Edmund Kemper /// Part 2 /// 262 | Forensic Files

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[Music] foreign worked at the campus and I had an ace sticker on my car and obvious access day
or night to the campus I was picking up some very lovely young women you know what we were talking about as
we're driving around almost as often as not this guy that's going around doing this
stuff and the second they started talking at they didn't realize it but they were getting a free ride
I couldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole I swear you know but they'd be telling me what all about this guy and
they're comparing notes and speculating on what he looks like how he carries himself why he's doing this stuff
telling me about it it's getting easier to do I was getting better at it I was getting less detectable I started
flaunting that invisibility severing a human head two of them at night in front of my mother's residence
with her at home my neighbors at home upstairs their picture window open the curtains open 11 o'clock at night the
lights are on all they have to do is walk by look out and I've had it why did you keep the heads when you cut
them off and why did you keep them something out of my childhood I could put it on an incident I mean my
father chopping the heads off of our two pet chickens and my mother insisting that I eat them for dinner
uh you know we could say it was something that simple I don't think it was now my dad heads out back with that
hatchet I got on my bike and I wrote I tried to stop it I remember that I got on the
bike Road around the block I was crying I haven't talked about that for a lot of
years I'm sure that may have implemented something that may have gotten something
rolling but along fantasy lines but it took a lot of years of development along those lines to really get off but how
are you able to in one minute have someone's head in your hands and very shortly they're acting through a fantasy
however that would relate to that severed head and then five minutes later I'd put that
away and there'd be a knock on the door and I'd put it away and answer the door and the landlady
would be there and we'd discuss it discuss what reality her reality not mine some people go crazy at that
point I felt it it was one hell of a tweak I mean to just flip out and not know where I was
to be walking up the stairs with a camera bag or belonged to a young woman that had her severed head in it
walking up to my apartment passed a happy young couple coming down the stairs who nodded and smiled at me
as they went by good evening and they're going out on a date where I'd love to be going and I'm aware of
both of these realities and the distance between those two was so dramatic so amazing so violent
that really I can feel the wheels squeaking inside that was really pulling on it and I imagine at that point some
people break but I didn't literally go insane I didn't get lost [Music] Edmund Kemper was committed to the
Atascadero State Hospital for the criminally insane he was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia
this was a unique situation though we have young Ed Kemper living at the state hospital for the criminally insane
keeping in mind kemper's high IQ now add in kemper's personality he is of the type that flourishes in
this environment think about it he's the type that if you put him in a situation
he's been rejected his entire life all he wants to do is feel like he fits in or not have to be in a situation of
being rejected again this is not up to him to be there he's required to be there considered by most
to be a model inmate so he's granted Privileges and one of these privileges is that he is
delivering tests and test results to from office to office so during the course of this time when
he's running these tests and running the results of these tests from one office to another he's reading them he's
perusing the files he's looking through the papers he's memorizing things diagnosis treatments desired results
all of this stuff so later he would be able to manipulate this system he's in there he's talking to
psychiatrists he's talking to people studying him he's talking to people that are trying to treat him
and he's he's able to give them answers and responses that may not be truthful that may be learned behaviors learned
responses he's in fact learning what they want to hear from him Juan do you believe
that at this age that Ed wanted to be fixed himself um I don't know I don't know that he
considered there to be something wrong wrong with him in the sense that we would consider there to be something
wrong with him he considers there's that there's something wrong with him because he's
rejected by everybody that's been in his life so he knows hey there must be something wrong with me because I've
been rejected by all these people but what we see is somebody that has killed two people that's very different than
what he sees right he kind of sees himself more as a victim where we see somebody that couldn't cope couldn't
handle whatever his environment was and his reaction to such was killing two innocent people regardless
we we will never know if he wanted to be fixed cured whatever you want to label it we will never know if he even wanted
to receive treatment we will never know if the treatment actually in fact worked when you're
given all the answers to a test how does anyone determine if you actually learned anything right you know
he's essentially just memorizing what they want to hear from him what they want his response to be and at this time
you know you and I kind of chatted yesterday a bit about well he could have been a mass murderer at age 15 and then
we probably would have locked them up forever and that's you're more likely right than I am in that conversation
that we had of course well not of course you we can't just brush it aside so quickly no I meant because it was coming
from me well you're not just right because you are who you are um the thing is in this country at that
time late in the 60s in the early 70s especially in California and look Californians don't get all upset with
the colonel I didn't do this I wasn't the I can't go back and change history but what the history of it is is our
country not just in California foreign but especially in California this country was was hell-bent on the
thought of Rehabilitation at that time right you know we talked on this show several times about why was there so
many serial killers in the 70s and 80s well it has there's so many factors that go into that but some of that is this
