Getting Away With Murder /// Part 2 /// 552 | Forensic Files

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[Music] crime don't feel the [Music] same don't feel the [Music] same don't feel the same when we left
off yesterday Captain 11-year-old Jordan Brown was arrested for murder so what I
want to do here at the top of this show is start off with a little more background information on Jordan and his
father we're going to go back to 1997 this is when his mother Mildred Krauss was pregnant with Jordan during
this time she filed a protection from abuse order against Jordan's father Chris Brown Mildred that quote he drinks
heavily he uses drugs and he has such a temper when I told him I was going back to Florida he tore up my brother's room
he also tried running me off of the road when I had the baby with me he told me if I ever broke up with him he would
kill me end quote that is Mildred Krauss Jordan Brown's mother a protection of abuse from Chris Brown now we have no
way of knowing whether any of Mildred's allegations are true although she and Chris did split up very soon after
Jordan's birth Chris ended up with custody of Jordan however and Mildred she unfortunately became sick with
cancer she says she gave up custody because she couldn't take care of Jordan or give him a stable upbringing Chris
and Jordan were very very close and they did everything together Jordan's uncles
describe him as a normal boy who liked video games dirt bikes and hunting with his dad Jordan was on a Mighty Mites
football team at school we aren't privy to his school records because those are sealed some people say he was just a
normal kid and others say Jordan was a bit of a bully after the murders Kenzie's family started to tell stories
about Jordan Kenzie's brother-in-law Jason Craner recounted an episode in which his own child told him months
before the murders that he had been playing guns with Jordan and Jordan actually told my son that he wanted to
do that to her meaning he wanted to shoot Kenzie and her girls Jordan Brown is 11 years old is it possible that he
has a little bit of a jealousy because he's so close with his father and now these new people are coming into his
father's life and they're drawing attention away from him well and that's exactly what keny's family says they
believe was going on they said that there was an issue with jealousy we should point out that's not out of
question here and one could see that that could be the situation he's 11 years old and very quickly he basically
has a whole new family right they've only lived in that home for four months before Kenzie was shot and killed and so
in a relatively short period of time he's now not just living with his father but he's living with his father these
two young girls a new mom air quotes and a baby on the way and a new house so his
little young life has changed dramatically in a very short period of time well once keny's family brings up
these ideas of jealousy law enforcement's going to adopt this theory that seems right here Captain the
prosecutor started putting together a theory that Jordan wanted to get rid of Kenzie and that he was likely jealous of
the new baby wanting his father and his you know life all to himself whatever happened with this situation where one
of the kids tells a an adult that Jordan wanted to do that to Kenzie and the girls well this seems to have been lost
on Chris and Kenzie right they if if they were relayed this information they must have just denied it or dismissed it
and then we have the situation that Jordan's attorneys they point out that look Chris
Brown had no idea that his son had a problem with Kenzie and that's because they say he didn't have a problem with
Kenzie police also interviewed Chris Brown's girlfriend of seven years this is important here because we were
talking about an 11-year-old he lived with this woman for seven years Laura Miller remember Chris Brown dated her
from 2000 to 2007 Laura knew Jordan very well and told police that her son Frank
and Jordan called each other brothers here are some excerpts from her recorded interview question did Jordan ever act
out violently answer mostly he just cried question how did Jordan get along with other kids the answer was he was
shy if he was by himself he was shy when Jordan and Frank were together they were
never afraid to meet other kids how did you get along with Jordan this is really
interesting to me because this is another woman that he lived with for a much longer period of Time how did you
get along with Jordan were you afraid of him the answer is Jordan called me mommy
for more than 6 years we loved each other no I was not ever afraid of him not to interrupt you but we have to
remember that Jordan was calling Kinsey mom next question was Frank afraid of Jordan no Frank loved him like a brother
and he still does but Laura also told police of one fight between Jordan and Frank when Jordan was 5 years old and
she says I remember on one occasion in 2002 my son Frank was playing with his toy xylophone and Jordan told him to
quit I told Jordan that he was just playing and that he could continue playing Jordan was sitting on his dad's
lap punching his fist into his open hand sometime later Jordan got up and ran back into the bedroom and punched Frank
in the face Jordan then bit his own arm arm and said that Frank had bit him Jordan needed to learn how to deal with
his emotions is what she said Jordan cried a lot when he was very young she said he was shy withdrawn and jealous
over his dad during the time I knew him he lied a lot even when caught he would continue to lie this next story is
particularly horrible so brace yourselves get ready put them earballs in a seat belt because it's a bumpy ride
I wish I didn't have to say this but quote I remember one time when Chris had found some mice in the trailer he put
the mice in a bucket and went outside the trailer when I saw them Chris was throwing firecrackers in the bucket and
both he and Jordan were laughing my son Frank was also with them but he was crying end quote Yeah that's what you
want to do torture animals with your kid okay so the police have their man or their boy but now we need to flesh out a
case against him that will stand up in court so police interviewed everyone they could think of one person of
importance here Captain would be the school bus driver who first saw Jordan and Janessa when they were about a third
of the way down the driveway walking toward the road right he said that he observed them coming down the driveway
until they got onto the bus he said when they saw the bus waiting for them they both began to run toward the bus with
Jordan leading Janessa by about 10 yard they did not act in any way unusual nor did he observe either of them leave the
