Highway 95 Horror: Kristin David's Disappearance | Forensic Files

Hi, crime junkies. We are back with the details of a case that I ever so briefly
touched on last episode. The victim in today's case always gets lumped in with a group of missing and murdered people
from this like small Pacific Northwest area. And authorities and community locals believe that they were all killed
by the same man. But this case has always been the outlier because of how this young woman was found. dismembered
in garbage bags floating in the Snake River. The thing is, I think she very well could be a victim of a serial
killer, just not the one that we talked about last week. I have been tracking a new man who somehow kept turning up in
the same areas as dismembered women in the8s, and I want to bring you guys in on the investigation
because I need your help. But let me start with the University of Idaho student whose story came well before the
Idaho Ford that we talked about two weeks ago. This is the story of Kristen David.
In late June and into the first couple of days of July 1981, police in the Lewis Clark Valley, right
where Washington and Idaho meet, are getting a flood of calls in response to local news of a missing co-ed from the
University of Idaho. 22-year-old Kristen David was on summer break and while she was going to be
staying with her sister in Lewon, Idaho, she wanted her bike and like a couple of
other things that she'd left behind at her campus apartment. So on June 25th, she had a friend drive her the 30 miles
or so back to Moscow, Idaho, so she could get her things and then she was going to actually bike back the next
morning on the 26th. I mean, the ride was mostly downhill. It would take her maybe 3 hours. Easily doable for
Kristen. Except she never made it back to Lewon. Both her and her bike just vanished
somewhere along the long stretch of Highway 95. Now, it took a few days for police to consider foul play in
Kristen's case. But as news of her disappearance made its way to locals, plenty of people were calling in
sightings of her from the 26th. Some were innocuous, just saying that she was biking alone, but those kind of help
pinpoint how far she might have made it before she disappeared. But other sightings were more ominous. And over
and over again, police were hearing about a man and a mysterious brown van that may have been with Kristen on the
side of the highway. Now, these sightings differ a little bit based on who comes forward. Like, for instance,
one man says that he saw the brown van parked on the side of the road and a woman who looked like Kristen was
loading her bike into the back of it with help from this man. They said she didn't look distressed, so he didn't
stop or do anything or whatever. Then, another witness named James claims to have seen a similar looking van pulled
over to the side of the highway close to this town called Jennese, which is just
north of Lewon. And in this sighting, the driver was standing outside on the driver's side and a young blonde woman
matching Kristen's description was standing towards the rear of the van and the bicycle was like laying in the
weeds. Based on the scene, he assumed that the girl had some kind of accident and that this man was helping her.
Although, James says that he saw a shadow and two feet on the opposite side of the van, like there was someone else
on the other side that he just couldn't see. and he said he didn't stop because again he thought this guy was already
stopping and helping and you know nobody would need him. So being 1981, as police
start getting a flood of these vague descriptions, they begin bringing people in to put them under hypnosis, hoping to
get more details about this mystery van or ideally the license plate. All of the
witnesses agree that the Brown van was sporting an Oregon license plate. And a few under hypnosis can remember some of
the letters and numbers. Like James says that the last two digits were 37. And that's backed up by another witness who
says the plate had the numbers 737. >> Were any of them able to describe the driver?
>> Yes, they were. and not any better under hypnosis, but like in their initial statements, they all give this
similarish description. One witness who was driving past says that this guy had like this full kind of shaggy beard.
Another describes this guy as quote unquote grubby, whatever that means to that person. And James comes in with the
most detailed description, describing this man as approximately 30 years old. He's a white guy, 510 to 6 feet tall. He
said he had a husky build, maybe if you had to guess 175 to 180, with a trimmed beard, brown hair, and wearing a brown
and white checkered shirt and army type khaki pants. Although, as detailed as that was, I feel like it's worth noting
that James' story changes some over time. Like, for instance, he gives two statements shortly after Kristen went
missing. In the first he mentions seeing the feet under the van like someone else
was on the other side. But then in the second one he doesn't mention any other person. And then the story he tells
years later when he participated in an episode of the series Cold Valley, it changes like more drastically. I think
at that point in 2018, he says that he was driving past and he spotted this brown van, but now Kristen wasn't
standing up. She was laying down in the grass next to her bike as though she had
been hit. And then he says he sees the the driver, the one man, getting out of the van, walking back towards where
Kristen was laying. And this dude was smiling. >> And there's no mention of any of these
details before. >> No. And our team even tried reaching out to James, but we couldn't get through.
So, I kind of wonder if what he saw in 81 morphed into something more sinister in his mind, especially after July 4th,
when people finally realized what happened to Kristen after she went missing. [Music]
A little over a week after witnesses spotted Kristen on the side of the road with that bearded man and brown van,
this guy who is spending his Fourth of July fishing on the Snake River spots a black garbage bag in the water near the
riverbank. And it's unusual enough that curiosity gets the best of him and he looks inside. And that's when he sees
parts of Kristen David. And then downstream there is another one of these same black trash bags. So he calls
police who over the course of that evening and the next morning collect five bags in total containing parts of
Kristen's new dismembered body. Though according to an article in the South Idaho Press, it would take 5 days for
them to confirm her identity officially. Now, there was very little evidence to work with when they removed each part
one by one from the bags. I mean, they couldn't tell exactly when she had been killed or how long she'd been in the
water. But, Detective Jackie Nichols with the Asotin County Sheriff's Office told us that investigators believe she
had likely died either the day she went missing or very shortly after. Kristen's
body showed signs of skin slippage, which is like a natural part of decomposition, but it is slowed down
when a body is in the water. So, according to my research, it can take as little as 24 hours for this to happen
after a body is placed in water, although there are like a ton of different factors that can impact this.