simple thought of this we have at the time California going you know what oh you killed two people we
can fix you let's just talk let's lock you up for a little bit we're gonna and not only that
we're going to surround You by other people that we've deemed to be not only violent but criminally insane yeah and
your IQ depending on who you talk to could be near genius level as high as 146 we're going to put you in an
environment that you can learn from our doctors which we want you to learn from our doctors right yes it's not going to
be a basement there's not going to be rats we want you to learn from the treatment right guess what you don't
want a six foot nine 300 pound guy with an IQ of 146 to learn from the criminals
that you've surrounded him with the adult criminals the criminally insane people that you've surrounded him with
he's now learning from them as well and the problem that we had back in the the late 60s was we were doing this with
killers and I say we because other states were doing it as well we're still doing it on some level we were doing it
with killers and we were doing it with uh child molesters and people that would would reoffend and we're like well we
can fix it and you know one big problem that this country had in a lot of countries had back then was we didn't
never have a good understanding of these people that were raping children at that time we were almost identifying
it as something to being equal as homosexuality which of course now we're all educated and smart enough to know
that they have nothing to do with one another right never have and never will and so back then we thought we could
even cure something like that and just throw them back out on the streets and we would see oh they also thought they
could cure homosexuality they would have these they still to this day think they
can and they have these uh Church groups that you go out you know all men church
group that go out in the woods and and they can pray away the gay well and of course you know we we've we've
discussed it on our show several times you know even States like Texas Florida Ohio everybody was releasing these very
dangerous individuals and then you have somebody as smart as Edmund Kemper and look I'm not blaming the system
especially in this specific instance because we have a guy that was smart enough to figure out a way to manipulate
the system right okay so we can't blame the system for being tricked yeah but you know we need to take a look at some
of these systems that we've had in place for years and and correct some of that stuff well and that that's what I think
we've learned throughout these last few decades is really how quote-unquote curable is
would somebody be that's already committed double homicide right maybe the method for releasing this individual
is not to just have him check in once a week with somebody and go talk to him and the person goes yeah he's still fine
yeah because he's fine until he's not right he's fine until he's fine until he's decapitating somebody he was fine
for 15 years until he shot his grandmother in the back three times right Ed Kemper is released to his
mother's care which is another horrible idea oh this is great the person that he
hates the most during the talking yeah you think they would have figured that out like yeah we can't release him
to the mother you know what I will say in the defense of those that were helping him with his treatment at the
time they did tell the state you can't release him to his mother like you could the dad probably didn't want him you
could release this guy yeah but see that's the problem when a lot of a lot of States
and I know that it varies from state to state but from my understanding California I believe Ohio is the same
way California even as an adult if you're like paroled if they release you on parole the first thing before
considering you parole they say well where are you going to go to live well you've been in prison
you don't you don't you haven't had a job you don't have any money you don't have a residence so you have to go live
with somebody else somebody has to agree to take you in Ed Kemper has nobody but
mama and Mama probably didn't want to take him in it either but right she does for whatever reason and so he's released
to her care so now he's on parole and he's like we said six foot nine he weighs 280 pounds heavyweight champion
of the world well and he's released into a world that he just simply doesn't understand yeah you know he spent more
than a quarter of his life locked up and with people older than him well he also
says things like that like I I couldn't even imagine what it would be like to go
talk to a female that's kind of odd yeah I mean like maybe at first like when you're 10 it's
a little strange after that it's like yeah it might be frightening to people but it's like if
you find yourself in conversation like in the line at a you know Burger King to get a whopper or something you find
yourself talking to a lady that's not that strange to 98 of the the men out there yeah and I mean but we have so too
we have the thought of you know keep in mind the people his age in 1969 California they were free-spirited
California they almost spoke a different language than Kemper and as you said he had no experience
with with women but I mean as a young adult he had no experience being out in the real world as a young adult this is
my issue with when they're always talking about almost genius level IQs but not smart enough to figure out
so much [ __ ] in life but know that he had the tools to be equipped to do so and regardless I mean
I was thinking about this the other day you know let's say he's out and he's talking to
um a woman his age right or you know older younger whatever it doesn't matter where'd you go to high school oh I
didn't go to high school because I shot my grandparents and I've been locked up in a house hospital for the criminally
insane right for the past five or six years but I was a good patient yeah and I helped the staff well not only is he
out but like we said he's in his mother's care or living with his mother and once again he's experiencing her
verbal abuse right now he did get his GED once he was out and he wanted to be a police officer but instead he landed
at a job with the California division of Highways he saved his money and eventually purchased a yellow 1969 Ford
Galaxy vehicle this is a two-door car so for two years Ed is working he's trying
to adjust to civilian life trying to fit in he's you know just out there living doing his thing he's with his mother in
Santa in the Santa Cruz area his mother now separated from her third husband she's working as a secretary at the
