovered all of its data from the cell phone company.
- The purpose of a good interrogation is to get a confession. You want the person to admit involvement in the crime.
By the time you get to an interrogation, generally, a lot of work has gone into an investigation
and you are very sure of who your perpetrator or your suspect is. - [Vivica] Feeling confident
because of the information he's gotten from Marvin's phone and what he knows about Marvin's criminal background,
Detective Zehler decides to ramp up the pressure. - So quite early on, he outrightly tells Williams
that they never ask a question they don't have the answer for. This is quite risky,
because no matter what we think about that suspect that we're interviewing, there still needs to be the presence of rapport,
because a suspect's constantly thinking, "Well, are they my friend? Will they help me?
"Can I plea-bargain?" A lot of the time, suspects can just clam up. - [Vivica] Marvin Williams is lying about his whereabouts
the night his fiancée Cassandra was murdered. But this doesn't prove he's the killer.
- Marvin's an experienced convict. He's been known, a couple times, for serious crimes.
He's done penitentiary time, in Florida, which is never a pleasant place. And if Marvin starts thinking about
how badly he does not want to go back to prison, he's gonna say the magic word, lawyer,
and that'll be the end of the interview. (suspenseful music) - [Vivica] With his prime suspect
looking angry and withdrawn, will Detective Zehler uncover the truth, or has he pushed too hard too soon?
(suspenseful music) - [Vivica] Coming up, loose lips sink ships. - [Vivica] And Marvin gets creative.
- Describes it almost as a scene from a Shakespeare play. [Vivica] In Jacksonville, Florida,
convicted felon Marvin Williams has been brought in for questioning about the brutal murder of his 61-year-old fiancée,
Cassandra Valentin. So far, he has maintained his innocence, claiming that on the night in question
they had a heated argument, before he stormed out and headed downtown. But the Jacksonville police are only just getting started.
Detective Zehler knows much more than his suspect, Marvin Williams, realizes. His plan is to reveal this step by step,
each time, blindsiding Williams and weakening his resolve. He now hits Marvin with new information.
Both of his trusted sisters have been helping the police with the investigation.
- The detectives went to visit the sister of Williams. I believe that they went to another state.
It's important that they see her, because, from the family, it would appear that she was the closest relative to Williams
and would've understood what his movements were, how he'd be behaving, and what the authorities would need to do
in order to bring him to justice. - [Vivica] For Marvin, this is devastating news.
On the night of January 22nd, 2018, he'd left phone messages and a text for his sisters
saying he was going to kill himself because he'd murdered Cassandra, and wasn't going back to prison.
Williams had destroyed his phone to try and prevent police from seeing those messages.
But his sisters had given him up. - So the detective now is shifting into high gear
in the confrontation phase of the interrogation, right? Marvin, Marvin stop. I know you're lying.
I got the phone. I got the text messages. I've got the voicemail. I've got the cell tower location records.
I've got it all, Marvin. And, Marvin, you got a big problem. - [Vivica] Having revealed his trump card,
there's no turning back for Detective Zehler. This is the moment of truth. Now it's a case on whether they can break Williams
and get him to confess, or whether he will request a lawyer and try to shut them down.
- The level and the pace at which you conduct that interview and the amount of pressure you put on the suspect,
it has to keep moving forward, like a train, almost. Once you've got to a certain level,
you can't back down. And with Williams, we see him at one point sort of lean back,
change his posture because he's not happy. He's not happy, the way he's being treated.
So that was probably, for me, the pivotal to a point at which you could have gone either way.
(sighs) - As a detective, having interviewed many people for the offence of murder,
when an admission is made, you're like a swan. You're on top of the water, acting all regally,
but underneath, you're peddling like mad because it's a real adrenaline buzz to get a confession from a murderer.
- Williams has got quite a low voice in terms of volume. He's quite labored. He's quite slow in how he delivers information anyway.
But when he realizes that the game's up, the voice tone lowers even more. So again, these are all leakage signals and red flags,
the fact that there's been a sudden shift in emotion. - Williams describes the episode,
to start off with, as being fun, where there's pushing and shoving and a discussion and...
And it's far from fun. Cassandra dies as a result of this incident and he's trying to play it down,
to make it look as if it's an accident, it's self-defense. But he's trying to minimize
his involvement in this offense. - Lot of victims get blamed for their own demise
because of their bad behavior. So Marvin's trying to transfer his bad behavior
onto the girlfriend. And Marvin's on the hook for it. Even Marvin, as dumb as he is, has figured that out.
But he is still gonna go with these fairy tales. - When Williams describes the way in which Cassandra dies,
he describes it almost as a scene from a Shakespeare play. He makes it the most romantic murder that's ever taken place.
- [Marvin] (long exhale) - [Maleary] Williams asserts that Cassandra said, "Baby, baby, I want to die.
"I want to go home." He's effectively saying that she's given him permission to kill her.
- [Vivica] Detective Zehler doesn't challenge this absurd story. He knows the more Marvin says,
the deeper the hole he's digging for himself. - I think the circumstances surrounding her actual death
are quite surprising. And I think it's highly unlikely. In fact, it is incredulous in its finest degree.
And here's why. I don't know if any person who's been accidentally stabbed, as a victim,
