Criminal Blunders | "48 Hours" Full Episodes | Forensic Files

[Music] it was early evening of August 31st 2012 when yansy null left work and headed
home he started driving his battered old Subaru up interstate five at some point he encountered a man
in a BMW he had no way of knowing that he was going to be dead in 10 [Music] minutes Yancy no was just a guy who
lived in North Seattle had a girlfriend and a dog like to climb mountains he was
one of us when you prosecute murder cases for as long long as we have the random nature of death is what gets in
your head he was my best friend for 22 years he was my touchone he was the guy who kept me
grounded people adored him the last few moments of yansy n's life were pulling up at a
stoplight the BMW pulled up next to Yan's Subaru yansy turned and saw this car and this
man next to him he saw the gun pointed at his head and he saw the bullet that shattered the
window and tore apart his face and then he turned and was shot three more times in the
head the witnesses really didn't know what had happened they heard the shots and then they saw the BMW pull
into oncoming traffic screeched out leaving tire marks going so fast that when the car hit a hill it took air and
then sped out of sight when I arrived that day at the murder scene it was dusk they had yellow
crime scene tape around yansy NES Subaru there was blood outside the driver's door the driver's seat was
saturated with blood when police respond to a murder they're looking for a reason was anybody
mad at yansy did yansy have any enemies there might have been some kind of Road incident some kind of traffic incident
now what are people thinking that there's a killer on the loose there was a killer on the loose
anybody could have been the next Target police didn't know they were looking for a student of
murder someone who would kill just a [Applause] [Music] kill I'm Peter vanand tonight on 48
hours student of [Music] [Music] murder this case is about the presence of evil in our world
it was like a bomb had dropped none of us is ever safe any of us could have been yansy
null prosecutors Adrien McCoy and Kristen Richardson say the murder of yansy null in 2012 shot to death in his
car while stopped at a red light put the city of Seattle on edge the police went
all out they took it very seriously police are still looking for the suspect Yancy null was shot and
killed one week ago tonight right now the shooter is on the loose how big a story was this this was a very big story
Allison Grandy is a reporter for Cairo 7 a CBS News affiliate we have shootings in Seattle we don't necessarily have
many shootings in that area of Seattle that time of day and that type of victim what were you hearing did yansy n have
any enemies from talking to his friends yansy didn't have any enemies he was an outdoorsy guy who enjoyed fine
wine loved what he did working as a wine Steward at QFC hey what's your name Yan
bottom line 42-year-old yansy null right was a good-hearted happy go-lucky guy oh
yeah oh yeah and friends say the idea that yansy exploded into a road rage battle is ridiculous he drove like a
grandma he was very very careful longtime friend Brad Kenny he had a Subaru wagon not
known for its speed was he an angry man no was he impulsive No Reckless never verbally abusive God no not even close
he was so careful and mindful with how he interacted with people investigators suspect yansy and his killer crossed
paths around 700 p.m. on Interstate 5 just north of Seattle it's possible that there was some sort
of Confrontation and yansy pulled up to the intersection thinking nothing of it do you think he ever knew what hit
him never he was killed instantly thank God he had no idea what happened the details of this shooting
were curious to say the least right here five shots were fired with remarkable accuracy it was at about this time of
day and the shooter killed yansy null just a few feet from other motorists I hear five rapid shots like kind of like
a pop po pop pop pop friends Kevin watts and Angelo Rama were driving together when they heard those five pops behind
them the next thing they saw was a car Speedway into oncoming traffic I drove by and I was like that's kind of weird
that someone wouldn't wait for a red light upset that the driver had run the red light the two friends hit the gas
and gave Chase we couldn't catch up to him how fast did that vehicle peel out of here 0
to 60 in like 2 3 seconds he was gone Rama and Watts gave up the Chase and returned to the scene where a Subaru
was still at the curb with its motor running the friends had a sinking feel that those pops they'd heard likely were
gunshots I saw a lot of blood I saw where the bullet holes were and I realized that there was just there's
absolutely nothing I could do the shooter's bullets had hit yansy four times in the head the case was about to
consume detectives Frank Clark and Dana Duffy for the next two years YY had no criminal history no history of being a
hotthead we really didn't have a lot to go on after closely inspecting the crime scene
the detectives realized Yan's window was down and the shooter had fired those five shots right through his own
passenger side window that's so strange to me the shooter would shoot through the passenger side window of his car at
someone else have you ever heard of such a thing no it it was strange to us as well that was a huge piece of evidence
the police now knew the shooter's car had a broken passenger side window and there was more even though witness
Angelo Rama had only glimpsed the fleeing car for a split second something registered my first guess was an M4 it's
a BMW car the one that I saw was a convertible it was silver was the top up or down it was down and when he was
driving by I noticed it had really really nice silver rims armed with his detailed description the police advised
the public to be on the lookout for that BMW model with that broken passenger side
window as for the driver I looked at the person who was driving the car cuz I'm really good with faces Kevin Watts
helped a police artist come up with this remarkably detailed sketch of the shooter within a week the sketch was
released to the public along with grainy still photos of the car from a nearby security camera we knew that police in
Seattle were looking for a silver BMW and they were pulling them over all over the city yes
[Music] yes police were desperate to stop the killer from striking again not knowing
if or when he would 2 weeks went by and then a suspect surfac who surprised everyone when you see something like
this from somebody who has it all together he's not crazy he's just evil police are still looking for he was
driving a silver in his 20s or 30s did Witnesses say f for anyone with information in the two weeks that
followed yansy n's brutal execution cops received hundreds of tips about that darkhaired suspect in a silver sports
car it seemed at that time like everybody in the city of Seattle was driving a BMW Z4 or a Z3 then on
September 14th a woman calls in an anonymous tip for the first time this mysterious man
has a name and she provides a name of den Bowman and his address which is less than 10 blocks
from the shooting site when we pulled up a photo of him matched the description of our sketch
did his hairstyle match yes and the age description matched and yet the 29-year-old D Bowman appears to be the
most unlikely of potential suspects he's a dazzling engineer with an inventive imagination the golf ball hits the lever
of this press which drives the drill which spins the wire Goldberg contration he
created the it swings over and hits this water bottle the bottom of the water bottle is a magnetic plunger the people
that we've spoken to have described him as brilliant a genius others have titled
him as a genius which then triggers this flamethrower B Bowman was only a 12-year-old when he entered College in
his 20s Bowman opened his own business a boutique engineering company called vague industries that specialized in
robotics and then in 2007 Bowman met Jennifer Palm a successful dentist at an education seminar they were married a
year later I thought they were what I considered to be a power couple very very sophisticated Justin Mata was a
friend of The Bowman what were they like as a couple loving the both of them I think understood one
another but it was up to detectives Duffy and Clark to figure out D Bowman and they quickly learned that he had
owned a BMW we wanted to know does he still have that BMW is it still at his house and immediately we came up with
the plan that we're going to set up a surveillance on his residence a stake out a stake
out a tense week went by with no sign of the BMW coming or going but then the garage door opens up just enough for the
detectives to spot a silver sports car based on that information we're able to obtain a search warrant Before Dawn on
September 21st 2012 as D and Jennifer were leaving for work police swooped in to arrest D Bowman Den was placed in
handcuffs and transported down to our office let you know this is a police facility and everything's being recorded
okay just to let you know that Bowman has to wait 2 hours for detectives to arrive to question him
while he's killing time Bowman doesn't appear to be concerned he enjoys some snacks and a cup of coffee exasperated
Bowman complains his precious time is being wasted will you KN yes sir yes uh so I'm
kind of getting a little annoyed at how long this is taking do I need to like um
I'm sorry this it it has to take as long as it takes okay he was pretty confused
about the whole thing it was kind of weird Bowman also didn't realize that in another room his wife Jennifer had
agreed to answer questions from detectives Clark and Duffy have you heard of any murders like within a few
blocks of your house in the last few weeks I'm not sure you're not sure it's a yes or no question I'm not sure we
call it the I'm not sure interview I'm not sure I'm not sure I'm not sure because her responses were
overwhelmingly I'm not sure so your honesty right now is Paramount I understand and I'm
not sure what I can tell you Jennifer didn't know that the detectives had already inspected Den's BMW and had
discovered from these markings that the passenger side window had been replaced remember investigators were certain the
killer had fired through that glass the first thing we did was open the passenger door and you could see glass
shards in The Well of the door jam also Within in the garage there was this fresh smell of
paint That's because the BMW's silver rims had been painted black what about the paint smell that we
smelling in there I'm not sure do you know anything that goes on in your house for nearly 4 hours he bled
all over the freaking streets of Seattle okay investigators hammered Jennifer for
answers and I'm tired of you sitting there playing Dum while the interview was going
on investigators entered the Bowman's house which was surprisingly bare we knew that Jennifer was the primary bread
winner in that household and we knew from serving some of our search warrants that she made probably $250,000 a year
but when we got into the home she had hardly any bedroom furniture her mattress laid on the floor as they went
room to room investigators discovered a small arsenal of weapons and ammunition everything except the suspected murder
weapon a 9mm Glock when detectives finally got to Bowman they hoped he would answer a few
questions but Bowman was smart enough to shut down the interview if you want to talk to a lawyer or you want to talk to
us first well I guess I'd like to talk to a lawyer Bowman might have been done with the detectives but they were far
from finished with him you're going to be charged with a crime of what murder of what of who murder of a human
being okay it was something to see at least 45 friends of murder victim yansy null
packed AR reignment court this morning to get a look at this man you watch this man walk in and you see this unassuming
person and you go why why would why would you do this D Bowman has been in custody for 4 months
for the murder of yansy null and at this hearing Bowman learns his bail is set at
a stunning $10 million a sum he cannot make he hasn't shown any sign of guilt or even fear Brad Kenny is desperate for
answers it just fills you with so much anger well Bowman appears stoic in court prosecutors say the alleged killer has a
quirky side that emerges in hundreds of recorded Jailhouse phone calls with his wife Jennifer they had pet names Den was
Bunny and Mrs Bowman Jennifer was snuggles Bunny and snuggles Bunny and snuggles when they talk to each other
they talk and baby talk bunny bunny how are you I'm doing good how's my little snuggle cake I just wrote you in the
email yay it was very strange very strange I miss so many things right now I know I don't have a
snuggles you don't have a snuggle plum next to you everyone warned us don't listen to the jail calls don't listen to
the jail calls you'll want to throw up I'm just going to say love love Meanwhile Back among the grown-ups
detectives Frank Clark and Dana Duffy were methodically building their homicide case against Bowman they