driveway or throw anything right because Janessa claims that she saw Jordan throw
something when they got towards the edge of the driveway the children got onto the bus took their respective seats and
behaved in a completely ordinary fashion for the duration of the ride now the only reason why I'm not going to fully
believe the the bus driver again not saying that they're a liar but the but the problem is and and you know this you
rode the bus for many of years as a student M when the bus comes and the little stop sign goes out and they're
they're watching the kids they're also watching the traffic be behind them in front of them so is it possible at some
point this bus driver took their eyes off the kid and and Jordan threw something when when the bus driver
wasn't looking not to mention all the other kids on the bus yes this is a very distracting job um a job that I am happy
that I don't do uh so I applaud those that do that job I don't know that I would have any hair left if I had that
job but um yes so I can understand that it would be difficult for this bus driver to give a full account but the
account that he gave there you have it he saw them for the entire time they didn't behave in any way that he thought
was abnormal he didn't see either child throw anything or discard anything at any point that's why I kind of circle
back to the whole thing of I want these interviews recorded because we have these statements by Trooper Wilson who
says well in the second interview Jordan hesitated and he's changing his answers
what I really would like to know is by that point in the second interview he's been made aware that his stepmother or
soon to be stepmother has been killed has been murdered if he is innocent that means that during the
course of the first interview he's a unaware of any of that very important information now if he's guilty he is
aware of why the officer is interviewing him without being told that he's being interviewed because his soon toe
stepmother has been murdered right I want that to be a recorded interview because I want to know did this kid seem
nervous like be on the point of oh you're just being asked random questions ordinary questions from a police officer
I would think that 11-year-old boy that knew that information going into the first interview would have visible signs
of being nervous 100% agree I think if those interviews are recorded then we have demeanor yes and I think that's
really important and what we have here Captain is we have the Troopers going out of their way to explain his behavior
and to detail his behavior during the course of the second interview but we don't have the same for the first
interview where he could have just been a normal little 11-year-old boy that doesn't know something horrible has
happened to his family this is going to lead us to the preliminary hearing which
is really kind of a mini trial here this will be held on March 24th to determine
if there was probable cause to bind Jordan over for trial the district attorney said of the evidence against
Jordan I have a shotgun blast to the back of the head that's consistent with a 20 gauge shotgun shell I have a 20
gauge youth model in his room which smells like it's recently fired he's got gun residue on him I think at this point
that's more than enough he went on describing the killing as premeditated and cold blooded he said Jordan shot
Kenzie put the shotgun back in his bedroom threw or hid the spent shell casing in the snow and then rode the bus
to Mohawk Elementary School with Janessa as if nothing had happened seems like it'd be hard to act normal if you
murdered your stepmom or if you even accidentally killed her yeah and again though I think what we're pointing out
though here Captain I get what you're saying could this have been an accident that's certainly in the realm of
possibility the problem is when you start covering up your accident it's now murder and if he or if he planned a poke
around down there with a gun it's he's still responsible for her death at the end of the day yes but his actions of
covering up to me would lean more towards he's 11 years old and not 25 30y old kid trying to cover up murder okay
but that's not the picture that they're going to paint for us at his trial so at
this trial the prosecution will call 10 Witnesses we have a trooper that testified that test showed that Jordan's
clothing taken from his person on the evening of February 20th these are the same items that he wore to school that
day had gunshot residue on them he acknowledged on cross that the analyst report also stated that the residue this
is important because you hear gunshot residue on this kid and you go all right he did it let's lock him up and throw
away the key right but on Cross it's pointed out that the gunshot residue could have resulted from from any of the
following three things discharging a firearm standing near someone who discharged a firearm or coming in
contact with a surface that had gunshot residue on it another Trooper testified that he found a 20 gauge shotgun in
Jordan's upstairs bedroom and it smelled as though it had recently been fired another Trooper said that there was no
evidence of a Breakin at all at the Home in fact a wad of cash was visible on a table in the bedroom and just to play
Devil's Advocate yes no signs of Breakin because all the doors were unlocked and
if your purpose there was to murder somebody then who cares about the money that's on the table exactly you're
exactly right you don't have to break in just walk right in right another Trooper
testified that when she first talked to Jordan at school he said he saw a black truck near The Farmhouse that morning
but thought it was for a man who came to feed livestock the trooper went on to say that in the second interview about
10 hours later Jordan's story changed it was now a truck and there was a person in a white hat inside who ducked down
out of sight again I think we both agree that it it's adding details to a story I
don't know how much it's the story changing correct I I can lean toward that that argument the testimony of
Trooper Martin from a previous proceeding was also considered by the court and I think that this I don't have
the exact statements that they took from Trooper Martin statement but I think that this might have been about the
footprints in the snow that the kids prints the two children's footprints coming down the driveway were the only
ones around the house yeah and this is not a John Benet ramsy situation where they're saying hey there's no Footprints
cuz there was no snow there was a there was a lot of snow so so there should have been some kind of other Footprints
yeah there I mean there wasn't a ton of snow I guess but the thing here that I have a hard time wrapping my head around
