Katie Janness /// Part 2 /// 761 | Forensic Files

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sadly there is another victim in this case and that victim is the dog Bowie three-year-old Bowie now his cause of
death has not been officially released but after a few months an Atlanta Police Department representative
acknowledged at a press conference that he Bowie was taken out with a knife stabbed
specifically an autopsy on an animal is called a necropsy but whether one was done on Bowie has never been addressed
by APD Bowie's body was sent to gbi not to the Atlanta medical examiner's office
all authorities would say was that potential evidence was gathered from the victims
so notice that they used victims plural in that statement and several news stations confirmed that APD
requested the necropsy in this situation so I I would guess that that was conducted and of course that's going to
be key I think to their investigation because I think it's right for everyone to make the assumption that Bowie would
have vigorously defended Katie if someone was attacking her yeah I I agree and in fact the the other person here
Emma told the Washington Post quote there is no doubt in my mind that Bowie tried to defend her he was about 50 lbs
he had a huge mouth and he was a fast dog I am sure he tried his best end quote and that really without us
circling back into a lot of the specul and questions that we had in part one of this
case but that certainly raises those questions that we discussed in part one who would attack somebody walking a
pitbull in a park at the middle of the night yes this becomes very complicated for me because again if if you have if
this is a personal attack then you have your victim picked out if this is a random
attack I would think that dog would be such a deter current that she wouldn't be a victim by a random attacker but I
think you made some good points when you're you know pseudo profiling the killer that this seems like some kind of
sadus in a way yeah the to me it's the the amount of wounds the staying there at the crime
scene and then in particular carving letters into the body to me is is again I'm I'm no expert I'm no John Douglas
but it's to me that's indicative of what a aist would do one question that we have not seen an answer
to was again something that we were kind of talking about in part one was Bowie's
leash still attached when they're found because there are reported rumors that the killer took
something from the scene now this has never been addressed publicly this has never been stated as fact so I want to
say this is this is rumor and speculation for the most part but there's so much rumor there and you know
how I am captain a lot of times if there's enough smoke I got to believe that there's some fire at the yeah but
you're malleable I mean you you change depending on what case you're looking at but to hear the repeated rumor
of that the killer took that there was something missing from the scene I want to know what that item was if in fact
there was something missing from the scene because again it could tell us a lot about our killer now one piece of
speculation that I did hear in this regard was I believe it was from and I I hope I'm giving credit where credit is
due I believe it was on the unresolved podcast where the the host had had speculated if it
would have been possibly the leash the dog's leash that may have been taken from the scene it would make sense the
other item that I wondered about was Katie's driver's license or Katie's state ID I know she was out walking that
night I I couldn't confirm if she would have a driver's license or not but she is an adult who is employed so she's
going to have at least estate identification card and I know with some of these types that for some reason
seems to be an item of importance to collect from their victim you know we talked about it
in the it with BTK Dennis Raider that was an item that he for some reason could not resist taking from his victim
or from the scene of the murders that was an item that the Florida vampire when we covered that case he couldn't
resist taking the driver's license of his victims well men are visual creatures so it makes sense that would
they would take a object that would have their their photo on it to possibly relive the attack over and over in their
sick twisted minds and I talked about on in part one that there are a couple of questions that I have that i' I I am am
very invested on finding out the answers to and unfortunately because of the state of the case because it's an
unsolved case and they're still looking for the killer I don't know that we're going to get that information until they
make an arrest or until this thing goes to trial but one of those questions was what item was taken from the the scene
and was it in fact a driver's license or state identification card now this is the big question for the public in
general for anybody that's reviewed this case the The $64,000 Question in this case everyone wants to know did Bowie
have someone's DNA on his teeth or in his mouth or even possibly bits of fabric or something found in his mouth
like so if he defended if he had the opportunity right because we can't we can't assume 100% that he had the
opportunity to defend himself or his or Katie but if he did it's conceivable that he may have bit the attacker now
did he break skin did he not break skin who knows but could he have had blood skin uh or pieces of fabric from the the
perpetrator's clothing found on his mouth or or in his mouth or or near him again this also doesn't seem
if it's a stranger on Stranger attack it doesn't seem doesn't seem like a first attack for a murderer like this I mean
like I said they'd have to be pretty they have to be pretty ballsy you know maybe they got a tiny pee pee but they
got big old balls and they and and this would it just seems to me because they haven't released any any
information on moving of the victim or and I know there's evidence of such but evidence of what moving her 10 ft or
moving her 50 yards there's a huge difference there and so this person it's very dangerous because they
they they will do it again and the thrill that you're more likely to get caught or more likely that
somebody seen you and I I have to believe that law enforcement has more eyewitnesses than they're telling us
about because again time of night yes less people out less people walking around but this is a busy area and like
you said this entrance is not that far from an intersection so but it gets complicated because if the attacker was
wearing black that's not going to show up and some of these shitty CCTV footage videos that we always see yeah and if if
theack back and everything went down quicker than some expect or anticipate like you suggested in part one then that
reduces the likelihood of of an eyewitness or what any potential Witnesses may have seen right we don't