So, the working theory is that she was killed and then dumped relatively quickly. And then what probably happened
is the bags sank to the bottom of the river before surfacing and then being discovered on the fourth. And all of
that to say, investigators then were left with little hope of collecting any biological evidence. And none of her
personal effects like jewelry or anything else was found on her body either. And it's interesting, I do see a
note in the files that we have seen that says she had a wrist watch that she was
known to wear and that that watch was located, but I'm not sure where it was found. Like, was it with her remains or
did they go back to her apartment or something and find it there? I don't know. But there was one clue left behind
by whoever wrapped Kristen and put her in those bags. Each body part was wrapped in newspapers. And they realized
that the newspapers were from four different issues of the Lewon Morning Tribune. They were dated April 7th,
April 17th, April 19th, and April 24th, which to me is interesting cuz it's not like someone just found one random
paper. Like >> it really is more of a series of papers as though the killer used the ones that
had been delivered to their home and >> whatever was around, >> right? And sure, there are thousands of
other scenarios where these could have been picked up or found or whatever, but I mean, think about it. This person had
to have somewhere to go to dismember Kristen in the first place. >> They're going to go somewhere that they
know, somewhere that's private, that they are familiar with and feel comfortable in.
>> Well, and so familiar that they may get the Daily Paper there. That's my thinking because nothing about this
feels sloppy or rushed. This person took their time to do exactly what it is they
wanted to do to her. I mean, her dismemberment is described as almost surgical. Like, whoever did this either
has medical knowledge >> or has done this before. >> Exactly. And there were also signs of
mutilation on her body and some sort of muscle or tissue in her mouth. Do we know anything about her cause of death?
>> So, transparently, yes. So, we obtained some of Kristine's files through a foyer
request, and there is documentation of her cause of death and other injuries she sustained, but Detective Nichols has
asked that we don't publicize that information. While she isn't the lead investigator on Kristen's case, she has
done a lot of work on it, and she thinks that it would be best not to get into that in detail. And then we couldn't get
in contact with the actual lead investigator at the FBI and their office wasn't willing to answer any of our
questions. So, just out of respect for Detective Nichols requests, we're not going to get into that. But to answer
your question, yes, we know and investigators do know. And here's something I can tell you that I don't
think has been reported before and something that I think could be a hallmark of her killer's MMO.
I told you they discovered five different bags in the Snake River. They found her head, her torso, both arms.
Some of them were double bagged. And then her left leg and hips and buttocks were found all connected but not in a
bag. Now, the upper part of her right thigh was also recovered, but I can't tell from the reports if that was in a
bag or not. But what I'm getting at is when all is said and done, when the whole shore had been searched and
investigators were ready to pack everything up, the rest of her right leg, so we're talking everything from
the knee down, was never found, never recovered. What could searchers have just missed it? Possibly. I mean,
there's one report I saw in the case file that briefly mentions seeing a similar looking black trash bag floating
like way out in the middle of the river. And since the waters were choppy, no one
could get to it before it disappeared. So >> maybe that's where her missing leg ended
up. But also, I don't see any reports of that turning up later or being found by
anyone else. And so I can't help but wonder, could the killer have kept it? >> And you'll see why I asked that question
a little bit later. So it's not just me being like wild crime junkie theories. It really is the question of could this
be part of his MMO? And that remains to be seen. So despite a thorough search of
the shoreline, nothing else is recovered. And there's still the question of where her body went into the
river. And detectives here are in luck because they're soon contacted by a woman who says that she and a couple of
others found two separate stains of what looked like blood on the railing of a bridge a few miles upstream from where
Kristen's body was found. So investigators go check it out, and the spots are still there. And it may be
because of this that investigators start theorizing that Kristine's body was dumped off this bridge into the water
below. And then two witnesses even come forward later stating that they saw what
looked like a dark van parked on that bridge, possibly on the same day that Kristen went missing. Now, these
witnesses didn't actually see anything suspicious. They just said that the driver of the van sort of matched the
description that they've been working with. And the guy didn't look happy that someone had seen them. But it's not like
this witness actually saw this person throwing bags over the railing. And I could talk to you about who saw the
spots and when they saw them and go around in circles, but I'm not going to build you up only to bring you down
because samples of that may be blood are collected later tested and it's determined to not even be blood at all.
It doesn't mean that someone didn't still use that bridge to put the bags in the water. Doesn't mean it didn't happen
on a tight timeline, >> right? But this doesn't offer any kind of proof. Like they're right where they
were before. >> Did they ever find her bike or pieces of her bike or anything? >> No, not her bike, not her clothes, not
even some of the personal items that detectives learned she would have most likely have had on her, like her
checkbook and her coin purse. >> When you say coin purse, and I'm thinking of a serial killer, it feels
like one of those things that he would keep as like a a trophy or is it like a trophy or souvenir difference, right?
>> Right. It depends on what he would have done with it if I remember correctly.
Like trophies, I believe, are the kinds of things that killers would give to someone else so they can see them
wearing it or holding it. Like that's what they get off on. Souvenirs they kind of just keep tucked away.
>> Okay. But still, I could see him keeping something little like a coin purse or a
checkbook. >> But something big like her bike, I feel like that would be hard to like hide
away. It would it would be like noticeable. I know in my mind like throwing it in the river would have been
easy but I mean unless they totally just missed it like they searched that river.
It's not there. Which makes me come back to the idea that it could be this guy's
home or something like that wherever he did the dismemberment. Like did he have a place that he could also store the
bike to keep that out of sight? Do you think there's a chance that he could have done everything in like the back of
his van? like this van keeps like popping up in these like sightings and stuff. So, it's a possibility. And