newly opened University of California Santa Cruz Ed with his car made a practice of
picking up the beautiful young college female students that were you know in the area looking
for a ride looking to hitchhike which was very common back then well what and wasn't this because since his mom worked
at the school he had some kind of school identification on his vehicle yeah he had some kind of sticker I don't know if
it was for parking purposes or just to be able to get on and you know onto the campus area and drive around well but
that was probably so good for him because if especially if you go to a small College when you see that sticker
on somebody's car you see that thing hanging from their mirror it almost makes you like reassured that they're
okay this person's okay yeah you identify with them and you probably would think uh maybe they're a student
you know so looking to get into a car looking to hitchhike somewhere you would be willing to get in his vehicle seeing
the sticker is the general thought now he drove a lot of young women around for a long time and I actually believe
captain that he thought that maybe this might lead to a date or some type of relationship because we have an
individual that doesn't seem to have the means or the ability of meeting people very well but hey if I do something nice
if I offer you a ride now we're we're locked and loaded here right we're sitting together we're on a journey
together I'm going to take you somewhere I'm doing you a favor we can strike up a
conversation yeah if you can be Charlie cool about it but when you're pulling up
rolling down your window and your banana hammock and you're going oh Excuse Me Miss would you like a ride
I can give you a ride in my car well fairly quickly I would guess this letting women into his car picking
women up for hitchhiking purposes probably very quickly became more about his violent sexual fantasies and just
like he learned in the hospital he is now going to start to try some different tactics to see what works and what
doesn't work okay so you referenced the sticker on his car probably helped him pick up some young women he also said
that he had a look like he had a specific style of sunglasses that he would wear just when he wanted to pick
up hitchhikers he also had a move too that he would do that when asked if he could give them a ride he would try to
act like he was annoyed like he had somewhere to go like you know looking at his watch and going oh I guess I guess I
can help you out that way to let their guard down that he's not so eager just to get this individual into his vehicle
right he says that he started taking things a bit further each time like he would start veering off of the natural
route to where they wanted to go or start taking them to a secluded location where they didn't want to go right so
kind of the the thought process here is well I'm going to turn right instead of left here and let's see how they react
yeah yeah the worst case scenario they go uh no you're not supposed to turn right here and you could always play
dumb oh I'm sorry I took the wrong path eventually he takes this to the point of
he starts to keep a gun in the car with him when he's picking up women yes that way so when they go you should have
turned left and not right he just pulls the gun out and go don't you tell me how
to drive on May 7 1972 Kemper was driving when he picked up two 18 year old hitchhikers these women were from
the Fresno State University they were students this is Mary Ann Pesci and Anita lucasa after driving for an hour
he drove to a secluded wooden area near Alameda which he was familiar with from his work at the highway department
there he intended to rape the women but while he was locked up he learned from serial rapist to not leave Witnesses
so here's an issue for him he's decided that he wants to rape at least one of these women
think about Ed Kemper he's six foot nine almost 300 pounds he's easily identifiable
so he decides hey I learned from these guys while I was locked up not to leave any Witnesses if somebody's five foot
ten white guy brown hair he's probably you know you could identify that individual to police and
you not find him or home in on him so quickly you say hey this guy was a giant he wore glasses and he drove a yellow
vehicle they're going to home in on him fairly quickly yeah so what he decided to do is he tied up the girl that he
wanted to rape and he put Anita laquesa in the trunk of the vehicle he attempted to rape peshi
however he was unable to do so and when he couldn't get it up he got angry with her and he took it out on her
and he decides to stab Marianne Pesci right even though that we heard in the interview he claims
that his stuff works well he stabs her to death and eventually he realizes crap I got this other person in the car
I can't just let her go now she's in the trunk she doesn't know what's happened but I can't just let her go now so he
goes back to the the trunk he lets her out and he opens it up and tells her that hey she sees blood on his hands and
he tells her hey your friend got out of control got crazy with me I had to punch her I think I broke her
nose you're going to want to come check on her you're going to want to come make
sure that she's okay and as soon as she turns her back on him he stabs her both of these these women at least one
of them he slit their throat we have this situation too where afterwards he kind of goes into an
immediate panic he closes the trunk he's now got one of the victims inside of there
and he believes that he he can't find his keys yeah he starts to panic thinking that he locked his keys in the
trunk of the car and now he's screwed he's got at least one body in there at this point he might have had two because
he did he did ultimately transport both of them with two of both of them being in the trunk right so he's panicking
he's thinking crap I've locked my keys in there with these two victims he starts to panic he trips over his gun
that he dropped on the ground and he says that when he fell this kind of brought him too like he kind of had a
Moment of clarity there realizing that his keys were in fact in his back pocket he never kept his keys in his back
pocket he says he finds him in the back pocket picks up the gun that he had that
he used to control the women to begin with and now he's going to drive so he can
dismember these bodies and dispose of them on the way to his destination he gets
pulled over for a tail light he's got a busted taillight it's always a busted tail light now I wonder if that was
