Insanesville ////// 268 | Forensic Files

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Zanesville, Ohio. A little before 5:00 p.m. on October 18th, 2011, Sam Copeck walked to the paddock behind
his home to attend to the horse he bought 9 days earlier. The horse was acting skittish and moved
toward the far corner of the field. On the other side of the fence separating them from his neighbor, Terry
Thompson's property, Copeck noticed Thompson's horses seemed very agitated. They were running in a circle and in the
center there was some kind of dark shape. Only when the shape broke out of the circle could Copeck see it was a black
bear. The bear was small and ran away from Copeck. Copeck planned to put his horse in the
barn and go back inside his home. He walked over to his horse and started guiding the animal to the barn when
something caught his eye. Just on the other side of the fence and staring right at them was a fully grown
African lion. Kopechne continued with his horse to the barn, even though the lion could easily
clear the fence separating them, it just sat there watching him and the horse as
they hurriedly walked toward the barn. Sam Kopechne and the horse made their way inside and Sam locked the doors
behind them. Once there, Sam grabbed the phone and called his home where he knew his
84-year-old mother was sitting watching TV. She picked up the phone and Sam explained what he saw.
Mrs. Kopechne telephoned the home of Terry Thompson, her neighbor, but no one answered.
Inside the barn, Sam Kopechne kept a watchful eye on the events just outside. To his astonishment, he spotted a tiger.
The tiger spotted the horses and quickly went after them. With no one answering the phone at the
Thompson's house, Mrs. Kopechne called 911. The emergency dispatcher picked up. Mrs. Kopechne said, "Yes, this is
Delores Kopechne on Kopechne Road. We live next to Terry Thompson and there's a bear and a lion out."
The dispatcher questioned further, "There's a bear and a lion out?" Mrs. Kopechne replied, "Yeah, right up
behind us." That would be the call that set the whole town on edge for with that 911
call, postal delivery was suspended and the Zanesville City Schools were closed and thus began
the search for lions, tigers, and bears. Deputy John Mary was serving a court summons a couple miles away when the
call came through about large and dangerous animals in the area of the Thompson and Kopchak properties.
He responded immediately arriving a short time later. There he could see just inside Thompson's fence a tiger, a
black bear, and two lions. While he was waiting for Mrs. Kopchak to answer the door, he saw a large gray
wolf running southward along the road. He ran to his patrol car and followed the wolf.
After following the animal for a while, the wolf veered from the road and started running toward a house. The
officer pulled over abruptly, parked the cruiser, and popped the trunk. Keeping his eyes on the wolf, Officer Mary
retrieved a rifle from the trunk and set out on foot following the animal. Along
the way he called in each observation and action to police dispatch. Do you understand how big a wolf is,
right? Well, yeah. I mean, they're It's not like he's tracking a big dog. This is like
a dog times a hundred. Yeah, it's not not like a coyote like you're picturing in your mind right now.
Picture that but times it by about three cuz they're giant. So, he's keeping his eye on this animal.
He's got the rifle now that he got from the trunk of his car. And he's following
this wolf on foot. And he said he was about 80 yards away when an order came over the radio to put
the animal down. Officer Mary fired a single shot and dropped his target. After the wolf went
down, Mary fired a few more times to make sure the animal was dead. He was inspecting the body when a call came
over the radio. Some officers cornered a lion near Thompson's residence, so he hurried back. Mary drove up the hill and
stopped near the Thompson's driveway. There he saw a black bear. Officer Mary got out of his cruiser and facing him
and running straight toward him was the bear. Armed with only his standard issue
weapon, the officer fired a single shot before the charging bear could reach him.
Just in a short time, officers saw several lions, at least one tiger, a cougar, a black bear, and a grizzly. The
officers were ordered to patrol the borders of the Thompson's property. So, he's ordered to take down the wolf,
but as far as patrolling the property, were they told to also take down anything that they saw at the time?
Yeah, I believe that anything that they spotted, you know, they wanted them to basically
form a perimeter around this property. And if any of these animals are trying to leave the property, their orders were
to shoot to kill. Mhm. Um so, here's the situation, Captain. We have the Thompson's property.
He was known, Terry Thompson was known to have exotic animals. And so, this wasn't like something that
was unknown to the sheriff's department or to the local police. They knew about this. The problem here is these animals
are loose. They believe they're coming from Thompson's property. And when they get to the property, they can see lions,
cougars, multiple bears. Oh my. And the question here is how many of these animals does he have?
And how many of them are loose and why are they loose? Right, because this isn't this is a
private property. This isn't like a zoo where a bunch of locals have gone through and said, "Hey, I've been there
before. We know that there's 40 animals or 100 animals." Nobody knows how many animals there are.
At 5:35 p.m., the man in charge, Sheriff Matt Lutz, arrived on the scene. In the 15 minutes that it took him to
get there, the reports over the radio escalated. The seriousness became very clear. There were several large and
dangerous animals on the loose. Now, in the immediate area surrounding the Thompson property, there's an apartment
building, soccer fields, and Interstate 70. No one seemed to know where property
owner Terry Thompson was or what was really going on. Sergeant Steve Blake decided he should drive up to Thompson's
house. So, we know that there's animals all over this property and this guy decides,
"Hey, I'm going to drive up to the house." Mhm. And who cares if there's lions there or
tigers there? Yeah, they need to locate Terry Thompson and they need to speak with him to
figure out what's going on. I mean, it takes somebody with some big cojones Yeah.
to do that. Or or a lot of uh he trusts his vehicle. You know what I mean? Like, he's like
Who cares about the vehicle? You have to still get out of the car and go to the door.
Well, as he neared the farm buildings, he saw more animals. Uh their cages had either been cut through or left open.
Mhm. The officer honked the horn several times, but no one came out of Thompson's
house. Back near the road, John Moore arrived. Moore worked on the Thompson property for Terry and took care of the
land and fed Thompson's exotic animals. John Moore went with Officer Blake back up to the Thompson house. Along the way,
they saw nothing. When they arrived near the home, Moore pointed out some cages. The cages
contained two monkeys and a dog. Still no sign of Terry Thompson. They turned around, but before they could reach the
road, they spotted a large white tiger near the barn. Mhm. At the tiger's paws, there was a
lifeless human body and the tiger appeared to be eating it. Okay, so Eating the body.