actually, Detective Nichols said something interesting that might play into this. So, she said that whoever
dismembered Kristen had some struggles with her legs. Like one of her upper thighs, either the right or the left,
I'm not sure which one, had some cuts that indicate that her killer had trouble dismembering her, like I said.
So to kind of spell it out for you, Kristen essentially was taken apart at the joints almost like a hunter would
break down an animal. So maybe he's in an area where when you have a limb as big as a leg, like you're you have
issues, right? That's totally possible. >> Like if you're in a van, >> right? Or the other alternative, one of
the reasons he might have had trouble is if you think about a hunter who's used to animals on humans, the hip joint is
higher than you might think, >> which would indicate a hunter versus someone with like medical knowledge,
knowledge of the human anatomy. Like that's not a mistake that they would make. They would know that it sits
higher, >> right? So again, is he like cramped for space or did he not know where to go in
at initially? And again, this is just a theory, and I feel like hunters in rural
Idaho are a dime a dozen. So, who knows if it even means anything. But regardless of the killer's background,
the search for that van is all the more important. So, based on what they know from witness sightings, detectives come
up with a list of plates and vehicles that they want to check. I mean, they literally went to the DMV in Oregon,
pulled registrations for every Oregon plate, ending with a variety of combinations of the reported number
73737, whatever, and then from there, they whittleled it down to just Brown Vans. And then they individually
followed up on every single one. It was timeconuming and difficult and would have been worth it had anything come of
it. But unfortunately, check after check, they don't get anything. They don't get any suspects that seem to
stick. And even though they do a bunch of searches of nearby houses and sheds and barns, basically anywhere that could
hide a very bloody crime scene, that turns up nothing either. They aren't out of things to do yet,
though. A composite sketch is created within the first few days of the investigation based on those witness
reports. And they're fine, but not any more helpful than the vague descriptions we already have of a white guy with
brown hair. But like, forget what this guy looks like. Who is this guy as a person?
>> Like a profile. I love a good profile. >> This one delivers. I'm assuming it's
made by the FBI, though the document doesn't actually say, but we know that they've taken over the case now. And
back in the early 80s, local law enforcement agencies were not profiling like that was the feds. So they put
together this 20 point psychological profile of this guy. >> Okay. White male, probable age 21 to 28
years, living alone or with a girlfriend or mother. Mother would dominate family
if family is together. Considered intelligent but is an underachiever, i.e. Others think he could do much
better than what he does. High school education or better. Probably owns a late model vehicle of which he is proud
of. Cruises the area in his vehicle, which side note, we saw that before. >> Yeah,
>> it was in the Eve Wilkawitz case that we did like I feel like it's a year or so
ago at this point for fan club. And I always wonder where that comes from. Like what about a crime tells you that
someone's into late model cars or has one? >> Well, yeah. And if I'm remembering
correctly in Eve, we thought that like maybe that had been connected to like a witness sighting or something.
>> Yeah, but that was a guess. But here, I don't see any witness statements about a
car like that. I mean, granted, I might not have everything, but I don't know. I'm kind of just wondering if they think
certain types of people are drawn to those. And does that say anything about the larger population who owns these?
like baou call me I have follow-up questions but let's keep going >> probably has an arrest record or
discipline record going back to teen years the record would be for crimes against persons i.e assaults, bites,
violent type acts, has a hard time keeping a job as he considers himself better and more knowledgeable than
others. Therefore, will not follow directions and orders of others. Considers himself superior in
intelligence to law enforcement officers. Therefore, he will follow the investigation and might leave clues as
the investigation progresses to aid police. Might return to the crime scene at later dates to fantasize and relive
the situation. Crime scene occurred in one area and an attempt to hide body and evidence made
by taking it to another area. All in the general area of where subject lives. Souvenirs will be kept for fantasizing
which might include body parts, clothing, and other personal items victims had at the time. So when you
were talking about coin purse, yes, possibly. >> When you were talking about the lower
part of her leg, >> also possibly. This is what I was saying. is obsessed with photographs
might have been taken of the body to help relive event at later date. Victim will not be known to subject but was
available when situation presented itself. Death probably came quickly to victim. No torture. There might not have
been any sexual intercourse before or after death. >> Oh, question. Was the mutilation to
Kristen done pre or postmortem? likely post. According to detective >> number 14, the incident is
psychosexually satisfying to the subject. Although an impersonal event, the victim means nothing to him and he
has no remorse over what he did. Subject will have lived in the area for a period
of time and will be known to various people in his community. Bite marks or stab wounds commonly made after death.
weapon used to cause death will normally be his own as opposed to a weapon of opportunity. Will keep the weapon for a
period of time. As this fantasy wears off, will kill again and more frequently as time passes.
We'll have fantasized about what he would do to a girl if the situation presented itself, i.e. premeditated. And
when the situation does occur, he conducts himself as he has fantasized. and finally might have left the area
after the killing, moving to another town and establishing himself, job, etc. before he will kill again. So, who fits
this psychological profile? >> Yeah, there is no one perfect fit, but there are a ton of men who have come
across investigators radar over the years, and there are a few that I want to talk about because I swear I've said
this a thousand times, it should be a life roll, but I haven't made it short and sweet. But this is a reoccurring
theme where I'll come into a cold case, one where there are no real suspects. It's ice cold and on the surface it
looks like there would be no suspects because like no one's talked about any >> but then you get to see the files and
you dig in and it is the opposite. I am like how can there be this many people around all the time that look so guilty?
Like they can't all be guilty. So like what the heck? It has made me start sideeying every person around me. Like
if I died, like what secrets do you have that would come pouring out? And like I
mean I think that's also just life rule number one, right? You never really know
anyone ever. >> Well then it's life rule 1.1. Like you never really know anyone ever until
