Free at Last? | "Murder in the Orange Grove" | "48 Hours" Podcast (Episode 7) | Forensic Files

[Music] hey long time no see how you doing I'm good how are you I'm fine going you look
good you look really good thank you thank you you know mhm in February 2020 I made yet another trip to Florida my
third to catch up with Crosley green it had been 5 years since I had last seen and spoken to him face to face I
couldn't let go of crosley's case I couldn't get it out of my head it had been 21 years since I first started
reporting on it and here I Was preparing another installment for 48 hours you and
I have been seeing each other a long time 99 I think 99 yeah so a little over 20 years see I was really looking
forward to this yes I wish too it was hard to believe but almost 2 years have passed since crosley's murder
conviction had been overturned by a federal judge in 2018 overturned thrown out I'd hope that
by now I'd be catching up with Crosley maybe at a cookout with his many family members and maybe Crosley would show me
around Mims Florida his hometown and we could check out his church Crosley should have been out
celebrating his freedom but instead we were meeting again in a Florida prison this time Calhoun Correctional
Institution a long 5H hour drive from his home what do you want people to know about Crosley green the Crosley Green in
2020 30 years 31 years that's enough to break a man that's enough to destroy a man but I want the people to know that
I'm not destroyed I'm not down I'm still [Music] alive that was really important to
Crosley to let me know he wasn't a Broken Man even after all the heartbreaking disappointments over the
last 31 years this podcast Series has delved deeply into many of them when I went to see Crosley in 2020 he was 62
years old and he had spent half his life in prison and in some ways this was the
cruestv devopment of all crosley's prayers had been heard and Against All Odds his conviction had been
overturned and yet he remained Behind Bars how is Crosley not free already I'm 48 Hours correspondent Aaron
morard this is murder in the Orange Grove the troubl case against Crosley Green episode seven free at
[Music] last in 2018 Crosley green finally won a rare but major victory when a federal
judge overturned his conviction the judge had agreed with crosley's attorneys that former assistant State
Attorney Chris White who handled crosley's 1990 trial had violated crosley's constitutional rights when he
withheld crucial notes from the defense information like that is very powerful and it it would be explosive to
introduce it into court this is Kenneth nun he's a visiting law professor at Howard University who also served on the
Florida innocence commission a group that suggests changes to Florida law to avoid wrongful convictions I would
assume there are people sitting in prison right now actually Innocent but because they can't prove that either the
prosecutor made an error or withheld evidence or the judge did they're just going to sit there for the rest of their
lives yes or their defense attorney because they may have been the one to make the error as well so if you can't
show there was an error that was made by somebody then you can sit in prison for
the rest of your life Professor nun knows crosley's case well and we met up recently to talk about its NeverEnding
twists nun said that prosecutors are obligated to turn over evidence like the notes in this case he said it's
fundamental to our criminal legal system which hinges on due process finally he got his conviction overturned how
unusual is it to get that kind of ruling well that's if you have a federal court
after many many levels of State review to look at the case and say there was a conviction it happened 30 years ago but
it shouldn't have happened and to correct that that is not an everyday occurrence in the criminal legal system
so it's a big deal a really big deal because with that ruling in the eyes of the law Crosley
green was once again an innocent man and yet he remained Behind Bars nearly 2 years later in
2020 rosley wasn't released immediately why not judges want to make sure that the community is protected and that
people who committed a crime actually receive the punishment that they are due so they're going to give the prosecution
an opportunity to show that there was a problem in the case after the federal judges rulle the state had 90 days to
decide whether to retry crosley's case which is what Crosley was hoping for or to appeal the decision the state decided
to appeal all Crosley green has wanted through all these years is a new trial correct I mean we have seen everything
that went wrong with his trial including this very questionable photo lineup all
the Witnesses who recanted their testimony contradictions in the only eyewitnesses
testimony why wasn't he given a new trial at that point it's a very big hurdle for the prosecution to win a case
after 30 years if they're thinking we're going to have a new trial then we have to call witnesses that may
not be alive at this point 30 years later we might not be able to find mind whose memories may have dissipated and
they have the burden approved it's much easier for them to say okay we'll just have an appeal we're going to kill some
trees and send some papers up and have another Court look at this and then that will make a decision it just seems like
there's so many obstacles to have someone just take another look at this case Congress and federal courts are
more concerned with preserving convictions than they are concerned with making sure that innocent people get
released from prison while the state pursued an appeal everything was put on hold
including crosley's release the same federal judge who overturned his conviction also ruled that Crosley had
to stay in prison for the appeals process even though I should point out here Crosley was a model prisoner the
assistant Warden at Calhoun Correctional told me that Crosley had a near perfect
record and yet he remained in prison it was a devastating blow to Crosley and his family and for his