know if they were able to collect any DNA it's it's simply we have that statement from law enforcement that
potential evidence potential physical evidence was collected from from the victims which would be suggestive that
they're talking about both Katie and Bowie now for those that don't know this pedmont park is an ins City
187 acre Recreation space used by thousands of atlantans daily for things like running just getting out into to a
beautiful area right getting fresh air picnicking Frisbee and all sorts of other things that people do in and
around Parks it's Atlanta's version of Central Park so it's a very popular place for dog walkers yeah and there is
a designated dog park within the park itself there's a Shake Shack and other food vendors that show up during the
daytime there's yoga classes that can be seen being conducted at the park there's
a large lake at the park as well so after you eat your Shake Shack you get to do the yoga to help it digest yeah
and I had said yesterday that because the I had said in part one that because the bathrooms would have been locked at
this point of the evening when the attack went down that the killer could not have washed up or scrubbed up in the
restroom area but I guess that large lake provides an opportunity for that type of cleanup if you will after the
attack yeah again and that would be a area that if I was walking in a park late at night there's probably not as
many lights around certain parts of that Lake it be pretty easy to dispose of your clothes change into new ones and
it's not that uncommon to see somebody walking around with a a book bag on now some of this is a little bit repetitive
but we're going to go into greater detail with the timeline and locations that are involved D in the timeline of
that night leading into the early morning hours when Katie and Bowie were found so let's review that timeline and
where this all went down as we said already Katie sit out with Bowie for their walk around 10 pm on July
27th we have unfortunately we do not have really any clue where they walked to or from for the next 90 minutes
approximately 90 minutes well just to put this out there I think law enforcement knows but that's because
they're passing a lot of businesses I'm assuming that at least one of these businesses had to catch Katie and Bowie
on surveillance footage but where we pick up their Trail is at that Henry's Midtown Tavern the restaurant where Emma
was working at that night they stopped in to say hi to Emma Emma has stated that she saw Katie and Bowie at 11:35
p.m. Katie told her that she was going home home after their visit then a security camera perfectly captured an
image of Bowie walking on Katie's left side as they crossed the pride rainbow painted
crosswalk on 10th Street in pedmont Avenue in midtown Atlanta right this photo was taken at 1209 a.m. and so we
know Katie and Bowie are alive and well at 12:09 a.m. according to this surveillance camera footage and in the
frame they are alone there's nobody else seen with them in the frame Harry's Midtown Tavern was on 10th Street
Northeast about 2,000 feet this is how close everything is 2,000 feet from the 10th Street in Charles Allen Drive
entrance to the park right where Katie was found but once Katie and Bowie crossed the crosswalk at 12 9 a.m. we
don't know which entrance to the park that they used right we can't see that from that image they could have walked
up to pedmont Avenue to 12th Street Northeast there's an entrance there they could have walked through the park
planning to exit at Charles Allen Drive this is they were closer to that location when they were found if Katie
and Bowie walked into the park at Charles Allen they would have arrived there at about 12:15
if they walked up the 12th Street entrance they would have arrived close to the Charles Allen exit a little while
later probably closer to 12:30 because simply because they had to a longer walk through the park right now Emma said
that it was not uncommon for Katie to walk Bowie in the park but she told 11 alive since I was at work she came by
and I don't know exactly the route she would take I noticed she did walk through the park sometimes she wouldn't
go deep in the park she might have walked from 12th Street entrance to the 10th Street
entrance end quote as we know both were deceased by 1257 when Emma arrived at the Charles
Allen gate so we know that they're alive and well at 12:09 for them to be in that
location just the speed and the time that it would take for persons to walk that distance would put them there at
the earliest at 12:15 at the latest closer to 12:30 they're found deceased at 1257 so we don't have regardless of of
what entrance they went into we don't have a whole lot of time that goes by no and then also by making that window
smaller I I think the big question for the public is well her partner Katie's partner Emma found her and did she have
enough time to commit a crime like this I think that's the big question here and
I don't know cuz I couldn't find anywhere that law enforcement is definitively saying that we don't view
her as a suspect yeah they they wouldn't they wouldn't publicly clear her from my
understanding but they've never referred to her as a suspect again it's it's tough with a case like this because you
don't know how much information they're holding back and what they're releasing to the public and is this the only the
the footage that you said uh of Katie and Bowie walking across the the rainbow crosswalk is this the only image they
have or is there another one we we we don't know I don't think we're privy to that information but I think what we've
narrowed it down to is we're talking about a window of somewhere between 27 minutes to 42 minutes approximately yeah
from the time that they're alive and well to the time that they we know them not to be now to put a little bit of an
expert Spin and put it under a a an experts a person that I consider to be an expert uh I thought you were going to
talk about yourself I was going to say don't don't have me do it because we both know I'm not an expert I'm a
captain Cheryl McCollum who we've met at crime con my understanding she'll be there at this year's crime con anybody
that's familiar with her work would I think wouldn't you wouldn't have to argue too much that she's an expert in
in her field so she wrote a a write up about this case she does a lot of good work out of the city of Atlanta she did
a write up on this case for Crime online and this is what she said there she says
Karen Greer and I walked the scene at the exact time the murder would have occurred and this was her observation
their observations that they made it was dark but the illumination from the street lights provided enough light to
see clearly as you navigate your way through the park any witness that would have come along could have easily seen
this murder Karen Greer said quote you can hear people at a nearby restaurant talking and laughing but no one reported