their life intersects with a criminal investigation and then there is no hiding >> unless you have a bad detective.
>> Life rule 1.1 point no I'm just kidding. All that to say, even though the Kristen
David case has only publicly been linked to the Louiswis Clark Valley murders and
disappearances, there were plenty of other highly suspicious people that came on law enforcement's radar.
Okay, the first couple of guys that I want to talk about are ones that made a splash for investigators early on, but
then fizzled out pretty quickly. So, first was George Williamson, aka Buzz. Now, Buzz came on police's radar because
he actually made a report about another guy that he thought could have killed Kristen. Now, that other guy gets
cleared, but Buzz remained on police's radar. He lived on the same street as where Kristen was going to stay for part
of the summer. Plus, he matched both the composite sketches and some points in the psychological profile and was known
to be bitter and hateful towards women due to a divorce and custody battle. According to Detective Nichols, Buzz
also claimed to have done some truly horrific stuff like disembowing people in Vietnam when he was deployed there.
He even had a van, although it was purple and yellow and mistaking it for being brown when so many people claimed
to have seen a brown van seems unlikely. >> Yeah, purple and yellow quite different,
>> right? But all of that, like even this though it's suspicious, Detective Nichols told us that the FBI has ruled
him out. Ultimately, they determined that a lot of the claims he made about disembowing people were actually false.
Buzz had been in the military, but he had never been deployed to Vietnam. And all those claims of like what he did
were just like one of numerous lies that he told. Detective Nichols said that while yes, his claims are disturbing,
he's also very mentally ill and makes claims all the time that can't be substantiated. So, while yes, he should
probably stay on police's radar, they don't think he killed Kristen. Plus, that van he owned, he even sold that by
the time Kristen went missing. So, next up, there was Donald White. In an interview with police a few years after
Kristen's body was discovered, Donald talks about his friend, this guy named Larry Kof, who he claims he used to grow
marijuana with. Now, these two guys had a huge falling out after which Dawn's children allegedly started remembering
bouts of sexual abuse from Larry and a teenager named Travis. They also claimed to have seen a woman being trapped in
the basement of this other family that Larry allegedly knew and spent time with. But before we even go spiraling
down this rabbit hole, neither Donald nor Larry were ever really considered legit suspects to begin with. And
Detective Nichols told us that the reason was very similar to Buzz. Donald talked a big game, but when it came time
to actually verify details from his story, he couldn't. Based on what I have, there isn't a ton of detail around
who owned what type of vehicle and who did or didn't get the Lewon paper. And I think these claims are incredibly
concerning, but if those claims could not be verified, like, you know, no, they are there. Did they just say Don
couldn't verify the claims, or did he actually check with Larry's kids and family to try to see if all this was
real? Well, Detective Nichols told us that Dawn's ramblings were immensely drugfueled, she said. And so, after just
like a brief look, they were like, "Yeah, no, like this ain't our guy." And they just kind of moved on. So, that's
Don and Larry. I've spent most of my time digging into someone else. Someone who was a blip on the radar, but maybe
you'll see why. Like, I just am so invested in a second. Let me set the scene. So, I told you early on that
investigators searched for a place that might be the crime scene or where the dismemberment happened, right? Cabins,
abandoned buildings. They were also searching hotels and motel in the area. Well, shortly after Kristen was found,
investigators hear from a housekeeper who worked at the Sack Joa Lodge in Lon, she tells them that on or around June
30th of 1981, she went in to clean one of the rooms and inside she found a bloody bath towel and then a bloody hand
towel. And I'm not talking about like, ooh, I nicked myself shaving like little dabby dabs. She claims that the larger
towel was completely soaked, save for like one corner. Now, she couldn't remember exactly which room she found
the towel in. And when investigators asked for the towel itself, she's like, "Oh, I passed it on so it could be
washed." And then like presumably reused. >> Yeah. I was just like if it's being like
that. >> No, >> this is like a whole side story, but I spent so much time on this. I want I
want all of our listeners, if you work in like the hotel service industry, maintenance, housekeeping, I want to
know your most horrific story because I cannot fathom. >> This feels like it's got to be up there,
but she's so nonchalant about it >> that she's just like, "Another blood soaked towel. Can't wait for the next
I'm going to start bringing my own towels and sheets and everything to hotel rooms. I'm like terrified now that
that towel went back into circulation. >> Yeah. Okay. Um, back on track. Sorry. >> So, okay. So, she finds this bloody
towel again. She didn't keep it. She sent it off >> and no one is jotting down the room
number. She can't even remember what day it is. >> No, but this this is what I'm saying.
Like, I think they see some wild stuff like again fully blood soaked towel like me, another day, another dollar. like
and then you know police come knocking or she hears about this dismembered body and I was like huh I wonder maybe and I
don't even know if it was them like knocking or or like her seeing on the news or something that like started this
whole thing. It might have been the fact that more bloodied stuff was found at the same motel.
>> Okay, what is going on there? >> Girl, I like couldn't tell you. And by the way, this isn't some like remote
little highway. I I affectionately call them murder motel, >> which is exactly what I was expecting.
>> This is like a This is in downtown Lewon, which is like right by the river. I'm not saying this is like New York
City, but it's it's like a big hotel. >> People see it all the time. Yeah. Anyways, so also at this hotel, this
woman finds blood on a padded suitcase stand when she was cleaning over a week later on July 10th. Luckily, she
remembers that it was in room 273. And I don't know if this like joged memories or what. I still don't even
know if these are in the same room or different rooms or >> would anyone have seen the suitcase
stand between June 30th and July 10th? Like could it be from the same incident? >> I don't know because I don't know if
anyone stayed in that room like in between those or even if they did, did they actually like pull that out or did
like leave it out for for housekeeping to see? But police must be at least considering that this is all the same
thing and it might be related to Kristen because one, they search the room and it
yields hair samples that look like they could be from Kristen. And the FBI do tests on those samples. According to
Detective Nichols, one hair sample was consistent with Kristen's hair type and the others were not. But I mean, we know