discovered that for years the techsavvy genius had been downloading these books artic
and videos to his computer on the subject of death and murder it's not that he just had a little bit of it he
had tons of [Music] it and then there was Bowman's obsession with this man [Music]
Bond James [Music] [Applause] Bond and it showed in Bowman's computer videos that's D Bowman driving a car at
high speed s around an obstacle course and here he is blasting away in shooting demonstrations where he proved
he was an expert Marksman with either hand I don't believe that Den Bowman got up that morning thinking today's the day
that I'm going to shoot somebody this situation presented itself somehow but once it did then all his self-training
and research kicked in we're going to talk about shooting through glass and one of Bowman's videos made by a
Firearms expert really shocked police I've come into a situation where I feel threatened by somebody off to my
passenger side it was a play byplay of Yan's murder of course I recognize I come down I grip I cross parallel extend
touch press if you want to know how to shoot somebody in traffic from your very fancy
sports car it was an awfully helpful video he didn't even have to roll down his window prosecutors came to believe
Bowman wanted to kill someone just for the thrill of it why would he commit this murder in broad daylight where
there are witnesses around who could see his car perhaps see him what's the fun of it if there's no challenge if there's
no Witnesses if there's no need need to get away to speed off and fly through neighborhood streets and hide your car
in your garage that was the fun for him soon after the murder police say that Bowman went to his computer where
he had his vast library of murder related books including arrest proof yourself how to cover up a murder how to
get rid of a gun how to get rid of gunshot residue and police say Bowman now had an accomplice Jennifer Bowman
AKA snuggles do you understand how serious this is right now Jennifer Jennifer to me seemed very very nervous
tell us the truth poor eye contact I could see that she was shaky tell me the truth right
now I have told you the truth Jennifer never asked for a lawyer and handed over her purse where police found receipts
that aided the investigation do either of you have the belief that Jennifer had prior knowledge of this attack I don't
think she had prior knowledge but I believe that at some point D told her what happened she had to know something
because the next day she went to Portland with him why'd you go to Portland it was just
a a little date trip a little road trip a trip that led to this AutoGlass Shop where police say Bowman began to cover
up his crime his wife wife by his side she was very standoffish she didn't say much repairman Jeff Shields he just
seemed like he needed a window right away Bowman told Shields the BMW window had been Shattered by a thief while he
and Jennifer were eating in Portland what time of day was the window broken um we found it um in the afternoon at
approximately what time it was right after we ate lunch but detectives say a restaurant receipt from Jennifer's purse
told a different story they were never there for lunch they went there at dinner
[Music] time 3 weeks later the Bowman's visited a tire store in Northern Seattle manager
Doug hasket says Bowman used the name Peter while his wife avoided eye contact she was a blonde and she just kind of
looked at the ground she really wouldn't talk to anybody Bowman bought four cheaper tires to replace the expensive
BMW tires why would he get new tires because during our investigation the media released that there were tire
tread tracks left at the scene why did he get new tires I'm not sure I were the on were
the other ones wore out I'm not sure what if we put you on a polygraph test today you'd fail it like a sack of
potatoes I mean I can tell your lion just looking at you police say they later found the set
of expensive practically new BMW tires inside Bowman's workshop at vague Industries the murder weapon was never
recovered but prosecutors felt they had enough evidence to try D Bowman for first-degree murder please rise and he
would soon take the stand and tell a story he had long kept secret if I didn't do something right then I was
going to die [Music] Frank what do we have here Peter we're in the evidence Warehouse of the Seattle Police
Department two vehicles side by side once again just as they were on that summer evening in August 2012 this is
Den Bowman's BMW roadsters Z four and yansy n's super rof what brought them together is
unclear the result of their encounter is not what goes through your mind when you
look inside this car sadness Devastation for yansy this family lost a a loving member murder is is very ugly it's never
pretty and now on November 19th 2014 2 years after yansy null was savagely gunned down his alleged killer
enters the courtroom to face the charge of first-degree murder please rise court is now in
session by the time of trial he looked like he was 13 didn't bman is transformed gone is The Confident cocky
young man who first met with detectives do you want to talk to a lawyer or you want to talk to us first well I guess
I'd like to talk to a lawyer and in his place is what appears to be a cleancut college student this guy doesn't look
like a killer and that's not at all uncommon for defendants to change their appearance in order to appeal to the
jury Bowman's mother a native of Vietnam and his father a Boeing engineer are in
court every day to support their only child but his cing wife Jennifer his snuggles is nowhere to be
seen we are ready to begin opening statements prosecutor Adrien McCoy tells jurors that the motive for murder wasn't
greed or jealousy this was a fulfillment of a quest but something far more maob a
quest to know what it would be like to kill someone McCoy attempts to take the jury inside
Bowman's Mind by showing these training videos recovered from his computer we're going to talk about
shooting through glass from video to thousands of pages of research on killing another person
prosecutors paint a portrait of a premeditated murder it was the equivalent of the library of of Congress
on death you ever seen anything like this before in your career not even close why was all that stuff on his
computer he hoarded information he had a lot of things on his computer that are totally bizarre having possession of it
doesn't mean anything Mr Bowman was actually trying to create a library of basically everything Bowman's lawyer
prominent defense attorney John Henry Brown whose former clients include serial killer Ted Bundy says there's no
evidence that Bowman ever read or watched any of these materials there were thousands if not hundreds of
thousands of pages about engineering techniques but also there was all this bizarre stuff that the prosecutors used
in order to make up their motive as the defense presents its case Brown takes a big gamble you swear our
fir ofal he puts D Bowman on the stand I felt like it was just this crazy bad dream and like I was just run like I
was running from a monster and brown knows he's risking it all on Bowman's ability to sway jurors and convince them
that he was the victim of road rage if I didn't do something right then I was going to die Bowman explains that it all
began when he accidentally cut off yansy null on the inter state there was sort of
a a stream of swearing I think the the the phrase that caught my attention was um you better learn how to drive that
fancy car boy or you're going to get yourself up Bowman says yansy closely followed
him off the interstate to this traffic light where they both stopped and it was that point when I got r
yeah that Wham Bowman says was a wine bottle thrown by yansy that hit him in the head he's an absolute liar that's
sacrilegious to yans he would never throw and waste wine on somebody like that I remember seeing his eyes really
like bulging and like as he was kind of as he was yelling I would describe it as just
like violent hatred that you would I had only seen in the movies did you think it was possibly G yeah yeah I was
scared fearing for his life Bowman says he pulled out his 9mm Glock pointed it at yansy and
fired you intentionally shot him yes was it your intent to kill him no road rage
is by definition not premeditation and Bowman says he shot yans in self-defense I remember opening my
eyes seeing that I had the gun in my hand and I just dropped the gun and stepped on the gas though Bowman claims
he was the victim he didn't call the police panicked Bowman says he collected evidence from his car including the wine
bottle and the gun and threw it all away throwing away of the evidence that would
support his own story this is a guy who's genius level IQ right well but yeah but a lot of geniuses I know don't
have a lot of common sense you threw away the evidence that you could show the police to prove you were not a
criminal right I didn't think they would even believe me but prosecutor Christen
Richardson isn't buying a word of Bowman's story do you don't think that most husbands would go home to their
wives and say oh my God I almost got killed I figured the more that he talked the worse it was going to get for him
you're an expert shoo what was your target I there was no aming involved in this okay well you did a pretty good job
didn't you cuz you hit him four times in the head including the temple right um that surprised me for 3 Days
Richardson hammers away at Bowman you lied to your parents you lied to your wife right is that a question but he
never loses his composure Mr Bowman you have no trouble answering yes or no to Mr Brown is there something wrong with
the way I ask questions of you no that seemed like a strange question okay well that's the first no I think
I've gotten from you so I guess the point's been made I have nothing else thank you you may step down as D Bowman
steps down the question is did he convince the jury that he killed yansy null to save his life I think Jim deeply
believed the jury would see that self-defense is justifiable homicide or simply for the thrill is he guilty of
murdering the first degree [Music] yes [Music] I will never forget [Music] yansy every time he hikes this Trail
Brad Kenny thinks of his friend yansy N I really miss him it's never going to be
over and I'll always miss him I mean it's good to be here but it's um it's really
difficult please rise after 3 weeks and 31 Witnesses D Bowman's murder trial is coming to a close he hasn't shown one
iota of remorse he's just completely stoic I think we're ready for the jerks on December 9th 2014 more than 2 years
after yansy n's murder and coincidentally Den Bowman's 32nd birthday jurors begin deliberations it's
the worst part of the job waiting for a verdict but it's just the nature of it you always doubt yourself one person not
doubting himself is Den Bowman as he confides to his wife Jennifer in recorded Jailhouse phone calls we should
chastise the jurs if they take longer than tomorrow Jennifer has not appeared a single day of Bowman's trial but she
stays in constant contact and has no doubt whatsoever of his innocence this is obvious they need to
acquit like how could they consider anything else you have to be completely irrational to believe anything else be
seated please on day three the jury returns I understand the jury has reached the
verdict I will read the verdict form we the jury find the defendant Thomas Ben Bowman
guilty of the crime of Murder in the First Degree as charged guilty the jury didn't buy Den Bowman's he killed n but
says ite murder required premeditation it's a total surprise to Bowman but sweet relief to Yan's girlfriend and his
supporters the verdict is read what was that moment like for Den well he was so emotionally upset he said I can't
believe it I can't believe it I can't believe it 3 weeks later a very different looking D Bowman is back in court for
sentencing Mr Bowman made some bad decisions the once cocky boy Genius is gone as the reality of the guilty
verdict sinks in and his parents step forward to beg the judge for Mercy I know this is my
fault defense attorney Brown must finish reading her statement our son's acts are
our faults my husband and I we provide and allowed him to learn a gun for self- protection Brown a seasoned trial lawyer
can't help but show emotion as Den's mother asks the judge to send her to prison in place of her only child ask
you to allow myself to substitute any punishment by placing myself in Den's role it was heartbreaking to watch his
mother at sentencing for her to offer herself in his place to do his punishment for him that's real moments
later it's Bowman's turn Dan are you able to speak but Yan's girlfriend and his supporters refus to
listen I'm disappointed that the jurs didn't believe me and the first words out of Den's mouth when he's asked to
make a statement at sentencing is not about his parents or his heartbroken mother or Yan's friends or family it's I
can't believe the jury didn't believe me that's his Focus I don't envy your task of having
to make the uh burden of deciding my fate it's and I'm sorry for placing you in that