Eating the body. The human body. Mhm. Mhm. So, this is a crazy scene, right? I mean, we've talked about a lot of
strange scenes uh throughout the years on this show. Some would say it's a typical Thursday.
This has got to be one of the craziest scenes that we've ever discussed. And And we've we've often spoke about how
easy it is for armchair detectives or people watching TV at home to go, "Well, why did the police do this? Or why
didn't they do that?" And we've always tried to remind everyone that often they don't know what they're walking into
when they arrive on a scene. Sometimes they get a domestic call. Or sometimes they get a call about, you know,
a strange vehicle somewhere. Mhm. And they arrive and they don't know what's going on.
Or two drunk guys in a garage doing a podcast. The thing here is they at least get the
call that there's a a lion and a bear out wandering around. But when they get to the scene, they're spotting all kinds
of animals now. Mhm. Since the law enforcement could not get in touch with Terry Thompson, and it was
likely his body they spotted near the barn, they needed to get some intel from Mr. John Moore. So, they did an
impromptu interview with Moore and Moore's fiance at the foot of Thompson's driveway.
After some back and forth, they determined that there were 56 animals on the property. I'm unclear, Captain, if
this includes the two monkeys and the dog found in the cages near the home or if this is from another portion of this
very large property. Mhm. Meanwhile, the authorities phoned the Columbus Zoo. The Columbus Zoo is is
pretty well-known. I mean, it's nationally known. Opened up in 1927, the Columbus Zoo is considered to be one of
maybe even the number one zoo in the United States. It is. I mean, sometimes it goes falls to number two,
but when I rank all the zoos, it's the best. There you go. The The nonprofit Columbus
Zoo houses thousands of animals and hundreds of different species from all over the world. The zoo is about 40 mi
away from the Thompson property. The zoo's chief operating officer was alerted by a staff member who told him,
"We have to go to Terry Thompson's. The animals are out." Now, the COO didn't know who Thompson was, but others at the
zoo did. Mhm. Dr. Michael Berry, the zoo's director of animal health, was up at Thompson's
property to inspect his large private collection of animals in 2008. Berry said he was horrified at what he
saw there in terms of security, cleanliness, and animal cruelty. It wasn't like this guy had this
facility that was nice for the animals. These were small cages for big animals. There was I mean, it was dirty.
Mhm. It looked like they weren't fed properly, but the laws being so I guess you'd say loose in Ohio,
Mhm. that all they could really do is do these checks on these individuals and then maybe fine them or have a a permit
violation, but even that wasn't even a big fine. The Columbus Zoo assembled its capture
and recovery team armed with both tranquilizer dart guns and regular weapons, and they set out for
Zanesville. Continuing the interview with Moore, he told police he last spoke with Terry
Thompson the night before at 9:00 p.m. The officers needed to get back on Thompson's property and move to see what
was really going on. The plan, one officer would drive a pickup truck while four armed officers
would sit together in the bed of the truck. Mhm. And they were told to neutralize the
animals on the loose if they saw any. They drove back to where the lifeless body was spotted. Two tigers surprised
the crew charging the bed of the truck. The officers were forced to shoot them. The tigers were put down.
From where the truck was, the men could see a man's body flat on his back. A white tiger was on top of him. The
tiger stood up and was staring at the truck. They believed the body was that of a deceased Terry Thompson.
Mhm. The unit received a call to respond to another portion of the property. When
they returned, the white tiger was gone. At the spot of the body, they found bolt
cutters and stainless steel Ruger .357 Magnum revolver. The cause of death seemed to be a
gunshot to the head. The gunshot wound suggested a barrel placed in the mouth. There was a sizable laceration on
Thompson's head that was consistent with a big cat's bite. Mhm. The body had laid in one spot for some
time, and then it was dragged some distance away by his arm. The body had been chewed on. There were
also pieces of raw chicken scattered around the body. Well, that's interesting cuz you wonder
where this raw chicken is coming from. Was Thompson carrying it? Well, here's the thing. One of the
experts from the zoo theorized that Thompson probably used the raw chicken to entice the animals to eat the
chicken, but also eat his body. Mhm. So, let's talk more about the zoo's involvement, right? Because I remember
hearing this on the radio and thinking, "Cool, they're bringing in the experts from the zoo. They're They're doing the
right thing." Right. But, by the time the Columbus Zoo team arrived, it was dark out.
Well, we already have a bunch of dead animals. Well, they were told that it wasn't safe
for them to try to tranquilize anything because so many animals were circulating
and others were scattering outward. Well, and and let's break this down because what I heard was first of all,
when you hit the animal with a tranquilizer, it works best if you hit it in not a fatty area, but a a muscle
area. Mhm. So, in the dark, you wouldn't know did you get a good shot or a bad shot? And
if it hits a muscle, it's going to take 5 to 10 minutes, but now that animal's going to be irritated. And those animals
are around other animals. So, do you irritate that animal and have it attack another animal?
Mhm. Or again, if you have a bad shot, it could take 10 minutes, 15 minutes, or not completely work. So, then you have
the fear of you have four tranquilizer guns, you start shooting these animals and
they start after 5 10 minutes, they start dropping and and going to sleep, I guess.
Right. But then you could approach them and all of a sudden, boom, they're back up.
Mhm. So, this this becomes uh a hazard more so because of because of the time of day and not being able to
see where you're shooting the animal at. Yeah, and this was covered this story was covered really well by a lot of our
local media coming from Columbus. But one of the best uh sources for information on this case comes from GQ
magazine. They did a uh big story on this about a year after it took place, around the 1-year
anniversary. Mhm. And according to that article, even when a tranquilizer dose is successfully
administered, it needs about 10 minutes to take effect. And there is great care that is required to establish that it
was done correctly. Right. So, as you were pointing out, and as this article points out, it is
impossible with so many animals running around to to do it this way, to to correctly administer a tranquilizer.