consistent could mean a lot of things. In the case file, the hair is described as having the quote same microscopic
individual characteristics. End quote. Like that's not enough. That's not a DNA comparison, right? But that's where the
hair testing stood as of 1981. And the number two, the other thing is they start looking into the room and they
specifically look at who stayed in that room right before the bloody towel was found on or around June 30th. And they
found that on June 29th, the room had been rented to a Pete Madson. And the registration clerk remembered him
somehow. She described him as having collar length blondish hair, maybe like 5'9 to 5'11, was tallish, and weighing
between 160 and 180 lb. And she also believes she remembers the car he drove as a yellow oldsmobile.
And lucky for police, she even still had his like check-in paperwork, which included an address that he gave in
EMTT, Idaho. almost 5 hours south of Lewon and information on the car that he said he had with him, like a license
plate number. And he even wrote down it was an Oldsmobile, just like the one the
clerk thought she saw. Except when they try and look this guy up, that's not real. Police match the license plate
number on the registration not to a Peep Madson, but to a guy named Glenn who lived in Boise. And by the way, Glenn
doesn't even drive an Oldsmobile. He drives a Ford. But according to what he told police, like he wasn't even in the
state when Kristen's murder took place. He said that he was in California going to a family's wedding and he had left
his car behind. So either someone stole it, which I don't really think so because we know it's not a Ford that was
there or at least wasn't seen, or someone stole the just the plate on it, or this person just made it up.
>> Or maybe it's someone who Glenn knows who just so happened to know his license
plate number. Yeah, I mean the possibilities are endless, but with the license plate being a bust, they just
decide to focus on the name. And there are a few Pete Madsens that the FBI looks into. There's Peter J. Peter M.
Peter L. Now, it's not clear if like any of these are the Pete Madson, but based
on like identification from driver's license and height and who has connections to where it seems like the
FBI tentatively rules out, and that's their quote, tentatively rules out all of the Pete Madson's. And Jackie
couldn't give us any more information on Pete himself. But of all of them, I think they spent the most time, and most
is like generous cuz there's barely any, but spent the most time on Pete M. Now,
when they looked at the address that was on this registration, right? We know the
plate number is bogus cuz this address that was listed for EMTT Idaho, it doesn't belong to a Pete Madson. It's
registered to someone else. However, this someone else does actually know Pete Madson, who by the way drove a late
model car, a 1970 Oldsmobile. And I'm just going to read from the FBI report cuz it's super interesting to me. So
this person quote advised that Pete Madson resided with him for approximately 3 weeks during June 1981.
On June 26th, 1981, Madson was either in route to Lewon, Idaho, or was staying with them at their home. I'm redacting
the name. Believed that Madson left his residence to go to Moscow, Idaho around 62681 or 62781,
but could not recall the exact date. He stated that Madson presently resides at,
he gives his address, Moscow, Idaho. Madson is a student at the University of Idaho, working on his master's degree.
And then it goes on from there. So, long story short, it seems like this Pete Madson is a real person, but like if he
is connected at all to me is still a mystery. Though again, the FBI says they have tentatively ruled out Pete Madson.
So maybe that's true, but Pete Matson, whoever you are, I would love to know your story.
>> Yeah, I don't think there's a world where a bloody suitcase stand thing and bloody towels turns out to be like an
uninteresting nothing burger a thing in this case. The one thing I'll say is so Detective Nichols told us that she
doesn't necessarily think what was found on the suitcase stand was blood because
there is absolutely nothing on the result of the samples that were taken. And she even has some doubts about the
housekeeper story to begin with because I guess each time she talked to the police, her story just got a little more
like conveniently inepth. Like first she doesn't report the bloody towel, then all of a sudden there's a bloody towel
and then a bloody suitcase stand. And then even later, she said that she saw a man holding a bike on Highway 95. Like,
it just seems like there was more to the story every single time. And it's so specific to Kristen that Detective
Nichols wonders if maybe she embellished her story. >> Still, I can't shake it. Like, it's just
like I get these like little Spidey sense things sometimes. I'm obsessed with this whole Pete thing. And not
because this Pete Madson guy had anything to do with it. Like, everything on that registration seemed to kind of
be bogus. Why? Like was it really someone named Pete Matson or did they just pick like
>> I mean they would have had to know that like >> that guy had a friend named Pete Matson,
>> right? Like there's like so many things that like have to fit perfectly together
for it to be explained. It seems so fantastical. >> But I'll tell you this and this has
nothing to do with anything. But this is like one of those crime junky tangents.
>> So when I got obsessed with this Pete Matson, I'm like who is Pete Madson? Where is he at now?
>> Google. >> Have you Do you have your phone with you? You need >> told me to keep it with me today.
You need to just Google Pete Madson. >> Nothing else. >> Just Google Pete Madson or Peter Madson.
>> Ashley, I watched this documentary. >> What are the odds? >> So, I can't even like summarize it, but
Peter Madson has had like a a submarine and correct me if I'm wrong, like this journalist comes on and is like
interviewing him about the submarine and goes on the submarine for like a ride and then doesn't come back. cuz Peter
Madson dismembered her. >> Yeah. So, cannot It's not the same Peter Madson. Like, liter like the timelines
don't add up. There is no world in which this guy is that guy, >> right? And like the the case that I'm
talking about with the submarine happened in like the like 2017 2018, like >> very new,
>> pretty recently. >> Again, has nothing to do with anything, but when I when I Google and the first
thing to pop up is this, I was like >> Peter Madson murderer >> dismember. I was like, what are the
freaking odds? It was so >> No, that's wild. odd. But obviously that didn't happen earlier and Pete Madsen of
1981 was more of a blip on police's radar. They were far more interested in people like Otis Tulle
and Henry Lee Lucas as they popped onto the radar. Oh, what cases haven't they shown up in?
>> Honestly, I I need to do an actual episode on them someday because I truly don't know what they have or have not
been firmly linked to. But these dudes were like serial confessors. >> I was going to say do an episode. It
would just be a list of >> episodes we've already done. >> Yeah. Crimes that they confessed to that
we've already covered and they have nothing to do with. That would be the episode,
>> especially when you have a case where dismemberment was involved. They tend to