attorneys Keith Harrison and Jean Thomas it was perpetuating the wrongful incarceration of an innocent
man I actually think it's a tragedy um that he remains in prison Crosley at this point is innocent until
proven guilty if it were the original trial there's the Speedy Trial Act which guarantees
that the trial must take place within a certain amount of time but on appeal and
on these post conviction proceedings there's no clock running so now the fact that we have a decision that he was
wrongfully convicted and he is entitled to a new trial it's incredibly frustrating that there's nothing to make
the process happen faster since he's been sitting there waiting for his day in court again what has he lost well
he's lost family members and it was very hard on him in part because he had historically played the role of a father
figure in their family he still thinks of himself in that role and it was extremely hard for him not to be there
for uh his family at you know their time of grieving the the the closest two are my two
sisters you know both of them Brenda and tin and they was like back to back within two years of each other you know
couldn't go to their funeral couldn't go to the funeral that's been tough that's been
tough you've lost a lot yep while Crosley remained in prison and separated from his family his case still
inched forward in March 2020 the lawyers on both sides argued in front of the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals in
Jacksonville Florida how much is writing on that hearing literally everything if the
Court ruled R in our favor and says the district court got it right when it ruled that Crosley had been wrongfully
convicted then we will immediately move for his release and the state will have a limited period of time to retry him or
or decide not to retry him um which is certainly the state's option but there's also the chance that
the appeals court would side with the state of Florida and reinstate crosley's conviction
keeping Crosley in prison for a life sentence there was so much writing on this hearing and yet Crosley himself was
not allowed to go to Jacksonville to witness the oral arguments but his family showed up in full force including
his younger sister Sheila who had once testified against him at trial and his sister Shirley they had gone after work
driven through the night to get there in time for the morning hearing surely led
the family in a prayer ask for our brother Freedom oh heavenly father in the name of Jesus amen
amen the focus of this hearing those crucial notes that former prosecutor Christopher white took after meeting
with First Responders Diane Clark and Mark rxy 31 years ago when they told told him that they questioned Kim H's
story from the start we're going to be focused on what the impact would have been if the government
had not hidden these notes 13524 Crosley Alexander green versus the secretary of the Florida Department of
Corrections on March 12th 2020 the hearing opened with Assistant Attorney General Kelly nean a addressing the 11th
Circuit Court we are here appealing an order where a district court granted a new trial to Mr Crosley green based on
an alleged Brady violation by the state you listening to a court recording of some of the hearing we believe that the
District Court's factual findings are clearly erroneous nean argued that the notes withheld from crosley's defense
team pointing to Kim HCK were simply opinions of First Responders not evidence they administered first aid to
the dying victim they collected a firearm they roped off the scene and that's all they had to do with this case
she added that both Clark and rxy had been deposed before the trial and they hadn't disclosed this information either
but defense attorney Keith Harrison argued that the notes were crucial to crosley's defense and would have changed
the course of the trial they were all deposed but those depositions would have been completely different if these notes
would have been disclosed these notes would have been a game changer in this clip you'll also hear the voice of
visiting Circuit Judge William Traxler are you saying that prior to trial defense counsil did not know what the
two detectives flocks absolutely these officers in these notes were trying to paint a
picture for the prosecutor that they had the wrong man and that the investigation
was going in the wrong direction defense had no idea about any of that after the hearing crosley's family was
hopeful I asked attorney Keith Harrison if he was as optimistic what's the best case here the court rules in our favor
and at that point we would move for C's immediate release from prison [Music] [Music]
Crosley green had won a big decision in federal court but because the State of Florida appealed it his future depended
on what the court of appeals decided his attorneys as I mentioned went before the
11th Circuit Court of Appeals on March 12th 2020 but there was no timeline for when
the appell court needed to make a ruling and in this case the timing couldn't have been worse for CR green we are
going to begin right now with breaking news because the World Health Organization has declared the Corona
virus outbreak a pandemic citing alarming levels of spre of all the ups and downs in crosley's case a global
pandemic was truly something no one could have predicted no one wants to get sick in
prison even if you have picture perfect health but by 2020 Crosley was in his early 60s and had developed some health
issues here again is defense attorney Keith Harrison so while in prison Crosley uh was tested and it was
determined that he had latent uh tuberculosis which means it's not active but it does pose an increased risk if he
were to contract covid getting Cy out of prison was no longer just about Justice
it was about saving his life at the time the State of Florida published the number of covid deaths that happened
within its Prison Walls and I remembered reading those reports anxiously as the numbers kept going up and
