Carnival of Lies ////// Part 2 | Forensic Files

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true crime. >> [music] >> On Memorial Day weekend in 1991, Michelle Lodzinski, then 21 years old,
told police that her 5-year-old son, Timmy, vanished at a carnival in Sayreville, New Jersey.
She claimed he went missing while she was standing in line to get him a soda, prompting what would turn into a massive
and nationwide search for the little boy. Now, as you can see from episode one, Michelle is a big part of the
investigation, not just because she is the mother of the missing boy, but there are a lot of persons involved in the
investigation who are suspicious of the mother and her statements regarding the night that her son went missing. Now, as
said, a major red flag for me, uh, part of what we covered in episode one was her moving. Like, I get what she's
saying about moving away because of all the media attention and the cameras that were on her home at
the time, but I've never liked it when the parents of a missing child move away, especially this early in the case.
As the reports go, it was roughly 2 weeks. So, about 2 weeks after the boy goes missing that she moves.
>> Yes, normally I would agree with you, but we have Michelle is not stable. So, she's changing jobs often. She
changes her location of where she lives often, and also she's having financial difficulties. So, was
this excuse to get out of whatever lease she was in or whatever because she was having financial difficulties.
>> Well, and that's a keen observation there, my friend, because if she were, as I imagine, probably
living paycheck to paycheck, that means, look, the rent ain't going to pay itself, right? So, if your son goes
missing, your child goes missing, going to work is not your first priority. She may have had to call in a favor to
the landlady and say, "Hey, can I can I step out of this property because I'm not going to be able to make the
rent anymore. I'm not working currently." We do know that she had relatives that she relied on often. So,
I'm assuming a move meant that she went to go stay with folks that could help her. So, she's not leaving the area
per se, but again, look, and this will actually go along with some of her statements later
to police that I think doubles down on why it's a concern for me and a bit of a red
flag. At the center of this, to me, mom always leaves the light on for her kid. The good ones, anyway. Always
leaves the front porch light on letting the kid know, "We are here. We have been
waiting for you to return." In part, Captain, that's why we we called it the Porch Light Project. Leaving that porch
light on for those lost ones. Keeping hope alive that there will be somebody will return, somebody will be found, or
there will be some form of justice for the wrongs that were committed against that person. Go to porchlightonline.org
to learn more if you wish or to participate. Some of the investigators were convinced of one major detail in
this scenario that turns everything in this case upside down. Some were simply convinced that Timmy
was never at that carnival. He was never at that carnival that evening. >> Right.
>> Now, of course, if this is true, that leaves one simple fact. Whatever happened to him whatever happened to
Timmy to cause his disappearance happened before Michelle herself arrived at the
carnival. And therefore, she is responsible and she knows what happened to her son.
>> The other question I have is the individuals that she ran into that were they were related to her, correct?
>> Mhm. >> Did she know that they were going to be there? >> That's a good question because when I
first started reviewing this case, one portion that was quite confusing to me was remember she was supposed to pick up
a niece and take the niece to the carnival or as the story goes. One of the two people that she bumps
into at the carnival is her niece, but so Michelle comes from a a larger family.
She's got a bunch of siblings. It's my understanding that the niece that she bumps into is not the
same as the one she was supposed to pick up. >> Right. >> The interesting thing here is
the statement that the niece the person that was with her when she bumps into Michelle is also someone of So, that
niece's name is Jennifer. The person with her is Jennifer's age and also someone who had babysat
Timothy at least on one occasion. So, the people she's bumping into know both her and her son. I find that to be
rather interesting because they have insights into both the person that they find who is looking for her
son and the person who is missing. People close to Michelle described her as devoted to her son, devoted to Timmy.
Yet after the disappearance, investigators and to some observers, they were suspicious of her demeanor
believing that Michelle did not seem affected in the way that one would expect. Saying that she was she showed very
little emotion during the search for her boy. Now, her father does go on record saying
that that's my daughter. That's how she's always been. She doesn't show a lot of emotion when she's around people.
She doesn't react dramatically to situations when she's in front of a crowd or around a bunch of people, but
behind closed doors, he says that she is very emotional and it's his statement that she was emotional behind closed
doors regarding her son being missing. >> But like I said, every point in this story, there's a
argument for looking at her as a suspect and not looking at her as a suspect. >> Then came
the part of this investigation and the part of the story that is so very difficult.
It's her changing her accounts of the night in question. So, I was hesitant, Captain, to go through
that night as Michelle first described it as it has changed a lot over time. Her story has changed from slight