here Captain is it continued to snow right so I mean I guess yes if you could see the childrens and we're assuming it
sounds like we're assuming we we can't say for certain right that those are the footprints of the children but there are
two Footprints sets of footprints on the driveway could somebody have entered the
home and the footprints gone undetected that's the trouble troubling thing right
a killer doesn't NE necessarily have to walk up the driveway and go in the through the front door there's four
entrances to the home this is a rural property someone could have entered the home from any direction on foot the
Court ruled on March 29th 2009 that there was in fact enough evidence to try Jordan for the murders yeah Jordan Brown
11 years old well as we said Captain we have Jordan Brown who's going to stay in
that Juvenile facility for several years we have the court records and all the motions and trials that took place if we
go through all of them here well that will take about as long as Jordan sat in that Juvenile Facility so we're going to
kind of skim through this and give you the important details now in this regard there was a determination that there was
in fact enough evidence to try Jordan for these murders they're basically saying that we've established enough
evidence that the defendant was the killer that he acted alone the evidence indicates that on the morning of the
shooting the father left for work leaving the defendant the victim Kinsey ha and her children Janessa and Adeline
in the residence of the three children only the defendant was experienced in firing a shotgun and removing an
expended shell there were no signs of forced entry into the residence nor any signs of a struggle robbery or theft as
a result of the light covering of snow it was observable that the only Footprints were those of the defendant
and Janessa when they left for school at approximately 8:14 a.m. there were no other Footprints or tire tracks of any
person or vehicle that would have approach the residents during the time in which the killing could have occurred
they go on to say that the defendant owned a 20 gauge shotgun which was found in his bedroom along with other guns of
the Six Guns found in the bedroom the defendant's 20 gauge shotgun had the strong odor of gunpowder residue
indicating that it had been recently fired well back to that black truck if there was a black truck there whether
it's the man coming to feed the animals or if it's just a similar black truck where are the tire prints well and
that's that's easily something that you can detect and get to the bottom of you go and interview the person that feeds
the cattle right if he says he was there then you go oh right well that explains
the way the black truck if he says he wasn't there well then we have a whole another set of issues if in fact the
truck was there and as you pointed out where are the tire tracks for that truck I don't not going to sit here and
pretend that I have a great understanding of the layout of this property is it possible that there was a
black truck there and for whatever reason later tracks are not detected I think it could be but again not having a
good understanding of this property really limits my ability to have an opinion on that now here's where I get a
little upset yes so they go on to site they're citing the evidence as to why we need to try this kid for the murders and
one of the pieces of evidence that they site here in the court record I'll read from the court record here because words
are important just not Grammar it says along the path of the footprints of the defendant from the residence to the
roadway was located a shotgun shell in pristin condition indicating it had been recently placed in that location a
ballistics report showed that the shell was fired from the defendant's shotgun let me repeat that a ballistics report
showed that the shell was fired from the defendant's shotgun that is not true that is a false statement this is in the
court record and it really pisses me off because the reality of it and the science of it is this statement is very
incorrect tell them about it what the ballistics showed is that it could have been fired from that gun so to change
the wording of that to say that it was fired from the gun is incredibly misleading right they go on to site more
evidence gunpowder residue was found on the clothing taken from the defendant at
the time of his arrest this was clothes that he would have been wearing during the time frame of the murder they go on
to site too that the defendant was familiar with the use of a shotgun having been observed to have loaded and
unloaded a gun removed spent shells and to have been successful in a turkey shoot just several days before the
killing I was the champion at shooting turkey back in my day and there's one part here too that upsets me as well
where they're saying that of the three people that would have been in the home the three surviv iers Jordan Janessa and
Adeline that he is the only one yes we know that he operated a gun and he was familiar with with doing that but they
say he was the only one that could do that which is again an incorrect statement right it's not true I think
anybody with fingers and and arms could operate a gun yeah or people with long toes let me get this correct he was told
to move his guns that day we don't know that according to Janessa's story when she sees him carrying guns down the
stairs she ask him why he's doing that to which he replies my father told me to move them let's just say that part of
the story is true he could have moved those guns that would be the reason he would have maybe this gun residue this
gunpowder residue on his person that doesn't mean he fired the gun that is a possibility however Jordan statements do
not back up that statement of Janessa he doesn't say at any time that he handled
a gun that morning in fact he denies it that's a big problem I think in cases where you're interviewing children is
you don't necessarily think that they're lying to cover something up but they just might not be telling you the truth
well Jordan would sit there almost I don't want to say wasting away but he's sitting there in a Juvenile Detention
Facility before a bench trial could take place with which took place in 2012 the
murder occurred in 2009 Jordan consistently and continually denied having anything to do with keny's murder
and his family you know the brown side of the family anyway backed him up on this now there are many reasons why it
took so long but one really strange legal aspect to this case that's important to the story is as follows in
October of 2009 Jordan's attorney's motion that his case should be moved to the juvenile court in March of
2010 which is over a year after the murders the transfer to juvenile court was denied because according to judge