When the zoo people returned to the site the next day, this was 5:30 a.m., and they were joined by Jack Hanna. Now,
Hanna is is famous. He is famous for his appearances on shows like The David Letterman Show, and he established his
career at the Columbus Zoo. The previous day, he was doing an event at Penn State, and although he had just had knee
surgery, he drove straight there. He says 100 miles an hour. Zanesville's right between The wilds and
the Columbus Zoo. Mhm. So, I think that become it makes it more his problem, even though it's not his
problem, if that makes any sense. And Zanesville it it holds a a special significance for Jack Hanna. He went to
school around there. He enlisted in the army there. Mhm. I guess he spent his honeymoon night
there as well. And Hanna was a trusted and still is a trusted animal advocate. And Zanesville only being an hour from
us, I mean, it was a place that my cover band played all the time. I mean, those
people there, they love Garth Brooks and they love Nsync. Mhm. I played there so often, probably
every 6 weeks or so. And so, when this hit the news, it was like it could have been the weekend I was
there. Yeah. And let me just say if I saw a lion, I'd straight [ __ ] my pants. And the really sad thing here is by the
time that the zoo was on the scene the following day at 5:30 a.m. when, you know, when they had sunlight to work,
by this point 49 animals were confirmed dead. There was only one unaccounted for
animal. This was a monkey. Though, no trace would ever be found of it dead or alive. It was eventually decided that it
most likely was eaten by one of the cats. Right. Like once um he was letting all
the animals out, that during that time it was attacked by one of the cats. So, six of Terry Thompson's animals
survived. Three were leopards. They were still in their cages. Two more were monkeys kept in the living room of the
house in two small bird cages. And finally, out back near the empty swimming pool was a small grizzly bear
also in a bird cage. The house itself was disgusting. One person on scene said it was the most
horrific smelling house they'd ever been in. There was garbage and feces all over
the place. Garbage bags filled with garbage that was knocked over and I mean, the place
was just filthy. Yeah, his wife is going to arrive at the scene around lunchtime.
Yeah, Thompson's wife, Marion, uh she gets to the home. Now, she had to be convinced that the survivors, these
animals that survived this whole nightmare situation, they had to convince her that they needed to take
them to the zoo for safekeeping. Right. She was saying, "Please, Mr. Hanna, don't take my children."
Marion insisted on removing the monkeys from their cages herself. Uh she was waving off the zoo's personnel and
getting these monkeys out of the cages. She explained that she spent $30,000 buying them. And it seemed that she did
have a real bond with the animals. Before she opened the cages, she sang to them like a sing a lullaby or something.
Right, so before she opened up the cages that weren't the right sizes for those animals
and the filth that was on her property before all that stuff, she had a real bond with
them. Th- That's what people reported at the scene, yes. Mhm. And they said that the
the filthiest house they ever seen seen. The monkeys clung to her um and she took them one by one out of
the cages. It was decided that the dead animals were to be buried uh there and then on this property. And Mrs. Thompson
chose the spot where they buried the animals. So, the simplest and shortest version of this story is we have a man,
Terry Thompson, who on the second day of these events, they firmly believe, law enforcement firmly
believes, this man took his own life, but before doing so, he opened or cut open several of these cages, letting out
49 animals. Mhm. And these exotic animals, as we said, lions, tigers, bears, cougars, were
roaming this property. Yeah, a lot of people think there was two agendas here. One for him to set
them free, but then like you said before, after he committed suicide that they would eat his body, but then also
maybe that the second reason for this was that he wanted the animals to wreak havoc onto Zanesville.
Yeah, and the thing here is regarding the cages, some of them being open, some of them being cut.
Mhm. I don't know enough about it to speculate what was going on there. You would think he would just open the
cages, but one person on the scene said that they believed the cages were cut so
that he couldn't reverse what he was doing. Right. Like that you know, he's he's setting
this action forward and it's going to go down no matter what once he cuts that first cage.
Well, and a lot of people speculate too that he didn't release the leopards because they would have killed him
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Let me get you to the very latest now in a story that has captured the attention
of the nation coming out of Zanesville, Ohio. That's where a man who had a menagerie of wild, exotic animals on his
property, more than 50 of them apparently, opened their cages to set them free before taking his own life on
Tuesday. A number of those animals, 48 of them, were killed and there is a lot of questions this morning as to why they
were killed, why they could not have been tranquilized, perhaps moved to a zoo. Joining us to help answer some of
those questions this morning is Jack Hanna, director emeritus of the Columbus Zoo and Aquarium. He worked tirelessly
with police as they tracked down those animals. Jack, good to have you with us this morning and it is obvious to so
many just in watching you over these last couple of days how hard all of this has been on you as an animal lover.
It's been the worst thing that's ever happened to me in 40 years of this career, 40 years. But you know, I I sat
there yesterday when I got there and in daylight and saw the carnage of the animals and I go, why couldn't we have
tranquilized them? But then when I was with the veterinarians and the sheriff, you only only we had four we had four
tranquilizer guns that got there. Now, once they got there we're 50 miles away on each side. The darkness was about 45
minutes. Picture you I don't know if you see these bears behind me. Those are grizzlies. We had a couple of those
loose along with 18 tigers, 17 lions and lionesses. So, picture about 30, 40 of them coming out of this whole compound
with with with four tranquilizer guns. Now, if if we even shot one of these animals, like a tiger or a bear, this
thing has to hit a certain muscle. They're They're real good shots these folks are. But, we have 30-something
animals coming out coming at the sheriff, right? With our with our people. So, what can be done with four
guns? What you have happen here, once you hit the animal, the animal goes and for 3 to 10 minutes, he's not down. He's
just running everywhere cuz he's nervous, the drug is taking effect. No telling what would have happened if four
tranquilizer guns were all we had there and that started with 34 animals. They're huge carnivores. We would have
had There's no doubt in my mind with the 30-something years of the 40-something years doing this, we'd have some deaths
on our hand. Therefore, he had to make the critical decision. Every time I look at it, I know why people around the
world are contacting me around the England, Australia, all over, are very upset with over this whole thing, the
sheriff doing this. He had no choice. Or we would have major loss of human life in Zanesville, Ohio yesterday during the
night time, especially yesterday morning when the sun came up. So, it's all over
with now. Uh I sat here I sat here last night and cried several times when I look at this these pictures. I don't
believe it's happened, but what had to happen or we would have had a we'd have a mess on our hands beyond
comprehension. Jack, six of the animals were able to be saved. They were transferred to the zoo.