situation and all I can ask is for your mercy and for your help as the judge is about to deliver
Bowman's sentence he has something he feels compelled to say I feel very sorry for your parents Mr Bowman and I want to
tell them that it is not their fault Mr Bowman is responsible for his own actions Bowman gets 29 years and 1 month
slightly less than the maximum the case against in Bowman is over but the police
feel there's unfinished business was Jennifer misleading or dishonest or lying at any point during this
questioning yes she was I would very much like her to be charged with a crime the crime of helping her her husband
cover up Yan's murder Frank would you like her to be charged with a crime yes I would Jennifer today has changed her
name and her job she opened the door but we tracked her down in Seattle hey Jennifer Peter vanent 48 hours why did
you lie to detectives why did you help your husband cover up a murder you can talk to
us no answers still ultimately the state attorney chose not to bring charges against Jennifer and
she in turn has cut off all ties with the man she once endearingly called her bunny today the house the couple lived
in sits empty the two cars at the heart of this case remain in a police warehouse but the memories of yansy null
remain as alive as ever ready ready ready [Music] get [Music] one of my friends mom had texted
me cuz she lived pretty close to Great Vine Lake and she was like look what happened a developing story right now a
body found in the banks of Grapevine Lake nothing happens in Grapevine nothing except for what he
did the victim was identified as Jacqueline Vandergriff hello everyone my name is jacn Vander but friends call me
Jackie Jackie Vander was 24 years of age I am currently a junior here at Texas Women's University and my major is
nutrition with an emphasis in wellness and just beyond this area where the shade is pretty much hitting is where we
had our crime scene there are a lot of things that will shock you and this is by far the
worst thing I have seen my manager texts me Charles's just been arrested I felt like the world was
spinning like everything was out of control it's beli that last Tuesday Jacqueline vandagriff met up with
Charles Bryant at a bar in Denton surveillance video also cell phone pings all put Vander Griff and
Bryant together I remember him just being kind of quiet I immediately said there's no
way they have the wrong guy there's no no way that he did this are you telling me there's no evidence that Charles
Bryant killed Jackie Vander not direct evidence this is kind of my calling dealing with these really strange cases
the serial killer it's the ritualistic killings hey how you doing today good Jim H with the angels life good today or
not this this is not a a normal homicide I even know how I kill someone it all seemed to started with
Caitlyn how screwed up are you from Pin Man in the early days it was good after that first month that's when I started
to see these warning signs that he was manipulative very controlling I just told him I can't do
this anymore this isn't working this is over he flipped out he showed up at your dorm
room out of the blue you never gave him the address no you know you trespass in his mind he was seeking Revenge the
warrant that we got is for stalking on his exgirlfriend who had called the police on him how he was stalking me was
completely related to Jackie Vander Griff's death there's some similarities the way that vandagriff
looks and the way that Brian's ex-girlfriend looked do you think there's a chance of
possibility that he walked into this bar and saw somebody reminded him of you and
took his rage out on her most definitely I I think that he really wanted to kill
me I think that he wanted me dead [Music] [Music] when I first arrived on the scene I saw
a lot of police cars saw fire trucks there was a lot of activity it was September 14th
2016 Just Before Dawn when John Luna a captain with the Grapevine Police Department
responded to a call about a gruesome Discovery here at Grapevine Lake just off of the warn foot path you
have an area that's pretty well overgrown with weeds but you could clearly see a small area that was burned
just beyond where I'm standing there was a body that was obviously charred it had
been set on fire the body found inside a blue kitty pool was so badly damaged that police could not determine the most
basic fact facts about the victim we didn't know if that was an adult or a child male or a
female the next day using fingerprints police were able to identify the victim it was Jackie Vander a 24-year-old
nutrition major at Texas Women's University in nearby Denton I chose this major because um I realized the
importance of nutrition and just overall health both named Jacqueline named after
Jacqueline Kennedy one of Jackie Vander Griff's closest friends Jackie Tan they met in high
school ever since then we were Jackie squared and I loved it she made me feel like I could be myself and just be goofy
and funny Jackie Tan remembers her friend as a good student who was focused and trusting that girl smartest girl I've
[Music] known she had her whole life ahead of her she had plans me and my detectives
we went out there for her memorial service and um sorry for Captain Luna the brutality of
this crime hit close to home could it just as easily been my daughter that this happened
to Jackie spent the last evening of her life IND dented with this man police didn't know his identity right away but
this woman knew him very well he would always give me flowers always especially if he had something to be sorry about
Charles Bryant lived some 20 miles away but he had been making frequent visits to Denton trying to rekindle a
relationship with his ex-girlfriend Caitlyn matthysse who had recently moved there to attend the University of North
Texas he was just trying to win me back back and I was just like nothing is going to work Caitlyn's involvement with
Bryant had begun 3 months earlier in June in the town of Grapevine when it came into the restaurant where Caitlyn
was working as a server the day that I met him was the day after I graduated high
school he had lots of muscles um and Tattoos which kind of interested me at the at the
time Bryant was then 29 working as a bartender and personal trainer you're 18 he's 29 he's got muscles and tattoos and
must have made your mother crazy yeah extremely crazy in a good way though yeah she cared about me being a mother
of adult children is a different role you have to let go for them to to fly away
and grow up with you Caitlyn is the youngest of Karen H's four children she says Caitlyn was hard to
miss Fireball you know when she's in the house she never walked anywhere she ran
everywhere and Caitlyn ran headlong into the relationship with Charles Bryant that summer of
2016 one of their regular date spots was at the park by Grapevine Lake where this
picture was taken when Karen learned about the relationship she asked Caitlyn to show her a picture of
him I Got This Feeling Just deep inside to my bones an evil feeling and I said he's going to hurt you he's going to do
something bad wow and she's like oh he's nice he's good to me he makes me feel like an adult were you thinking to
yourself you're 18 you're too young to know yes but I didn't want to insult her within weeks Caitlyn was having serious
doubts of her own about Brian that's when I started to see these warning signs that he was manipulative he was a
bit of a Nar narcissist he thought very highly of himself he would say things like oh
you'll never find anyone better than me it was toxic and he was toxic in mid August 2016 Caitlyn broke
up with Bryan she thought that was the last she'd see of him but the next day he showed up uninvited at her mother's
house and somehow he convinced me to get back with him he was trying to say oh I
can work on this and and I can be better and making all these promises but Caitlyn realized she wasn't
interested in promises that was one of the things that my mom taught me people do not change you you can't change
someone at that point I was just waiting for the perfect time to end things a little more than a week later after
Caitlyn moved away to school she told Brian it was over again later that night police found him
on campus just by sheer coincidence I had made a traffic stop and he was driving that vehicle Captain Jeremy pul
was then a lieutenant for the UN campus police he pulled Brian over early in the
morning of August 24th I thought he was an intoxicated driver by the way he was driving and that was my focus so right
now I'm have to place you on you know Arris so good you can just remain seated it's all good Bryant was not over the
legal limit he was charged with a few outstanding traffic tickets and they let him go later that same day he was back
on Caitlyn's campus again he actually knocked on the door of my dorm room he didn't know prior to where I lived and
he said oh your name was on the door did that creep you out it did at that point
I was scared Caitlyn got him out of there and called campus police captain pul recognized Bryant's name on the
report and went along to interview Caitlyn the next day she told us things like I I just did
not like the way Charles spoke to me I did not like the way he treated me and I made that choice then and there you know
I would do everything I could to help her with this situation pul issued a no trespass order
Banning Charles Bryant from the UN campus but once again Brian would not take no for an
answer the biggest fear I have as a police officer sometimes is emotion because emotion drives people to do
things you would never [Applause] imagine [Music] it was my first day there and he walked
through the door and my heart just dropped to the bottom of my stomach it was August 31st
2016 a week since Charles Bryant had tracked Caitlyn matys down at her new dorm now he was invading her space again
coming into her new restaurant on her first day of work M was like I just want you to leave what did he say to that he
didn't really say anything he looked upset my new co-workers they like yeah he was here yesterday looking for
you Caitlyn asked her manager to keep Bryant out but her manager said there was nothing he could
do I can't work here I don't feel safe enough to work here Caitlyn went back to her old job a half hour's drive away her
mother found it all hard to watch from a distance I said come home it was my motherly instinct to protect her and in
order to protect her I had to have her with me but Caitlyn thought she'd be safe in
her dorm a week later on September 6th what would have been their 3-month anniversary Bryant was back yet
again he showed up to to my dorm knocked on my door and at this point I was shaking I'm all
alone I uh actually hid in my sweet mate's closet you hid yes when I was on the phone with the police they were like
we can't hear you you need to speak up and I was just afraid that he was going to hear my voice I did hear him say
Caitlyn I know you're in there just open up I have something for you and I'm like
God what what do you what do you have for me I don't want it Bryant left flowers send a two-page
letter when police arrived he was gone I heard him say hey it's Charles I have something for you you know for sure it
was him yeah I know it was him s 27 myself and 443 in a police found him outside 10 minutes later you at school
here no what's your name now in running clothes and arrested him for trespassing but you know you're not
supposed to be up there right Brian posted Bond and was released within hours although Caitlyn had
already blocked him on her phone email and social media he created a new email address and wrote to her later that same
day here I am heartbroken and with a criminal record for bringing the girl I love
flowers that's when it became really serious for me if an actual physical arrest doesn't stop the behavior then
you're you know something is wrong Captain pul helped Caitlyn get an emergency protective order and because
Brian had kept trying to reach her after his arrest how you doing Charles you have your ID with you poke had his
officers go to Bryan's house the next day and charge him yet again this time for stalking this was his third arrest
in 14 days I told him if he continued to communicate with Caitlyn I would use every email I would use every text
message I would use every phone call as a reason to have him rearrested 2 Days Later Bryant posted a $5,000 Bond and
got out of jail he was telling his roommate that I was the the crazy one in this
relationship so all of his friends were kind of coming at me and they were like why you need to like drop these charges
against him by September 13th Bryant was back in Denton just a half mile from Caitlyn's dorm in an area she had told
them about back when they were still dating I was talking about going up to fry Street and like meeting new people
Bryant went to fry Street public house that night at about 700 p.m. an hour later Jackie Vandergriff walked in asked
about a job and ended up in a conversation with the bartender and Charles Bryant about 45 minutes later Jackie
posted a message on her Twitter I'm glad I decided to get off Tinder and walked to a