MTO one no evidence connected anyone else to the murders and two the judge agreed with the prosecution that since
Jordan would not admit any guilt his lack of Contrition meant that he would not be amendable to rehabilitation in
the juen system per the law in Pennsylvania one test of whether a criminal proceeding should be remanded
to juvenile court is whether the child has accepted responsibility for the underlying
offense as a result of Jordan Brown's lack of acceptance of responsibility he continued to insist he did not do it the
judge concluded that the defense had not established that Jordan was amendable to
treatment and therefore was not appropriate for the juvenile system so what does all that mumbo jumbo mean per
a law review article that we read about the law applied by judge MTO quote Pennsylvania's juvenile transfer statute
puts the child in a type of Catch 22 admit to the crime and be tried as a juvenile or maintain your innocence and
be tried in the adult criminal justice system system which is complete [ __ ] yes and it's the same thing they do with
like prole hearings oh well if if I'm telling you that I didn't kill this person but you want me to accept
responsibility or you won't parole me right you're in a nowin situation now it would take until March of 2011 so now we
are over two years past the murders that this ruling got overruled basically they're saying this
is a violation of Jordan's Fifth Amendment rights against self-incrimination right admit to it and
get tried as a juvenile or maintain your innocence and go fight it out in adult criminal justice court giant pile of
horeshit so the reason that all of this is so important is because Under Pennsylvania law if Jordan were remanded
to the juvenile system instead of the adult system he would remain in the juvenile system only until his 21st
birthday that's if he's found guilty the juvenile court only has jurisdiction until 21 at that point he's eligible for
release if he's tried and convicted as an adult he could spend the rest of his life in
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Angie [Music] that all right we're back y all going to make me lose my mind up in here up in
here cheers everybody cheers and a quick reminder if you're not following us on Instagram Facebook or Twitter you want
to do so you can find us on any of those platforms at True Crime garage I will be
sharing photos not only of the people of the case but also a few of the pictures
of the property so you can get a sense of what we're talking about the attorney general or the AG's office would be in
charge of Prosecuting the case the case against Jordan Brown they started off the trial we would end up having about 3
days of testimony during this trial but they started off the trial by reminding the court of all the evidence that had
been relied on in the previous hearings and reminding them that we the state established that a juvenile's gun was
used to kill the victim gunshot residue was on Jordan's shirt and pants the police focused on him because he was the
most likely perpetrator all other possibilities were eliminated okay I'm going to stay on
this and I'm sorry if I upset anyone but I'm going to stay on it because it really upsets me you get them Goat Boy
again here's the line we established that a juvenile's gun was used to kill the victim no you established that a gun
was used to kill the victim not a gun that was specifically built for a juvenile to use
again you can control thought by manipulating language if you can control language you essentially can control
thought and by choosing to use these words and putting out incorrect statements and sentences at the trial
you are painting a much different picture it was established that a shotgun was used to kill the victim not
that a juvenile's gun was used to kill the victim then the prosecution explains why other possibilities were eliminated
yeah they say for someone else to be the killer other than Jordan Brown the AG's
office said they would have had to know where the family lived which was a remote location that they had not lived
in very long they had to know that the gun was kept in Jordan's upstairs room know that the ammunition for that gun
was kept in keny's room successfully go into her room without waking her get the
ammunition kill her her and return the gun to Jordan's bedroom the person would have had to have left without leaving
Footprints or tire tracks all of this within a half an hour okay so let's clear some of that up actually it was an
hour it wasn't a half an hour right uh let's get our words right here we're talking about sentencing somebody to
prison for the rest of their life 11-year-old yeah and again the wording on this they would
have had to have known where the family lived okay I get that they would have had to have known that the gun was kept
in Jordan's upstairs room again you've not established that that gun is the actual murder weapon right know that the
ammunition for the gun was kept in Kinsey's room again you've not established that the ammunition that
came from that arm wire actually is the ammunition that killed for killed her what we do know scientifically Captain
is that gun could have been used to kill her the ammunition could have been used
to kill her right and that we know that that firearm was fired recently they're presenting all of this as fact when all
actuality it's just possibilities well hold on a second one of the things I think like the
defenses maybe maybe they didn't miss this but didn't he fire and kill some turkey recently yeah he was successful
at that turkey shoot that was six days before if I'm the defense that's what I'm arguing that's when the firearm was
fired so B basically the AG's office is saying that someone inside the house is responsible and there's no other
reasonable suspect and he is the only reasonable suspect I'll try to bring this up for the last time of this case I
agree with you so much on the interviews being actually taped to know what his demeanor was that first interview would
have been crucial they also pointed out that Premed ation existed in this murder
because once Janessa saw Jordan with the gun he went back upstairs and covered it
up with a blanket before coming back down he also took a shell from the box downstairs this required deliberately
loading the gun to shoot Kenzie so basically if you have any length at time you're doing all these actions to shoot
her this proves that it's premeditated whoever used the gun to kill Kenzie then put the gun back
upstairs again we've not 100% satisfied me or anybody that that was absolutely the gun that was used basically what
they're trying to tell us here Captain is this is that that morning for whatever reason it could have been the
jealousy a whole lot of other reasons we don't know but this 11-year-old decided