hearing screams that night so that brings us to the question that we were talking about for for a good deal of our
review of this case yeah do we actually have any Witnesses eyewitnesses or ear Witnesses or or both or video evidence
exactly because Atlanta is one of those cities where security cameras are installed all over there were in fact
reportedly nine of them in the park that night these were under the purview of the Department of Parks and Recreation
shout out to Ron Swanson one of the first things police did was go to pull the footage from these
cameras hoping that the attack on Katie Andor Bowie had been captured on camera or that they could see the asent maybe
they could see where the the perpetrator came from where he went what he was wearing what actually happened but what
do we always end up finding when we follow this breadcrumb Trail Captain we get better pictures of Mars there was no
footage insane get your [ __ ] together people get your [ __ ] together so not one of these
cameras were working at the time the city has made some vague statements to the effect that the cameras were not
operational due to outdated technology so maybe maybe they didn't have the ability for them to be working I I will
give them credit here I gota as as [ __ ] well but as somebody who work security for a long time this is where I
will give them some credit this is where they do show some signs of brains here they they purposely left the cameras in
place as a deterrent right so that that people in the park would think that the cameras were working and beer be
deterred from doing any type of crime or or violence or anything of that nature yeah but hold on that doesn't do our
victim Katie any good or course not it doesn't any good and the problem the problem I have with with just the public
in general is you you take our money and then you don't allocate it the best way
you can and one of the best ways they could to just let's not have fake cameras or cameras that aren't working
or out of date or whatever to be a deterrent let's have them actually work and let's have cameras that actually get
get us good footage and not just this grainy [ __ ] like I said we have better pictures from Mars of course as
far as the park goes we don't even have picture right you know I I'm just simply
saying and I'm with you of course an ideal situation would be to have these cameras have them new cameras had been
installed and up and running and and working and operational I'm just saying as someone that had to manage budgets
and oversee security teams and and uh property I've gone into other properties where they've
wasted money from their budget to pay to have cameras taken down that don't work
anymore why Why Pay 10 cents to do that just leave them up save that money in your budget for something else and nine
times out of 10 if a criminal or wouldbe criminal spots those cameras they will make the assumption that they're running
but based off what you're saying it this killer is not a normal individual no you
don't stab somebody and slash them over 50 some times you don't kill a dog you don't drag the victim you don't do so in
a a public location this person sick this person's Twisted they're not going to give a [ __ ] about a camera well and
most criminals of course are are not violent most criminals the even the violent ones don't even reach this level
of violence but usually a we're talking about deterrence here most criminals will not break into a home if they think
that a dog lives there whether it's a small dog or a big dog or what have you so this person was not deterred by the
dog if they were even aware that the cameras were present working or not they weren't deterred by that they weren't
deterred by it was a public location exactly exactly now where we do get some some information at least that we do
know that some of the cameras outside of the park were oper operational we saw still
photos that the APD released of we saw the still photo of the APD released of Katie and Bowie taken by the camera at
the pride crosswalk at 10th Street in pedmont Avenue right so we know that camera is working that was four
blocks four blocks from where her body was found the APD found other footage that they reviewed as well looking for
any images that could be the Killer are entering or leaving the park or anyone who might have seen something suspicious
after all of course it's going to be theorized by many that the the killer likely would have had to have been
covered in blood drenched in it most likely yeah one image released by the police on August 6th was of a man who
appeared to be a jogger emerging from the park at 12:46 a.m. it was dark out and he was wearing a one of those
headlamp things and dark colored shirt and shorts they police were openly seeking
this guy right we want to figure out who he is and they they were being clear they're saying this man is not a suspect
yeah we just want to see we want to figure out had he seen anything or or possibly even seen the killer yeah the
problem is is when you want when you're wearing one of those idiot headlights you don't want to admit to people that
you're wearing the idiot headlight well let's let's be nice here because this man did come forward and he
according to police was very Cooperative with investigators and police have said
he's not a su suspect and they've gone on as far to say that he did not witness the
crime but he if he whether he saw anything at all that was helpful to their investigation
that has not been released now we should note here captain that the jogger we we
have we have photo evidence of this so this this is not in dispute it's worth noting here that this
jogger ran into the entrance where Katie was found or she's found near this entrance the Charles
Allen and 10th Street entrance and then ran out of the same entrance just after she he's only in there for 46 seconds
he's only inside the park for 46 seconds so and know you said that that that this
may have all gone down faster than the three minutes that some that many have suggested being the least amount of time
but I it I think it's a big jump to get from three minutes to 46 seconds it it's
almost to me like he ran into the park and went n not today not today but also look I I just want to I want to admit
publicly that one I'm an idiot and two I own about five of those headlamps and I wear them often part of
the mole Patrol right the the cartoons where they have the headlamps on even though moles are blind from my
understanding so the headlamp makes no sense but anyway that's a cartoon world so let's get back to the real world we
do know that Katie was found by Emma just 20 minutes later after this man the jogger scene entering and exiting the
park after only being in there for approximately 46 seconds keep in mind had he been the attacker that that short