bar Jackie's friend Jackie Tan Jackie was a very social person whenever she went out she would
make friends with everybody and it wasn't even flirty it wasn't anything you know she was talking to the
bartender talking to other people at about 9:00 Jackie left with Bryant and the bartender she and Bryant
went to another bar nearby and started talking to a group group of women by 9:45 it was raining and
everyone was headed out Jackie left with Charles Bryant I feel like she felt comfortable
enough with him that night because she had been hanging out with him for so long that she was like hey well whatever
he's just going to drop me off it's not that far and I'll be good once in his car Bryant stopped at a
convenience store this was the last time Jackie Vander Griff was seen alive the day after she was found dead
there was a new post on her Twitter never knew I could feel like this it was just really bizarre police suspected it
was a message from her killer and they knew they had to move quickly to ID the man Jackie had been with they had some
luck when they tracked down the women Jackie met that night one of the friends that was with
her had gotten a business card from this person because he was a fitness instructor now that Grapevine Police had
Charles Bryant's name they learned about that restraining order so in my eyes that played into him as being a good
suspect Grapevine Police called Captain pul who was in the middle of a road race
the first thing he told me was Charles Bryant was their main suspect and Jackie's murder and I immediately just
sat down on a park bench in the middle of the race it floored me Bryant was emerging as a strong suspect but
Grapevine Police did not have physical evidence connecting him to Jackie's death so for now Bryant was free and
pulk was worried about what he might do next I called Caitlyn and I just asked where are you I was like does this have
to do with the murder that happened in Grapevine and he's like I I I can't tell I can't specify that to you
Caitlyn but are you safe right now and what did you say I said I think so she might have been wrong in the days
after Jackie's murder Charles Bryan sent Katlin several emails including this picture writing on it first kiss under
this tree Once Upon a Time that photo was taken at Grapevine Lake he might have taken that picture that same day
that Jackie was [Music] killed it was September 2016 and Caitlyn mathys Charles Bryant exgirlfriend was
very worried he might have been involved in the brutal murder at Grapevine Lake just days before I was waiting for more
news to come out cuz at that point they hadn't even um arrested him yet were you
worried he was going to come after you I was I thought that's exactly what he was
going to do the emails and picture Bryant had recently sent Caitlyn were proof that he
was still thinking about her in the days after Jackie was killed but they were also proof of something else it was
prohibited for Charles to communicate with her in any manner and then if he did he would have been violating that
order Captain poke thought they could use those violations to help the grape vine police we didn't have enough to
make an arrest yet so I told the detective we can get a warrant signed on some evidence we just got and at least
you know get him off the street you go by Charles you go by Dean Charles okay Charles Bryant was arrested
on September 18th for violating Caitlyn's restraining order graef find Detectives were hoping they'd soon find
more evidence connecting him to Jackie's death he's brought to the gravine police
department for an interview and right away he's beginning to distance himself from having any almost any interaction
with Jackie recognize who she iside a bar and at the same time we began serving a search warrant for his
residence what can you tell me about her that's about it I guess it had been 4 days since Jackie's
body was found plenty of time to dispose of any possible evidence but Captain Luna at Grapevine PD says they found a
lot at Bryant's home including a large military style knife you know what her purse was found in there too
Briant had no way to answer for any of it including two more items police found while he was in
custody video of him buying a shovel the night Jackie disappeared and a kitty pool missing
from his backyard that matched the one Jackie's body was found in we have video of you with this girl should me you're
at the bar you're walking around Walmart at 4:00 in the morning buying a shovel she's found
dead in a pool that came from your back backyard he even got to the point at the
end of his interview with our detective where he said well I must have done it I
I I don't remember doing anything everything points to me it's like I had to have done
it an open and shut case not even close although there was overwhelming evidence
that Bryant had disposed of Jackie's body there was no evidence yet that confirmed how Jackie had died or that
Bryant had killed her and that's when they reached out to me and asked if I could come in and spend some time with
him and and interview him and see what I could get because you have a an expertise in dealing with this kind of
personality right this is kind of my calling Jim Holland is the senior member of an elite team of Texas Rangers a
select division of the Texas State Police he specializes in interviewing some of the country's most prolific
killers and analyzing their thoughts hey how you doing it's so and Char Bryant seemed to fit the
bill Jackie's body had been dismembered before being set on fire how do you begin to understand a mind that would do
that a lot of these people actually want to tell you uh they want to tell someone
at first Bryant kept to his claim that he didn't remember a thing yeah it's crazy CU I really don't remember me the
idea that he doesn't remember doing it oh no it's absolute nonsense so you knew Charles Bryant remembered exactly what
had happened oh yes absolutely and your job was just to pull that out of him right you know you're not a violent dude
you haven't uh haven't really been in trouble Holland says his strategy was to try to make friends with Bryant and get
him talking you know you obviously work out I mean you're stud right you don't want him to look at you as a law
enforcement officer you want him to think of you as a friend a Compadre a drinking buddy you know you kind of go
back to what two boys would talk about in the high school locker room you know about the the girl they kissed on Friday
night you don't have any issues with girls just blow my mind and Holland suggested possible scenarios to see if
Bryant would take it from there okay so so something happens bam there there's a
snap and we need to figure out what that is and maybe you know she got mad maybe
she she's giving you all the signals and and then cut you off I mean there could
be all kinds of different things going on here right I mean chicks right you know
chicks you know as we're going through the interview there I'm watching him I'm um I guess in a way a human lie detector
I'm um I'm reading him and I'm throwing things at him in which I know the answer
and I'm looking for his responses whether they're false uh or true under the pretense of of helping
Bryant remember what happened Holland suggested they do a memory exercise what we're going to do is these mind
exercises which means we're going to move back in time Bryant who first claimed he didn't know who Jackie was
then seemed to remember her he said he could see her coming into the bar she's looking for a job that's what
it was and offering her a ride makes sense it was raining I probably off to ride home there's tons of things in this
that I can tell you right over a pizza as Holland tried to steer Bryant to confess he probed about
a possible motive but what does everyone want to know yeah why and who's the only one who
can tell us that me you know Holland eventually cut to the Chase and asked if what happened with Jackie was really all
about Caitlyn was there a time that you pictured her as this girlfriend that did
you wrong or did anything like that come into play the level of nonsense that came out of
his mouth at different points about that was just astonishing do you think Charles Bryant looks around the bar and
sees Jacqueline Vandergriff ah she looks like Caitlyn it wouldn't surprise me if
he actually Mook her at first you know that saw her from behind and thought man you know my ex is here I think in his
mind that whole night I think that's what he pictured after the murder right after the murder
he took Jacky's phone and used it to add me on [Music] Facebook when Texas Ranger Jim Holland
was brought in to interrogate Charles Bryant the nature of the crime made him wonder if Bryant's brain was wired like
the serial killers he'd encountered in what way is the mind of a serial killer different from common criminal you know
generally people like that tend to be sociopathic or or Psychopathic mindsets and it's just a different game
psychopath would be someone who's basically born with a a scar on their brain and a sociopathic mindset is um
something that Society has brought on something happened to them that changed their psyche something maybe had
happened in his childhood Christy Dixon got a glimpse of Charles Bryant psyche firsthand she met him on a dating app
the year before Jackie Vander Griff's death he seemed pretty quiet and reserved almost like he was shy by the
second or third time that we were hanging out um I noticed he was getting pretty attached pretty quickly and I
just was not there it was very casual to me after she broke things off he continued to pursue her Bryant even told
her that he loved her chrisy says they'd never even shared a kiss it was a little
too much too soon too fast I work with abused children and that to me kind of stuck out christe says that's when she
asked Brian about his childhood he told her he had been molested a claim that 48
hours could not independently verify I remember thinking that makes sense I'm not a psychologist or anything but his
behavior sort of came off to me as maybe an abused child or someone who is just needing that extra love that most people
probably aren't seeking still christe thought he was harmless and stayed in touch I thought
he was just a really nice guy and felt sorry for him I'm not an angry guy I'm not aggressive as stranger Holland
continued his interrogation he wanted to see if Bryant would answer the key question how did Jackie Vander Griff
died her autopsy didn't provide many answers there's a lot we didn't know we didn't know where it occurred we didn't
know exactly how it broke down and so that's what my goal was Holland wondered if the crime had a sexual element but
initially Bryant denied anything sexual took place I recall having sex you don't
no nor that people having sex after three more hours of interrogation Bryant said they did have sex kinky sex
according to Bryant Jackie wanted to be choked with an oversized zip tie that just happened to be in his car she
didn't fight you in any way when when you're putting it on the consensual sex aspect of it was
was one of those things that that no I I felt strongly that he was lying about and Bryant also claimed that neither he
nor Jackie had tightened the zip tie intentionally okay so you think he just tightened up on its own basically that's
that like it had a snag on something okay then what happened try to remember she's not responsive
sh are you just thinking this is a complete and total lie yeah it's total fabrication did he killer yes absolutely
when you deal with these people it's it's so rare that you would sit down with them and they would just tell
you A to Z this is what occurred and they're always going to leave out things that make them look really bad in other
words there's an excuse I'm not a bad person I didn't mean for this to happen it was an accident although Bryant was
evasive about how Jackie died as Holland led him through the memory exercise Bryant went into gruesome detail about
how he disposed of her body K what do you see in the cool garbage bags right now tell me exactly what you
see occurring after that go true and what happens next put it on fire the fire why do you burn the
body even if he couldn't admit to murder Bryant seemed to waver between denying and acceptance at one point conceding
that the evidence showed he had to have done it I can't fight it it's obviously me
after an intense 6-hour interrogation and with mounting evidence Charles Bryant was finally charged with Jackie
Vander Griff's murder Christy Dixon could not believe the news that night I actually was scared to
go to sleep I had nightmares he had never threatened me before but just the fact that
someone that I felt that I knew had murdered someone potentially I was terrified for Caitlyn Mathis her worst
fears were confirmed and when she tried to learn more about the woman Bryant killed she made a shocking discovery on
Facebook I looked up Jackie Vandergriff and I realized oh my God I'm already friends
with her Caitlyn says that digital friendship began after Jackie's death you got a friend request from Jackie
Vander yes Caitlyn believes that Facebook friend request could only have come from one person Charles Bryant that