he was going to go downstairs with his gun that he recently got as a Christmas gift and shoot his soon to be stepmother
and person that he calls Mom they're saying that he put a blanket the the blanket that was later found with the
hole in it over the gun so that he could conceal the shotgun either from his from
the girls living in the house or from Kinsey herself right he has to go into her bedroom where she's lying on the bed
asleep open up the arm wire take out a shot gun shell load the gun put it to the back of her head pull the trigger
then go back upstairs wipe the gun down unload the shell do the hokey pokei put the shotgun back in its place cover it
up with the orange blanket along with the other five guns and then as he's leaving to go catch the school bus with
Janessa he then throws down the the shell some of the evidence at the house being the blanket with the hole in it
and the blood that is on the frame the door frame which is the front entrance to the home to which Chris Brown has
already told investigators nobody in the house ever used the front door and according to Janessa and Jordan Brown
they went out the side door that morning so yes maybe he could have touched the door frame prior to leaving the house
that day but according to their statements they went out the side door right and that's both of their
statements is there touch DNA evidence on the on the blanket do we know that that hole is from a gunshot well that's
where we get to Jordan's defense so his defense team is going to do their best to contradict the quote unquote evidence
presented by the prosecution they acknowledged that the shell found was consistent with Jordan's gun but there
was no evidence that it was actually fired by that gun the gun smelling like gunpowder could be residual from the
turkey shoot the blanket was subsequently subjected to microscopic examination and Chemical Testing and no
gunshot residue or blood was found on it this is important because according to their Theory the hole in the blanket is
because he left the the blanket concealing the shotgun as he shot her that's the only reasonable explanation
for this hole in the blanket why would there not be blowback spatter or gunshot residue is are theories wrong on this
gun or or on the blanket more importantly right they go on to say that no fingerprints or DNA linked Jordan to
anything this this is one that It's Tricky for me it sounds good for the defense look no DNA no fingerprints link
him to anything so meaning none of his prints or DNA was found on the gun I actually have a big problem with that
and a big problem with it for the defense if this was his gun and he had used it recently I would expect to to
find fingerprints his fingerprints on the gun but you did not that actually to me suggests that possibly this gun was
used for the murder and maybe somebody wiped this gun down before returning it to its rightful place yeah a wiper the
GSR found on Jordan was microscopic amount there was one particle on each of his shirt and pants and of course we've
already been told that it's possible that that could have been transferred from uh another item or another surface
and they point out specifically his winter coat because we know that he wore that same winter coat at the turkey
shoot just 6 days before they also pointed out that the family routinely used the property for target practice so
spent shells were all over the place and police found a couple of them on the property Jordan had no prior juvenile
record or History of Violence he was close with his father and had no mental issues or diagnosis and it's not
realistic to think that an 11-year-old is sophisticated enough to carry out this crime while leaving so little
evidence behind that is the defense's argument there's so many moving pieces and parts to this case it's almost like
law enforcement dismissed any idea of an intruder Theory to begin with I'd like to know more about the people that were
in kiny life well that's a good segue here Captain because I have another suspect for you we say that they
exhausted all other possibilities well one thing that was not clear was how much possible emphasis Jordan's defense
team placed on other possible suspects at this trial and there was probably a good suspect here there's one that at
least raised some eyebrows I know that and the day of the murder February 20th 200
the state police put out an APB for an Adam Harvey Harvey was Ken's ex of six years and police were well aware that
the two of them had a fraught history at the time of the murder Kenzie her parents her sister and her
brother-in-law all had a three-year protection from abuse order against Adam Harvey this was issued after an incident
in February of 20 8 this is a year before the murder when Harvey who was living in North Carolina called Kenzie's
mother and threatened to take her whole family out this was the second protection order issued the first
was issued in May of 2006 after Kinzie reported that Harvey abused her and said things that involved threatening to kill
her or have her killed by his friends he also physically attacked Kenzie and he and his brother threatened to kill her
after this Kenzie and Harvey reconciled and then moved to North Carolina but soon he resumed his abusive ways and
began accumulating guns Kenzie left him and took Janessa and Adeline who was born while Kenzie was in the
relationship with Harvey and moved back to wam New Galilee to be with her family
Harvey moved back to that area in October of 2008 so this is just months before someone killed Kenzie Harvey
lived within 10 miles of Kenzie Chris Brown testified that he and Kenzie deliberately chose to have an unlisted
phone number at the house they rented to make sure that Harvey could not contact
them Chris once listened to 12 voicemails Adam Harvey left for Kenzie in which he repeatedly threatened her
and her family well that's 12 voicemails too many he also left numerous voicemails for her mom and Debbie
threatening Kenzie and everyone else so very clearly Kenzie was afraid of her ex
Adam Harvey this little piece of evidence or a nugget of information I think is really important that two weeks
before the murder Harvey received a paternity test stating that his the the four-year-old daughter that he thought
was his was not his exactly and the other thing we should note here as well is that Adam Harvey drove a black pickup
truck old [ __ ] bag they did track him down now mind you this is interesting on
the same day that she's murdered they put out an APB for this man they're looking for him that's where their minds
go to immediately after finding her killed regardless of what they're seeing at the scene all these things that they
say later pointed to an inside job now they tracked him down and voluntarily he spoke to the police or that's the