up on April 18th 2020 48 Hours released its broadcast on Crosley green we had hoped that our report would push his
case forward but remember we were in the middle of a pandemic and everything had
stopped but when the pandemic dragged on yet another year crosley's attorneys took
action in March of 2021 they filed an emergency motion asking for crosley's immediate release due to the threat of
covid-19 while they waited for the decision they asked the secretary of the Department of Corrections to act due to
quote increased risk of serious illness or even death from covid-19 and added quote if Mr Green
should meet that same fate while awaiting the 11 circuits decision it will be a miscarriage of justice of
unconscionable proportions on April 7th 2021 phone started ringing and pinging at the croll
and moing law firm in Washington DC it was a Whirlwind of a day my phone started just blowing up and I looked at
it and you know it was a text that said we did it cwy is going to be released the court directed us to inform the
warden to release Crosley as quickly as possible I have never seen an order like
that even though attorneys Keith Harrison and Jean Thomas had worked toward Crosley Green's freedom for 13
years this was such a Sur surprising development a moment they both dreamed of and now it was happening Crosley
green was finally going to be released from prison and they had to act quickly I called his brother OK Conor
who couldn't even speak he was crying we let the family know they hit the road they had to drive all the way across the
state about 5 hours then Jean and I decided Well you know there's one flight that might get us there in time so we
rushed to make that flight and it was really surreal I remember hearing the news and immediately getting on the
phone afterward furiously searching for a camera crew that could get to Florida Crosley was going to be stepping out of
prison in just a few hours the gates opened and Crosley stepped out and he had two bags in his hand one bag was
filled with books and the other was filled with all of his uh court papers later that day at 1: p.m. in a dimly lit
parking lot crosley's family Harrison along with Thomas and other members of crosley's legal team stood outside of
Calhoun Correctional Institution waiting and watched a familiar figure walk out of the gate
Crosley was finally leaving prison and he stepped out and he paed paused for a moment um and he kind of looked up at
the sky and he looked around I mean he was trying to take it all in and then he looked at me and he dropped his
bags and we embraced we didn't say a word we both shed some tears um but eventually we we released
and I said Cy there's some other folks here who want to hug you down down there a local cameraman we hired was there to
capture this big moment what's do through your head okay okay okay um I can't wait to see the rest of my family
that's what's going here get to see my I want to see my kids my grand kids after nearly 32 years behind bars
Crosley green was released from prison due to concern over his age and health issues but it was only a temporary
release the appeals process was still underway and if Crosley lost the appeal there was still a looming chance he
would have to return to prison but the federal judge who had overturned his conviction decided that for the time
being he could wait at home with his family crosley's Freedom had been decades in the making but his actual
release happened over the course of just a day I knew this day was going to come but I
couldn't tell you when I just gave it to the Lord and let him do I was on his will having faith and uh I had a lot of
faith in that I he was going to do this for me tell me glad you're home glad to see this day
Lord thank you Jesus thank you it was it was incredible I mean tears were flowing
the the family was you know just screaming and crying and um it it was just uh glorious it it it was so
joyous it was like a clash where cley just basically ran into the arms of his screaming family it's a moment that I'll
never forget this day this is the day that we long for God we thank you Father God right now in advance for you
bringing our brother home Crosby green father family stood in a circle with Crosley in the middle and Keith right
next to him all holding hands they set a prayer in Jesus name we pray amen amen amen amen thank you Jesus
amen the next day crosley's legal team held a press conference first of all uh I want to thank
God I want to thank God that I'm standing here today as a free man I want to thank my
lord for making imp possible it's hard to really put in the words of my feeling at right now but my
feelings are so so strong as of being a free man today Crosley was released on a
Wednesday night and was staying at his brother-in-law's house I got there 3 days later for his first interview as a
free man hey Daddy how you doing it was a sunny day a bit windy and his family was all around us having a big barbecue
the food was plentiful music was playing in the background and everyone was feeling good especially Crosley as I
walked up to him he looked the most relaxed and happy that I had ever seen oh my
God hey can I hug you can I hug you okay I think we have all this time oh my God thank you thank you thank you thank
you thank you than I can't believe this I cannot believe this you know that first time
when I met you you were in a very different place do you remember that yes oh my God you look great you look great
thank you you look you look great though you're still looking good girl remember
the first time I met Crosley he was on death row but this time we were in the fresh air it was such a good feeling to
finally be sitting in a lawn chair under a Florida Sky across from a man I had only seen previously in shackles and
instead of a prison uniform crley was dressed in a t-shirt and shorts I started the interview the same way I did
for the past 21 years by asking Crosley to introduce himself ah crley I've been F 32 years