little window of 46 seconds also includes like running to the spot of the attack and then running from the spot of
the attack so that shrinks the attack even I think I think you are spot on my friend where you you said well you think
well maybe he just ran in and decided for whatever reason to quickly run back out if you look at a map of the park and
you look at the entrance and the exit that he accessed the restrooms are right there and what
did I say earlier we know that the restrooms were locked by this point in the evening he very likely could have
needed to go number one ran in and he checked the door it's locked and just runs right back out well look when I go
to a a local bar I walk through a park and if it's light out it's feels safe it's a very small Park very small
walking path when I'm heading back from the bar if I had a couple too many to drink or I or I stayed there a little
too long you start walking up to that Park and and it feels bad it feels scary it there's no
lights on in the park it's it would save me 5 to 10 minute walk and I go not today Satan I'm going a different way
and I think that's probably what happened but and I hate to keep throwing Emma under the bus here here but if we
have this jogger on surveillance wouldn't we have Emma on surveillance too and that would be able
to cooporate her story a little bit [Music] more you can start your day off right
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Angie [Music] that all right we are back talking in the air cheers to the people in the back
and cheers to you Colonel cheers to you Captain well and I I don't want to keep sounding like a douche maack with a side
order of cries but if I'm law enforcement it's just that's your job you have to look at
her Inner Circle because of the time frame and because we have been able to narrow it down a little bit closer look
it's just a fact Emma is finding Katie within what maybe 20 minutes of the attack maybe less Maybe within 10
minutes of the attack so she has to become a suspect and also because of Katie's social life and again you said
you know she's kind of a geeky person which I don't think is a bad thing I think being a nerd being a geek diving
into subjects maybe it's true crime that's cool and that's be that's actually become one of the new cools
right is to be passionate about things and and to dive into them and and let your nerd and geek flag fly but also she
worked at a restaurant she was a bartender I I hate to bring up baby Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer but is
there somebody in her life that was fixated on her these are the questions I'd be asking myself initially if I'm
law enforcement yes of course and I and these are all things that they are going
to ask and investigate internally but not necessarily release to the public their findings or what they
didn't find what they did release to the public is the police released other images from cameras at Park
entrances showing five other people walking into and out of the park and in the crosswalks outside the park asking
those people to come forward now the captain touched on something right before we went to our break there about
do we have Emma on camera going in or or exiting the park the the key here is while we've been we're being asked by
police were you one of these people that were captured on Photo near the park entrances that night could you come
forward or could somebody could you identify someone that you're seeing in these images keep in mind we still don't
have have information from the police where the victim entered the park that night she's found in the park but we
don't have anything we have no information of the police telling us look we have an image of her walking
into the park they just simply have released an image of her walking with Bowie Crossing that crosswalk right now
what I can see and it's you can clearly see that it's Katie you can clearly see that it's Bowie that's not not problem
not a problem it's not the best photo these are never the greatest of photos you know we talked about on I
don't know how many dozens of episodes with Deli had that picture just been better or a lot better we would have
gotten arrest a lot quicker than we did in that case now here what I can tell from what I can decipher from that image
of Katie janess is that Bowie looks very much to me as being on a leash in that photo for for what that's worth he
appears to be leashed to me at that point right now back to these other photographs uh let's give a little
description here so one of the photographs that's released by police was a group of three women crossing the
crosswalk away from pedmont Avenue Park entrance at 11:55 p.m. at 12:25 a.m. we have an image of a man with a cane who
walks out of the park he's looking down possibly he's looking at maybe a cell phone he walks out into pedmont Avenue
on the opposite side of the park he's wearing white pants and a white tank top so I killer yeah I can't vouch for what
the man with the cane was wearing when he was in the park but or or if he even entered the park at all again appears to
be walking outside of the park but we can say that he's not covered in blood at this point in that photograph at
12:43 a person in a hoodie leaves the park through the same pedmont Avenue entrance going off a memory here captain
that person I believe was dressed in dark clothing which makes it a little it's going to make it very in my opinion
difficult to see if there's blood on this person's clothing given the the vantage point of that camera to where
this man was standing after releasing these photos obviously investigators released a statement as well saying
investigators are hoping these in individuals may have seen something that could help forward their investigation
they are asking for assistance identifying or contacting them if anyone was in the area around the time of the
murder or if anyone knows someone in these photos we ask that you contact at ATA Police homicide investigators or
Crime Stoppers and maybe this is a stupid question but when you're talking about the letters that were carved into
the victim it doesn't seem like the way you described it that the letters go in order to spell fat that's correct like
it it it's from the way that it has been described and the way that I interpreted
that description it doesn't lay it out reading left to right FH T it sounds to me like these are all capital letters
because that would be the easiest way to C to make create these letters with what
type of instrument I'm assuming made these carvings but yes it doesn't lay out left to right f a t it's almost like
a t and then the f is in the wrong spot without having a better way of describing it yeah and again we don't
have we don't have a visual of of these letters so we don't know were they was it clearly a t or did
it look like a j and the reason why I bring that up is because if this was a hate crime you look at the a part of a a