busted before for or if it got busted during the the tussle that I don't know that's that's that's interesting but he
did he's able to weasel his way out of you know the the officer doesn't search his vehicle obviously well of
course not so he's able to make it back to his destination and I'm not going to go through all the details but much like
Ted Bundy and other individuals that we've discussed before on the show Ed Kemper was a necrophiliac okay yeah
he couldn't have normal sexual relations or sexual intercourse with a living breathing woman
he liked to have sex with their heads well and their bodies frankly and we don't need I said we weren't going to go
into details thanks captain so he was a necrophilia sometimes it needs to be said and he would dismember
these bodies so he could later dispose of them all right cheers mates cheers captain on
the evening of September 14 1972 Kemper picked up 15 year old Korean dance student
aikuku ku's family did not own a vehicle and she got permission from her mom to go to a dance competition so she was to
take the bus well after missing her bus she hitchhiked Kemper offers her a ride so he drives to a remote area pulling a
gun on coup before he accidentally locked himself out of his car wow so you believe it it will happen well coup let
him back inside the vehicle and then Kemper choked her unconscious raped her and killed her but this is after he
pulled the gun on her correct he packed her body into the trunk of his car and went to a bar and had a few drinks then
back at his apartment he did all of the terrible things that we've already discussed earlier before dismembering
and disposing of the remains in a similar manner manner as his previous two victims is this when he's going to
the bar uh that the cops like to go to I don't know what bar he went to that night but yes there was a bar that he
frequented called The Jury Room and this was a bar that was the regulars were pretty much law
enforcement right and he he made a lot of friends he would go in there he's I mean we we've already said this from the
interviews that they have of him online he's easy to talk to he's a talker and he would go in there
and he would buy drinks for the officers they would buy drinks for him they would
sit around drinking beers and talking about you know everything you know everything from the weather to these
missing co-eds well he would talk so much he he actually knew that he was kind of annoying because how much he
actually talked but I believe in one of the interviews he was stating that he knew just don't bring up any of these
murders or any of these cases because if you do then you might become a suspect right and you know for a while with
these three missing individuals you know he knows that he's killed them but for a
while they were simply missing persons cases right you know they all three of them had disappeared we have koo's
mother who she phones the police saying hey my daughter didn't show up to this dance competition she was supposed to
take the bus I've never seen her ever again she phones police and and reports her daughter is missing
so for a while they're just simply missing persons cases eventually they're going to start finding the body parts of
these different victims now in January of 73 Kemper picked up Cindy Shaw and we would have the same results you know
she's never seen again and in February the following month he picks up Rosalind Thorpe and Allison Liu so what we're
seeing here Captain is what we see often with these serial offenders we're seeing
an increase in the speed in the rate of the crimes you know it's like he can't control his urges or fantasies well and
there's less of a cooling off period so very quickly he's getting to the next victim so to speak
so we talked about Kemper War special glasses that he thought made him look more like a
college student made him look a little hipper you know he drove the vehicle that he had the campus sticker on the
vehicle yeah Kemper the original hipster and then he also had different things that he would do like I said he would
pretend to be in a hurry looking at his watch when asked if he could give somebody a ride
the other move that he did which is terrifying and it's really well thought out though on his part is once he would
get these hitchhikers into his vehicle think about his vehicle it's a two-door vehicle so if you're in the back you're
already at a huge disadvantage because the whole idea that he has is he's going to drive you to a secluded area and then
he's going to pull a gun on you well if you have the ability to flee that's your opportunity you got to get
out of Dodge as quick as possible if you're stuck in the back seat you're going to have a difficult time
getting out of that vehicle also take an account that he's six nine so his wingspan his arms reached the other door
the passenger door pretty easily well that was one of his moves so he would only have a victim in the
back seat if more than one hitchhiker got in at a time right you know because the natural thing is to ride shotgun so
what he would do is he would reach over his passenger and he would say oh I don't think your door is shut all the
way and then he would open the door you know using the the little latch open up the door close it shut and in the same
motion he would drop a tube of chapstick down into the door so what it creates is
it it prevents you from using that latch to open the door you couldn't he's not locking the door in front of you which
would be an obvious move making you uncomfortable right he's unbeknownst to you he's dropped this tube of chapstick
down there now if you go for the latch it doesn't connect and you can't open the door from the inside of the vehicle
right and and a lot of the doors now when you go to open them if they're locked they'll unlock automatically or
whatever they do but this is back in the day but wasn't it Bundy that just didn't
have a handle yeah he Bundy did all kinds of things remember he actually had um he altered the seats in his vehicle
in some form too oh yeah remember he had him like he took the screws out of him so if he needed to just push a chair
back or hide it he could right and in 73 that attack in uh February with on the two young women
he actually by this point he's in a bit of a frenzy because remember we talked about with his first victims as an adult
he drives out into the middle of nowhere there's a bit of interaction between these victim and killer leading up to
The Killing right with his last victims I think I personally think he's in a bit