suddenly realized they're bleeding out and say, "Why don't you just kill me "and get it over with,"
for whatever reason. And if that is his argument, that is a very, very implausible and weak argument.
- [Vivica] Marvin Williams has finally confessed to stabbing Cassandra Valentin to death.
But he's also claiming that it was a mercy killing, that Cassandra asked him to put her out of her misery.
(suspenseful music) - [Vivica] Marvin has just been told that his fiancée, Cassandra,
could have survived her initial stab wound if he called an ambulance instead of stabbing her several times in the neck.
His response says it all. - [Ciolino] "Marvin, you stabbed her in the chest, "and she's talking to you.
"You could have stopped and called 911 and saved her. "She hadn't been stabbed in the neck yet."
"No, no she hadn't." "You could have saved her." And Marvin looks at the detective with disbelief
and goes, "I'd still be sitting here." "Marvin, she'd be alive." "Yeah, but the end result is I'd still be sitting here."
In other words, "Ah, they'd get me "on violation of probation and domestic violence
"and I go back to penitentiary. "So, what do you expect me to do?" - [Lee] And his reaction was one of grave indifference.
His reaction was one of non-remorse of non-contrition. I think it kind of painted a pretty good picture
of his character 'cause that's what he appeared to be. That type of careless, reckless,
in this case, murderer. - Marvin Williams has confessed, but only to his own concocted and bizarre version of events.
He claims that Cassandra attacked him with a knife. In the struggle that followed,
she was accidentally stabbed in the stomach. Then, out of kindness, Marvin stabbed Cassandra multiple times in her neck.
He claims she had begged him to finish her off. - [Ciolino] So do we think we're finished yet,
with the craziness? Crazy Town is still in full force. - [Vivica] Coming up, Marvin's fantasy becomes
even more elaborate. - [Vivica] Does Detective Zehler have enough for a conviction?
- This is not a self-defense issue. This is a coldblooded murder. - [Vivica] Marvin Williams claims
he accidentally stabbed his fiancée, Cassandra Valentin, after she came at him with a knife.
Then, when she begged him to finish her off, he did so, with care and kindness.
- "And then you stabbed her in the neck?" "Yes. Then I stabbed her in the neck after that."
So, "Baby, I love you. "Baby, give me a kiss. Baby, send me home. It's just Marvin just spinning out control here.
- [Vivica] But the crime scene tells a different story. Cassandra was stabbed in the neck multiple times,
and it was done with such force and brutality that the knife's handle broke off,
leaving the blade embedded in her throat. So what is Marvin trying to achieve with this bizarre version of events?
- [Darren] Once you reach a certain level where you've been presented with evidence
that it's clear you're involved, people try to minimize the impact of that involvement.
So, again, with Williams, we see him give this account of the fact that it was a bit of a stab wound to the abdomen,
and then she was pleading with him to kind of finish her off and stuff like that,
which, you know, who would do that? Who would? It goes beyond the realms of anyone's sort of sense, really.
- [Lee] She's lying there, dying in his arms, and he wants one last kiss before she reaches out
and touches the face of God. That is just delusional, to no extent. I mean that is just...
It's unfathomable. And it casts him as someone who's, um... almost having an out-of-body experience.
- [Vivica] By claiming that Cassandra had actually attacked him first, Marvin is hoping to argue self-defense,
but Detective Zehler explains to Marvin that his own account of what happened has already ruined any chance of that.
- The account given by Williams absolutely destroys his own defense. There isn't a jury in the United States
that wouldn't convict him of murder because it is so fictional, it's so implausible
that 12 good people would always find him guilty. - [Vivica] But Marvin and Cassandra's relationship
has been complex and volatile, defined by violence, but also co-dependency over a long period.
Is it possible that a jury might believe some or all of Marvin's story? - This is not a self-defense issue.
This is a coldblooded murder. - The disconnect between the actions and behavior is just so obvious that
it doesn't even warrant further attention, to be honest. - [Vivica] Despite Marvin's confession
and his utterly implausible explanation, no murder case is cut and dry, and no conviction is 100% certain.
- You can never take a confession on face value. You have to prove that it has taken place
in that particular way. Therefore, you need to build all the other evidence around it,
the forensics, the telephone work that would've taken place, the witness statements that they'd have needed to take.
You need to put all of that together in order to prove the case. - [Vivica] And more than that,
it has to be made clear to the perpetrator, in this case, Marvin Williams, that he is not going to get away with his lies.
- [Ciolino] Yeah, it's pretty safe to say that Marvin's so full of it it's unbelievable.
And it's what makes this case remarkable, is that Marvin actually gives all of this up
in grand, glorious detail, with these crazy, I mean... The best lawyer in the world
couldn't get Marvin out of this one. - [Vivica] On January 24th, 2018, Marvin Williams was charged
with first-degree murder of Cassandra Valentin, but it didn't remain that way. - [Lee] He wasn't prosecuted for first-degree murder,
which I guess the state could not prove that it was with the intention or premeditation to kill.
But given that it was a crime, and perhaps may have occurred in the heat of the moment
where death resulted is more likely an unintentional homicide, and that is what he pled to.
(tense music) - [Vivica] In the end, Marvin Williams was found guilty of the second-degree murder of Cassandra Valentin.
In January, 2019, he was sentenced to 35 years in prison. Despite his vow to his sisters
that he would rather die than face prison time again, Marvin Williams will likely spend the rest of his life
behind bars. (intense music)