variations to extremely different versions of that same story. >> Right. >> We will circle back to that in a bit,
but the the changing stories led to further questioning from police investigators and FBI.
And further questioning of Michelle then led to her failing two polygraph examinations.
So, Michelle took two polygraph tests, one administered by the FBI. This was two days after the night at the
carnival. And another about a week later. The second one was conducted by the Middlesex County Prosecutor's Office and
said she failed both. According to officials, test administrators described her as emotionally inconsistent and
unusually focused on how she was doing during the exam. This one's tricky. This point of the
case is tricky for me because we've had experts who administer these tests and say that when they are conducted
properly, they're a very great tool. We've had We've had law enforcement members, both
FBI and police, who have stated that they can be a good tool and you could use them in a different
in a number of different ways in your investigation or when talking to a witness or a suspect, but not to put a
whole lot of weight into if somebody passes or fails. Now, back to something that John Douglas told us, legendary FBI
agent, criminal profiler, told us that often times when interviewing a parent, he said especially a father,
but he did say when interviewing a parent, he would expect them to fail the exam because they hold a certain
level of guilt even when they're innocent in the matter because a child because a parent naturally wants to
protect their child and if your child is missing or dead, you failed to protect them. So, you are you are guilty in that
regard. What I'm about here, Captain, when we we see certain cases where the police want
once they seem to hone in on somebody and it looks like they're really honing in on Michelle here,
their stance on everything and even their posturing on everything see is all always
presenting that same argument that everything points to this person. Everything that in our investigation is
pointing to this person. So, of course, her failing two polygraph examinations points to her being guilty and doing
something to her son, being responsible for why he's missing. But, if Douglas is right,
she failed because of guilt. I want to know what were the questions she failed on.
Are those questions that would be one would fail because they the person holds some guilt in their hearts and on
their minds? >> Right. >> Not because they did something wrong, but because they couldn't protect their
son? Or were these questions that actually would point to her being a good suspect for his disappearance?
And also to the average Joe, as we said many watching on TV found her to be far too composed during
her time with the media. We went through some of the good parenting statements from folks in
episode 1. Now, let's look at the other side of that coin. These are statements made to
investigators and to the DA's office. This is from two men that dated Michelle and from a one of her babysitters.
Now, she had a lot of babysitters, so let's keep in mind, I don't know, we don't know, it's never been reported if
this was somebody who babysat often or if it was a once or twice thing. Now, of these men,
this is from a man who for a short time was actually engaged to Michelle. So, this is a former fiance.
He was sharply critical of Michelle's parenting. He said he believed that she wasn't
attentive enough to the boy. And he said that he thought that Michelle acted more like an older sister
than a mother. He pointed to an incident that he claimed illustrated the lack supervision.
>> Yeah, but a neglectful parent is is one thing. To murder your child is a whole
different animal. >> Well, and to be clear, using his words, he doesn't say neglectful. He says
that she was just not as attentive as he thought she should be and that had lack
supervision for a youngster. This is So, she He's pointing to an incident when Timothy needed stitches after being
bitten by a dog that lived next door. Okay? And the man who was the fiance at the time
said that he had warned Michelle multiple times about letting the boy play outside in the backyard unattended,
especially while the dog was out there and and loose. >> Right. >> From my understanding, that engagement
ended well before Timothy disappeared, but criticism of Michelle's decisions did not come only from
this one romantic partner. As we said, from one of Timmy's babysitters, this babysitter described an occasion
when she was watching Timmy late at night while Michelle was out, and according to her account, Michelle
called that night, asked her to allow Timmy to leave with a man who the babysitter said that she did not
know. So, the babysitters tells mom no, so she refuses. Michelle doesn't like this. She returned
home, and according to the sitter, she forced Timothy into a car that was driven by Michelle's then boyfriend at
the time, his name Fred Bruno, and the babysitter said that she believed that little Timothy was
terrified of Bruno. >> And we do have evidence that she has a bad picker. >> Or trouble staying in a relationship.
>> Right. But again, this goes back to what I said. I mean, she's just she's not
stable in almost any aspect of her life. >> True. >> But some of that could just be maturity.
>> Well, she's 23, right? We We keep We are looking at this as she's a mother, but
>> Well, again, she's still young and >> 23's very young. >> Yeah. >> I told you, I said on the show before, I
had a soft spot on my head till I was 26. >> Maybe 27. We're not >> No. Nope. Don't you start. Okay, so
>> Doctor was still concerned. >> That's right. >> [laughter] >> Put on a helmet, sir.
>> Yes. >> Michelle Lodzinski's inconsistent accounts are what we need to get into.
We said we would circle back to it. So, the investigation into Timothy Wiltsey's