of a frenzy because he doesn't even bother to get them very far away from where he picks him up and he shoots both
of them he talks about how after the killing this paranoia of that that he's going to be caught right away that
everybody's coming to get him I wonder if that started setting in right when he picked up the victim I think that he had
developed what he likes to do to the victims and he wanted to get to that as quick as
he could and what I mean by that as we said earlier is he can't he can't have normal
intercourse or sexual relations or or normal relationships with people the way that normal people can right so he wants
to get straight to having sex with their head or yeah he wants to get straight to
the necrophilia as soon as possible because you know he can create I hope nobody's
eating their lunch yeah but he can create and make up all these reasons why who he is you know and how he turned out
and what he why he does what he does well that's because one time when his when he was eight years old his dad I'm
just joking but in the end the reality is this is his this is his sexual fantasy right and
it's now how can I get to that as soon as possible and that's what's tough about some of the interviews for me is
can we learn something to possibly see this early early signs in a child and maybe stop this behavior from happening
or is some of this just complete [ __ ] to justify their fantasy their sexual um fantasies well I think it's a way to
rationalize it right you know either for themselves or for everybody else to understand that this is why they did
what they did but in this situation he shoots both of these young women he actually gets pulled over with them in
the vehicle I mean he's not moved them to the trunk of the vehicle he gets pulled over um and he he had wrapped
both of them up to the neck area in a blanket and they were both kind of just like you know their heads leaning
against the door and the other victim head leaning against that victim if that makes sense yeah but they're both like
one sleeping on the other gotcha yes when he gets pulled over he tells the officer that both of these women are
drunk and he's returning them home and actually he's returning them to his home but he doesn't tell the officer
that right and the officer believes him and he goes on about his way and we've seen this with several several different
serial killers that in these moments some of them are able to not panic Not freak out and just kind of offer up an
explanation as to what's going on and they get sent along their way we saw it with Bundy you know we saw it with uh
BTK but it wasn't necessarily an officer it was um I think it was another scout leader or somebody that's seen this one
Dahmer yeah Dom yes Dahmer did almost this exact same thing well for years he's had hatred towards his mother now
he's gonna turn that against her and not these co-eds yeah at some point Kemper finally realized that his Ultimate
Fantasy was killing his mother now it's difficult to say how long he planned such an act it's likely months or at the
very least probably every time that they got into an argument because you have heard in the interviews he will often
reference the him and his mom we got into a bad argument on this night and then I went out driving around right and
so we do know from these interviews though that he would was at least actively seriously planning to kill his
mother for about a week or so before he finally did this was two days before Easter Sunday
on Good Friday 1973 Kemper decided to kill his mother he battered her with a hammer stabbed
her with a knife and he cut off her head and of course he did all of the other things that we've already discussed that
he did with the other bodies and then we have Sally Hallett this was his mother's best friend
he once he cools off he calls her up and invites her over to dinner so she shows up expecting to have dinner
with Ed Kemper and his mother and as soon as she enters the place he gets behind her this giant and he basically
picks her up with with his arms and he's he's strangling her in midair and she dies pretty quickly
many people have suggested captain that given his homicidal obsession with his mother that we are supposed to
think that maybe killing his mother like exercised the demons that tormented Ed throughout his life
because this would kind of be the end of his Killing Spree well let's stay on this
murder for a second because didn't he also say that she went out with a friend and she was drinking and then she came
home and uh he like passed by her room or something and she made like some snarky
comment like she always does right like oh I suppose you want to stay up all night talking now yeah now is it true or
false because I know and look at your right I mean you don't wanna you're not one for the Gory details
but is this just a part of mine hunter or was this actually what happened because he
claims in mine hunter that he took her larynx yeah and and put it in the garbage disposal there are many
different versions of that same story so I believe there's got to be some truth to it
and if you want to take it to the most extreme he says something to the appoint to well
the way The Story Goes anyway I couldn't find his exact words on this right mind
you there's like hundreds and hundreds of hours of of interviews with Ed so can you please say it in his voice I I don't
I don't think I could do it you're not you're not gonna even try I don't think though that I think the listeners would
like to hear you try your best you know I think the listeners would like to hear
you try but see that's how Cameron that's how Cameron Britain talks I know that's not how Edmund kempered but
that's still hey that's still Ed Kemper impersonation now yeah he's he's he's got the character spot on in the sense
that Ed's very matter of a fact matter of fact right you know he just kind of says what he did he has the look in his
eyes the look in his eyes are very similar to Ed's yes they are they're they're 100 so let's take this story to
the most extreme that I've ever heard you know the most extreme version of this story is that after killing his
mother he couldn't silence her voice that she was still nagging and bitching at him even in death so he did he
decided to remove her larynx and her tongue and throw it down the garbage disposal and when he turned on the
garbage disposal pieces of that or the whole thing came back out at him to which later he told law enforcement is
it made sense to him because he wasn't able to silence her that even in death she was going to continue to nag him and