statement that we have is that he voluntarily came to talk to the police this was after the police confronted him
at an intersection they noted that his black truck had a light coating of snow on it and the snow was dirty Harvey was
taken to the state police barracks and interviewed at 12 I'm sorry and interviewed around 2:20 p.m. on the day
of the murders he admitted that he was surprised by the paternity test results and that he and Kinsey argued over child
support payments but he told police that he didn't know where Kinsey lived and besides he said he had an alibi for the
morning of the shooting he had been at home in the basement of his parents house where he lived since 10 p.m. he
says the previous evening and that the only way out of the house was through the upstairs through an upstairs door
where his dad was his dad would have seen him leave and his father says that he never saw Harvey leave between
10 p.m. the night before and the time in question I don't like these aliis I spousal Alibi or family
Alibi uh nope I don't I don't buy them it's not an alibi to me per the court record Harvey's hands were tested at the
time by investigators for presence of gunshot residue but none was detected based on his proferred Alibi and the
presence of snow on the truck which the investigator opinion suggested that he could not have driven to wam a a
distance of about 8 to 10 miles away and then back without all the snow coming off so they say that the snow evidence
on his truck no gunshot residue on his person and The Alibi uh being at his parents home seems
to be enough for them to have moved on from from Harvey well he could have used the blanket himself and then therefore
there'd be no gun residue on his person yeah possibly I'm just a little confused why there's
no scientific evidence on the blanket itself it it makes right you can't I don't think you can have it both ways
right you cannot say that he used it to conceal the shotgun and I'm assuming their statement is that he
continued to cover the shotgun when he fired it and that's how the blanket got the hole in it but the problem with that
is why is there no gun evidence or blood evidence on that blanket when you're telling me the pathologist is saying
that the gun was 2 in or less from the victim when it was fired it just it doesn't ring true and you can't have it
both ways so either that blanket has nothing to do with the murder at all I mean that's what the the the scientific
evidence would suggest right or it was not used in the manner that they are implying that it was used well I see our
blog post blowing up this week again that's at True Crime garage.com I can't get over the fact
that this guy one exboyfriend he's abusive I can't get over the black truck Jordan is saying I saw this black truck
it's not the guy that I normally see in a black truck that's similar to this and
the fact that Jordan told people about this black truck before he was even interviewed by law enforcement yeah it's
difficult and this whole case to me is difficult because of the evidence or the lack thereof and
again it goes back to well how do you paint the picture and the way that they paint the picture is as such that it was
that gun in his room that was used it was the ammunition that was in keny's room that was used to kill her and
because of those factors those key factors and then janess is saying I saw him with the gun and I saw him Chuck
something into the yard when we ran to the bus well then that makes him your Prime Suspect however in reality is it's
never proven that that was the gun that was used it was never proven that that shell casing was the ammunition that was
used to kill Kenzie you have Janessa's changing stories she's seven years old is it
possible that somebody entered the home through an unlocked door shot and killed
this woman and then turned around and walked out and for whatever reason nobody detected tire tracks or
Footprints the bullet casing that they found in the yard that Jordan Brown chucked according to Janessa as they ran
out to the school bus was found underneath snow so it's also not crazy to think that there's potential o other evidence
that was then covered by snow after the murders in my opinion because of the prosecution controlled the language
controlled the narrative that's how they got the guilty verdict that they got against Jordan Brown yes he's found to
be guilty and after the trial we have Jack Hal who is keny's Father who called Jordan evil he stated quote I hope he
gets the help he needs the kids got a problem and we have her mother Debbie who told the media he's guilty and my
only reaction is yes he should have been found guilty but it ain't bringing back
Kenzie and the baby so Jordan is remanded to the custody of the juvenile facility until
the age of 21 now under state law during his juvenile treatment Jordan would receive
counseling and would also be evaluated every 6 months for possible release per the juvenile act every six months the
judge gets in effect a progress report on the child to determine if Jordan is fully rehabilitated and
releasable but at the latest he would get out in August of 2018 when he would be turning 21 years
of age this is one of the things that makes the case so difficult because if you believe that Jordan Brown is
responsible for the murder of his stepmom and his half sibling that him getting out of prison
when he's 21 is not Justice and that Jordan Brown got away with murder on the other hand if you don't think Jordan
Brown is responsible for the murders and you believe suspects like Adam Harvey should have been looked into
more then you could view that situation as Adam Harvey getting away with murder well and after the conviction we're
going to take Jordan's case all the way you know up the courts as they say and we're going to appeal this and we're
going to appeal that and we're going to challenge the ruling we're going to challenge the verdict and continue to
plea our case that Jordan is innocent and did not commit this murder now Jordan's arguments to the Supreme Court
are as follows that the gun in the shell in regard to the gun in the Shell the Supreme Court agreed
with Jordan that the evidence of the record did not support the juvenile Court's conclusion that the 20 gauge
shotgun recovered from the upstairs bedroom was the murder weapon the Supreme Court agreed that the 20 gauge
shotgun shell which was recovered from an area in which Jordan and his father had routinely shot such weapons on
previous occasions was found buried under snow covered ice and leaves raised a doubt as to whether it had been been
fired from the shotgun on the day of the murder also the school bus driver did not see him throw anything further
Jordan in his arguments to the Supreme Court points out that the Firearms expert could not directly link the