disappearance highlighted multiple inconsistencies in statements from his mother, Michelle. And I as I said, some
of them are slight- -ly different versions of that story, and others are dramatically
drastically different. So, Michelle told investigators that she and Timothy spent
that afternoon at Holmdel Park before going to an evening carnival, right? The park police
reported that the lot The parking lot where she said she parked her car was actually closed that day.
They said that they found no one who saw her and Timothy at that park. >> Yeah, that's a
>> It's >> It's a little bit of a red flag. >> It's suspicious, but it's also not It's
not 100% conclusive, right? She could have just parked her car elsewhere. >> Mhm. [clears throat]
>> Um there could have been a discrepancy there, and she I'm sure we've I'm sure
I've been to a park or you've been to a park at one point, and nobody else saw you there.
>> Well, especially if I wear all camo. >> Now, we also pointed out that the last
confirmed sighting of Timothy by someone other than Michelle was that neighbor who said that
they had saw the two of them earlier that day. So, we have that confirmed sighting, but the
the problem is after that, other than these two carnival workers who didn't know Michelle, didn't know Timmy, that
said that I think that's who I saw, we don't have anybody else saying that they saw Timmy and mom together that
evening. Now, more than a week after Timothy disappeared, Michelle was interviewed by police in
Sayreville and claimed that two men with a knife took her son and threatened her into silence.
>> Wait. >> [snorts] >> That's a much different story than I was buying a soda and turned around and he
was gone. >> Mhm. >> So, let's go back to the original statement with the I I was hesitant to
report what her original statement was because there's been multiple variations of that and I don't know where those
variations come from. So, in some of those variations, she and Timmy are in line together at the refreshment stand
to buy a soda. She's waiting on change for the $10 bill, turns and he's gone. >> Mhm.
>> The other variation of that is that she he was in line for a ride and she didn't want him to lose his
place. He wanted something to drink. The refreshment stand was was right nearby the ride. She walks
over just a few steps, hops in line to get the soda. After she gets her change for the $10
bill, turns back expecting to see him still in line for that ride nearing the front of the line, and he's no longer
there. So, that's a slightly different variation, but I don't know where those I don't know that both of them I can't
say with 100% certainty that they both came from Michelle. What I can say with 100% certainty is
this version of that same story, which is completely different, did come from Michelle, and it was a statement that
she gave to police at the Sayreville Police Department. A week after her son went missing, she says two men with a
knife took her son, threatening her into silence. >> That's bizarre. When police challenged her on this,
the report is that she walked out of the interview, and that later that same day
she returned to the police department with her sister and a friend, and recanted her statement from that
day. >> But, it makes you wonder how was that questioning going? Was she volunteering
this information up, or were they We've seen this happen multiple times where it's not an interrogation, it's a
questioning that turns into an interrogation. >> Where it's accusatory, yeah. >> Right. And the person starts going, "I'm
trying to remember. I'm trying to remember." And then they start tossing out these [ __ ] stories. I mean,
sometimes uh claiming that they're the killer, right? I'm trying to remember. I'm trying to
figure out, you know, so is it possible that that's what this was? And then she goes, "Well, maybe
these two guys at knife point kidnapped." You know what I mean? So, >> Right. We've seen that in in multiple
cases. The yogurt shop case comes to mind. >> Yeah. >> But, it doesn't end there, my friend.
The next day, this is during a long, confrontational interview. So, this is reported as being
very long, very confrontational. She seemed to offer up a third version of the story. It still involves the two
men, but now involves a woman. So, she says two men and a woman took Timothy after the woman offered to watch
him briefly while Michelle went to get sodas so he could keep his place in line for a ride that he wanted to go on.
Michelle said that she knew the woman as Ellen. Now, she says what's tricky about this Ellen person is
it's unclear if she claims to have known the woman by name or by a nickname or remembers her to be Ellen because she
describes this Ellen as a local go-go dancer who at one time was a customer at the bank where she had worked at one
time. Uh she worked there as a teller. So, this story's very complicated because she claims that this woman would
cash her checks at the bank where she worked and that's how she knew the woman. What's weird about this story though,
and I I'll I'll circle back to Ellen. It's weird for all kinds of levels. >> Yeah.
>> I don't know why I always say that. [laughter] It's one thing that's weird. >> you're an idiot.
>> I'm a [ __ ] It's that soft spot. It never, you know. >> It never Well, you said it healed.
>> It did. It's solid now, but it it's brain damaged. >> Sometimes it opens back up.
>> But remember there were teenage boys that said that they thought they saw a little boy with two men and a woman
leaving the park, leaving the festival. >> Yeah. Yeah, I was that's what I was going to bring up.
>> So, that is crazy. But then Okay, so then the FBI's like, all right, well, let's figure out who this Ellen person