she was going to get the last word right but when we listened to Ed talk the way
that he would let us know what was going on inside of him is he throws out there
the suggestion that had I just killed mother before everybody else I wouldn't have
killed anybody else right again I have to wonder is this the absolute truth because
the reality is he killed his mother and then shortly afterwards he killed her best friend he didn't stop with his
mother right he had the opportunity to but you and I were just talking about uh willpower well we yeah and uh one's own
will you could argue there's evidence against your theory Ed he would call he ended up calling the police so he drove
to Colorado he left a note this takes you back though he calls from a phone booth right yeah he and he left a note
at his mother's home saying hey you know I sorry about the mess boys I had to leave I got things to do
he thought that again that paranoia sets in where he thought all of a sudden everybody's going to know what he did
and as he's driving to Colorado he kept expecting to hear this story on the news
you know breaking news we found two dead bodies at this home and no he never hears that So eventually he decides he's
going to stop he calls Santa Cruz Police from Colorado and he says look come and
get me before I do it all over again and the police they initially refused to believe him
you know this is the guy that they drank with at the bar right it took several follow-up calls
for them to believe that he had done what he said he had done and they they even asked him information that only The
Co-Ed Killer would know so Kemper finally convinced the police that he was the man that they were
looking for and he was quickly arrested without incident and charged with eight murders in the first degree now I do
want to point something out here that's that's not often discussed when Ed Kemper is discussed is there were there
were more difficulty in this case than uh they're then looking back many of us would know of and that was there was
another active serial killer in that exact area at that exact same time as Ed MC Kemper which created a big problem in
the investigation so we had Herbert Mullen he was kind of killing people at random you know where right we have
Kemper who has a very distinct victimology right the problem was that at the time investigators believed that
all of these murders were likely connected and therefore it made the it made establishing a real pattern
it made it very difficult right because there was no real pattern you have one guy killing at random well then you have
two things also going against you you have a guy confessing and if any more crimes happen while he's in jail then
you go wait well then this guy's falsely confessing but then he's also only confessing to some of the murders so
you're going well why is he only confessing to some of them and not all of them and here's one thing that I'm
shocked of this is a great idea for anybody out there that has time to do it I'm a little surprised that there wasn't
there's not a movie or a book based around this whole idea of two working in the same area at the same time what was
that movie like Kiss the Girls or something Forrest Gump where they're operating on different sides of the
country these two serial killers you have a unique situation where two are operating in the same area and they're
basically they're almost apprehended roughly about the same time so they're active for about the same periods of
time now we know that Kemper beheaded several of his victims he would eventually tell his attorney that he had
eaten the Flesh of at least one of them so at his trial he did testify and during his trial he said that the
slayings were his way of acting out homicidal cannibalistic and sexual fantasies that dated back to his
childhood stating that that was the only way they could be mine referring to his victims
Kemper said I had their spirits and I still have them Kemper was found guilty and sentenced to life imprisonment for
the eight murders because there was a stay on the death penalty in the U.S at the time of his conviction Santa Cruz
County Superior Court Judge Harry Brower said at the time Kemper you should not be released from prison during your
natural life Edmund Kemper remains housed among the general prison population at the
California medical facility in Vacaville California ultimately John Douglas believes that these types agree to talk
with the FBI for a number of reasons but with Kemper Douglas believes he cooperated because he was somewhat
bothered by his crimes and this was a way to make some sort of amends and talking about his crimes also allows
Kemper to better understand himself Douglas also says that he believes Kemper was made to be evil rather than
born to be evil but he also throws in there hey we have to keep in mind if this individual was raised in a happy
environment a non-abusive environment by different people right he says I can't guarantee that he
wouldn't grow up to end up killing people yeah I look I respect John but I also think
when you almost become friends with an individual like this I think that your viewpoints
are going to be skewed a little bit yeah I can agree with that I think that Kemper makes it difficult
to remain unbiased in this situation because he is easy to talk to you have Douglas in his
own words and Bob Ressler and his words as well stating that you know they found
him to be friendly easy to talk to Easy going and even had a good sense of humor
to the point where they talked with him for hours and will have to remind themselves hey this guy's a this guy's a
real monster he's a killer well they're also talking to other monsters that aren't being as Cooperative guys that
are probably just completely lying to him not giving them any correct information so therefore it's like
here once again Ed Kemper is the star student here's a little recommended reading
before we get out of here today this week we're recommending the Allure of premeditated murder why some people
plan to kill by Jack Levin and Julie Weist as violence remains such a prominent and troubling topic Nationwide
the Allure of premeditated murder successfully explores the reasons behind the worst violence as well as the most
promising Solutions and if you're interested in any of our recommended reading you can check that
out by going to our website truecrime garage.com and check out the recommended page for all of our old episodes check
us out on the Stitcher app it's free and check out off the record on Stitcher premium all right until next week be
good be kind and don't litter [Music] thank you [Music]