really sounds diabolical it was Brian pleaded not guilty to Jackie's murder his defense
was the same story he told Ranger Holland these two young people met they consumed a lot of alcohol our position
is they had sex kinky sex i'llbe it and she died Brian's court appointed defense
attorney glennis McGinty says Jackie Vander Griff's death was a tragic accident are you telling me there's no
evidence that Charles Bryant killed Jackie Vander not direct evidence prosecutors Lucas Allen and Anna
Hernandez believed the evidence they did have would be enough but they also knew
that most jurors want to motive and they weren't sure they'd be able to tell this
jury why they thought Jackie was targeted you have to wonder what is driving this person to do something like
that in your minds there is no doubt that the murder of Jackie vandagriff is connected to the stalking of Caitlyn
matthysse yes I think we believe that definitely she might have just been victim number one with Caitlyn being
victim number two to help prove this the prosecution was hoping the judge would allow Caitlyn
to testify against her ex-boyfriend turn stalker in open court I felt sick what do you think was the most
telling part of Charles Bryant's interview take a look at the evidence in the case against Bryant on Facebook at
48 hours Jackie was the most special person I know I'll never meet someone like her again in April 2018 a year and
a half after Jackie Vander Griff's untimely death Charles Bryant was standing trial for her murder her friend
Jackie Tan could not bring herself to be there I wanted to go but I'm going to be
honest I couldn't look at him Charles Bryant would have to answer for a long list of items the prosecution had
collected including that giant zip tie the shov purchased the night Jackie died and that large knife which police
believe he used to cut up her body all founded his house this is something that you pray
every night does not happen to your child when they go off to school investigators had also found a stun gun
in his car with Jackie's DNA on it but it appears Jackie was spared at least one haror prosecutors Anna Hernandez and
Lucas Allen say the medical examiner was able to run tests on Jackie's remains and found no evidence of sexual assault
there was Zero evidence to support that they had any type of sexual encounter prosecutors say this undermines Bryant
story that this was kinky sex gone wrong his attorney glennis McGinty how could they have had sex if there's no evidence
no evidence to the degree of no sperm found in her that doesn't mean they didn't have some type of consensual
sexual uh encounter she likes it making out prosecutors chose not to play that interrogation tape for the jury which
meant Bryant would have to take the stand if he wanted jurors to hear his version of events he elected not to
shouldn't he be explaining to the jury why he's not at fault for her death and then that flies in the face of our
constitutional rights but the defense knows it has an uphill battle to convince a jury that
Brian is not guilty of murder while admitting he disposed of Jackie's body if he says it was just an accident why
didn't he call for help sure fair question in toxicated panicked and his mind would not process all of that to
make a rational decision that you or I would have made call the police but Bryant went further than simply
discarding Jackie's body much much further and prosecutors wanted the jury to hear their Theory a huge piece of
that story was the stalking but before the jury could hear from Caitlyn the judge would have to
rule on whether or not to allow this evidence how is he his boyfriend local TV cameras were there when without the
jury pres Caitlyn took the stand and faced her ex I was disgusted just to see his face did he look at you did you meet
eyes at one point we had to when they made me described to the court what he was
wearing and he just had this smirk on his face there's nothing really that can prepare you for that is there no the
second I walked out those doors I started balling in the end the judge ruled against
Caitlyn being able to tell her story to the jury it was definitely a real blow to us that was the right decision why he
had not been convicted of anything with Caitlyn as the jury went out to deliberate the defense was hopeful I
don't believe that they could prove that he murdered her I don't think that they
provve that but would the jury agree they were out for a little over 2 hours and even without hearing Caitlyn's Story
We the jury find the defendant Charles de Bryant Jr guilty of the offense of murder Charles Bryant was found guilty
of Jackie Vander Griff's murder and dismemberment to your way of thinking was Justice Done
yes I knew she was up there and said thank you because prosecutors had no evidence Bryant committed another crime
at the same time as Jackie's murder like rape or kidnapping he was not eligible for the death penalty he was sentenced
to life as terrible as it is is to say but I wanted the death penalty under Texas law Brian could be
eligible for parole after 30 years Caitlyn says she feels like she's still looking over her shoulder and
always will be I fear that when he gets out he'll come and find me and do something something to either me or
someone that I love that's my biggest fear ever since this happened Caitlyn and her mother have been thinking about
Jackie and her family this whole time I wanted to reach out but I didn't know how they felt nearly 2 years after
Jackie died they finally met her grandmother bless her heart she immediately came up to us and to Caitlyn
and hugged her and said I've been so worried about you these past two years [Music]
wow Karen why is this the part that gets you he took away their little girl and the the pain I saw in their
eyes I could feel their pain and yet the grandmother was telling Caitlyn she was
worried about Caitlyn yes you sound like very special people they [Music] are Caitlyn says she struggled with the
fact that she survived and Jackie did not this so easily could have been you and some days I wish it
was it's just the guilt that eats me up sometimes I would have easily taken her place if I had the chance
[Music] Jackie vander's family has endowed an internship in health and wellness at
Texas Women's University in her name a young mother murdered there was only one suspect in this case who else
would want this sweet young lady murdered decades later the prime suspect arrested but a witness changes
everything I kept the secret for 30 years 48 hours Saturday at 109 Central on [Music]
CBS for anyone who knows Carmen there's just a magic to her she was going through
this transition ending her marriage there was just no question that we were meant to spend the rest of our lives
together hadn't heard from her that day um left a couple messages hey darling how you doing me and um really concerned
I am that couple of messages were in please give me a call just to this you know you're okay got panicky it just I
knew something just wasn't right and finally called the um police there was quite a struggle a heck
of a fight had gone on in that room furniture was turned over potted plants were knocked over uh there was blood
everywhere ceiling walls carpet was Blood Stained everywhere I think it was fairly clear to that a murder had
occurred I knew from the time I had children that the worst thing that would ever happen that could ever happened to
me would be to lose a child and in this case she was just ripped out of our Lives somebody had to have a motive for
this to happen I only know one person that had anything to gain Tom my ex-son-in-law an English Professor but
he he couldn't do that he doesn't have the guts I told Mr Murray that his ex-wife Carmen had died and that we
needed to speak to him about that in me you have not just a likely uh suspect but a convenient one why didn't you just
arrest him then and there we couldn't prove that he had done it if this scenario falls apart you're very well
back to square War we didn't have a lot of physical evidence we never found any bloody clothing we never found a murder
weapon we were going to have a tough road ahead of us I began to think about all the things
that I did wrong I didn't spend enough time with her I didn't call her often enough the fact that someone took her
life away it was important to me that there would be some justice this crime will be solved I'll spend every damn
penny I've got a mind for [Music] [Music] [Music] murder [Music] you don't meet many people in your life
like my daughter so caring about everybody and almost everything when they talk about Carmen
the oldest of their four daughters that's K Danny and Judy Ross are never at a loss for words she's bubbly she's
fun to be around she makes the room warm she's the sunshine Judy even put together a list of words that come to
her mind when she thinks of kmen brilliant empathetic thoughtful spiritual patient political loving
peaceful delightful silly playful Courageous full of life daughter of our [Music]
youth and Carmen's 1985 wedding to her sweetheart Tom Murray was one of the best days Dany and Judy ever had
beautiful absolutely beautiful both of them wrote their wedding vows I stood there and cried through the whole thing
was your husband the only one crying that day no there were some others that was a happy day
absolutely Carmen met Tom at Ohio State University but it wasn't a typical College romance she was a junior he was
her English Professor I was hesitant because I didn't know why a professor would be interested in one of his
students and is he married and how do you know mhm these are questions I've heard parents ask in the past well sure
absolutely sure absolutely Tom Murray was only 27 a firste professor and once she met him Judy was impressed he was
very easy to talk to very proper good manners you know everything did you like him absolutely did you love him
absolutely absolutely Carmen's three little sisters Samantha Heather and April who never had a
brother were delighted to At Last have a brother-in-law it was family he was we hang out we'd have Thanksgiving and
Christmas dinner and laugh and tell stories right after they got married they came over every Sunday after church
and we had Sunday dinner together he was attending church with us he didn't drink
excessively he didn't smoke he exercised this is something that the two of us uh
created together he was polite all the time around everyone two out of three children w nestled each snug in her bed
Heather had fallen asleep on the stairway again and April had to be gagged tied and bodily carried up to her
room and I said Tom you're too good to be true in 1988 after Carmen graduated from
law school the couple moved to Manhattan Kansas where Tom took a job teaching Linguistics at Kansas State University
his colleague Lyman Baker says Murray made an immediate impression a very gentle guy he had a very sharp mind
personable reasonable good listener serious did his work you know I always got the impression from people that they
really appreciated having a man like that to work with and despite the fact that his specialty Linguistics can be a
little tedious Tom Murray managed to make it almost exciting he was a great teacher there seemed to be something
very gentle and at the same time very endearing and caring never came with any notes or anything he would just come in
sit on the desk just like we are and deliver his lesson and I thought that was pretty pretty you know admirable
because he knew everything about the subject but while Tom Murray was on the academic FastTrack Carmen was struggling
to find her place in the world she gave up law after just a few years and instead hoping to change people's lives
in less confrontational ways she became a mediator she would always say she was a recovering attorney and um she wanted
to help people though so she decided to mediate cuz she thought she could help them come to you know a solution without
having to go through all that but Tom and Carmen were searching for a solution to their own problem they could not
decide whether to have a child when they first got married they were going to have children Tom wanted a bunch then
they were married for 13 years and now Tom doesn't want any children and she's now changed careers and now she wants
children in 1998 despite the disagreement Carmen became pregnant and that December she gave birth to a
daughter Kiara he was angry I think with Carmen being pregnant and never treated
her the same after that I think he punished her Carmen stopped working she loved being a mother but felt she was
Raising Kiara alone and Tom's indifference to the baby LED car to question other parts of her life she
felt as if she was living a life that just didn't fit very well with how she felt about things and how she believed
Angela Hayes Carmen's best friend it sounds cliche but she wanted so much to help people and she felt as if she
wasn't able to do that in the way that her life was playing out Carmen was about to make a momentous decision when
Kiara was still a toddler Carmen changed careers again and became a Healer she was in an apprentice program where she