is. And it's not their first investigation. So, what do they do? They go to the bank
who's going to have records of all of these transactions. >> Right. >> But they only need to hone in on the
time that she worked there. And I don't know how long she worked at this bank, but we we went through
we'll go through some of her other work history later, but some of these jobs she only held for a handful of months.
And what the FBI says is at no point does a woman named Ellen cash a check at that bank
when Michelle worked there. So if this woman exist, either she has the name completely wrong or she's the
woman doesn't exist >> Or it's a nickname. >> and she made it up. So basically the FBI
their statement is we tried, we cannot locate Ellen in air quotes in any capacity and we are actually unsure if
this woman even exists. >> Yeah, but then the eyewitnesses that see the two men with the lady and
the child. >> Mhm. >> But there's probably a lot of two men and a lady and a little child at the
carnival. >> Now remember the boyfriend Fred Bruno who the babysitter said she thought Timmy was terrified of this
guy? >> Yes. >> We need to point out here like Fred Bruno was beyond cooperative with police
to the point of like trying to help them snare her in some kind of trap. Okay, so
he he's her boyfriend at the time. Police arranged with Michelle's boyfriend Fred Bruno
to call her while they sat in and monitored the conversation trying to get to see what she would say
about her son being missing, what happened that night and so on and so forth. >> Right.
>> During this call, she refused to discuss details by phone and told him she would
talk to him, but only in person. So, the next day the two meet up. Bruno picks her up.
They're in his vehicle, but prior to him arriving, they planted a microphone in Fred
Bruno's vehicle. He knows this, she does not. >> Well, some people report that they shoved it
right up his butt. >> Now, during this conversation So, they talk about Timmy being missing. And during
this conversation, what was recorded on that butt phone was that Michelle repeated the Ellen account and
said that she had originally withheld it at first because she feared that people
would think that she was a bad mother for leaving Timothy briefly with someone she barely knew.
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the air. >> You used to call me on my butt phone. >> Phone. Yeah. >> All right, let's get serious. Here,
Captain, this is a serious situation. >> my phone up my butt, I like to put it on
vibrate. Just for the record. >> Well, that's one way you can guarantee that no one at Crime Con will pick up
your cell phone from our our table. >> [laughter] >> All right. The following day,
we have Michelle. She's at the police station once again. She's being interviewed once again. And this time
the interview is reported to have taken about 5 hours. During this interview, she repeats the Ellen story, but she
amended it a little bit adding that at one at one point one of the men held a knife to her throat.
>> Mhm. >> And I tell you what, I've heard even more versions than this about these
different stories. I I think there was an account where at one time they had threatened to cut the boy's face
if she didn't shut up. So when again when challenged by police she, according to police, she's the one
that ended the interview abruptly, telling police, "Hey, if you want to charge me with something, charge
me. If not, I'm leaving." Part of this story is crazy. And this goes back to the idea
of she moved because during that interview, what police would say is that she not only did she repeat the same
account of the Ellen story, but she's also saying that they told her this these mystery men and and the woman,
Ellen, told Michelle that they would they would taking the boy and that they would return him unharmed
in about a month if she stayed quiet. >> Yeah, but that this reminds me of the case where the the boys are missing
and but the dad says that he left them with somebody, but he won't tell people who he left them with.
>> Yeah, the case that's another case out of Michigan. >> Don't go to Michigan. >> The skeleton boys.
>> Yeah. Skeleton brothers. >> This part I is important that we report this as well because
after this interview, her friends are concerned about her appearance, her well-being.
They drove her straight from the interview to the hospital. And she was like malnourished, dehydrated. She
appeared to be having a mental breakdown as well. So good for her friends. Maybe
[snorts] some of this is plays into what she's saying during this interview. >> Right.
>> It's it's really hard to say. She's going to She's going to stick to this story though for a very long time as
we're about to see. 5 days later, an investigator from the county prosecutor's office interviewed Michelle
at her home with a similar result. She became increasingly hostile, gave short answers, then burst into tears, said her
son was the most important thing in the world to her, and ordered the investigators to leave the home.
Just before Timothy's birthday, that So, now we're in early August 1991. Renewed media attention followed
his birthday. Michelle went and visited her sister in Florida. Remember her sister One of her sisters is down in
Florida. She went down to Florida to visit her sister for 2 weeks, and during that time
she sought counseling. Now we get to the sneaker part of this story. We have to get into
the sneaker story. This is from the Home News out of New Brunswick, New Jersey. They ran an article by Jennifer
Hutchinson dated November 19th, 1991. Pay attention to that date, November 19th, 1991. The headline was "Missing
Boy's Sneaker May Have Been Located." The article included a map marking where a sneaker was found.
>> Yeah, but this sneaker is interesting. >> Yeah, it's very interesting. So, a brief