When Cassandra Valentin is discovered brutally murdered inside her home, suspicions immediately fall on her fiancé, Marvin Lee Williams. Once inside the interrogation room, Marvin relents his innocence but drops a bombshell when he shares the craziest story these detectives have ever heard. Hosted by Vivica A. Fox, THE INTERROGATION ROOM is a brand new true crime series that brings viewers behind the scenes, where real-life murderers and detectives play cat and mouse. Behind every shocking crime is a detective racing to uncover the truth, and it all comes down to the wire inside the interrogation room.

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Brief Summary

Marvin Williams is interrogated for murdering his fiancée, revealing his violent past and bizarre justifications for the crime.

Key points

Marvin's Arrest. Marvin Williams is arrested in connection with the murder of his fiancée, Cassandra Valentin.
The Gruesome Discovery. Police find Cassandra Valentin dead in her home, raising suspicions about Marvin.
Detective Zehler's Strategy. Detective Zehler ramps up pressure on Marvin during the interrogation.
Marvin's Confession. Marvin confesses to stabbing Cassandra but claims it was a mercy killing.
Marvin's Bizarre Justification. Marvin claims Cassandra asked him to finish her off, revealing his twisted mindset.
Marvin's Implausible Defense. Marvin attempts to argue self-defense, but his account undermines his case.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

He has absolutely no idea.

0:21WatchJun 15, 2023

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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