show always show up, especially around this time. But if you know anything about them, I don't think they fit the
profile at all. And there's no point in spiraling here because Detective Nichols
told us that they too have been ruled out. Now, police did spend some time looking into a suspicious butcher.
>> Oh. >> Which I was like, "Huh?" Like, again, I know we said we're looking for someone
with medical knowledge, but like we talked about a hunter. >> Yeah. And a a butcher would like fit
into that sort of like knowledge base, >> especially when you think about the fact
that each body part was wrapped in newspaper. Like that feels very butcheresque to me.
>> Yeah. Like wrapping meat in butcher paper. Yeah. >> So, this guy uh his name is Mike Spring.
He comes on the scene because in September of 1981, he wrecked his pickup truck, but then left the scene of the
accident. And when a state trooper found the wreckage, he found several large knives inside,
>> which like might not be suspicious for a butcher or like meat cutter. >> Maybe not. But when they tracked Mike
down, they learned that he went by a completely different name. >> Oh, Jim Blunk, which turned out to be
his real name. So, Mike Spring was just an alias. And I'm not sure what exactly made
investigators zero in on him at the time. But when he was asked what he was doing the day that Kristen vanished, he
claimed to be out of town. And although there is nothing in the report explicitly stating that his alibi was
confirmed, Detective Nichols told us that they must have confirmed it or found some other reason to eliminate him
because she said that he was definitely eliminated. And I looked him up because like my biggest thing in these is like
just because something was done a bazillion years ago if something is still unsolved maybe like go back and
check. >> I was going to say like I feel like this is such a like such a situation where it
could be like but did we cross that tea? Like how many times have we said like well they must have been ruled out
because we aren't talking about them today and that hasn't been the case. >> I've met so many investigators who are
working a cold case and the file leaves something open-ended and I'm like so how
do you know this guy's ruled out? And they're like oh we just know >> we moved on.
>> He like oh somebody before me did it. I'm like, "Yeah, but how." And if you can't say how,
>> like, "Show your work." Right? >> All that to say, I'm not saying that the FBI has that wrong. I probably don't
have a lot. But with most of these people, I'm like looking up just to see, hey, has anything happened between 1981
and now that would like stand out? The only record I could find on this guy was like a DUI. So, you can see a lot was
happening in 1981. Lots of men are coming on their radar for nefarious reasons. But then comes 1982.
That's when someone comes on their radar for writing a song. >> Okay. A song feels like a crime junkie
first. >> I know. And I love that I still have first with you. Like I just hate that
it's this because this song will make your skin crawl. So, in 1982, there is this student at
Washington State University who wrote a song called I don't want to go to jail. And this song had been printed in a
program promoting a rugby game. And I have the lyrics, but like I hope I'm doing a good job at pretending I'm okay.
I'm like starting to get really sick and lose my voice. And so, if you don't mind, I'm actually I planned on reading
it, but I'm going to have you read it instead. Oh, this is like a proper song. Okay.
>> That they printed. Just stop. I can't. >> I don't want to go to jail. I don't want
to go to jail. I met a girl and I really had to know her. Only a few ways I could
really show her. I built a fire and threw her up on top. And as I walked away, she began to snap, crackle, and
pop. Put her in the bathtub, threw in the radio, and as I turned away, she began to glow. Had her over for dinner,
put glass in her food. As she began to choke, the blood really spewed. Jabbed a knife in her uterine wall. Now she can't
have any children at all. Reached down her throat and I pulled out some veins, cracked her skull like an egg, and
poured out her brains. You guys, I'm only like halfway through. It keeps going. I took a fork and stuck it in her eye.
Now she can't laugh, and by God, she can't even cry. I took an axe and nipped off all her toes. I took all 10 of them
and stuffed them up her nose. I took barbed wire and wrapped it around her throat, threw her in the river just to
see if she would float. >> Mhm. >> I tied her down and plucked out both of her eyes, smeared her with honey, and
left her for the flies. threw her in the oven, turned it on to broil, and when I
opened the door, she was stuck to the coils, broke both her legs, and I poured out all the marrow, cut off big hunks of
her flesh, and fed them to the sparrows. Now I'm in jail, and I love her oh so much. I kept her hand so we could keep
in touch. And then there's a little note at the bottom that says, "Repeat as many times
as intelligence permits." Ashley, we've talked about this before. You have me read some of the most horrific things on
these episodes. This might take the cake. >> So, this guy, apparently, it wasn't just
him that wrote it. He said it was him and a group of his buddies. >> Okay. Why write it? And then also this was
published advertising like a sports game at the school. What what happened here?
>> Yeah. How are you like, you know, we're just going to like skip over the national anthem. Let's print this
instead. Like the8s were a lawless time. And I'm not going to say this guy's name. We looked into him. No criminal
record. Detective Nicholls says that this was just this dude being a dumb kid. >> A really dumb kid.
>> I agree. I mean like how you have to like I don't know. But anyways, this guy
is one of the few people who actually like picked up the phone and talked to us for this episode. He's like, "Listen,
this was a really stupid thing to do. We did it as a joke when I was like drunk with my buddies." And I guess he says
that like writing traditional like rugby songs or writing rugby rugby songs is some kind of tradition and normally
they're more sexual in nature. So, I don't know if like that was like a justification for what is happening on
this page. But he in the end, like to us, he claimed that he didn't even know who Kristen David was. And by the way,
that even though this came on police's radar, I know it did, they never actually spoke to him. So, they must not
have taken this very seriously. Now, even though they never questioned him, there was a woman's rights group who
wrote an article in the paper basically calling him out for all of this. Okay. But I'm kind of stuck on the fact that
police never even so much as talked to this guy. Like that seems kind of bonkers.
>> I know. He he even claims so I mean he told us he regrets writing the song but
he says that he didn't even know that his name had been brought up because I mean that's how much it's not like they
asked around about him or anything like it never even made it back to him that this song made it to police about this
crime. >> But like I can't help but see a lot of parallels in this song to the FBI
profile to what we know about the crime scene. Well, I feel like you I hope you heard it while I was reading the lyrics.