g and and a t and they look those parts of those letters look similar you have a
line going down and across on a capital G and so was that what the perpetrator was trying to spell
out and then by in by all indications that would definitely Define this as a hate crime yeah and I think
that so early on in the case from from what I reviewed Captain it appeared that that was largely the
speculation that that many people in Atlanta I'm not talking about us podcasters or people living far away I'm
talking about in the city of Atlanta the speculation early on was that somebody was attempting to or had successfully
carved the letters [ __ ] right and that that would be indicative obviously of a hate crime and
I think I think that the police and maybe the mayor was involved in this decision making I don't know but
I think that the police felt like their hands were tied in this situation and I think they felt forced to release the
information that the no the letters were f a right without having any of us having
seen that I guess one could always argue that well how distinctive were those letters right but it sounds to me based
off of what they have released and keep in mind this is a situation we can all agree on this fact of the case that this
is an investigation that they have chosen to release some information and chosen to withhold some information and
they're being very methodical about what they choose to release and what they choose not to release and I say that
because to me that implies that what they are releasing to them is fact that they wouldn't go out of their way to say
no it wasn't [ __ ] the letters were fat yeah the arrangement of those letters certainly in some debate but I
think that they are convinced and would not say otherwise if they weren't 100% that
the the letters are F A now I will say this on one of the descriptions that I read of those letters it it's described
like that that the the writer for lack of better term may have made a Mis like made an extra Mark when trying to to
create the team e you know you you should have um a single line up and down and then a single vertical oh sorry
single vertical line single horizontal line to create your capital T correct yeah and this description it makes it
sound like there were two vertical lines next to each one another and the one horizontal line at the top
so not a perfect T if you yeah but that also to me this if this person tried to curve the
letter that maybe they were unsuccessful but you you normally would start a g at
at the top and circle back down so I I don't know it's very very tough but I think it's
especially in this community in the lgbtq plus Community you you have to look at this as a possibility the police
obviously closed the park to conduct a thorough investigation or as as well as they could for their
investigation of the grounds of this park and presumably I think yes I'm making some
assumptions and presumptions here but presumably you would believe that the investigators took a strong look at
Katie's phone and a strong look at Emma's phone right and their emails and Communications because what you do have
have here with Emma being look there nobody's openly called her a suspect well I shouldn't say that
there's been plenty of speculation that people do believe that she should be a suspect so I'm sure somewhere somebody
has openly called her a suspect but let's pretend for a moment that she is an actual suspect in this case you have
her statements her statement is I attempted on multiple tries to reach Katie via phone call and text so if you
are able to collect her phone and to do a full forensic check on her phone then you can one thing you could it her
phone's not may not tell you if she is the perpetrator or not but what it will tell you the digital forensics on it is
was she where she said she was at the time right was she was she where she said she was uh at work did she leave
work approximately at the time that she said she left work according to her phone's information was she calling
Katie from their apartment looking for her like she said in her statement was she texting Katie from their apartment
like she said because to me Captain if she were to have perpetrated this these two murders she would be in big trouble
very quickly if that phone didn't match up with her statements and if her phone did did match up with her statements and
she did perpetrate these murders then that means that she had to go to the park kill the two of them go back to the
apartment stage some things with her phone change her clothes clean up and then go to the park and pretend to find
them and call 911 and we've already talked about how short of a window that is and and she wouldn't have knowledge
of where she was going to be picked up on camera and where she wouldn't be picked up on camera and if she had her
phone on her person at the the entirety of that time her phone may indicate to investigators that she did go to the
park go back to the apartment and then went to the park afterwards which would make her look very very guilty yeah I
think I think if they had that information this is why I don't love her being a suspect one the time frame is
very small for her to have committed this murder and two if police had that information and that information was as
I just described I don't think that they would have any trouble naming her as a suspect and or arresting her like I I
think we would be looking at moving this thing toward trial rather than still looking for the killer this is where it
becomes complicated for me because Emma is the one with her story that she brings up find my phone so this would
have to be a very sophisticated level level of criminal to go hey I'm going to bring up this whole find my phone
angle with the victim knowing that then eventually you're going to say well we need to check your phone and we need to
know about your phone's whereabouts but is that a play to go well because I I'm the one that committed this crime I know
where my phone was I was the one that placed it to to make it look in away so by me brining up find my phone to to the
public and to the law enforcement then then they check my phone and go well her phone says that she couldn't have done
this but I know that's again I'm making some big leaps but again if I'm law enforcement and this is not to throw
Emma under the bus because if she's innocent then obviously she's a she's a victim as well and to one to have your
partner murdered so viciously but two to find her and then also you have to add into the equation their beloved dog so
it it becomes she's obviously a victim if she's Innocent but I I I think if we're talking to Emma right now she
would say if she was law enforcement this is an angle that you have to look at and you have
to almost start clearing these people the process of elimination if that makes any sense and then you can start looking