was physically doing treatment of people in the local area and a lot of people made fun of it because they didn't
understand it perhaps even her husband Carmen was practicing congr a spiritual approach to medicine that claims to
teach the body to heal itself in September 2002 she went to a consr conference in Witchita and that's where
she met Larry Lima she came home and said have you ever looked into somebody's eyes and just felt like you
know you were soulmates just like that the conventional thinking is that's the way you're supposed to feel about your
husband true and I think she did up until maybe that day how did she changed when she met Larry Lima she was kmen
again smiled and she had the sparkle back in her eyes she was like almost too happy like why are you this happy I mean
Larry Lima was a social worker living in San Diego shortly after they met the couple began an affair are you upset
about the relationship that she was in it bothered me it hurt me because she was acting in ways that uh a lot of
people in the world act that who don't have respect for their spouse and just are out living for their own
self-gratification but after Years of Living what Carmen considered an unfulfilled life her friends thought
change was good for her she was extremely happy and not only had I never seen her that happy I've never seen
anybody that happy she felt that her life was unfolding as she'd always wanted her life to be and it wasn't long
before Carmen decided she wanted to divorce Tom Murray she tried to get him to go to counsel she tried to make it
work and she eventually just said it isn't going to work but the trouble was only just beginning because Carmen had
not only decided to leave Tom she decided to take their daughter with her how does a peaceloving mediator type
person react to a nasty custody battle she described it to us that her mama bear claws are going to have to come
out [Music] this is like the morning light and a very dark night Larry Lima still
remembers the first time Carmen Ross caught his eye we met at a workshop in Witchita Kansas and she had this plate
and uh I walked by and she you know just very kindly asked if I wanted a piece of
watermelon and I grabbed a watermelon seed and ate it and walked away she just kind of raised her eyebrows and said
afterwards that she knew you know that that was the moment Larry lives in San Diego and by
the fall of 2002 Carmen was flying to see him as often as possible she confided to Larry that her marriage to
Tom Murray was ending something had kind of died inside she had worked very hard
and been unhappy for a very very long time in her marriage in her marriage yeah in June 2003 after muray grudgingly
agreed to divorce Carmen she began making plans to move to California but even though Tom Murray didn't want
children at first he now was not about to let go of their daughter Kiara we had hoped to work out you know some sort of
an agreement that uh would be best for Kiara to go back and forth and just clearly wasn't going to be feasible did
she want him in her life absolutely in k his life absolutely so did I and I know
how important it is for a child to be with both parents as much as possible so Carmen left Manhattan and moved here to
Lawrence Kansas about 90 minutes away from Tom Larry Lio is now planning to move here and join her Carmen and Tom
were temporarily sharing custody of Kiara but working with a mediator to negotiate a permanent settlement Carmen
was determined to work things out she didn't want to hurt him him even though she was leaving him she still wanted she
wanted to be friends with him she really believed that in some point in time they
would become friends again but while Carmen was trying to bridge their differences Tom was busy Burning Bridges
clearly he was angry and certainly sent emails and phone calls that upset her were you surprised that he was putting
up such a fight on the custody issue oh no no no CU that's all he has left but also he wanted to win he's a winner but
this time Carmen was determined to win on November 11th 2003 she arrived at the mediation session and put her foot down
she told Tom that she wanted K to live with her and then I was moving there and how was she emotionally at that point I
think that in the midst of feeling anxious and and a bit afraid that there was also a
sense of relief because she had done it she had done it yeah but she was clearly
satined and afraid of how it was going to turn out by the next night when Larry called from San Diego Carmen was feeling
better we spoke for hours at Wednesday night and I thought um that she was in a fairly good place I mean um that we were
going to get through this as it turned out that was the last conversation they ever had they didn't hear from her that
next morning I uh I knew something was wrong on Friday afternoon Larry frantically called the Douglas County
Sheriff's Department detective Doug Woods went to carman's house to investigate and when he got there it was
almost too much even for him Blood on the floor Blood on the walls Blood on the ceiling Furniture had been turned
over potted plants and stuff were broken against the fireplace there was a great
degree of brutality I think that went on in this house and in the middle of the room Carmen Ross lay dead beaten and
stabbed to death at the age of 40 I remember sensing that um this this is just not
true Carmen's house was now a crime scene one that promised a wealth of physical evidence as crime- scene
investigators combed the house for Clues detective Woods drove to Manhattan to tell Tom Murray his ex-wife was dead Mr
Murray came to the door opened the door I told Mr Murray that his ex-wife Carmen
had died and that we needed to speak to him about that what did he say Mr Murray
asked me if we had to do it right now he said do we have to do this now and you said I said it would be best if we could
do this right now so Murray agreed to go with Woods to a nearby police station did you have to convince him to talk no
sir to the extent that I'm helping in your solving the case I'm tickled the death to participate he was free to go
but I'm not holding you here against your will no okay you're here of your own free will and you're agreeing to
stay you don't have to keep ring you haven't been mean to me and you're not holding me against my in fact it turned
out the professor couldn't stop talking well let me ask you this he sat with Detective woods and others from 8:30
that night until 6:00 the next morning without a lawyer when this interrogation began all you had said to to Professor
Murray is that his ex-wife had died yes sir did he want to know what had happened he never asked me how she died
if I were you I'd be looking at me I think you should so in my mind then tell me what a great guy you are why I
shouldn't be pointing the finger at you a little bit right now oh you don't know
me um I'm sort of the original Boy Scout I mean I've always been the straightest
arrow in the quiver he could explain away everything that we would bring at him I think he thought he was smarter
than we were I had bought a fresh pineapple and was cutting it apart and sliced into my sliced into my hand
there Murray's right hand had small cuts and both his wrists were bruised I mean
they all happened in the last two or three days and Murray vehemently denied killing Carmen I never wanted Carmen
dead I wanted her reasonable you have some kind of strategy in mind when you're talking to him basically locking
him into his story then we can start disproving some of the things he says Mr Murray however though would change his
story periodically you're going to look at this with a raised eyebrow I did go out and drive around a bit but I did not
drive to Lawrence I didn't tell you that before it was a cat and mouse game will
you be here sort of looking over my shoulder to leave you alone that went on all night long there's no such thing as
the Perfect Crime you're going to get caught the bad guy always gets caught but if Murray was the bad guy he wasn't
getting caught tonight so at this point you don't have compelling evidence you're not going to you're not going to
Tom get us to sit here and tell you about our case okay I don't want you tell me about the case but I'm
concluding that because if you had compelling evidence wouldn't you just go ahead and arrest
me at 6:00 a.m. Tom Murray went home I was upset with myself because I didn't push the right button or say ask the
right questions or go in the right direction to get him to confess Murray talked so much he was now their number
one suspect but police had nothing against him I really don't know why I got these except a lot of talk they
waited for evidence from the crime scene and finally found nothing we never found
any bloody clothing we never found a murder weapon it just didn't exist Tom Murray continued to teach and to raise
Kiara over the following months Danny Ross feared the murder would never be solved though he was growing suspicious
of the son-in-law he once loved how do you come to terms with that don't have an answer for that because if I had
thought he had actually killed my daughter I would have hurt him right then [Music]
badly nearly 1 year after Carmen Ross was murdered in November 2003 we'd run the gamut of this case it we weren't
going to find any more evidence police still had not arrested anyone then in October 2004 detectives
Doug Woods Pat Pollock and Lyall hagenbush decided they would have to take a chance on a circumstantial case
they arrested their number one suspect Professor Tom Murray I thought we had a good case not great not great
um because we didn't have a lot of physical evidence it was very hard for Carmen's sisters
Samantha Heather and April to believe the charges you don't want somebody that you loved that you gave Christmas
presents to that you hugged and said you loved you don't want them to be the person who could have done
that things were about to get tougher for the Rosses just three months before Murray's trial began the district
attorney and Lawrence was voted out of office leaving this case in the hands of Angela Wilson and assist assistant DA
trouble was she'd never prosecuted a murder before I've handled a number of rape cases in attempted murder case but
this is by far the most involved but Kansas has an unusual law that allows victims to pay for a special
prosecutor to help the District Attorney's office so the Ross family hired Tom bath a noted defense attorney
to be part of the prosecution team I'm assistant counsel which means it's really up to them to decide what role if
any I have in this case they've allowed me to be a full team member Murray has hired two of the
state's best attorneys Pedro irigaray and Bob I I think our best card is the evidence or the lack
thereof morning Danny how you doing in February 2005 the Rosses came to Lawrence determined to win two things
all right a guilty verdict this the state of Kansas versus Thomas E Murray 2004 and custody of Carmen and Tom's
daughter Kara who' been living with them since Tom's arrest on November 13th of 2003 Thomas Murray a precise articulate
college professor bludgeoned his former wife to death in the living room of her home as Angela Wilson Begins the biggest
trial of her career she's a little nervous a few months before Carmen's death she moved into her own apartment
in man apartment in Manhattan that afternoon at 12:15 excuse me at 12:45 and it would be nearly 24 hours or over
24 hours before anybody would know she was dead thank you your honor defense attorney Bob I is eager to exploit the
weaknesses of Angela Wilson's case all they had was a hunch and a hunch is all they have
today it's an emotional day for everyone this is a photograph of Carmen when she
was alive she was the person even for the normally stoic Tom Murray after investigating for more than
a year the best piece of evidence against Murray is still the first piece his 10-hour videotaped interview with
the police I'm going to go ahead and step out these folks from douas County will go ahead investigators asked muray
about the day of Carmen's murder and Thursday morning did you drive to Lawrence no and I drove home and I agre
to my midterms Murray was seen at 8:30 a.m. when he dropped his daughter off at the babysitters and again around noon
when he got her back no one saw him in between and detectives believe that's when he drove 90 mies to Lawrence to
kill kmen in my mind I can't get there in back inside of the time I have available but detective Lyall hagenbush
says Murray Could Hagen Bush knows because he did it we were able to show that Tom Murray could drive from
Manhattan to Lawrence and have uh plenty of time to kill Carmen Ross and return to
Manhattan detectives don't think it would have taken long for Murray to kill Carmen they think he beat her first then
stabbed Carmen with a knife he got from her kitchen I didn't do it I mean I'll sit here and say this until I'm blue in
the face you can shoot to believe me or not all I can do is tell you the truth there are times when Murray
appears genuinely upset and times when he's not you are a very skilled interviewer Pat you've been
trained very well you to Doug I mean you're good at what you guys do you knew during the time that when the defense
