Kill or capture? That is the question | Forensic Files

[Music] The interesting question for people to ask themselves is just as we were
talking about this Senate Intelligence Committee report on interrogation techniques and torture, if you will. The
question people need to ask themselves is 10 years from now, will people be asking them the same questions about the
use of these drones? They are lethal man-made birds of prey. When you can stare at a target
unblinkingly for hours, if not days, and then use a weapon against that target that has a 14lb warhead in it, and with
an accuracy measured in inches, this actually makes warfare more precise. And that should be a good, that's the
correct geometry. Give me 10 seconds. Roger. Yeah, direct hits right there. Now, the
dark side. You know, you can't be perfect. There is collateral damage. We We feed the jihadi
recruitment video that these Americans are heartless killers. The most controversial target in the
history of drone warfare is about to enter the CIA's crosshairs. To the American people, I say your security
will continue to be threatened as long as your government continues with its aggression against the Muslim people. He
is Anoir Elaki, a sworn enemy of the United States and an American citizen. He was born in the
US and was someone who was using social media in order to convey a message about
jihad and doing it very effectively and was someone who had gone to Yemen. There
was no question in my mind that he was extremely dangerous and somebody that we had to go after. As you send us your
bombs, we will send you ours. The charismatic cleric conspires with the so-called underwear bomber in a failed
plot to blow up an airliner over Detroit on Christmas Day 2009. And he inspires the jihadist militant who kills 13 and
injures more than 30 in a shooting spree at Fort Hood, Texas. And I was asking, "What were we interested in Locky
about?" Well, somebody said, "Well, he he's a bad guy. He's on the president's list." I wait. What list is that? Well,
the the goodbye list. The goodbye list, also known as the kill list. It's the grim roster of terrorists targeted for
execution by the US government. I for one was born in the US and lived in the US for 21 years. We went through the
process to make a case for why Alaki was dangerous. and uh the justice department
along with uh our general counsel and counsel out of the White House felt that a good case had been made to put him on
that list. [Music] September 30th, 2011, David Petraeus is now in charge when CIA drone pilots in Nevada draw a
bead on Elaki in Yemen. They have been watching him for days. Come back on those guys. Here we go. I think you
always do soulsearching when you're putting individuals in harm's way. You turn these over in your mind and uh
there are occasions where you say, "Let me mull this one. Let me think on it." Uh but if you ensure that you're within
the rules of engagement, um then uh you press forward and and and make a decision.
Moments later, Anoir Elaki is dead. Alaki was the leader of external operations for al-Qaeda in the I believe
that that the consequences of allowing the precedent of an American president being
able to kill an American citizen under any circumstances on just his signature is dangerous.
Anoir L. Awaki was just one man, but the CIA's drones have killed scores, perhaps
hundreds, whose names are unknown. Any personel around you see What about um the the so-called
signature strikes? I I can't talk about signature strikes, if they are even taken. I don't know what they are. I
don't believe these directors are talking about this stuff. I'm not talking about him. You have
every reason to believe that there are bad guys there at the moment. You don't quite know the name of the bad guy, but
you know the van. You know the weaponry. You know the size of the group. You know
what kind of meetings have been held there before. You know the other vehicle that pulled
up and you make a decision. My worry is that there are too many of what we would
call signature strikes which are at a group of suspected terrorists where the evidence may not be that clear of
specifically what is going on and more people clear to engage all I think this administration prefers killing the
prisoners rather than holding them captive and the reason I think is because it's hard it's hard to capture
uh It's it's hard work and many would consider it dirty business. They're killing a lot of people with let's say
drone strikes that would better be captured and interrogated. Then we would might have a chance of learning what the
terrorist group is going to do next. You can't question somebody you've killed. So in other words, the CIA is just we're
taking no prisoners. I don't know that that's the CIA's uh position. I think that's the president's
position. I I think he is killing more people than he needs to and we'd be better off
capturing some of them and interrogating them. Now look, it's hard, right? And anybody who makes these kinds of
decisions going to lose some sleep, but you'd also lose sleep if you failed to make these decisions and bad things
happen to Americans.

Until now, the CIA has never acknowledged that it operates lethal drones. But in "The Spymasters: CIA in the Crosshairs," the directors go off script, debating the efficacy and ethics of the classified drone warfare. For the first time ever, hear from 12 living CIA directors, Saturday, May 21, 9-11 p.m. ET/PT on CBS.

Brief Summary

The episode examines drone warfare ethics, the CIA's kill list, and Anwar al-Awlaki's targeting as a U.S. citizen involved in terrorism.

Key points

The Dark Side of Drone Warfare. Exploring the collateral damage and moral implications of drone strikes.
The Goodbye List. Unveiling the controversial 'kill list' of targeted individuals by the US government.
The Death of Anoir Elaki. The CIA's decision to target and kill an American citizen raises ethical questions.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

You know, you can't be perfect. There is collateral damage.

Discussing the implications of drone warfare.

1:02WatchMay 17, 2016

Tension

65/ 100Some tension

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