towards the idea that it that it was a stranger un stranger crime well and APD Atlanta Police Department they're a
large outfit they're a seasoned outfit Unfortunately they you know this is not an area that only experiences one or two
murders a year they are seasoned at investigating homicides because it's a big city like the nearest Big City to us
Columbus unfortunately there's like aund some murders a year and so they're used
to investigating homicides they have resources for that we do know that they called in the FBI which to me I think
that that you know there's multiple reasons why you would call in the FBI I kind of feel like the details of the
attack the the wounds the carving of the letters to me I think that's why they called in the feds to provide a
profile of of the wouldbe killer well it might not just be a profile but they could be calling in for assistance and
again a type of crime like this like you said with the profile of how vicious this attack was in the in the
public hemisphere call in all hands on deck we need we need to catch this individual
because this is a very dangerous individual well and if it was a very if let's say that it was not a targeted
attack that means that it's random stranger on Stranger violence at its highest level most violent level and in
a public place that's terrifying when you have a city of millions of people and you if if this is not targeted and
this is random you're right all hands on deck because this could happen very you know
could happen again and very soon yeah or again it could be random but targeted random in the sense it's a stranger on
Stranger but this the Killer is looking for a type of victim and this is a a hate crime on some level which I know
somebody's going to say all crimes are hate crimes yes you have to hate I'm the one that coined that I'm the one that
coined that phrase well we'll just spend the rest of the show padding ourselves on the back
well I'm not saying it's the best phrase ever coined but I mean of course how could you not hate the person in the
moment that you're killing them and then in this case this whoever whoever ended
This Woman's life didn't just kill her attempted to deface and Destroy her that's a whole
another level and that's why I believe that the FBI was brought in now as far as statements go from Emma circling back
to what you're talking about a minute ago with her being a victim here that on her Facebook page she wrote today I lost
the love of my life and my baby boy it was tragic she was the most intelligent kind humble and beautiful person I have
ever known I wanted to spend every second with her he was the sweetest most loyal companion my heart is so very
broken my world will never be the same thank you to everyone who has reached out it is truly appreciated that's the
other thing that a lot of people bring up even if if if for some reason Emma would to have been the perpetrator of
this murder would she have gone so far to kill her pet right that is not a to me that is not a
necessary step in the attack on Katie unless unless one needed to neutralize the dog or you just have a a horribly
evil violent person that just wants to kill everything yeah and I think if that was the case we'd have more people
people in their Inner Circle speaking up and and saying that that Emma should be
looked at and look and in these cases sometimes I feel bad just for braining it up or like when we you have when we
have a missing child or a mi missing mother or father you have to look at everybody in the Inner Circle and
sometimes I feel awful for bringing it up but if I didn't bring it up I'd be a fraud and
well the the reason why you bring it up and you have to bring it up is one because of your you you play the
percentages it's a discussion that needs to be had but in this case it goes beyond that because a lot of people got
suspicious of Emma due to a GoFundMe that was set up so somebody in Emma's family and forgive me I do not have the
name or know the relationship of the person who set up the GoFundMe the information I have States someone in
Emma's family or a family member of Emma set up a GoFundMe to help with Katie's funeral
expenses Emma didn't help matters in this case because it's been openly reported that she used a large portion
of the GoFundMe money to buy herself a condo and she openly admits this she told 11 alive that news Outlet she could
no longer live in the area she was afraid and not just afraid but saddened she could no longer live in the area
where she had shared so many memories with Katie CBS 46 reported that Emma Clark used about 75% of the roughly
$79,000 raised in the Katie Gone Too Soon GoFundMe campaign to pay for her new condo with the rest going towards
Katie's funeral service and also there was a charitable donation made from that money yeah but question for you I mean
if somebody puts out a GoFundMe for the captain to make a the best Bas Jazz record known to man and it raises
$100,000 and it's only going to cost me $10,000 to make the best jazz base record and jazz flute record of all time
then who who's to say what I do with the rest of the money right or or is that person supposed to give that money back
I I don't know how that works well and it's coming that money's funneled in from so many different persons and areas
that it's like how do you how do you determine how to give that money back like so for example with the pchl
project we are always doing fundraising efforts to help and assist law enforcement and families in Ohio Cold
Case homicides and in missing persons cases and identifying Jane and John Doe well some of our fundraising efforts
when we when we attempt to do DNA testing it varies man depending on where we send what lab we used how much work
they H has to go into trying to identify the person or identify the suspect from
the the evidence provided that we never know if it's going to cost 5,000 to let's say
$85,000 well if we do a fundraising effort for a specific case and we raise $88,000 and at the end it only costs us
6,000 to pay for everything that we set out to do we're left over with a surplus
of $2,000 who do we who do we give that money to what we do simply is just apply
it to the next case so we're using it for the same efforts it's just a different victim
now and I'm not trying to absolve Emma of Any of of what probably a lot of people perceive as wrongful doing with
this GoFundMe money but know this anybody that's had to it's unpleasant to pay for and have to purchase life
insurance right it's unpleasant to sit there and discuss and and talk about one's own demise and how do we pay for
things when the colonel passes away and yes this money was set Spit on His Grave
this money was set up the idea was that it was to pay for Katie's funeral expenses well it sounds to me like those
funeral expenses were covered and now there's a surplus of money but anybody that's had to have the unfortunate