finally gets a chance to speak Pedro irigaray says even though it lasted almost 10 hours Tom Murray's statement
proves nothing have you found one bit of conclusive proof that Mr Murray was at Carmen Ross's house on the 13th of
November I'm not aware of any in fact the state's own forensic experts who prosecutors hope will link
Murray to the crime actually helped the defense team make its case there were 54
or 55 samples tested from Miss Ross's home and in none of those Mr Murray's DNA was found correct correct there's no
DNA and there's only one fingerprint matching Tom Murray the only fingerprint that was found of Thomas Murray's was on
a brown dropper bottle yes and no prints of his were found anywhere else that is
correct it is true is it not then the defense says the evidence suggests there was was more than one person at the
crime scene police found what looked like two bloody shoe prints neither of those two shoe
prints matched anything to your knowledge belonging to Mr Murray that's correct no further
questions faced with a lack of forensic evidence the prosecution argues Murray is the only person with a motive to kill
Carmen they believe he exploded after a mediation session just 2 days before the
murder it was apparent to her that they were going to have to go into a custody battle and prosecutors say Tom Murray
had another motive the oldest one in the book jealousy because Carmen's fiance Larry Lima was about to move to Lawrence
were you in love with her passionately when were you planning to move to Lawrence first part of
December you familiar with that exhibit can you point for the jury the location where
you would have gone into the house as the state methodically Works through four weeks of testimony he seemed
disheveled he seemed tired the trial is long were you able to determine the number of stab wounds here in this neck
area that would be 13 and at times difficult this is a tear of the tissue that's been caused by Crush of the
tissue between a hard object and the bone underneath it's a numb feeling because
as I sat there and I saw the all the pictures it makes me think thoughts that I don't think a human being should have
to [Music] think prosecutors say Murray carefully planned Carmen's murder and cleaned up
afterwards and they're about to present some startling evidence explaining how an English Professor could possibly know
so much about murder these are the computers that were taken from Mr Murray the search term was how to murder
someone and not get [Music] [Music] caught after weeks of testimony Professor Thomas Murray's attorneys say things are
going their way the physical evidence that they've presented it has by and large shown exactly what we thought it
would and that is that Tom Murray was not at the scene of this crime that's just what Danny Ross is worried about if
in fact the worst case happens and he is acquitted then the jury is going to put
him back with my granddaughter yes three generations of Rosses from five different states have moved to Lawrence
Kansas hand me the remote for the duration of the trial detectives were unable to find any evidence during but
the routine is becoming a grind it's really hard to set there patiently and let them do their job and it concerns me
is he going to get the justice that he really deserves there's good reason for the Rosses to be nervous and I think
kmen that is line the prosecutors started out strongly playing Tom Murray's revealing police interview all
right but now assistant DA Angela Wilson is having a tough time trying her first
murder what was the quantity of blood involved in that case objection you're H this that's not relevant on a case of
this magnitude it has been overwhelming at times questions about webites but things are starting to look up for the
prosecution and the Rosses the jury is about to hear the most powerful forensic evidence yet and it's got nothing to do
with blood or DNA have you ever gotten on the internet and looked up any websites that
have to do with crime scenes or polygraphs oh I got under the CSI website occasionally have fantasies
about trying to make it as a uh freelance writer investigators could not have imagined what they discover When
They confiscated Murray's computers it turns out the Professor was not just researching Linguistics although there
is a word for the kind of searches he was doing online suspicious maybe even damning Robert Dean Brown Dean Brown is
a forensic computer expert is this he dug around in the recesses of Murray's computers 11:25 a.m. the search for on
Yahoo quotes murder For Hire just a few seconds later is there another search done yes ma'am there's a search for how
to hire an assassin did you find anything shortly more than an hour later and there was a search for how to make a
bomb it's beginning to sound like a prosecutor's dream it shows Yahoo search for how to murder someone and not get
caught investigators were thrilled with the secrets Murray's computers revealed especially when they learned the
searches were conducted just as the custody battle Tom and car were having was getting nasty when you have somebody
searching numerous times for this kind of topic and then somebody winds up dead it's kind of a clue me you're
hoping in part to to hoist this guy on his own hard drive sure yes can you do it the evidence is there but the defense
has an explanation the next page shows a site visit on the 10th of November is something called twiz
tv.com script CSI Mr Murray was interested in the possibility of writing an episode for a
CSI type program is your best explanation of these internet searches that they're just an unfortunate
coincidence what would you like for us to do invent something I mean a trial lawyer works with what he or she has to
work with the computers offer up more bad news for Professor Murray emails that show his anger with
Carmen was growing and even more pissed at her for beginning an intimate relationship with
another man and even more pissed at her for continuing that relationship through
all the months that she and I were supposed to be making an effort at working things out but I can't just sit
back and have my daughter taken away from me I'm increasing ly coming to feel like an animal that's being backed into
a corner state is resting the prosecution rests Tom Murray's defense will make three main points first a custody
attorney told Murray he had no reason to fear that Carmen would take Kiara away if one parent wants to leave the state
of Kansas fine but they don't take the child with them next the defense argues even though Murray expressed his anger
in emails he was still committed to working with Carmen and that's according to the mediator herself Nancy Hughes
they worked well together it was pretty clear that they were trying to support each other in doing in taking care of
their daughter and finally the defense argues not only is there no evidence Professor Murray was even at the crime
scene there is a mystery blood stain on Carmen's sink suggesting someone else was at Carmen's house
defense expert Robert Trestle would you please describe for the jury what that stain represents to you what we call a
pattern blood stain transfer do you have an opinion as to what could have caused
that particular stain on that pedestal sink my impression is this is a tenant shoe print if it is a shoe print the
defense says it's not Murray's can we get copies of your notes please but Angela Wilson has hit her stride and
hits back attacking the experts expertise you don't have any certifications in the area of blood
stain analysis do you certifications I'm sorry sir but that's a question that just requires a yes or no answer so if
you could please answer my question the one that I'm asking you don't have any certifications in the area of blood
stain pattern analysis do you no I do not I felt I could see Angela just get a little more confident as the trial went
along I think she did a superb job look at the knife look at the edge and she saved a
little drama for her closing argument this is a person who was bent on murder 13
times he slammed that knife into her neck ladies and gentlemen Tom Murray never takes the stand the defense pins
its hopes on Reasonable Doubt and they argue there is plenty of it let's go back to the crime scene there's none of
his blood there none of his fingerprints none of his Footprints no one sees his car there no one nor any
scientific test can put Tom Murray on that house on the 13th for the Ross family this is now one
of the hardest parts of the trial waiting for the jury to decide died I recognize that the jury could find him
innocent and if he is found innocent then my heart will be broken again because we'll have to give our
granddaughter to [Music] him I'm past being hurt I'm just very angry at what this man did to my
daughter it's been nearly a year and a half since Danny Ross's daughter Carmen was murdered he has now taken her away
from us so I'd never get a chance to hug her ever again there's no doubt in the Ross's
Minds about who killed Carmen but the fate of the accused murderer her ex-husband Tom Murray now rests with the
jury it's putting the case in the hands of 12 people that don't know everything that we know they get to make the
decision and that's that's very tough I have looked over at him still sitting there and I watch him and I'm like I
loved you there's no wiggle room for the jurors they either have to convict Maria
of first-degree murder or set him free everything is on the table as we speak right over there Murray's attorneys
repeatedly argued that but Murray's life is not the only one at stake Ross and Murray shared custody of if he's
acquitted the Rosses would have to give him Kiara the daughter he had with Carmen it's the worst case scenario the
Rosses hope they'll never face my daughter was killed and we can't bring her back but having my granddaughter raised
in a proper environment is what my daughter would have wanted and that's the most important thing to our family
all rise do you somly swear the testimony you're about to give it took five weeks to present all the evidence
and the jury is taking its time going through it all I believe he's guilty and I believe he's going to be found guilty
after 3 days of deliberations there's a vert ICT it is St Patrick's Day and the professor appears relaxed reading a book
on the Polish language even as he waits for the jury to come back all right state of Kansas versus Thomas E Murray
verdict we the jury find the defendant Thomas E Murray guilty of murder in the first
degree Murray is one of the few people in the courtroom who contains himself Carmen's family is
overwhelmed you've gotten the outcome that you wanted what does Justice feel like thank
God for so long it has been all about this process coming to an end today this imagining this day and that we have
Kiara she's safe now I can really mourn for Carmen it is also an emotional victory
for the prosecutors especially Angela Wilson who began this trial as a rookie against seasoned defense attorneys and
won big I think this is the the first time I've ever seen a prosecutor cry at of
her when it was a good one yeah there was just so much emotion around this case and around the family and it has
been very good to be included in the family fold I think I joked early on that I was an honorary Ross girl
Carmen's family and her fiance say have the verdict they want and they know it's
now time to move on I'm convinced that this is a domestic violence related homicide Larry remembers Carmen by
volunteering with domestic violence victims at the Family Justice Center in San Diego every victim that comes in
here it's like okay Garmin you know how do we how do we go about making this person's life a little less
traumatic it will be a little harder for the the Rosses who once considered Murray a son and a
brother this guy was part of your life absolutely and it is a very con it's a very confusing conflicting
feeling because I have no doubt that it were his hands that hurt her but I don't know what happened to
his head to come to realize that someone that you love took away someone that you
love how how am I supposed to explain that to my kidss when I don't get it and his
[Music] daughter there'll be no explanations from Tom Murray who remained defiant at
his sentencing I remain nonplused that the jury believed the prosecution's fairy
tale of my involvement in Carmen Ross's death he insisted he was innocent and refused to
apologize I have never raised my hand in Anger against anyone not ever much less against the woman with
whom I created a child and in a rare display of emotion dear Kiara he saved his last
words for his daughter since I can't be with you I'm very glad you're able to live with people love you so
much Kara who is now nine lives with the Rosses at home in Indiana I asked her I said are you
worried about who's going to take care of you and she looked at me like this and she said no I'm glad I have my
family to take care of me and she's got an entire family that adors her and would do anything for her and we'll take
care of her together we will take care of her [Music] go [Music]