Edmund Kemper /// Part 2 /// 262

Part 2 of 2

www.TrueCrimeGarage.com

Edmund Kemper was raised by a mother that very likely hated him, even as a small boy. Ed liked to play death ritual games with his sister. He grew to be a very large man and extremely intelligent. Ed was about 6 foot 9 inches tall and his I.Q. was near genius level. As an adult he was convicted of the mutilation slayings of eight women. Was this monster born evil or was he made evil? This week we take a strong look at Edmund Kemper - The Co-Ed Killer Beer of the Week - You’re a Good Man Charlie - Brown Ale by Santa Cruz Mountain Brewing Garage Grade - 3 and 3/4 bottle caps out of 5

Beer Fund: https://truecrimegarage.com/home

Brief Summary

Ed Kemper's manipulative behavior and chilling murders are examined, highlighting his psychological issues and relationship with his mother.

Key points

Welcome to True Crime Garage. Hosts introduce the show and thank listeners for tuning in.
Edmund Kemper's Dark Past. Exploring the chilling history of serial killer Ed Kemper.
The Manipulation of the System. Discussion on how Kemper learned to manipulate psychiatric evaluations.
The Hitchhiker's Fate. Kemper's chilling decision to pick up hitchhikers and his intentions.
The Trunk Revelation. Kemper realizes he has another victim in the trunk, escalating the tension.
A Deceptive Encounter. Kemper tricks his victim into trusting him before attacking.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

I haven't talked about that for a lot of years.

Sharing a personal memory

4:27WatchNov 23, 2022

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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