conversation with their spouse their loved ones with purchasing life insurance you if you have the ability to
do so you don't just buy life insurance enough to put the konel in the in the in
the ground right and maybe a nice little headstone above his poor little body there no you you you need to have money
for the for the living the people that that are that are left and and unfortunately I have had I shouldn't say
it's fortunate that I have these relationships it's unfortunate what they've had to experience I know people
that have lost a child grown professional people that had their lives completely in order had great jobs
husband wife spouse what have you nice home in a nice neighborhood had everything going for them and by some
freak accident in this particular case that I'm thinking of right now car accident lost a child a teenage child
those persons they were fortunate enough to have life insurance on their child that life insurance wasn't just for
funeral enses for their child these people could not go about their daily lives they couldn't go to work they
couldn't function and and this and this is an accident Emma Emma is living in the neighborhood where the person if if
everything she says is true she's living in the neighborhood of the person that she loved the most that was murdered
viciously forget about functioning how are you not scared out of your mind on top of that the confusing part for me
right now is did that money that she paid for the the condo come from fundraisers or did it come from life
life insurance no this I I'm equating this money to as what somebody would use life insurance for right she this
GoFundMe was set up the information I have set up by somebody other than Emma and 79,000 roughly was raised for the
funeral expenses for Katie and the funeral expenses were covered a charitable donation was made and then
75% of the remaining money or sorry 75% of the total money from my understanding
was used to purchase a condo which moved Emma out of the area right at the same time again I don't want to I I don't
want to sound like I'm have full understanding of her decision making and that I'm 100% backing her and defending
her I just want I'm just presenting but she's not lying about it she's not lying
about it she's open about I'm just presenting some other information that that persons
who go well that's that's an indicator that she murdered Katie no I'm just trying to present some other information
that that is real life stuff that is tough stuff that none of us should have to experience that might have a better
reasoning and understanding of why that money was used in the way well it's yeah
it's a reasonable reasonable explanation of why you wouldn't want to be be in that area and not even just for your
safety but just all those moments are going to and all those locations are going to make you rem remember this
person that you loved and that you missed and you could also make an argument that she didn't know that this
GoFundMe was going to raise any money and so I don't think this is something that somebody could point to as a motive
because she didn't know that this money would be coming to her after the death I'd also like to say that if I made a
jazz flute record I'd call it the jazz flute goes toot toot what what a lot of this led to Captain was
harassment accusatory phone calls messages that she became a suspect in the eyes of speculating public well now
you're make me feel like a salty bag of dicks well but I think you have to ask the questions but no no no it's fair
because until we know we don't know we don't you know it's unsolved for a reason there are people smarter than us
with far more information than us that have looked at this case and they've not been able to solve it so and until we
know we don't know everybody's a suspect it's like one of my one of my favorite conversations I had with a detective was
I started asking him about suspect this suspect that suspect he he said you know
what when I show up to a murder scene there's only two people at this point in the investigation that have been cleared
myself and my mother and so that's the way that this is going to be with this case until we know
everybody's a suspect now we do know that Emma Clark publicly asked the APD to clear her to please release a
statement saying that I am not a suspect because she was receiving threats and I believe some of these were
death threats because people believe that she had killed Katie and that she was taking money and profiting from it
and the police while they never cleared her would not make that public statement
they did go out of their way to say look nobody we've not named a suspect in this
case and it sounds like the only person that they've cleared publicly anyway is the jogger because we we do have the
statement of them on camera saying the jogger we've interviewed him he's cooperate cooperating with police he is
not a suspect but hopefully Katie her family everybody that loved her that came across her and then also came across
little Bowie you know we get some answers sooner than later well and the police are really still hoping that
they're going to get some information from the public unfortunately like as as hot as this case was when it first broke
and it sounded like police had a lot of leads again it was releasing pictures of
person seen coming out of going into or near the Park that night and then chasing down those leads the crazy thing
though is go back to the statements of of our fellow podcasters and um who wrote for Crime online saying that we
walk the park at that time of night we could hear people at restaurants nearby we could hear cars passing and they
point out nobody reports having heard any screams that night I just feel like this is a situation where
Katie was ambushed and before she could even Scream the attack is is too far in for her to to be vocal and loud enough
for anybody nearby to hear anything right and there's a level of sophistication to that or luck I mean to
to me I look I know we we've danced around the idea did the did did this was this P this person's this perpetrator if
it wasn't someone known to Katie was it their first attack you know is this a budding serial killer I I believe that
that it might be their per if it were a budding serial killer I believe that it might be their first attack first kill
because of some of the things that I'm seeing at the scene and some of the way that the the details are described I
would be very curious if the FBI had the same assess to me the carving of of those letters if it's not somebody that
knows our victim it's something that the killer could not prevent themselves from
doing staying at that crime scene only heightens your risk of getting caught and the longer you stay there it goes up
it goes up it goes up it goes up every second every minute that you're there for some reason I can't shake it out of