for Crime I been committed and now I'm free for a little while at least but I'm free and what does that feel like so
sweet so so sweet when you were sitting in calhon and you were imagining getting
out what was the first thing you wanted to do hand me a pain out ice cream really he I got
it for years Crosley had craved something that most of us take for granted a scoop of strawberry ice cream
so on his first full day of Freedom Crosley went to an ice cream parlor with him were some of his grandchildren he's
my two favorite babies yeah I'm glad to be home with him how you feel bu good you feel good okay okay and what did it
taste like oh man so good was that really the first time that being free sunk in yeah I was able to
get what I want I don't think I fully appreciated what Freedom really meant until I spoke
with Crosley that day for over three decades he was unable to make any decisions for himself what to eat or
when to eat it when to take a shower or for how long but on this day Crosley was
finally able to do what he wanted when he wanted to do it he finally had the power to choose something for himself
I've also been interviewing several of crosley's relatives for decades ades but until this moment I hadn't had a chance
to meet his extended family and it's a big one tell me who every you know who everybody is here this is uh my uh great
nephew this is my great niece this is my granddaughter I got another granddaughter here Crosley was meeting
some of his relatives for the first time you did miss a lot didn't you yeah I missed a lot how are you
13 13 how old are you 11 she's 11 that's that's 13 years already gone I can't get
that's 11 years already gone that Kan year you know what else what else has just struck you that is different in
just these days have you noticed I still wake up at the same time around 3:00 3:30 and you know what I do
I walk out doors sit on that back of that pickup truck you know what I'm saying and look up and say thank God I'm
free you know man I get me a coup of Cofe sit down and smoke me a cigarette you know listen this is a
wonderful thing it's a wonderful feeling to be free I really is see I'mma show you I I'm now this is just a little joke
okay suddenly Crosley stood up and he started to unclip his microphone he he began walking away I wasn't quite
sure what was happening and you can actually hear the confused voice of Dennis my cameraman who thought that
Crosley was abruptly ending the interview and then Crosley started to laugh no oh oh my bad but but yes still
I'm going to do this here no don't worry about it don't worry about it we're not going to be able to
hear you but I don't want you to hear me oh hit this here I don't want you to hear
me I have no idea what he's going to do here you don't know I don't what are you
going to do what you don't know no I ain't got to do this interview you understand what I'm coming
from now I I do you now could choose ask can you I made this Choice that's the thing about this whole interview I am
able to make a choice now to be with my family this moment really caught me on off guard Crosley was showing me what
his new found Freedom meant to him in the past when I interviewed him in prison someone else told him where to
sit and how long he could talk today he could call the shots he could stand up during the interview or he didn't have
to talk to me at all I started to laugh but luckily for me Crosley did put his microphone back on and sat down to
continue our conversation if it wasn't for my family I I wouldn't be here my sister celese
she always told me don't give up your day going to come I used always say all right girl
when I get out we going to do things you know but that day never came she died crosley's sister Celestine known as
Tina was buried in a cemetery just down the road from where we were sitting and this was when Crosley described the
boundaries of his freedom during his temporary release Crosley couldn't visit Tina's grave or go most anywhere else
without special permission from his probation officer he was free but within limits show me where where can you go
right here I can't go on that sidew what would happen if you went on the sidewalk well that's that's my
borderline he walked up to an invisible border a property line between his brother-in-law's house and the neighbors
that he couldn't cross show me take me a little bit where you can go how far here
about right about right here Crosley stood on the grassy edge of the yard right along the sidewalk I was
told I couldn't go to the mailbox and I want to be out here I have this Freedom here
if it ain't it 12 yards I like I take them 12 yards of Freedom he walked across his 12
yards of freedom and then showed me his new Jailer here it is right here this ankle b b right here cley
pulled down the sock on his right leg and revealed an ankle monitor a constant reminder that his movements were limited
in his home confinement crley though does that ankle bracelet also remind you that your time home might be
temporary it does it does I I got to be honest with you it does a week later on April 17th 2021 48
Hours aired our fourth bro cast on Crosley Green's case and for the first time since I
started reporting on his case back in 1999 I finally got to say the words Crosley green is out of
prison but as we've already discussed Crosley was not truly a free man he was living in a legal limbo waiting for the
appeals court to make its decision still he moved on with life he was allowed to
get a job as a machinist at a local tech company while on Sundays he was permitted to go to
[Music] church with me you with my father with me crley knew he was living on borrowed
time and he Faithfully followed the rules of his temporary release still he dreamed of the open road he asked around
if anyone was selling a used motorcycle that he could buy and he was put in touch with a woman named Kathy
spikes one of his friends caught me asking if I was selling my motorcycle and I said I didn't have it
but I would help them look for one if they were serious and then about two weeks later we talked to the