How are they doing this morning? They're doing very well. We have footage, I think, here right now of the
animals footage that was taken earlier is about 4:00 a.m. this morning. They're eating well. They're doing well. And by
the way, the governor, we met all day last night. The governor now is passing laws immediately. There will be no more
animal auctions in the state of Ohio with exotic animals. Within 6 months of that, we're going to go out here to the
people like we saw last night, and those folks better expect a knock on their door. And if they're not up to
standards, which are going to be great standards cuz I might have something to do with setting those standards, those
animals will be taken immediately and taken to the wilds where we're going to spend several hundreds of thousands of
dollars building a repository there for these animals to have a home in a decent
way. You bring up such an interesting point here. Terry Thompson, who had these animals, had a record of animal abuse.
Authorities were called out a number of times, even had convictions on related charges, and yet he kept these animals.
The conditions have been described as deplorable in some cases. If we knew of the situation there, if it was seen
firsthand, how was it allowed to continue? That's just what we've been sitting over
here for the last 3 hours since 5:30 this morning. My wife asked me the same exact question. The sheriff had been up
there 30, 40 times. He went to prison. My own people I didn't know but I didn't know they were out there somewhere.
There's people who have these animals I didn't know it was him. The own people went there and they weren't allowed.
They went to the tobacco and firearms and people went there and they went to rescue him for all the weapons. They
went there, but they weren't allowed to do anything because the law states he's not open to the public. So the United
States government cannot inspect his property to to write him any kind of citations. So what do we have here? We
have a situation that was unbelievable. There wasn't any law that we could do anything to him. Can you imagine this?
all they could do Jack was basically check and make sure he had the permits that he needed to have in the state of
Ohio and that was it. Is it? Can you imagine that? Well, that that whole thing is changing in the next
60 to 90 days and this will this will be one of the toughest states in the country when this gets done to pull
anything like this off ever again. As long as I'm here, I know the governor, Governor Strickland started this whole
thing, Governor Kasich now is going to carry it through in the next few months and we will be out there and this will
not happen again here under my watch in the state of Ohio unless somebody is sneaking this without any of us knowing
inside of a cave or something. There's so many questions about why this happened and how it happened, what his
thinking was before he took his own life. You actually met with his wife yesterday who's dealing with a number of
things at this point. Tell us a little bit if you can Jack about this conversation and any insight she may
have been able to offer you. Well, what happened was I understood she was very upset with me for taking her
children. Remember these these were her children. For me for someone killing her
children and why would I be up there trying to take the remaining three leopards, there's certain little small
primates and I say small apes this big and as well as one grizzly. Why was I taking please don't take she was crying.
She was actually uncontrollable. And you know what I did? When you see somebody that's just beaten to death that's just
done. She's lost her husband, You know, I can't help that. But But her husband committed suicide. But you see someone
that's lost everything. I hugged her and I tried to hold her. She was shaking and
she I've lost everything. Are you taking my children? I said, "I'm not taking your children. I'm taking them to the
Columbus Zoo right now to take care of them. They're still your children. They're your animals. We cannot bring
them back in these conditions. I'm trying to help you right now." And you know something? Tears started coming out
of my eyes. I'm not just telling that for you. I don't want anybody to feel sorry for Jack Hanna. I'm saying that
the emotions that have been with me and our staff that the sheriff deputies When
you saw those deputies sitting there that had to shoot those animals, I wish you could have seen their faces. I wish
you could have seen them when they said they had to go and talk to their children. That's not something that they
wanted to Half of them looked like they had tears in their eyes what they'd done. They They were afraid to somebody
even look at me because here they are shooting animals that Jack Hanna was trying to save. You know, this is
something that that if you try to write a script for this, I couldn't even imagine even Hollywood coming up with
something like this. It The thing is like a such a bad dream for all of us that it's
over now. The animals lost their lives. The only good out of this came that in 90 to 100 days from now, this state will
hopefully never have to face this again. But the woman as you it was was beaten.
She's done. What was I to do but hold her and tell her that you know, this will hopefully never happen again.
That's all I could do. Jack, can't tell you how much we appreciate your time this morning. Thank
you. All right. First beer break of 2019. 19. Yeah, and we heard Jack Hanna talking
there during that clip. The strange thing though here, Captain, is while that was Terry Thompson's body that they
found on his property, Mhm. you know, you and I know there has been some question. And the question here is
did Terry Thompson take his own life or was he murdered? Yeah, well, cuz somebody's sitting there
and they're thinking, "Hey, I'm listening to the True Crime Garage and what are these
wackadoos talking about? Where's the crime?" Mhm. Well, first of all, it's a crime to
release these animals into the public. Mhm. And if they would have got a hold of
somebody this, you know, somebody would have been facing murder charges. But now
you have where you the individual that let these go, did he commit suicide or was it foul play?
And you know what though, as sad as it is that all these animals, these magnificent animals were killed
Yeah. that night, it's almost a miracle that no one was hurt in this whole thing.
And look, we're we're animal lovers here. And so is obviously Jack Hanna. Mhm. But he said it best, the fact that there
were zero human casualties, this is almost a miracle. Mhm. Well, let's take a look at Terry
Thompson. Terry Thompson was 62 years of age at the time of his death. Yeah. Thompson's body was taken from the scene
for an autopsy at the Licking County Coroner's Office. Terry William Thompson was 5 ft 5 in tall and weighed 174 lb.
He was wearing a black t-shirt, blue jeans, and white briefs. He had a cardiovascular disease. The only notable
substance in his blood was Benadryl. There was gray powder residue on his left hand that appeared to be from a gun
being fired. Aside from the gunshot wound, they found a 2 and 1/4 in vertical laceration on the right lower
forehead and along the spine of his nose. There were 21 other injuries or clusters of injuries that they detailed
these simply as on his head and neck area. Right. Others were noted on his torso and legs.