description here, a white a color white child's size 13 sneaker was found in a swampy area of Edison,
New Jersey. And the article says that that sneaker that was found may have been worn by the missing boy,
Timothy, who's been missing since May 25th, 1991. As the story goes, the discovery and then the handoff of this
piece of potential evidence, October 26th, so almost a month before the news article.
October 26, 1991, Daniel O'Malley, he's a science teacher at Bound Brook Junior and Senior High School.
He says he found a mud-coated sneaker while walking in a marsh near Raritan Center, which is a large industrial park
off of Woodbridge Avenue near Middlesex County College. So, he brought the sneaker to the Sayreville police who
were investigating Timothy's disappearance. And police summoned Timothy's mother,
Michelle, to come to the police department to inspect the sneaker. So, this is all going on in October. We'll
get to why the news article came almost a month later here here in a second, but what police say is that
when she gets to the police department, she looks over the sneaker, she could not confirm that it was Timothy's.
And we we need to I need to be clear about this. This is where parts of the story get very difficult because we
don't get to have the privilege of sitting in on that conversation between mom and detectives. All we get is mom
talking to the newspapers. So, what we get is basically the detectives say mom comes in and told us it wasn't Timothy's
sneaker. Mom tells the newspapers she's a bit vague, but she's kind of like I can't confirm or I can't say that
it is his, I can't say that it's not his. Which could also be what she told police.
>> Yeah, it's very difficult because I think simply you go these are newer shoes that she bought.
How can she not recognize them? >> True, but she's looking at this shoe in October.
>> Yeah. >> The boy went missing in almost exactly 5 months prior, and she's simply saying, "Look, when when they
showed me the shoe, it was covered in heavy mud and the time that's gone by since his disappearance, I can't confirm
that it was Timmy's. So, her her version of how that went down is she says, "I couldn't say it was his. I couldn't say
that it wasn't his." Police tell the paper she said it wasn't his. >> Right. >> Now, what we do know happened, this is
fact, we can prove this. She did later return to the police station with another pair of Timmy's shoes. And she
said that she brought them to the police department to compare the soles of the shoes because she said, "Hey, look, my
son when he wears his shoes, he tends to wear down one side of the shoe." >> Yeah.
>> And she said, "When I was there looking at the shoe that you asked me to identify, I didn't think to look at the
soles. So, here's the sole of the shoe. So, here's some shoes that he wore prior, can you compare them?" Now,
regarding the shoes that he was wearing at the time that he went missing, this is months before the sneaker was found.
She did give police a shoe box. The empty shoe box for the pair of shoes that he was wearing. Okay, so the shoe
box would describe the shoes, right? It says green Ninja Turtle, it was so it was a
green Ninja Turtles box stating white, color white, size 13, stock number 0758. The sneaker that was found was white in
color, youth size 13. It shows Raphael, the one that wears the red color >> Mhm.
>> turtle on the but it only shows his face for my understanding. Now, the stock
number listed inside matches 0758. Now, a local shoe store manager did caution everyone. Caution police and
said, "Sometimes different styles from the same maker can share a stock number." But again, police discounted it
as being Timmy's shoe, which seems bizarre to me. The stock number is the same, the description is the same.
You're already not trusting Mom by this time. So, why then do you say to the papers later, "Well, she said it wasn't
his, so we took her word for it." That seems weird to me. >> Yeah. >> You either trust somebody or you don't.
Like, you can't pick and choose. >> Well, you can. >> Well, I guess I guess they did.
>> Right. They did. So. >> Yeah. >> Evidence that you can. >> They said that when they originally
interviewed Michelle, she reacted strongly in October that the shoe was not her son's.
She told the police during that conversation that Timmy's shoes had many Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles on them,
including villains, and the stamps showed their bodies, not just faces. So, those details obviously would not
have matched up with the shoe they found. Now, this Dan O'Malley dude, I I like this guy. I Other than Other than
Timmy, he's my favorite guy, my favorite person in the story. So, O'Malley said he found the sneaker after he was
attending a baseball card show with a friend that was held at the Raritan Center Expo- Exposition Center
at the Raritan Center Exposition Hall in October of 1991. He and the friend drove down Olympic
So, this is described as a deserted, unlit road with no houses. They say that they parked at the end of
this road, and they walked into the swamp area, the the marsh area, to look at wildlife. They were both
They're both into wildlife. And so, they just wanted to take a little walk in the area while they're
out there. He says he spots the shoe, and it seemed familiar to him because he had followed the story in the paper.
So, he turns it into the police. >> Mhm. >> Well, the newspaper gets the story from
Dan O'Malley, not from the police, not from Michelle. They get the story from Dan O'Malley because he's like
he goes to the newspaper and he says, "Look, I'm a little annoyed. I turned this thing in a month ago. Nobody's
talked about it at all. Nobody's called me to ask me about it, so I went to the newspaper." Well, police did say that