my head that this was carving those letters was not only impulsive to not only shows and suggests the
impulsiveness of the killer which then could be an indicator of the Killer's age but on top of
that the they they couldn't stop thems they had to do that whatever for whatever reason they had to do that
before leaving the scene it's almost like a like a pyromaniac right pyros Technic most of the time get caught
because they do not possess the ability to leave the scene they are so sick and Disturbed that they they set the fire
and they have to stand there until the whole damn thing Burns to the ground but see that's where my argument would be if
this is a serial killer this is not the first attack because with a number of wounds to the victim the the carving of
the letters like you said broad daylight you you go is this some form of evidence
of escalation obviously we don't know what attacks they had before but I would think this is somebody that got
comfortable with being in an uncomfortable situation and being able to take their time if you view that it's
going to take a lot of time this is very complex and and a very sad case not you
know not just for the the families but the whole freaking Community you know what I mean the that whole area the
there's probably not a day when somebody's walking to their car or walking through the park or or how many
people stopped going to the park or stop jogging through the park because they couldn't get KD out of their mind and
then eventually people move on and and I'm no expert but if if I were profiling this case the offender here I
would be I would be telling the local authorities that I would be looking for somebody not older than 21 22 years of
age at the time of the murder likely living at his mom's or parents' house at the time which would be fairly close to
the park in proximity to the park if by chance he's not living with Mom well then his residence is still fairly close
to the park if it is somebody younger than that age of 2122 at the time of the murder you might be able to stumble upon
your killer by finding persons that have been picked up in the park or near the park for break curfew shortly before
after the murder now shortly after the murder I would expect if if police found the Killer and it was somebody that did
not know the victim on a personal level I would think that if they found that killer early on I would expect the
police to find some kind of drawings that this person made for memory of both the murder scene and both of the victims
the of Katie and of Bowie the do the thing about this case that that will continue to resonate is the viciousness
of this murder and how heinous of a crime this was in such a public place was the
riskiness a very big part of the thrill or part of the enjoyment for the Killer and if so that also points to someone
who's deranged a psychopath or someone consumed with hatred and as for what he did to Katie what did it all mean to him
why fat why fat why the cuts to her throat so deep she was nearly decapitated and why disbaling why the X
on her face we don't know and it seems like only a psychopath might know whether the
answer whatever the answer is this guy succeeded in accomplishing his goal he came equipped he waited patiently or
followed his prey he was not deterred by a large dog he moved swiftly and apparently silently he struck before his
victims even knew what hit them he carried out his mission his fantasy his Thrill Kill and then he slipped out of
the park undetected covered in blood in a major city with people out and about it was the work this is truly the work
of someone very evil who still lives among us we should point out if anybody wants to go and listen to some of
Katie's music Katie's music is still available for all to hear at soundcloud.com
ky- [Music] Janice the episode's over and you're thinking to yourself but I need more
True Crime garage well you can sign up at patreon or apple podcast subscriptions for bonus content Colonel
do we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners this week we are happy to be
recommending FBI diary profiles of Evil by retired agent Peter Kismet Jr with this book everyone can Venture
into a world where few have gone the realm of the FBI's most selective unit the profilers the author of this fine
work of True Crime was a member of the first group of FBI special agents who were handpicked for this groundbreaking
revolutionary and controversial training follow his path as an agent working cases in the field walk and think along
with him as he uses the training to assist law enforcement with violent murders and other crimes this is one of
my favorite true crime books it is FBI diary profiles of Evil by retired agent Peter Kismet Jr you can find that great
title and many more wonderful recommendations on our recommended page at true Crim garage.com
and make sure you sign up on the mailing list until next week be good be kind and
don't litter [Music] [Applause] [Music] you can start your day off right when you find a professional on Angie to get
your plumbing right first connect with skilled professionals to get all your home projects done well
visit angie.com you can do this when you Angie that

Katie Janness /// Part 2 /// 761

Part 2 of 2

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In July of 2021- 40 year old Katie Janness was walking her dog in a city park in Atlanta, Georgia when the two were attacked. Piedmont Park was just a short walk from Katie’s home. The two had walked together in the park many times. But on this night both were attacked and stabbed by an unknown assailant. Just before 1AM Katie’s partner Emma discovered Katie in the park and called 911. Please help get justice for Katie Janness. If you have any information please contact the Atlanta Police Department by calling 1(404) 614-6544

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Brief Summary

Katie Janess and her dog Bowie were murdered in Piedmont Park, Atlanta; the investigation reveals troubling details and community impact.

Key points

Angie's List Rebranding. Angie's List is now Angie, offering more than just a list of services.
True Crime Garage Introduction. Hosts welcome listeners and share a toast to fans.
Bowie's Defense. Discussion on how the victim's dog, Bowie, may have defended her during the attack.
Surveillance Footage Frustration. Lack of operational cameras raises questions about the investigation.
The Jogger's Suspicious Timing. A jogger was seen entering and exiting the park just before the attack, raising questions.
The Investigation Intensifies. Police are scrutinizing the victim's inner circle due to the short time frame of the attack.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Bowie would have vigorously defended Katie.

Discussion about the victim's dog and its role in the attack.

4:27WatchMay 22, 2024

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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