And then there was a 5 and 3/4 in by 4 in gaping laceration involving the pubic region with the
absence of genitalia with exposure of the pubic bones and adjacent soft tissue. Right, but to be clear, we have one
gunshot wound. Correct. So, we believe that is from himself. He's or or we think because we have the gun
residue on the hand. Now, people argued that uh Thompson was a guitar player and
that he played right-handed guitar. And so, the fact that he would have been shooting with his left hand would be
odd. Mhm. I I also make the argument that I know a lot of people that are left-handed that
play guitar in the traditional right-handed way. Mhm. Because your dominant hand on on a
right-handed guitar is your left hand. So, that it to me is no sign of what hand he is.
Right. But, I think, you know, his wife probably could tell us what hand he was.
Well, remember John Moore and remember Moore said that he last spoke with Terry Thompson at 9:00 the previous evening.
Thompson told Moore about a letter he received from an unnamed author saying Terry Thompson's wife, Marion, had been
unfaithful. Now, I don't know if she actually cheated on Terry, but if she did, this is how this went down.
Remember we said Dr. Michael Berry, the director of animal health at the Columbus Zoo, was up at Thompson's
property for an inspection back in 2008. Right. This, I believe, was at the request of
law enforcement. Dr. Berry was accompanying a an ATF raid that eventually led to Terry Thompson going
to prison. Thompson was in prison for a year on gun charges. Even though Dr. Berry did not approve of the animal
situation as far as the law is concerned, there was no action that they could take concerning these
animals. You know, this is for a multitude of reasons. One, the animal laws in Ohio,
as you pointed out, and actually many states at the time were pretty relaxed. Right.
You know, well, very relaxed animal laws. The other reason Thompson didn't receive any punishment for the animal
situation was because under the old setup, you were allowed a certain amount of time to improve the animal situation
and environment before action would be taken against you. So, basically, they saw a problem. They told him, "Hey, you
can't be treating these animals or taking care of them in this way." Right. And instead of there being an immediate
punishment like there would be for other laws being broken, he had time to correct the situation. So, he made
changes or upgrades or whatever to improve these facilities. But regardless, he went to prison for 1 year
for the gun charges. According to this letter, Thompson's wife cheated on him while he was in prison. Thompson was
only out of prison for 3 weeks before he opened these cages, cut some of them open, and
killed himself. Yeah. When Terry Thompson spoke with John Moore at 9:00 p.m. the night before,
Terry was asking John Moore about Maryann having cheated on him while he was in prison. Moore told Thompson he
didn't know whether she did or didn't. And then Terry makes this statement back to him.
Mhm. He said, "Well, I have a plan to find out, and you'll know it when it happens."
Okay, so his plan was to release these animals and then maybe she'd tell him? No, I don't think that I don't think he
thought he would figure it out. I think he had this plan to do something very crazy.
Right. I mean, letting these animals out and then taking his own life. And I think it was just that it's kind
of a a very ominous statement, right? Hey, I I've got a plan. I'm not going to tell
you what it is, but when it happens, you'll know because it it's going to make the news. You're going to hear
about this. Yeah, when you see the lions running down, you know, 70 Right. on the freeway, you're going to know
what it will happen. But this is this is a tricky situation anyways cuz one, it's
like I don't like to take anybody's rights away. So, should somebody have the right to have a tiger? I
To me, it's like, well, if you can afford to house one and you can and you can care for it properly, if you
have enough land, you know, what's the difference between somebody owning one privately and and
somebody having one at the zoo? Mhm. But now, the zoo has funding. Do you have the funding?
In this case, Thompson just doesn't have the funding. Right. And maybe he had the funding at one
time. Mhm. And then maybe this is part of everything slipping away from him. He has this house with some land. He has
all these animals he can't take care of. He has people coming after him saying, cuz one, the more and more animals you
you have, the more and more inspections they're going to do, the more and more they're going to be nitpicky. You need
to fix this, you need to fix that. I don't think I had enough money to take care of these animals. And instead of
being the bigger man and saying, "Hey, how about I I sell these to somebody that can or or donate these to some
zoos, give these animals proper homes." There it was almost like he was stuck, like he was going to try to figure out
this problem. I got I got to make this right. And then he who had these illegal guns, right? That's what he was arrested
on. Correct. So, you have So, just a odd situation where you have these tigers and these lions living on
your property. Now, you have these illegal guns. And look, there's probably a lot of people
in rural areas that have illegal guns. But maybe because they couldn't get him on charges
for the animals, they went after the gun route. Well, the ATF was there for the raid.
And I think what they did was they knew animals were on the property, so they decided to bring someone in from the zoo
with them to accompany them. Right. But what I'm saying is, if they have charged him, if they have given him
him fails and and charged him to fix things and they can't get it where they can
stop him on that level well, we also heard a rumor that he has these guns. And that'd be another way to
get him in trouble. And just basically I mean, we've see this happen with a lot of people. Like, oh, we know this guy's
a drug runner. We can't get him on drug charges, but we can get him on taxes. Mhm. I just wonder if it's the similar
thing. If he was becoming such such a nuisance, if they knew that these living conditions were not fit for the animals,
but we can't do anything but charge him some fees that he's going to pay. That maybe this is an another avenue to
get him to get him to wake up and fix his situation. Well, let's unpack some things before we
move on. So, first it was determined that Terry Thompson took his own life after opening the cages on his property
that day. Now, second, you got to wonder how could a private citizen amass a collection of so many unusual and
potentially dangerous animals in the first place. Well, that is because at the time there were very little laws
preventing that. You know, what laws were in place were as said very light at the time of this tragic event in Ohio
and a few other states, a home and land owner could buy as many tigers, lions, and other exotic animals as he or she
wanted to. You know, as as as many as the heart desires. So, even if you own just like an acre.
Yeah. Wow. Yeah, and and at the time they were technically under no obligation to even
tell anyone that they owned these animals. Oh, that's nice. Now, to breed, exhibit, or commercially
transport animals across state lines, you did need a USDA license for that. Uh Uh, and this required that facilities be
inspected periodically to check that they met some very basic standards. But, other than that, there were no special
checks or controls. Now, the change in these laws, amongst some of of the other details deemed suspicious by some, have
surfaced conspiracy theories regarding the deaths of these magnificent animals and Terry Thompson.