the area near the Raritan Center had been searched multiple times, saying that detectives had received phone calls
from psychics. They had received at least one anonymous tip about the area, and of course the
discovery of the sneaker prompted searches of that area. I have listed that this area was searched three times
after the sneaker was found, roughly within the month that it was found, but these searches turned up nothing of
importance. The tricky thing here, Captain, and I don't mean to be overly critical, but I
question how the thoroughness of these searches and how many resources and how much effort was put into them. I don't
know. It's Sometimes these things these details in these stories really bother me because as bad as this case is, a
missing boy, as sad as that is, you have to look at it from an officer's perspective and a
detective's perspective. While you don't want any kid to ever go missing, isn't this the stuff that you
live for? Isn't this what you get up like >> Mhm. >> Some of some of the people that work in
this line of of work, that go into these careers, they do it for the excitement.
And if I'm involved in a missing person's case and somebody tells me that they found a shoe that could be the shoe
of the missing person, >> Yeah. >> you're going to have to drag me out of that area. I'm going to be there day and
night looking for something. Like, [ __ ] this is the break we we needed. It's been 5 months.
Regarding Michelle, she spoke with the newspaper as well. She expressed a lot of concern. She was concerned at the
possibility that the sneaker might be Timothy's. She said, "Look, the thought of it being my son's shoe makes me very
uneasy." She said, "I want my son to be found. I want him to be okay. When he's found, I want him to be wearing his
sneakers when he's found. I don't want him scattered all over the place." And she added that if the sneaker is not
his, she would be happy about that. That is really where the case rounds out and
ends the year of 1991. So, now we move into 1992. In March of 1992, the case shifts
toward the Raritan Center that we just discussed. The ongoing investigation into the disappearance of 5-year-old
Timothy Wiltsey reached a new phase in March of 1992 with law enforcement turning its
attention more deliberately toward searches and physical evidence. By that point, the case had already accumulated
interviews, theories, and repeated retellings of events. The investigators needed
now something concrete, something that could anchor the story to a place, to an item, or timeline that could be tested
and figured out if these items or timeline is true. >> Right. >> So, we have an FBI agent. The FBI's been
involved in this, as we said, since the beginning. But, an FBI agent assigned to
the case decided, "Hey, you know what? We're going to interview Michelle again."
And this time she did not come alone. She had an attorney present with her during this interview. When questioned,
she did what she had done before. She reiterated the Ellen story, the same account that she
had previously provided to investigators. Nothing about that interview, at least
on the record, sounded to be new or a dramatic break in the case. >> Right. >> It was another official conversation,
but her earlier narrative still stood. But, here's where the case starts moving because the FBI agent did not stop with
Michelle. So, he interviews Dan O'Malley again, the guy who found the sneaker, and he wants to hone in on this Raritan
Center located in Edison, New Jersey. And that sneaker, if it did belong to the boy, obviously would be significant,
right? An object found in a location that demanded explanation. The agent began interviewing Michelle's
friends and family again, and during those conversations, he uncovered a detail that reframed the geography of the case.
Investigators learned that 3 years earlier, Michelle had actually worked for 6 months
at a fulfillment center located in that Raritan Center complex. >> Mhm. >> Now, what's even more troubling about this is
prior to finding out this information, they had asked her to provide them with her work history. The work history that
she provided did not have any mention of her working that 6 months at the Raritan Center complex.
>> Which I'm guessing 6 months at [clears throat] a job for her would be longer than most of her employment
locations. >> I guess in a if in her defense, I would say it was 3 years prior, but I again,
if she's providing the best that she can, her work history if they asked for it to
include 4 years or 5 years, that should have been in there. And like you said, 6
months would be a big chunk of time during that that time frame. >> Right. >> So, they go and they find some people
that used to work with her, some co-workers and people that knew her during her time when she worked for the
fulfillment center at the Raritan Center. And a couple of people said they had remembered that she was known to have
taken frequent walks around the complex. Now, that meant something important to their investigation
because that fulfillment center sat within a few blocks of where the sneaker had been found.
>> Right. >> So, the discovery becomes more interesting, more troubling, >> makes you want to do more searches.
>> And did she hide the fact that she worked in that area? When she was later asked about it directly, she didn't she
didn't try to duck or dodge the question. She did acknowledge. She said, "Yes, I did in fact work at that
fulfillment center." So, the the omission itself becomes part of the investigation. Again, whether
intentional or not, difficult to say. >> Right. >> But, the linkage would drive the linkage
would drive the investigators to the next step in the investigation. So, the following month in late April of
1992, a 2-day search near Olympic Drive. So, during this 2-day time period, law enforcement teams conducted a full