phone and we talked about bike a little bit we talked for about 6 hours um he told me about being incarcerated but
didn't tell me full details um just told me that he was recently um released and
he was on house arrest so he couldn't go anywhere and he just wanted to see a different side of life I mean did you
have some hesitation that you're talking to this man and you enjoy talking to him
but he's admitting he's under house arrest and he just got out of prison uh didn't that make you a little
nervous yeah yes um but also I'm told not to judge they hit it off on the phone talking over the next few weeks
finally Crosley took a chance and asked Kathy if she would meet him in person I was in a place to where I said you know
I wanted to be with someone and I did not know who or when or what but I was kind of open at that point to meeting
different people so I just said okay Cathy decided to take a leap of faith and meet this mystery man she was
suddenly drawn to um he wanted a root beer that night so I took him a root beer it was uh June 30th and then I text
my sister I think I met my husband you're kidding that's why I know the date like exactly
the feeling was Mutual for Crosley it was love at first sight too someone I meet someone that that's going to be a a
perfect partner for me and matter of fact since that first day she's been right there by my
side Kathy is a certified nurses aid quick to smile and laugh she works at a hospice center caring for the sick and
those facing death she had moved from Ohio to bravard County after visiting Florida on vacation Kathy had always put
her career first but when she entered her 40s she wanted to find love she appealed to a higher
power I wrote a letter to my grandmother who's in heaven asking her whenever she
speaks with God let her know um what kind of man I want what I want as a husband and two weeks later he
calls and how did you describe the man you wanted when I'm weak he's my strength
when he's weak I'm his strength I had prayed and really asked the Lord to put somebody in my life you know what I'm
saying and I've told her that I said listen the best thing ever happened to me was that you got in my life I said
cuz I that's the one thing I did ask God for if I ever get set free give me somebody that I'm going to settle down
with you know enjoy life with so both of you separately had prayed that you would
find love yeah and you found each other yeah this was a development I never expected I later asked Kathy about the
moment she learned that he had been in prison for murder and if that caused her to have any second thoughts
I went home and I Google I'm thinking oh my goodness you you this cannot be true
and call my sister and toally like I I was ready to jump ship but at that time I've already invested probably three
months of just talking and just being around him and then I was like okay the person that I was with was a person that
had compassion a person of much Faith a person that will give somebody the shirt
off their back you know the more him and I have spoken about it I don't believe it at all even
though Crosley remained under house arrest at his brother-in-laws that didn't stop him and Kathy from dating
like a typical couple we Netflix and chill Netflix and chill ain't that what we did for the
first weeks why are you when I tell her that that's the truth my brother-in-law get a kick out of her I mean
always enjoying ourself laughing having fun it's like to him little teenagers just fall in love
is that kind of the best way to describe you like two teenagers in life in a sense we ain't just like little
teenagers at times at times we really do but it it go farther than that with me mhm you know I think it does with her
too that teenage love turned into a strong unshakable bond Crosley asked Kathy to marry him I would have never
thought that I would first of all fall in love with someone that was accused of such a crime but let
alone you know being in love with them to know that that's my husband and willing to stand by that
neither Crosley nor Kathy wanted to talk about it but the threat of going back to
prison loomed over the couple like a raincloud by the beginning of 2022 Crosley was still waiting for the
appeals court to make a decision would they side with the state and reinstate crosley's conviction or rule in
crosley's favor and even that could present a risk because if the court were to side with Crosley the State of
Florida would have 45 days to decide whether they would recharge and retry him for the murder of Chip
Flynn what I've been telling you for the last 20 something years that I was innocent I want my da Court to prove
that okay give me my shot to prove that you still have faith in the system after your first TR
why your now the court syst didn't put me in here people all put me in here I really
bleed that deep down in my soul I'm not going back to prison and then in March 2022 the appella court finally handed
down its decision after almost 4 years and crosley's fate would change yet again on the finale of Murder in the
orange Grove the troubl case against Crosley green when I first heard about it you
know I was I was shocked why so much is going against me when do you feel that sometimes that
just as soon as you make a step forward there's something that step backwards you make a step forward step
[Music] backwards murder in the Orange Grove was reported by me Aon morard alongside
producer ERS Alan Pang Annie Cronenberg and Allison Bailey Kiara Orbitz is our coordinating producer and Florence
Barrow Adams is our story editor additional production support from Dylan Gordon Marlon polycarp Caroline Casey
and Christine Driscoll Judy Tigard is the executive producer of 48 Hours Gail Zimmerman asena basak Mark goom
Charlotte Fuller Judy Ryback and Steven McCain produced the original 48 Hours episodes associate producers were
Michael Loftus and Shaheen Toki Patty aronowski was a senior producer special thanks to Megan Marcus
Jamie Benson Nick poser and Gail spru