Right. And the agenda of the conspiracy theories, let's just get this out in the
open. Yeah. The what they're stating is that somebody killed him. That authorities killed him. That this
was planned by authorities. And the reason why is because the laws are so loose.
Mhm. That they wanted to tighten up the laws. They wanted to make it harder on individuals to own these animals. And
so, anybody in Ohio or other states, they start trying to point out these like little things
that don't line up, saying they made this happen. They made They're the ones Law enforcement are the ones that made
this uh, scare, this panic. They're the ones that then, you know, massacred these animals. And
and all for for them to be able to pass uh, tighter laws, stricter laws. Yeah. So, the the general thought is
it it's it's the old argument. We've heard it a hundred times. It happens every time there's a school shooting or
mass shooting where people set suggest, "Hey, this was a scripted event that took place because we need stricter gun
laws." Right. And so, here we get these These laws did pass. The I think it's called the
Dangerous Animal Act or something like that. But, these laws did pass and they passed relatively quickly after this
situation. So, then people point to that and say, "Well, this was orchestrated so
that these laws could go on the books. Now, I don't want to get into the finer details of of the law and these
laws. Right. But, one thing I would like to point out to people that make that argument
is technically, at one point, we did have stricter animal laws, but they expired.
Mhm. And for whatever reason, the Ohio state government, once they expired, did not
do a very good job of getting them back on the books. They just kind of sat there.
I've been thinking about this a lot this week, but I started thinking about this, like, you
know, who do you blame here and who do you who do you point the finger? Who Who do
you get angry with? Who do you lock eyes with? Bring them in close. Sniff them. Let them know
you're a piece of [ __ ] Who do you do that here? And at at some point I went, "Well,
it's it's the people passing the laws, too, though, right? Aren't they responsible for this?" But
then I really started thinking as the week went on, you have a lot of other problems to deal
with. Oh, yeah. And you have millions of citizens. You have these you you have a lot of missing
children, missing people. You have murders happening every day. You have all these things that you have to deal
with. How many people in the state of Ohio actually own these types of animals? And out of those many people, how many
own too many of them? Right. And how many of them, you know, cuz like, look, if some guy in Cleveland
owns five lions and he has the the land for it and he has the you know, how many of them are causing
problems? Mhm. And so, I I can't really put a blame on them when that has to be a low
it has to be low on their list of priorities. Mhm. Well, the other thing that people like
to point out, too, Captain, is that many have suggested, how would he have been able to open up all these cages? I mean,
we're It's not one or two cages, it was like 50. So, many people have suggested, "Hey, he
would have been attacked and killed before he could get all those cages open." Now,
we should point out, if you look at pictures of his property, one, these cages were like in groups.
You know, they would have like I mean, picture like a a grocery store where you have aisles.
I am going to be posting a lot of this a lot of these pictures that we're talking
about to our Instagram page. Go to Instagram @truecrimegarage. So, picture this. This is the way this
goes down. I mean, you could You could open up a cage, walk three step steps and open up another one. Walk three
steps, open up another one. I I mean, very quickly he could open up all these cages. The The thing that I have a
problem with with people saying that I I get their argument. I get the argument of saying, "Hey, man, you let
go all these big, huge creatures and they didn't kill you before you got to the last cage." I get it.
Right. But, the thing here is we have a guy that I mean, he he did take care of these animals in some
sense. You know, he he did have some kind of relationship with these animals, one. And then two, I mean, we're we've
all had, you know, dogs or cats or whatever. Have you ever just opened up a cage and
not open the door for the animal and and notice that it it takes the dog, uh, you know, 3 minutes or so to figure
out that, "Hey, I I'm free." You know, um, so I wonder if it's that situation. The other thing, too, is we have people
that had suggested, "Well, they didn't have to kill the animals." Well, well, let's stay on the the cage
for a sec second because a lot of people also claim that there was chains and certain locks on these doors. So,
that would make it harder. The cages are close together, but there's chains and there's locks on all these doors.
There is no evidence of that. Mhm. And you'll hear people talk about this. There was chains on all of them, so it
would have took him so much longer. You have no evidence of that. That's just speculation that you're making.
Right. Right. And the thing too that I think that gets lost along the way when people look for a conspiracy
and and it's fair that people look for a conspiracy, I think, because as you pointed out, when something like this
happens in any of the cases we cover, you want somebody to blame. You want somebody to hold accountable for
something that you did not like or didn't agree with or that was just plain wrong.
Well, right. And that's the thing. And And this is where I people that look into conspiracy theories get a bad rap.
I mean, it's the idea like you take Sandy Hook. You're talking about one of the most horrible tragedies in the world
in the history of the world. But you can watch those videos where in the back of the school building
it's almost like they're going in a circle. Now, I don't know what that means and
I'm not saying that it's that that Sandy Hook was a conspiracy. That's not what I'm saying at all.
That happened, but what I can't make sense of is why are these individuals going in a circle on the back of the
school? I don't understand that. And so, that's not me calling the whole thing a
hoax. That's me saying, "Well, what's up with that?" Yeah. What's up with that? Don't start that.
Um but but same way here. If he if he is left-handed Okay, so he shoots a gun with his left
hand. Well, it seems like the exit wound is coming from the left side of Thompson's
head. Mhm. So, you got to put the gun in and then point it that that doesn't make a lot of
sense. It would make more sense if you fired the gun with your right hand and you put that in your mouth, the exit
wound would be coming out of the left side of your skull. Mhm. So, I I think it's likely and this is this
is tough because we're doing a a a radio show, but you know, I'm going to show you something. I think it's likely that
he did this that he uh that he did one of It was a revolver and from the way that the autopsy
in the mouth right side up. He put it in his mouth upside down. That would be my guess because the way
that the autopsy reads, it sounds like this is horribly graphic, but the the the top back portion of his head was
blown off. And so a crime show, man. I I'm not doing this thing in 2019. I'm not doing the thing
where I'm apologizing if you get offended. Okay. I just said that it was It's a true crime show. There's going to
be some stuff. I didn't apologize. I just said that it was it's graphic. But the thing here is
Okay, who cares what hand he is? There's gunpowder residue on him and it's not like they found it on his foot, you
know? I don't I was I would also argue there's probably some kind of residue on his right hand.