pellets recovered from the victim's body to the shotgun taken from Jordan's room the
test he ran showed only that the pellets recovered from the victim skull were quote consistent end quot in their size
shape weight and material with the pellets and the unfired shotgun shell located inside the armoire the Firearms
expert testified that smooth boore shotguns unlike rifles or pistols have no unique grooves in their barrels and
hence they do not produce any identifying marks on shotgun shell pellets discharged from a particular
shotgun as a result he could not perform an individualized comparison analysis of
the pellets which were recovered from the victim's body with the pellets in the box of shells located in the armor
that's a really long way of saying they were not able to determine if that ammunition was used to kill her right
which they said in their theory that they presented at court that that ammunition did kill her they're also not
able to prove that the gun was fired on that day that the gun was used to commit
that murder they present Ed it as it was and so basically what we're going to end
up having here Captain because I could go through about seven or eight more pages of this stuff in the end what they
are going to determine is that these items they don't necessarily weigh stronger one way or another do
they they don't necessarily suggest guilt or innocence they're all kind of just 5050 these these are the facts of
the case yes there were guns in the house a similar type gun was used to kill the victim yes there was ammunition
in the house a similar type ammunition was used to kill the victim but you can't put all these things together and
string them along and say that yes this happened this was used and this was used
by this person to kill this person you can't weigh one way or the other in an opinion or a determination of the facts
hold on to your seat for one of the most frustrating endings of a case so like we
said he was charged he gets out of prison charged tried and convicted yes and but but because of these appeals
here Captain what we end up with is the Supreme Court of Pennsylvania the Western Western District would
ultimately hand down a verdict in 2018 this is after n and a half years of legal back and forth and three Appeals
the court unanimously threw out Jordan's conviction it overturned the original guilty verdict the Supreme Court ruled
that the Commonwealth's evidence was insufficient as a matter of law to overcome Jordan's presumption of
innocence in fact the court concluded the forensic evidence and witness testimony could go either way being that
they were consistent with two possibilities his guilt and his innocence but by them throwing out his
conviction you would think that the state then wants to go after a different suspect but it doesn't seem like the
state's doing much to solve this this case well it's really uncommon for this to even go down the way that it did to
begin with and although the court did not go so far even though they threw out his conviction they didn't go so far as
to declare that Jordan was innocent it did reverse the juvenile court adjudication of his delinquency because
there was not enough evidence to convict him again a rare occurrence but because
he had already been tried for the murders now Double Jeopardy is attached and Jordan cannot be tried again
so he's free as you said uh but he was actually already released before they overturned his conviction as it turned
out pursuant to one of the every six months reviews that were called for by law when Jordan was found guilty he had
already been released when this ruling came down he was released in June of 2016 at the age of 18 he was released
from juvenile custody custody and placed on probation in the custody of an uncle
who lived in Ohio when he turned 21 he would be released from the probation so he got out of he got out of prison was
on this probation and would have been off of the probation when he turned 21 but before that the Supreme Court ruling
changed everything and again it overturned his conviction and he would no longer have the guilty verdict
hanging over his head or on his record but it's unsatisfying isn't it Captain that's what she said this whole case
this whole story all of the trials all of the legal stuff the shifting it's all very un satisfying because at the end of
the day we don't know who is responsible for these murders the state spent so much time telling us that Jordan Brown
was the one responsible for these murders and then the defense in the appeals process later tells us well we
can't really determine who in fact was responsible well basically telling us that Jordan we can't determine if he is
actually responsible just that there's not enough evidence to convict him so now you have
if you were to present this story this real life True Crime Story to a room of 100 people you're going to have 50 of
them that say he's guilty as hell and he got off easy and you're going to have the other 50 people that are probably
going to say they didn't find the right guy they didn't get the right guy and the real killer is still out there but
after presenting all the evidence is there something that sticks out to you that
maybe sways you one way or another there are severe concerns I have about some of
the statements and possible evidence in this case first off I don't like the contradicting stories of Jordan and the
bus driver in Jordan's story Janessa is ahead of him when he sees this truck that's parked by the garage when the
officer asked him did you tell Janessa about the truck he says I attempted to but I don't think she heard me because
she was too far ahead of me by this point the bus driver says that when he sees the kids running down the driveway
to get to the bus that Jordan was in front of Janessa by about 10 yards according to the bus driver in Janessa's
story she says that she saw Jordan Chuck the shotgun shell or Chuck something down toward the ground while they were
running on the driveway well if Jordan is behind her she can't see him Chuck anything so when we have three people
telling us a story here factual if we are to believe that only one of them would be lying or
believe that there's consist inconsistencies in their story well two of their stories are matching up and
that's not Jordan's version of those stories what's matching up is Janessa's version along with the bus driver's
version of that story so that doesn't look real good for Jordan in my opinion I have some very strong questions about
that part of the story I also have major concerns that I've already voiced time and time again about this blanket that
was found we're told by the state that it was a big part of the case and a big part of the murders yet there's no