Crosley Green won a major victory when his conviction was overturned in 2018. But two years later, he was still languishing in a Florida prison. How could that be? It would take a global pandemic and the tenacity of his legal team to give him a chance at freedom.

Get early, ad-free access to episodes of "Murder in the Orange Grove: The Troubled Case Against Crosley Green" by subscribing to 48 Hours+ on Apple Podcasts or Wondery+ on the Wondery app. The series is widely available everywhere else you get your podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/murder-in-the-orange-grove-the-troubled-case/id1766382718

Crime. Social justice. Impact. "48 Hours" investigates the most intriguing crime and justice cases that touch on all areas of the human experience including greed and passion. "48 Hours," which premiered in 1988, has developed a rich history of original reporting and impact journalism that has helped exonerate wrongly convicted people, caused cold cases to be reopened and solved, and along the way changed lives.

For video licensing inquiries, contact: licensing@veritone.com

Brief Summary

Crosley Green discusses his wrongful conviction, release from prison, and ongoing legal battles while adjusting to life outside incarceration.

Key points

Crosley's Overturned Conviction. In 2018, Crosley Green's conviction was overturned due to constitutional violations.
The Fight for Freedom. Crosley's attorneys filed motions for his release amidst the pandemic, citing health risks.
Crosley's Emotional Release. After 32 years, Crosley is released from prison, reuniting with his family.
First Taste of Freedom. Crosley enjoys ice cream for the first time as a free man, savoring the moment.
Crosley's First Taste of Freedom. After decades of confinement, Crosley experiences the joy of making his own choices.
The Weight of Legal Limbo. Despite his release, Crosley faces uncertainty as he awaits the appeals court's decision.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

That's enough to destroy a man, but I'm not destroyed.

Crosley Green reflects on his resilience after 31 years in prison.

2:04WatchOct 30, 2024

Tension

75/ 100High tension

More from 48 Hours

Solve the Crime

Read a real case one clue at a time, then see how your call held up against the investigators.