Like, there are like >> very direct parallels, >> right? And like, sure, okay, the FBI
says that he didn't do anything. You know, he doesn't have a criminal record when we look it up now. All fine and
good, but like, you know, my question is like, who are these people he wrote it with? Like,
>> right, >> I bet they would fit square into this profile, too. I have a lot of questions
still about this, but I seem to be the only one. Now, there are more people like this kid who pop up for weird
reasons, but who are either deemed not even worth looking into or who quickly get ruled out. I mean, the case file is
full of them. But there is one guy who Detective Nichols is still suspicious of all these years later, a man named Harry
Hatman. Harry was originally arrested for the sexual assault and murder of a young
girl in 1968, but he escaped the facility that he was being held at and remained on the run
for years. And he lived in a remote cabin in Hell's Canyon, Oregon, which is like 2 hours from Lewon, Idaho. Now,
when he was on the loose, they ended up finding out that he committed several violent crimes in the area, including
abducting a woman. And then he finally gets rearrested in 1993. like he was he was on the run for a long time. So,
Detective Nichols has always wondered if he could have abducted Kristen, taken her to his remote cabin hours away from
Lewon, killed her, and dismembered her there. Detective Nichols even says that Harry was somewhat of a career student,
like he would go to various colleges and take classes when he could, presumably even while he was in hiding. So, it's
possible that he could have gone to the University of Idaho where he saw Kristen. We also know that he was a big
game hunter and previously had driven vans, although it's still unknown if he actually drove a brown van at the time
of Kristine's disappearance. And unfortunately, he's not around to even ask anymore. As much as Detective
Nichols was suspicious of him, he died by suicide in 1994. So, I have to ask because it's kind of the
guy who brought us here. Does Lance Voss ever show up in any of Kristen's case files? So that's what's so interesting
to me. No, Lance, if you didn't listen to last week, he is this guy that everyone talks about in connection with
a lot of the crimes that were happening in this area, disappearances, murders, >> which is like Kristen gets lumped into
in a lot of them. >> He is not mentioned once in what I've seen, which really, at least for me,
confirms that she's probably not related to the other murders and disappearances
in the valley. But for some reason, like you said, she keeps getting lumped in. And I think that can cause real harm,
you know, like maybe someone hasn't come forward with information because the public has tunnel vision or the public
thinks like, oh, police must be thinking this is right. They don't think necessarily that he did anything to
Kristen. But that is not to say that her case isn't connected to others. Maybe we're just looking at the wrong suspect.
Dismemberment is a very specific method. >> What was done to her body in death was
specific. And this does not feel like something that just happened as a one-off out of the blue. There are other
dismemberment cases in the Pacific Northwest area around this time frame. But what if one part of the profile
that's wrong is the part about this guy being local? And I know there was a part
in the profile that suggests like maybe he like like knew the area for a little bit. Like what I think is like what if
he was local for a minute, say like stationed nearby, but he moved around. Because recently I've been looking into
a former military man. His specific job in the military was as a medical lab specialist. And it seems like wherever
this guy traveled, dismembered women showed up. Colorado, South Carolina, Idaho, Wisconsin, Illinois, Georgia.
Dismembered with precision. Plastic bags often left around water, but not always.
specific ways in which the women were killed before they were dismembered. I'm not going to go into detail on the other
cases because I can't say 100% that they are all connected or connected to this man yet. But I find it very interesting
that this happylooking family man on Facebook in 2025 was actually charged with murder on a
military base in his early years while stationed overseas. He got off on a technicality and continued to serve and
be transferred all over the country. And by the way, if you look this guy up the
way I've been looking up other people to like look at his criminal record, there
is not one that pops up, which that's the part I can't wrap my head around. I don't know why none of this is showing
up, even though I know other agencies have talked to him. And also, I found it really interesting that years down the
line, his son was later convicted of a brutal murder and he had some choice things to say about his dad and his
upbringing. And listen, I know I am being vague, but it is because I can't say much yet. I usually don't bring all
of our crime junkies in until way later in the investigation, but I actually want to try something new. You guys have
proven to be an invaluable resource, and all of your eyes and ears and brains combined is better than months of my own
heads down researching alone, which I am still not stopping. But here's what I need. I'm looking for more cases that
could fit into a similar mo. Cases that happened in the 70s, 80s, '90s, maybe in
the early 2000s. We're looking for murdered women who were dismembered, bound in trash bags, and whose bodies
might have showed signs of mutilation. Specifically, cases where body parts were cut off in addition to the
dismemberment. Or cases where even after the remains of the victims were recovered, parts of the limb or part of
the victim was still missing. The case you're thinking of might just fit some or even all of what I mentioned. But if
you know of one in your area that is close to what I said, please email tips@auudiochuck.com.
There is a very real possibility that Kristen's case isn't connected to the military man I'm looking into. But
whoever killed her, I have to believe that he did it before or after. And whether Kristen is connected or not,
people are looking into her case. Detective Nichols told us that testing led by the FBI continues to this day,
especially on those newspapers. and they wouldn't hate a helpful tip to nudge their investigation along. So, if you
know something specifically about Kristen's murder or someone you think might be worth looking into, reach out
to the FBI office in Salt Lake City. Remember the profile. He would have been young. Sounds like maybe a bit of a
narcissist. And there are likely other murders that have popped up wherever he goes. Maybe he owned a late model
vehicle. Maybe he has or had a brown van. Maybe he let something slip. and you're remembering it now as I'm
talking. If that's you, reach out to the FBI and let us know, too. This is a story we're actively following and
reporting, so we would love to hear from you. Again, that is tipsuck.com, and we'll have the FBI's contact info in
the episode notes. You can find all the source material for this episode on our website, crimejunkypodcast.com.
>> And you can follow us on Instagram, crimejunk podcast. >> We'll be back next week with a brand new
episode. [Applause] [Music]