scientific evidence to suggest that it had anything to do with the murders at all so that's a real kind of convoluted
part of this story the other thing that I want to point out too that we pointed out in episode one that that we talked
about briefly but we didn't go into detail of we have the story of Adeline that that changes throughout the years
when she originally spoke with police on the day of the murder now mind you she's
4 years old all right so we need to take this with with a grain of salt but when
she spoke with the officers on the day of the murders she said that she was up for a while she watched TV she ate some
food in the kitchen and then it was when she heard her mother's phone ring that she went into keny's room to find her
dead when she tells the story to 2020 years later she says that she wakes up to a loud boom which would be possibly a
shotgun blast I don't know I can't make heads or tails of which one is is correct it it
doesn't did she hear a shotgun blast wake up and then eat some food watch TV for a little bit and then does not go
into the room until the phone rings that's a possibility but the story is changing
and and the the problem of having little kids basically filling out the blanks for you has really left me kind of
confused in this story as to what I think possibly happened the black truck because Jordan could have easily
said yeah the black truck there's a guy that comes and feeds the animals that's who I saw he didn't say that he he went
a step further and said it looks like the same truck but it wasn't that guy and the fact that you have a protection
order against abusive [ __ ] already threat to kill her and her family multiple times that would
lead me away from Jordan being guilty but I don't think this case is that clear-cut and I think you could study
this one for a very long time and flip-flop on on whether you thought he was innocent or guilty I don't think it's
that clearcut in this case it's not it definitely is not and it's one that I've struggled with for the past week I will
leave everybody with this you know one of this is a crucial element in the case I believe and as we pointed out in
episode one the time frame the timeline is very crucial to this case and every minute
counts and we have the story and this comes from Jordan when he's first asked by the
officers from Trooper Wilson's report quote when asked what time it was Jordan Brown stated that they usually leave the
house at 8:12 but since his mom was telling them they needed to go or they were going to be late he stated that it
was probably 88:13 or 8:14 everyone's statements are that the bus came to pick them up at 8:12 to 8:15
every morning one thing that I think is very interesting and I wonder why it is missing
from The Trial was that Janessa was never asked to testify about her statements about
that morning and we do know that those statements seem to have changed or morphed through the course of multiple
interviews she's not asked to testify what she witnessed that morning and I think that that is key
here because if if you really believed her if you were the state and you really believed everything that she told you
which was one of the things that led to the arrest of Jordan Brown well wouldn't
you use that in Your Arsenal against this guy to convict him the obvious answer is yes but they did not why does
she at any point did she at any point back up Jordan's statement of well I heard keny yell I heard my mother
yell that we were going to be late that we need to go outside or we're going to be late or we're going to miss the bus
if she were to back up Jordan Brown statement then that would have gave him approximately 2 to 3 minutes to go
upstairs retrieve the gun cover it with the blanket go downstairs find the ammunition load it point it to the back
of her head pull the trigger and Janessa does not hear the shotgun go off and then he goes back upstairs unloads the
gun wipes it down puts it away and then runs out the front door and Chucks the shell casing as he's running to the bus
gets on the bus and then behaves like nothing happened at all it seems very very doubtful to me that that
could have went down in a matter of two to three minutes whatever side of the fence you're on whether you think he's
guilty or innocent somebody got away with murder [Music] this case leaves a lot of questions we
want to hear your thoughts and opinions go to true garage.com and leave those on the blog
Colonel do we have any recommended reading this week for the beautiful listeners this week we are recommending
the spy and the trader the greatest Espionage story of the Cold War by Ben McIntyre you're going to love this book
I am about halfway through this one here captain and excited to recommend it to everyone out there so check out the spy
and the trader the greatest Espionage story of the Cold War by Ben McIntyre you can find that great title and many
more recommendations on our recommended page at true Crim garage.com and until next week you beautiful people be good
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Getting Away With Murder /// Part 2 /// 552

Part 2 of 2

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February 20, 2009 - Wampum, Pennsylvania. A 26 year old mother of two is found dead in her home. She was found to be shot in the head laying in her bed. State Police quickly determined that she was found a very short period of time after having been killed, maybe just minutes. More than in most cases, the timeline of the events and movements of persons closest to our victim will be the key element in this week’s true crime story.

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Brief Summary

Jordan Brown, 11, was convicted of murdering his stepmother but later had his conviction overturned due to insufficient evidence.

Key points

Mildred's Allegations. Mildred Krauss filed a protection order against Jordan's father, citing his violent behavior.
The Arrest of Jordan Brown. 11-year-old Jordan Brown was arrested for murder, raising questions about his motives and behavior.
Evidence Against Jordan. The prosecution presents evidence including gunshot residue and a shotgun found in Jordan's room.
Misleading Evidence in Court. The speaker argues that the court's evidence is misrepresented, causing frustration.
Jordan's Fifth Amendment Rights. Legal complexities arise as Jordan's rights are discussed in relation to his trial.
Premeditation in the Murder. The prosecution claims that the actions taken by Jordan indicate premeditation.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

He drinks heavily, he uses drugs and he has such a temper.

Mildred Krauss describing her ex-husband's behavior.

4:31WatchNov 16, 2023

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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