And the thing that gets lost in the shuffle here when people take a look at this, when
they glance at this, you do have to do some digging to find out that he kind of made a threat to his friend the night
before when he said, "Hey, I've got I've got a plan and you'll know it when it happens."
Yep. I mean, that's a threat. And obviously after all this happens, we know what his
plan was. Yeah. And the thing that's I mean, it's it's tragic, but I just don't see a situation
where this guy was murdered. We don't have any eyewitnesses that have anybody else on the property
at the time of him releasing those animals. Right. That we know of. Right. Uh interesting story though, so
I know a guy that was a sheriff here in uh Zanesville. Mhm. And he told me that one time that they
had to go to the Thompson house and talk to him. And there was three sheriff on one side.
I'm I'm probably telling this story a little wrong. Please forgive me. But they're on this island. There was
this island in the kitchen. Mhm. And on one side of the island was Thompson. On the other side of the island was the
three sheriff. Mhm. And then all of a sudden they could hear claws. And they know he has animals.
Right. They know that they know that he has big cats. They know lions, maybe tigers.
They don't know everything, but they know some stuff. Right. So coming down the hallway are these
giant claws click. You know how your dog you can hear your dog. And they said right behind Thompson just walks
a tiger. I can't remember if it was just a regular tiger tiger or or if it was the
white tiger. Right. But they said this just walked right past him. He didn't flinch. He didn't
even look at it. And it just walked into another room. And one of the guys uh you know, drew his gun on it.
Mhm. Cuz he thought Well, yeah, I'm going to need this if this thing decides to pounce on me.
Could you imagine if you're sitting there talking to him and you just start hearing
those claw marks. Mhm. I mean there's some things that are just hard to picture what you would do.
Mhm. And that's one of them. I mean uh wouldn't know what to do. Well, and I'm going to say some
unpopular things here. But I've I do. I do want to put out my feelings or at least my thoughts. Let's not say
feelings. We'll say thoughts on this whole event and how it went down. Look, I I I do not love the outcome of
this situation. I don't love that so many of these wonderful animals were killed.
Um but the the thing here is we have a police department that's responding to a situation and they had to make a call on
the fly of what to do. What is in the public's best interest? How do we protect the other citizens in this area?
And I think they had to make a judgment call on the fly. Again, I don't love the
outcome of everything, but they had to protect the public there. And they had to put these animals down
as sad as it is. And the other thing too about this whole situation, man, for all
these years, this is going to be very unpopular. Okay. That I I apologize. Here's an apology.
our last show of the the year and the last show of our career. So, for years, you know, this happened
over 7 years ago, I've really had a pretty strong hatred for Terry Thompson. And what we talk
about when something terrible happens or something goes down, you want somebody to hold accountable. You want somebody
to hate Look in the eye. for their actions. Look me in the eye. And so, I've for all these years, I've
hated Terry Thompson. If you do want somebody to to hold responsible for this, it's Terry Thompson. It's the guy
that opened up the cages and killed himself. But, the more that I got looking into this situation and the more
I got studying Terry Thompson's life, I'm really just kind of left feeling I I'm not going to lie. I I feel bad for
the man. And And here's why, okay? I don't agree with getting 50 animals, whether they be exotic animals or just
dogs and cats. Right. One person can't take care of that many animals. That's not something I agree
with. But But you can try to love all those dogs. If you got 50 dogs, you can try.
What I saw was a man that made a lot of bad decisions, but he had lots of collections. He collected guns, he
collected cars. He This man served this country in Vietnam, and he saw some terrible stuff. He was He was a gunner
at the door of the helicopters. Yeah. And so I don't want to go into the things that he probably went through
during wartime, but it was very obvious to people that knew him that war changed
him in a bad way. When he came home, there was often times where he would mention things like "Yeah, I'm I'm not
going to heaven. I've I've killed too many people. I You know, during wartime I've had to do some some bad things."
And what I see is more of a hoarder. You know, we see these situations on TV where that you find some person that's
like buried up to their neck in trash in their home because they won't throw anything away.
Yeah. I think we got this guy, Terry Thompson, who decided one day he wanted to start
collecting animals. And I think probably his intentions were good in the beginning. I think
yeah. I think this is a psychological thing. It's you know, like you said with the hoarding or the collecting. It's
almost like something happened in war and he and he has some kind of broken uh part inside him. He's trying to fix
it by these collections, by whether it's gun collections or animal collections. Yeah, and he I mean, this guy he had a
pilot's license at one time in his life. He had a very successful business where
he he was a Harley-Davidson dealership that he owned for many years. So he made a lot of money. And but what he did with
his money was he collected things, guns, cars, animals. And the thing was people
pointed out to say, "Hey, I'd go to Terry Thompson's property. I'd see all these beautiful cars from the '50s and
the '60s just sitting there neglected, falling apart, rusting." Right. And what I think happened here was his
last love might have been the collection of these animals. And I think at some point he just kept
collecting them and collecting them, and he couldn't take care of them. Right. And it
Was it the right thing to do? No, hell no. Terribly wrong. He should have got out a long time ago. But what happened
was when he got arrested on those gun charges and he went away to prison, everything that I could find, it seems
like his his life with his wife, his marriage was falling apart before he went to prison. But when he went to
prison, she didn't visit him very often. They didn't have phone calls very often.
She He went to prison, she treated it almost as if their marriage didn't exist. And I think what happened is
Terry Thompson got out of prison. After being there for a year, he came home and
he felt like he had nothing. He a man that had a lot and and now he had nothing. No children, no all of his
things were neglected the entire time he was gone, and even his wife was not his
anymore. Right. And I think when he had nothing, I think this guy was probably suicidal for some
time. I think he was deeply depressed. And I think that he Well, and a possible I'm just going to
throw out another possibility there, too. I mean, he could have some kind of early onset dementia or
You know what I mean? Like where he's just not completely there in his head. I mean, that it's very possible.