Today, we take a look into the troubling unsolved murder of Kristin David, a 22-year-old University of Idaho student who vanished in June 1981 while cycling along Highway 95 from Moscow to Lewiston, Idaho. Days later, her dismembered remains were discovered in garbage bags along the Snake River, wrapped in pages of the Lewiston Tribune. With leads pointing to a mysterious brown van and connections to the eerie Lewis-Clark Valley murders, Detective Jackie Nichols and the FBI continue to investigate this haunting cold case. With our original reporting and investigators, we have gathered new details and other possible connections. We hope that as we explore the details, suspects, and lingering questions surrounding this tragic mystery, new answers will surface to help bring justice to Kristin David's case.

More details about Kristin David's case can be found in last week's Crime Junkie episode - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OZGzu-CQ4Q

For even more stories like this one, join the Crime Junkie Fan Club today: https://crimejunkiepodcast.com/fanclub?utm_source=youtube&utm_medium=episode_description&utm_campaign=signupfanclub

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About Ashley Flowers Ashley Flowers is the top female podcaster in the U.S. and the host of Crime Junkie, the #1 podcast among women and the #1 true crime podcast globally. As the Founder of audiochuck, she has built a top-tier podcast production company that has garnered over 2.6 billion downloads, captivating audiences with its gripping storytelling through 10+ chart topping podcasts. Ashley and her team are dedicated to creating responsible true crime content that respects victims and their families.

Follow Ashley: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ASHLEYFLOWERS/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/ash_flowers TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ashleyflowerscrimejunkie Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ashleyflowers.af/

Check out these other great crime channels: @bellafiori The Case of Misty Copsey https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xapky5Nq98 @kallmekris The Most Dangerous Cult In The World | Aum Shinrikyo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qz9KYxRj8bk @rottenmangopod Karen Read Says She’s “Framed For Murder” -No One Believes Til Shady Cops CAUGHT Editing CCTV Video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5B5FU02pPzc @KendallRae How Did His Body End Up On The Burn Pile?! The Case of Gary Farris https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FR-bJpFpPo

Brief Summary

Kristen David, a University of Idaho student, was found dismembered in 1981; the investigation reveals multiple suspects and ongoing challenges.

Key points

The Mysterious Disappearance of Kristen David. 22-year-old Kristen David vanished while biking back to her apartment, sparking a massive search.
Gruesome Discovery in the Snake River. A fisherman discovers black garbage bags containing parts of Kristen's dismembered body.
The Killer's Methodology. Investigators uncover clues suggesting the killer had medical knowledge or prior experience.
The Psychological Profile of the Suspect. FBI creates a psychological profile of the potential killer based on witness reports.
The Bloody Towel Discovery. A housekeeper finds a bloody towel in a hotel room, raising suspicions.
The Mysterious Pete Madson. Investigators track down a man named Pete Madson linked to the case, but his identity is questionable.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

I think she very well could be a victim of a serial killer.

Speculating on the nature of the crime.

0:35WatchJul 31, 2025

Tension

65/ 100Some tension

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