"48 Hours" brings you stories of crimes uncovered through trails of evidence. Binge-watch the full episodes, including "A Student of Murder," "The Murder of Jackie Vandagriff" and "A Mind For Murder."

00:00 A Student of Murder 40:50 The Murder of Jackie Vandagriff 1:23:40 A Mind For Murder

Crime. Social justice. Impact. "48 Hours" investigates the most intriguing crime and justice cases that touch on all areas of the human experience including greed and passion. "48 Hours," which premiered in 1988, has developed a rich history of original reporting and impact journalism that has helped exonerate wrongly convicted people, caused cold cases to be reopened and solved, and along the way changed lives.

For video licensing inquiries, contact: licensing@veritone.com

Brief Summary

Yancy Null was murdered in 2012; D. Bowman was convicted for the crime after a complex investigation and trial.

Key points

The Search for the Killer. Police launched a massive manhunt for Yancy's killer, fearing he could strike again.
The Unlikely Suspect. D. Bowman, a brilliant engineer, emerges as a suspect in Yancy's murder, shocking everyone.
Den Bowman's Guilty Verdict. The jury finds Den Bowman guilty of first-degree murder after a tense trial.
Heartbreaking Sentencing. Den Bowman's mother offers to take his punishment, showcasing a mother's love.
Caitlyn's Fear. Caitlyn hides in her friend's closet, terrified of her stalker, Bryant.
Bryant's Arrest. After multiple arrests, Bryant's behavior escalates, leading to serious legal consequences.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

It was like a bomb had dropped.

A prosecutor describes the impact of Yancy's murder.

4:00WatchMar 9, 2024

Tension

75/ 100High tension

More from 48 Hours

Solve the Crime

Read a real case one clue at a time, then see how your call held up against the investigators.