search of a mostly marshy area near Olympic Drive in the Raritan Center. It did not take long for the search to
produce results. Investigators quickly located a second sneaker matching the first one that had been found.
>> Mhm. Not good. >> Like the first one, Captain, it was Timmy's size. The report is the second sneaker was
found roughly 150 ft from the location of the first. The search teams also found a pillowcase at about that same
location. Then about 2 hours later searchers located something far more damning. At a point approximately 400 to
550 ft further away from the sneaker location, they found a skull and 10 other bones.
The remains were discovered in and around a truck tire that had been dredged from the bottom of Red Root
Creek. The area continued to yield objects that felt haunting to the investigation. A
Ninja Turtle balloon was found. So was a 10 ft by 3 ft blue and white blanket. This was found buried into the
embankment positioned about 15 to 20 ft above the creek bed where the bones were
located. So we have these shoes, a pillowcase, a tire in the creek, scattered bones, a balloon, a blanket.
The identif- The identification >> Was she able to identify any of the other items?
>> That's interesting. I I don't know how quickly she was notified or asked to identify these
items. She does look at them at some point, but from my understanding, so what we get is
the medical examiner, of course, is going to get involved, and the skull is confirmed to be the remains of Timothy
Wiltsey. This identification was made and confirmed through dental records. >> Right.
>> The county medical examiner ruled the death a homicide, but even with that ruling
the most critical s- specifics remained out of reach, right? Due to the advanced decomposi-
decomposition the time of death, location of death, and medical cause of death could not be
determined. So, she's not there when he's found. She is later informed. So, she's
informed that night after they positively make the identification. According to the FBI
agent, Michelle was unemotional when told that the remains were found. She was unemotional when questioned
about a detail that in- investigators could not ignore. Why was his remains found 0.4 miles from a former workplace?
>> Right. >> 0.4 miles from a former workplace that you had initially not disclosed to
police. >> Absolutely. >> Now, >> and and then also the changing of the stories. That's something that I think
law enforcement is going to have a very hard time getting past. >> Mhm. >> I think I think listeners of the show
are going to have a hard time getting past that. It's it's I mean, you're looking for your son. I don't care about
a guy with a knife. Anyway, so now, she did say, "Look, when they're questioning her,
and they bring up, 'Look, you you did not disclose to us that you had worked at this place and it's so very close to
where we eventually found the skull of your missing son.' >> Yeah. >> She does say,
and I don't think they could find anybody to refute this, she does say, "Yes, I took walks around the center,
but I walked around the complex where I worked. It's 0.4 miles from where you found
him." She She says, "I'm unaware that Olympic Drive, so this is the street nearest where the body was
found. She's I don't even know what that road is. I don't know that that road exists."
>> Right. >> So, it's it's it's difficult. >> interesting just to take her other
locations of where she worked and to go, "Well, how far away was his remains from
from those locations as well? Because if one is 0.4 and the other one is 0.6 and
the other one is 1. whatever, then you go, well, maybe this is that doesn't mean much of anything.
>> Exactly. And and if the others are a great distance and this is not, then this is a one-off and you it carries
more weight. >> Right. >> So, we do get lab testing, but really, dude, I think this this ends
up being unanswered questions about these items that were found near the remains.
Now, the physical evidence went to the FBI lab, but testing did not produce the hoped-for breakthrough in the case.
According to these reports, no trace evidence was found on the items recovered during the search. As for the
blanket, the 10-ft by 3-ft blanket, >> Mhm. >> reports said that neither Michelle nor
her parents recognized it as coming from their home. So, they were shown the blanket.
The blanket remained an object without a confirmed origin after these questions posed to her parents and to
Michelle, despite being found in a location that now carried an enormous investigative weight to it. The
pillowcase raised its own unresolved question. It was not known whether the pillowcase
was shown to anyone who might recognize it. We don't have any statements regarding the pillowcase.
But the case really transformed, obviously. The search moved from a from a sneaker found near
an industrial complex to the confirmed recovery of Timothy Wiltsey's remains, along with objects found nearby that
hinted at movement, concealment, or disposal. Yet, despite that grim clarity, the investigation was still
left straining for the connecting thread that would explain [music] how the pieces fit together.
>> Twist and turns, [music] what to believe, what not to believe, evidence that points
for or against Timothy's mother being the prime suspect. So much more to get to.
Until then. >> Be good. Be kind. And don't litter. >> [music] [music] [music] >> Walmart shoppers, meet the debit card
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>> Courage. I learned it from my adoptive mom. >> Hold my hand? >> You hold my hand.
>> Learn about adopting a teen from foster care at adoptuskids.org. You can't imagine the reward. Brought to
you by adoptuskids, the US Department of Health and Human Services, and the Ad Council.