I think the most horrible part of this entire story, though, I think he let the animals out to punish
his wife. Right, I think he was going to kill himself anyway, and I think the the
letting the animals out was a way to punish his wife, because they were or at least spoke of them as if they
were their children. And we've seen this in other cases that we've covered before, in cases that we'll cover in the
future. Sometimes the husband or wife will do something terrible to the children to punish their spouse.
Well, right, but let's start with the idea that you're you're the sum of all your actions, not
the sum of one action. But meaning yes, he served his country. And that's a good thing.
He probably was a good friend to people, good businessman, fine, whatever. But this act
is a piece of [ __ ] Mhm. This act is a piece of [ __ ] These animals did not deserve to live
that way, they did not deserve to die that way. Right. And um and I would have I would have hated to
be one of the sheriffs and having these animals running free. And the fear that you must have. I mean,
we all see these majestic animals when you go to the zoo, but it's from a distance.
Mhm. But if this was in another yard, what would you feel? The fear that you'd have to fear.
And a lot of these cops just it was awful. And and like we said, there's there has been rumors
that the some of these cops have said Mhm. that that this was fun, like hunting,
right? Right. Is it possible that there was out of all the uh police officers involved,
a lot of them, which Jack Hanna said, a lot of them were crying Mhm. afterwards, a lot of them felt awful, a
lot of them said, "I have to go back and tell my son or my daughter, I killed a lion. I killed a tiger."
Mhm. Now, did one of those guys go to the bar, get drunk, and instead of telling
the truth, decide that he's going to make some stupid joke about it? Possibly. But I I really do think
that this was a a very unfortunate situation, and the cops did what they had to do.
Everybody involved as far as Jack Hanna and them, they had to just deal with those consequences.
Mhm. Because those decisions, when you first hear about it, it almost sounds like the
zoo was telling the law enforcement what to do. But that's not what happened. They had to take it They had to make
actions happen before they can get the advice of law enforcement. Mhm. Now, as far as the conspiracy theories
stuff goes, there are some people that own animals that claim that they reached out to law enforcement when
they heard about this saying that they could help. Again, I don't fault the I can't fault
the sheriff because you you're running out of time. You're running out of daylight. And I just don't see the
conspiracy. I think there's enough evidence that the Thompson had a lot of demons
from his past, stuff going on mentally, stuff going on in that present time with
his wife. Um and just such a tragic thing. Yeah, and I think it regarding law enforcement, we should
keep in mind they are the ones that called the zoo. They are the ones that called in the experts from the zoo.
have to call anybody. Right. They tried to get them involved. The zoo did get involved. The but they
were the ones that put that action into place. And I think I'll leave it here for today with a statement from one of
the officers on the scene that day. He said, "I was sick shooting these animals because they didn't ask to be there."
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simplisafe.com/garage. Real quick, Captain, before we wrap up here today, I want to mention that I got
a very nice email from a woman named Gina who was suggesting that we cover the Jodi Arias case. Well, we actually
covered that way back in season 2. So, if you want to hear all of our old episodes for free, you can do that by
getting the free Stitcher app. We have all of our previous seasons and years, whatever you want to call them, on
there. Plus, you'll want to check out our premium show Off the Record on Stitcher Premium. I'm still receiving
emails from people regarding our Jodi Who's in True Update that we did months back. So, it's a hit show. Check it out.
It's on Stitcher Premium. It's a hit. All right, I got some recommended viewing for you if you
haven't heard. We have a famous person in the garage now. We know him as the Colonel. The rest of
the world knows him now as Nick from True Crime Garage. And uh you were on the Lake Erie's Murders.
Lake Erie Murders, yep. Lake Erie Murders, which uh premiered last night on the ID channel.
Yes. And so, you want to check it out. It's a three-part you're you're part of the
three-part series about about the Amy Mihaljevic case. Yes. So, if you haven't checked that out,
I don't know when it's playing. I don't know when it's playing again, but you know those those channels typically
re-air things and I'm sure you could see some of that at their website as well. Well, now that you're a celebrity, your
pay does not increase here in the garage, my friend. And you know, maybe next time that you're uh
you're on TV, maybe you could ask me to join you. Well, I would have liked for you to be
on, but they were afraid of your foul mouth. Oh. Well, until next week. All right, everybody be good, be kind,
and don't litter.

Source: https://www.podbean.com/media/share/pb-gcx5j-a34463

Insanesville ////// 268 Part 1 of 1 www.TrueCrimeGarage.com Zanesville, Ohio - October 18th, 2011 - a call came into 911 that set the whole town on edge. There was a lion on the loose. Police arrived on scene to find many large and dangerous animals roaming free. They also found the lifeless body of a 62 year old man. What went down on that autumn day can only be described as insane. Beer of the Week - Zookeeper by Empyrean Garage Grade - 3 and 3 quarter bottle caps out of 5 Visit the Garage sponsors and save some cheddar! www.SimpliSafe.com/Garage - for a great deal on top notch home security www.ThirdLove.com/Garage - find your perfect-fitting bra and get 15% off your first purchase Listen to the Mind’s Eye podcast - Parcast.com/Mind'sEye to listen now

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Brief Summary

Terry Thompson released exotic animals in Zanesville, leading to a police response and the deaths of many animals.

Key points

A Wild Encounter in Zanesville. A man discovers a lion and a bear near his home, leading to chaos.
The Search for Terry Thompson. Authorities find a tiger eating a human body on Thompson's property.
The Aftermath of the Escape. By the time the zoo arrived, 49 animals were confirmed dead.
Marion's Heartbreaking Plea. Marion Thompson begs Jack Hanna not to take her animals after her husband's suicide.
Tragic Decision to Shoot Animals. Jack Hanna discusses the heartbreaking choice to euthanize the animals to prevent human casualties.
New Laws for Exotic Animals. In response to the tragedy, Ohio will implement stricter laws on exotic animal ownership.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Inside all of us there is a wild thing.

1:28WatchJan 1, 2019

Tension

75/ 100High tension

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