Carnival of Lies ////// Part 2

Part 2 of 4

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May 25th is National Missing Children’s Day. President Ronald Reagan proclaimed May 25, 1983 as the first National Missing Children’s Day. He established the annual observance to bring national awareness to child safety and encourage communities to prioritize protection efforts. The date was chosen to mark the sad anniversary of the disappearance of Etan Patz, a six-year-old who vanished from a New York City street corner on May 25, 1979. Twelve years after Etan Patz disappeared and on National Missing Children’s Day 1991, a five-year-old boy named Timothy Wiltsey vanished from a Carnival in Sayreville, New Jersey. This week in observance of National Missing Children’s Day, we take a look at a case that will never leave the hearts and minds of many. This is the unsolved case of Timothy “Timmy” Wiltsey. To learn more about National Missing Children’s Day and/or the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children go to MissingKids.org (http://missingkids.org/)

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Brief Summary

Michelle Lodzinski's inconsistent statements raise suspicion after her son Timothy goes missing, leading to the discovery of his remains.

Key points

Ryan Reynolds' Wireless Call. Ryan Reynolds promotes Mint Mobile, offering premium wireless for just $15 a month.
The Power of Hope. A message about the importance of hope in recovery from addiction.
The Disappearance of Timmy. Michelle Lodzinski reports her son missing at a carnival, sparking a nationwide search.
Inconsistencies in Michelle's Story. Michelle's changing accounts raise suspicion during the investigation into her son's disappearance.
Michelle's Confrontation with Police. During a tense interview, Michelle challenges police, insisting on her right to leave.
The Sneaker Discovery. A child's sneaker is found, raising hopes in the ongoing search for Timothy.

Episode highlights

Episode quotes

Mom always leaves the light on for her kid.

A poignant metaphor about hope and waiting for a loved one to return.

6:44WatchMay 27, 2026

Tension

80/ 100High tension

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